Still undecided on what to get as a waterproof for commuting. (colour wise)
Is it a [b]fact[/b] that fluorescent is safer than any other colours?
It's just that the Montane velocity is anothet £20 for a fluorescent one.
opinions please (probably divided I guess)
Ta
Dave
Better to be seen too much than too little!
what other colour options ?
Red seems to work well
blue doesnt seem to work well in the rain
Safety gear for workmen on the road is always fluo and generally though not always yellow.
A lot of people who know what they're talking about made that decision, so it's good enough for me.
As a driver I can't say much clothing stands out against a backdrop of car lights. Lights, lights and more lights and make sure your batteries are fresh. See too many folks with LED lights that may be flashing but need new batteries.
I'm definitely getting a fluro yellow one for commuting this winter.
Basically since becoming a regular driver i've realised that the only cyclists i spot early are the ones wearing bright yellow.
Bright orange might work as well (like the roadworkers pointed out bove).
I can't say much clothing stands out against a backdrop of car lights
Well with flouro colours we're talking about being visible when cars haven't got their lights on - in the dark there's no substitute for reflective stuff (hence why workers safety gear has both). Not even having your own bright lights beats reflecting the car's own lights back at them with something retro-reflective.
I seem to remember that yellow is better in the dark and orange fluro is better in the clag (from motorbike training).
There seems to be so many people wearing flouro stuff nowadays due to h&s that it just tends to blend in!!!!
I'm thinking more of when as a driver you are pulling out and can't see cyclists as they are in front of cars with their headlights on. The most effective way to be visible then is a flashing LED. Reflectors on pedals really stand out, as would something reflective on shoes or legs I suppose. I just think its important to check those batteries, people don't seem to realise that LED's fade when the batteries are nearly dead.
Already have a reflective band around my ankle and multiple led's both flashing and non flashing. I agree with the 'can't have too many lights'
It would appear that in the daylight the yellow is better but at night it's the reflective stuff and lights that work, hence the altura night vision stuff is black with reflective bits.
I wear one of these shameful items over my normal clobber -
[url] http://www.ukbikestore.co.uk/product/27/rcn905/nitezone-courier-reflective-vest.html [/url]
The most important thing for night riding is good retroreflectives- and not the "slightly shiny" yellow rubbish you get on most bike-specific stuff, you want 3M or similiar, and as much of it as possible. All in all, what you generally want is a dirt-cheap worky's vest... Or if you wear a rucksack, a full jacket. These are lightweight and use a very open fabric, perfect really. But there's not any waterproofs etc that I've seen that come close to their visibility.
Get a waterproof to stay dry - colour etc doesn't really matter.
heaps of reflective tape and blinky lights in the dark. Come daylight, there really is no excuse for drivers not seeing you (I know, that is no help if you get squished etc!) and flouro yellow doesn't really stand out to be honest anymore than any other bright colour - 'normal' yellow, orange, red, 'bright' green, etc
my tuppence...
I use one of the yellow Altura Night Vision's. When I'm driving I find it a lot easier to see people with jackets like these, especially when they don't have lights on, which is good enough for me.
can't do any harm, though reckon bright orange is better than the commuter uniform of fluro yellow
I'm thinking that I'm going to get a black Altura Night Vision as I have 3 lights (5 LEDs total) and have even left on the rear reflector I dont want to look like a power ranger by going for the yellow and it also means I can wear my commuting jacket on the MTB.
FWIW My lights will probably be arranged in a triangle with a small one of each of the seat stays and the big one on the seatpost just below the reflector this coupled with this level of reflection should get me seen. Oh and a Hope 2 LED on the front.
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I'm doing my first dark commute on Wednesday down mainly country lanes that at 4:30am are normally pretty quiet.
Can I had that even though day glow isn't the most fashionable item (specially from a girl point of view) it is much safer than black/grey or other trendy MTB colour.
Another point to consider is the helmet. White with a small light on it is a mucho better 😀
Usually wear red in summer but switch to yellow/reflective for the dark. Driving up a 3 lane carriageway this morning I spotted a rider in yellow from a long way off. So did most other drivers who pulled out in time.
As already mentioned, the worse 'cyclists' are those with dim rear lights and dark clothes.
