Rode whites level at Afan today and had saw a guy on horseback with redcoat hat etc, didn't think too much of it until we came round a corner on one of the downhills and had to stop for a pack of hounds!! I though the FC didn't allow hunting on land they managed. Maybe it was just a practice- hope they told the fox.
Did you let the FC know....Banwen Hunt used to go above Rhigos and seen them hunting above Aberdare in the old days
Looks like the FC don't mind
http://www.banwenminershunt.co.uk/
and on Tues 17th they were meeting at Cymmer so looks like it was them
http://www.banwenminershunt.co.uk/page3.htm
Hmm, is it only hunting with dogs that banned? Could i chase foxes on my bike with my mates?
Maybe he was just going for a ride with his dogs?
Hmm, is it only hunting with dogs that banned?
Not exactly, you can chase it with a pack of dogs, but can't catch it, however 2 dogs (not 3) can as thats not hunting apparently.
Black and White really
Welsh foxes are fair game as they can damage the Welsh sex industry.
Sheep.
chase the fox with dogs, release eagle to kill the fox.
The law is a farce, but what do you expect from a bunch of knee jerk politicians.
Hunting with eagles sounds like a right laugh. Eagles and bikes killing foxes - could be awesome. Maybe thats a way for who ever it was to make money from the trails they build?
I saw a full blown hunt the other day on the South Downs, quite spectacular really. I was asked to wait until the hounds had gone past because they could chase me (that would make for a great dog rant post). I was talking to someone about it afterwards and apparently they use human runners who lay a scent trail. So maybe not such a bad thing perhaps.
[i]they use human runners who lay a scent trail[/i]
One 'went to ground' in our local Starbucks once.
It was chaos.
ruffrider - thats called a drag hunt.
it shows the massive hypocrisy of the hunters that they try to find ways round the ban on hunting with dogs rather than doing drag hunts. Drag hunts are no fun as they don't get to kill things
The Quorn hunt now cannot use a real fox, so they have to use a meat substitute.
Fight the Ban!!!!!
What ban? 😈
Would leading a drag-hunt around Gisburn improve my lap times? Would certainly stop me dithering at the top of the stone bit on HomeBaked...
Drag hunt is a bit tight on those poor trannies, got enough to put up with already I reckon!
One 'went to ground' in our local Starbucks once.It was chaos.
LOL!
find ways round the ban on hunting
No they don't, they partake in [b]legal[/b] forms of hunting.
For example, my regular hunt was a Beagle pack, we hunted hare's on foot, this was banned, so we switched to hunting Rabbits, which is perfectly legal - we oraganised a powerpoint session for the hounds and everything, so we could explain to them that they were only allowed to hunt rabbits now.
thats not "finding ways round the ban" - its doing exactly what the law permits, whats your problem with that?
whats your problem with that?
Probably terrorising defenceless animals then tearing them to shreds with a pack of dogs.
What I don't understand is that the people who are opposed to hunting foxes will quite readily shovel meat down their neck from an animal that has seen nothing but cruelty for it's whole tragic young life.
I'm not a fox hunter nore do I even know anyone who is, but I see most people who are against fox hunting simply following the pack (get the pun) to get a dig at the posh lot.
What I don't understand is that the people who are opposed to hunting foxes will quite readily shovel meat down their neck from an animal that has seen nothing but cruelty for it's whole tragic young life
add to that the reason foxes numbers need to be controlled is to protect the animals that end up on said peoples plates.
What about urban foxes. It'd give the fox a fair chance if the red coats were galloping through Tower Hamlets, Moss Side, Croxteth etc.
Probably terrorising defenceless animals then tearing them to shreads with a pack of dogs.
whats your problem with that?
we oraganised a powerpoint session for the hounds and everything, so we could explain to them that they were only allowed to hunt rabbits now.
PMSL!
What I don't understand is that the people who are opposed to hunting foxes will quite readily shovel meat down their neck from an animal that has seen nothing but cruelty for it's whole tragic young life.
A semi valid point, and I've cut back my meat intake significantly as I am conflicted, however anything I do eat I make a point of ensuring it did have a good life. I can certainly guarantee that it wasn't hunted and ripped to shreds.
slight hijack, but do we all know now that the sell off of great wood/bits of the Quantocks is actually about hunting? As in making it permissible on those bits? Other forms of access unlikely to change, but the concillor involved in the sell off is also a very big cheese in local hunting community.
With regard to the banwen miners hunt, word on the [s]street[/s] forest road is that hunting plus working forestry/harvesting do not mix at all well, as in the latter is greatly screwed up by the former.
whats your problem with that?
I dislike scum that partake in such activities.
however anything I do eat I make a point of ensuring it did have a good life
I'd imagine that given the choice the animal would prefer not to end up on your dinner plate.
I dislike scum that partake in such activities.
I, and a lot of other people have a problem with people slitting animals throats and letting them bleed to death without any form of stunning to reduce the pain incurred, purely because their big book of superstition and magic stories tells them that it the only acceptable way, but I'm told that we're not allowed to ban that as we need to show tolerance towards peoples tradition, or 'religion' as they like to call it.
Am I allowed to call Moslems and Jews "Scum" because they do this?
I am against fox hunting for the simple reason it has no utlity. Its all about killing an animal in the most prolonged way for fun.,
Zulu and others apologists for this disgraceful thing will try to defend it
1) Hunts have no utility - they do not reduce the numbers of foxes indeed many hunts actually feed and protect foxes to ensure a supply of foxes for hunting. Zulu will attempt to deny this but it is proven time adn time again
there are not significantly more foxes in area with no hunting
2) the hunt is deliberately cruel. The hounds are deliberately bred to be no faster than a fox so the chase takes a long time - and how "good" a hunt is is dependent on having a good long chase. Its no fun to kill the fox quickly.
Dogs could be bred to be faster and catch a fox with no chase
Its a barbaric practice, and is indefensible by anyone with any shred of human decency. Its an affront to humanity.
"the unspeakable in pursuit of the inedible"
I am not against all forms of hunting shooting and fishing - but I abhor the deliberate cruelty of hunting with hounds.
I, and a lot of other people have a problem with people slitting animals throats and letting them bleed to death without any form of stunning to reduce the pain incurred, purely because their big book of superstition and magic stories tells them that it the only acceptable way, but I'm told that we're not allowed to ban that as we need to show tolerance towards peoples supersition, or 'religion' as they like to call it.Am I allowed to call Moslems and Jews "Scum" because they do this?
This will only go one way so I'm going to bow out now and refrain from posting again on this thread.
Where do you stand on religious slaughter TJ?
The thread will now descend in to another, inevitably dull Big-Hitter-ARMAGEDDON thread, with countless posts all stating FACTS and then the pointless arguing and personal attacks will begin.
May as well close it now, Mods.
Tj are you a vegetarian, not trolling just asking
what C_F said. I thought it has started quite well but it was only a matter of time...
TJ - Do you agree or disagree that fox numbers need to be controlled?
LoCo - MemberTj are you a vegetarian, not trolling just asking
Meat is an occasional treat to me.
Cruelty in meat production is not deliberate and meat production has utility - the meat is eaten.
fox hunting is deliberatly cruel and most importantly has no utility.
Where do you stand on religious slaughter TJ? 😉
phil.w - MemberTJ - Do you agree or disagree that fox numbers need to be controlled?
Its very much disputed - but even if it did they hunts do not control fox numbers - they ensure a supply of foxes for hunting by feeding them and buy creating artificial earths and if you wiped out all the foxes in a hunts area the hunt would be annoyed as they would have no prey left.
Ok just asking, yes hunting foxes is a very inefficient way of controling them if it is deemed necessary.
I'm not sure that management of hunts includes creation of sets for the them and effectivly breeding them for 'sport' in a similar way to game birds are managed is acctually correct TJ, it's certainly not something I have ever come across in my past career working in the countryside
Meh, it's just a fox. I'm sure it would gladly rip lambs and chickens to shreds for fun if given the chance, so why cant the dogs do the same, with us going along for fun? Plus we get to dress up in awesome clothes and ride around the country side on horses. Its brilliant!
they ensure a supply of foxes for hunting by feeding them and buy creating artificial earths and if you wiped out all the foxes in a hunts area the hunt would be annoyed as they would have no prey left.
Utter bobbins.
Not sure where you've got that information from, Daily Mail perhaps? But that simply does not happen.
I am with TJ on this, if they need contolling send someone out with a rifle to shoot it.
Its very much disputed - but even if it did they hunts do not control fox numbers - they ensure a supply of foxes for hunting by feeding them and buy creating artificial earths and if you wiped out all the foxes in a hunts area the hunt would be annoyed as they would have no prey left.