I used to have a 3M vest for motorbiking in winter, tried it on the mtb and it probably worked but looked a bit special needs. 20min stitching later and it was as close fitting as any race jersy, and as a result much less likely to be 'forgotten'
I never really find that clothing colour matters for visibility unless its fairly light anyway, but reflective (especially 3M Diamond grade stuff)is so reflective that even the slightest hint of light and you're visible from miles away.
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Ohh, and avoid orange, its almost invisible at dusk when the streetlamps haven't warmed up yet, especialy in the rain.
So to summarise:
Florescent Yellow jacket
Reflective 3M everywhere
BRIGHT lights with back ups
Done.
o to summarise:Florescent Yellow jacket
Reflective 3M everywhere
BRIGHT lights with back ups
And white helmet 😉
Reflective 3M everywhere
Especially on bits that move, like feet/ankles/pedals. A [s]dozy idiot[/s]driver's brain is far more likely to register things that are moving.
cheers folks, looks like the extra £20 is is probably worth it for the fluorescent one.
Other alternative is to get the "cheaper" waterproof and maybe stick a mesh vest over the top? This one is £6 posted
http://hivizextras.co.uk/vests.html
There do a nice rucksack cover too. I've had loads of comments about mine from other commuters - I've got the more expensive Respro equivalent.
I've got a yellow and orange respro cover, but TBH i'm trying to get away with a small bumbag rather than a rucksack, hence the thought of having some yellow on my upper body.
cheers for the link breatheeasy, a black jacket and one of those could work well and be £17 cheaper
You can buy 3m reflective tape. Stick it on crank arms, forks, bag etc.
As mentioned above, movement is key. Ankles are a great place for some Scotchlite and a small (fixed beam) LED can also be very effective on the outer ankle, as it traces light up and down.
Other than that, contrasts are good, such as the yellow and orange contrast on the Respro Hump...
I've had loads of comments about mine from other commuters - I've got the more expensive Respro equivalent.
🙂 *Smug* 🙂
Has anyone tried attaching the Respro I-Shots ( http://www.respro.com/products/urban-commuting/hi-visibility/ishots/) to clothing? Thinking of sticking some of these to my shorts/trousers....
Cheers,
Alex
I've got the more expensive Respro equivalent.
*smug*
Sorry, yes, that did come across slightly badly! I actually meant to say I'd not purchased said recommended rucksack cover, and I have bought the more expensive one before I realised there was a cheaper alternative.
breatheasy, that wasn't what I meant! The Respro Hump was originally my idea, hence the smugness!
[i]Has anyone tried attaching the Respro I-Shots ( http://www.respro.com/products/urban-commuting/hi-visibility/ishots/) to clothing? Thinking of sticking some of these to my shorts/trousers....[/i]
Yes - got some of the chevron ones stuck on my backpack. But unfortunately, they are not wash proof - so it would work out pretty expensive to stick them on your shorts!
As far as colours go, I always wear red (hides the blood) - I was a passenger in my mate's car last week - he moved over to let a cyclist go past leading up to a roundabaout - this guy was wearing a nice yellow flouro jacket. As we turned left on the roundabout the cyclist was picking himself up off the floor after being sideswiped by a Peugeot. I've ridden the same roundabout countless times without a problem. How you ride makes the difference, not what colour you wear.
LOL @ Capt'nFlashy.
I take it back, I wasn't smug, but applaud you on your own smugness 😆
Did you find with the Respro Hump that the reflective was on the top and thus not in drivers eyeline when you actually assume the riding position? I ended up fitting mine upside down.
Has anyone tried attaching the Respro I-Shots"
I bought myself some Respro leg bands, cut them up and stuck them to my saddlebag with Evostick impact adhesive.
That was five years ago.....
My latest trick is to loop some leg bands together and hang them off the saddlebag's right-hand pocket. Makes me appear a foot wider and encourages traffic to give me more room.
<<It would appear that in the daylight the yellow is better but at night it's the reflective stuff and lights that work, hence the altura night vision stuff is black with reflective bits. >>
they also do that stuff in yellow as well so it is daylight and night visible - just don't see the point of their black version...
[i]they also do that stuff in yellow as well so it is daylight and night visible - just don't see the point of their black version... [/i]
Really? Point is it looks a lot nicer. And it's very visible at night. Haven't got one myself, but used to see a chap riding in the opposite direction every day wearing one. Very visible he was.
They also do it in red.
So what do people do about the changing weather? All these reflective waterproofs look great for cold wet evenings, but far too warm for mild dry evenings....
That's the benefit of a mesh style reflective vest. Just chuck it on over whatever you feel you need to wear for the ride.
Just ordered a Montane velocity in yellow after all.
and I will be looking at those mesh style reflective vests for when the waterproof is not needed.
<<they also do that stuff in yellow as well so it is daylight and night visible - just don't see the point of their black version...>>
<<Really? Point is it looks a lot nicer. And it's very visible at night. Haven't got one myself, but used to see a chap riding in the opposite direction every day wearing one. Very visible he was.
They also do it in red. >>
Altura Night Vision in Yellow and Black:
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It is a good jacket, though i had a fluro one for two years and after two years it went a kinda of whitish yellow...
though now I have a pearl izumi version - not as waterproof, but it has stayed bright yellow and the arms zip off
As a driver, I've been impressed by those Schwalbe tyres with the reflective sides - a lot of the reflective bits on coats, panniers, rucksack etc tend to face mostly backwards or forwards, two big glowing hoops works well to make cyclists stand out, for example crossing t-junctions.
Commuting on the bike, I wear as much fluourescent stuff as possible (inc helmet), and as much reflective as possible for after dark - reflective ankle bands work well because they're moving. As Dimmadan said, better to be seen too much than too little!
yep i have the reflective strips on the tire and i have the strips all round my mudguards - i have 3 rear lights some solid some flashing , i have my red jacket and 2 front lights - one flashing one solid - and 2 rear reflectors and 1 front.
Like you say more is better - surviving anderson drive twice daily at rush hour so far !
Be as reflective as possible - I'm thinking of going for some of the Schwable tyres. Already put wheel reflectors on my road bike - always taken them off all other bikes. Front and rear reflectors as well.
Hi-viz - I actually prefer orange to yellow. There just seems to be too much yellow hi-viz around today and I'd rather not be the bit of information the driver is not processing because they are overwhelmed. Plus work-wise I've found Orange is easier for the pilots to spot on airlifts (upto 2km out), yellow just disapears into the moors after a few 100m.
Definately as much reflective tape as possilbe. I'd go long sleeve rather than tabard / vest as you need cars to be able to see your arms when you signal plus it give good side coverage. Again this is from work where I want my arms to be seen for signaling or when hooking stuff on. Montane superfly used to have hoops of refective tape round the arms unfortunately new version doesnt. I dont think patches are quite as good.
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A mate has the black NiteVision and it is fantastic - but as everyone has said, at night it is lights that get you noticed - at least one fixed and one flashing at either end, and preferably ones that offer side visibility as well.
Pedal reflactors are also great - the movement attracts attention. I have some on the SPDs on my commuter.
As for yellow in the day time, I tend to just wear a bright solid colour - red, bright blue and orange are in my current wardrobe. Not been hit yet in 6 years of commuting!
*touches wood*
As a driver, I've been impressed by those Schwalbe tyres with the reflective sides - a lot of the reflective bits on coats, panniers, rucksack etc tend to face mostly backwards or forwards, two big glowing hoops works well to make cyclists stand out, for example crossing t-junctions.
They are wonderfully visible, the trouble is that like wheel reflectors they're all but useless from a road safety perspective. That's because they'll only reflect if they're in a headlight beam, and by the time you come into the beam of a car coming from a side road, the driver has already made his decision on whether or not to pull out. If the driver has time to react to seeing the tyres, you'd have already been clear anyway.
Pedal reflactors are also great - the movement attracts attention. I have some on the SPDs on my commuter.
Platform SPDs, or have you got some of those clip in things that come with new bikes which make your pedals single sided? Or is there some other way I've missed? Fortunately my shoes and overshoes all have reflective stuff on them, which must do just as good a job.
Usually wear black, have done since I started commuting by bike back in the '90s. Includes commuting across London, Reading and Bristol over the years.
Bright proper off-road lights slow drivers down and make 'em take notice.
I reckon if you wear yellow, you get targetted!