I see your adding a big dose of trolling to your views again TJ 🙂
if they need contolling send someone out with a rifle to shoot it
While I don't completely agree with hunting with hounds this is definitely not a better or workable alternative.
Yes lamping them with a rifle is alot more efficient means of control
Edit. sorry that should be lamping and shooting them with a rifle, I'm not suggesting culling any animal by beating them to death with a rifle.
LoCo -I'm not sure that management of hunts includes creation of sets for the them and effectivly breeding them for 'sport' in a similar way to game birds are managed is acctually correct TJ, it's certainly not something I have ever come across in my past career working in the countryside
Proven to happen often - no question at all. Its all kept hush hush by the hunts but it is common practice. Read the league against cruel sports evidence on it. seethe court cases
there is no hunt without he prey. most of the earths areknown about - they could easily be eliminated.
[i]lamping them with a rifle is alot more efficient means of control[/i]
I suspect shooting would be even more efficient - you have to get really close to hit them with the wrong end of a rifle 😉
Read the league against cruel sports evidence on it
while i don't disbelieve you TJ (it seems plausible that it happens), i wouldn't believe anything the league has to say on the subject.
Phil - its commonpractice to support fox populations ith artifical earhts and feeding
http://www.acigawis.co.uk/artificial_earths.htm
Sorry not convinced, but then the area I was working in had pretty good habitats to support a full range of species.
Not pro on hunting with dogs but have seen both sides of this issue over the last 15 years.
Proven to happen often - no question at all. Its all kept hush hush by the hunts but it is common practice. Read the league against cruel sports evidence on it. seethe court cases
HAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!
I assume that is meant to be funny?
How about the telegrpah then?
HE Beaufort Hunt, which the Prince of Wales and his friend Camilla Parker Bowles follow keenly, has been accused of breaking rules by breeding foxes for the chase.Undercover video footage, presented to Newsnight, the BBC2 programme, by the International Fund for Animal Welfare, allegedly showed a Beaufort employee leaving food for foxes outside artificial earths built by the hunt. The footage appears to show its official terrierman, Thomas Burton, shovelling offal on to stone slabs. A sheep was also allegedly put out.
Simon Hart,[b] of the Countryside Alliance's Campaign for Hunting, said: "There is no secret about artificial earths.[/b] We took the Burns inquiry to see artificial earths."Let's wait until Monday to see what they have to say about them. The foxes are not forced to live there. The earths are built to encourage them to live where they can be hunted safely and do not cause a nuisance, which means not by the motorway and not by the pheasant pen."
Alastair Jackson, the association's director, said: "If any rules have been broken we will act swiftly." In some hunt countries, he said, it was common practice to build artificial earths, not unlike nesting boxes, in which foxes were free to come and go.
There was no law to prevent food being put down for foxes. He said: "Fox hunting is about controlling the fox population, it is not about exterminating the fox population." Supporters of hunting said it was a frequent practice for animal lovers to feed foxes, even urban ones, to see them in their gardens.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1341954/Beaufort-Hunt-broke-rules-on-fox-breeding.html
The league admitted it cannot definitively prove that the people who maintain the earths or feed the foxes are connected to local hunts.
From your link TJ. Like I said, anything the league says has to be put into context of them liking to talk bollox.
So if fox hunting does not control the numbers, how do you explain the increase in the fox population?
Teh Beaufort hunt has admitted building artificial earths and feeding foxes
OK the odd case maybe, but it's the Royals, TJ you know they don't count and can do what they want, like MPs 😉
Religious slaughter is a valid point.. Do you uphold the freedom for people to kill animals in a barbaric way due to their religious/cultural beliefs yet not others due to their historic/cultural pastimes?
Oh, I do enjoy these threads where
i) TJ comes out with wild allegations that are unsubstantiated
ii) TJ spends the rest of the thread digging his way out of a hole or arguing the point on a tiny, tiny side issue because its the only thing he's got left in his armoury.
iii) Someone asks TJ a perfectly reasonable, on topic and relevant question, and he spends half the thread avoiding answering it in an increasingly convoluted fashion, because he knows that his answer completley reveals his position to be both fundementally flawed and hypocritical...