I reckon for most drivers the only thing that would slow them down is to make a sign out of 3M tape to look like this:
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and stick that onto your rucksack/back
new colour for night vision:
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I do wear reflective and yellow, mainly a road workers reflective summer top with the sleeves cut short for commuting. It isn't waterproof, but goes over everything else that is, and it's light enough to not get to sweaty when it's warmer
As for Lights, as other have said, have at least 2 each end. The only thing I'd add is to split them up. I have bar & seatpost as well as F&R on the helmet. Seen too many with everything on the bars and they can get lost. The P7 on the helmet is great for seeing over cars to stop people turning in front of me (on intermittent strobe you really get noticed 😆 )
As TinMan syas - I put a flsahing LED on the helmet. The idea being that people can see me above cars in front of me.
Just took delivery of a yellow Night Vision jacket and its very bright.
The other reason for 2 at each end is in case one fails / falls off
I also have those schwalbe tyres but not sure if they work after a week or 2 of road spray has greyed them out a bit.
just picked up some flashing reflective armbands from Aldi for £4 for 4.
seem quite good little things.
I've never bothered with bright clothing, usually wear black. Hope vision 4 on the front, cateye ld 610 on the rear seem to do the job. I'll probably fit a set of [url= http://www.zyro.co.uk/product-category/Lights/Light-x0020-Sets/id/CA490SL12.aspx ]these[/url] to my pompino but my other commuting bikes unfortunately have incompatible wheels.
Just to chuck my two penny'th in regarding orange and yellow, as a poster above mentioned about the yellow losing it's visibility on t'moors, orange is the colour of choice for rescue purposes, the MA1 pilots jacket has a reversible bright orange lining, International Rescue Orange or some such name, because it's the last actual colour the human eye can make out in dim light; it's why serious divers watches have orange hands or face as an option, like the Bell & Ross ones, and it's not a common colour in natural suroundings, also rescue aircraft always used to have bright orange markings rather than yellow, 'cos yellow 'fades' to a whitish colour with distance. Personally, I rely on reflectives and very bright lights at night, and don't bother with dayglo, as I'm usually wearing a bag of some sort that covers most of a jacket or vest up. My Timbuktoo bag has the entire centre panel in reflective white, and that is very bright.
Don't forget the wheel reflectors! Yes, they look crap in the daylight, but they rock at night - great for side-on visibility. Also, I reckon these and pedal reflectors really say 'cyclist' to the driver's subconscious. Well, they do to me when I'm driving, anyway.
I picked up some black retro-reflective tape from some US website, damned if I can remember the name now though.
I stuck some on the rims before I got the wheel reflectors, and they do a good job. Plus, because it's black you can't tell it's there normally. I also stuck some on the back and sides of my helmet, in a chess-board pattern. My mrs says it's quite eye-catching when driving behind me at night. And again cos it's black it doesn't look crap at other times (and let's face it, we're (almost) all a bit vain about bike gear!). I also wear a road-worker style orange hi-viz vest with loads of 3M retro-reflective stripes, and the helmet has a flashing 1W LED on for getting attention at side roads and roundabouts, when the other 1W flashing LED isn't necessarily pointing towards an oncoming vehicle.
And... that bottle in the cage is the reservoir for an Air-Zound - 115 decibel air horn. It's saved me from a couple of crashes when drivers have pulled out on me despite all the flashing lights and retro-reflectivity. Makes them think something motorised is a hell of a lot closer than they thought, and they slam the brakes on 🙂
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Will, all that and no mudguards? 😕
Movement is a key to visibility, as mentioned before. As such, ankle bands are great, as are pedal and wheel reflectors.
My plan is lots of lights, 4 red ones, going to put a couple of the little flashing ones on my pack, and have my ayups on helmet and bars, plus a cheapo one to make me roughly legal.
My pack has a fair bit of reflective on it but will probably put a yellow Hi-vis over the top of it, lets face it if they cannot see over 600 lumens of light from the front I am screwed either way.
Rozzers might not be quite so impressed though
[url= http://www.kleins.co.uk/3m-scotchlite-reflective-tape-trim-28-p.asp ]This stuff looks worth a go too[/url]
Meters of scotchlite tape
Will, all that and no mudguards?
There's a crud-catcher on the down tube and a home-made one on the underside of the pannier rack (being pushed out of shape by the lock). Once I'd got the hi-viz vest, the wheel reflectors and the skinny tyres, I figured I couldn't look any more of a div, so the mud-guards went on!
I also use the crappy plastic clip-in reflectors that came with the spuds on the bike - great for being able to clip in and still have pedal reflectors. Even though they don't weigh much, it's enough to make them automatically rotate to the underside so the cleat is always on top.