Yes lamping them with a rifle is alot more efficient means of control
I really don't want to get involved but though I should point out that hunting certainly has a couple of advantages over shooting;
a) You will never, ever end up with a wounded fox from hunting. The fox either gets away or is killed near-instantly (albeit in a way that isn't TJ approved).
b) Shooting is totally indiscriminate whereas hunting actively selects for the culling of injured/elderly foxes.
Loco is that not MP's in general?
RE fox number.. I've seen a massive increase in the number of foxes along my night time biking routes over the last few years.
timmys - Membera) You will never, ever end up with a wounded fox from hunting. The fox either gets away or is killed near-instantly (albeit in a way that isn't TJ approved).
rubbish - it is chased for a significant period of time. Nothing near instant about it
Loco - its a common practice but well hidden. there is a a huge amount of data on artifical earths and fox feeding.
Religious slaughter is a valid point.. Do you uphold the freedom for people to kill animals in a barbaric way due to their religious/cultural beliefs yet not others due to their historic/cultural pastimes?
Fancy answering Elzorillo's question TJ?
Edited that so it's 'wingless' Bren 😉
rubbish - it is chased for a significant period of time. Nothing near instant about it
Pretty sure once it's caught it's pretty damn quick....
Zulu - the "wild allegations" are well proven and indeed accepted as true by the hunts now in many cases. see the telegraph quote. Loads more data / proof / court cases if yo wnat to see them
Once we've banned all guns (as some people want), shooting won't be an option.
As I said.. I don't actually know anyone who hunts but I know a few sabs (hunt saboteurs) and you could never wish to meet a more vicious, blinkered, self righteous, downright evil group of people.
I'm naturally not that sympathetic to hunting but I also get really upset and frustrated when foxes get my lambs. And they do seem to be on the increase.
So I veer towards grateful that there are people out there who want to control foxes. Not in the way I would - but then I'm not sure that the other alternative - lamping - in which a bloke sits around on a hillside in the dark with a gun and a light is that healthy either. Wouldn't want to run into him nightriding...
Druidh - as you perfectly well know I have no problem with people who need guns as a tool to control vermin
It's little more than dog fighting. Foxes are related to the canine species, canidae species vulpes vrs Canidae Species Canis.
Eating meat and hunting are seperate issues. Don't confuse the two. Hunting for food, no problem with that. Hunting because it fun is as TJ said.
Fox numbers may or maynot need controlling. Either leave it for natural selection or the motorcar.
Leave it for natural selection, get real!
Numbers will increase ten fold.
Have any of you anti-hunt seen the damage 1 fox can do?
Lamping is only effective for so long, why do you think the fox gets the name "Wise old fox"
"Numbers will increase ten fold". Explain how you reach that statement please. Also explain damage to what?
Bren - the farm my family come from is still run by people we know as a poultry farm. there is a fox earth on the farm, the owners refuse to allow the hunt on the land. there is no issue with poultry being taken
I am against fox hunting for the simple reason it has no utlity.
Yes it does - social action.
It may be outside of any social action that you recognise but just because it does not conform to your ( or my ) worldview, it ce3rtainly does not mean that it has no utility.
It is cultural action and if your only argument is utility - you have no argument.
trailmonkey
The hunts argue they are needed to control fox numbers but that is shown to be false
if its purely social then drag hunts are the way to go surely - no need for the killing.
TandemJeremy - MemberBren - the farm my family come from is still run by people we know as a poultry farm. there is a fox earth on the farm, the owners refuse to allow the hunt on the land. there is no issue with poultry being taken
Same as the farm I used to work on, we never lost any poultry or lambs to foxes for all the years I worked there.
There was more than enough food left about for foxes that they did not need to come bother our stock.
Our boss also banned fox hunting from his land, mostly because of the mess the followers used to leave.
It’s the people who go fox hunting that I can’t tolerate. A cull of rightwing toffs would be most welcome.
a) You will never, ever end up with a wounded fox from hunting. The fox either gets away or is killed near-instantly (albeit in a way that isn't TJ approved).
Pretty sure once it's caught it's pretty damn quick....
Pretty sure it wasn't on the four or five I've seen. Though there wasn't much fox left to ask.
I don't like hunting, I'm vegetarian and so posh I get out of the shower to pee.
if its purely social then drag hunts are the way to go surely - no need for the killing.
Thing is I'd be well up for that - as the 'hare' or riding, it'd be a hoot.