[Closed] Fatty Tyres

I'd try what's on first.

All fat bike tyres are crap in mud.

Surly nate... [url= http://slam69.co.uk/surly-nate-38-super-wide-folding-bead-120tpi-casing-the-no1-fat-bike-tyre-7532-p.asp ]here[/url]

Keep the JJ's for the summer months.

I'm running the JJ's and they are a very fast tyre - yes, you don't want to be going through more mud than about 1/2 inch but they are great as a trail centre tyre, as long as it isn't a mud bath. Really like em. However, my winter choice (cost alone) was going to be Floaters - but heard the news today that On One appear to be knocking them on the head - what a bummer 🙁

Sure the Nates are great but the cost...ouch.

Maxxis FBF/FBR 🙂

Bud and Lou on my Moonlander laugh in the face of mud. Not *all* fat tyres are poor.

It's been stated before but wheels and tyres aside a fat bike is just a bike. Nates might be expensive but they work and they'll last a long time.

Bud and Lou here too, they're great in mud. Though you will get it all in your face on a quick downhill!

How big a tyre can you put in a Dude? If it'll take a 4.8 I'd go straight for a minion or bud/lou combo (Minion is a little smaller).

Depends what you want to do though. Mine is mostly a trailbike and for that, there's no replacement for displacement. But for other folks a skinnier Nate might be better.

All fat bike tyres are crap in mud

Possibly, but it rather depends on the mud and a Bud/Lou will blow the JJs away on most mud. Actually I have no problem with mud using Bud/Lou, but I understand that other people have different mud.

If I take it up ashridge it will be a proper mud fest! Local riding is pretty awful at the moment unless it's frozen.
The dude comes with 4.8 JJ's, I was wondering about the minions..Is there much in it between the nates and minions? Both are around £70 each.

Does the bud/Lou wash out when entering mud patches at speed?

Does the bud/Lou wash out when entering mud patches at speed?

Not for me. Where the JJs would be sliding all over the place the Bud/Lou just grips. But that's on North East Scotland mud. No idea what they are like on clay, for example.

Northwind made a comment a while back that they lacked feedback and that may be true. Mine haven't let me down yet (obviously not pushing them hard enough!), but I've gone round muddy (or loose) corners on them at speed thinking "these must be about to break free" but they just feel rock solid, so I fear that when they do go they might just go suddenly. But up to that point at least, they are amazing.

Yeah, that was me. I think the Bud's got more grip outright but I can use the Minion better.

TBH the big difference is basically feel. The Minions are pretty bouncy, the Surlys more damped. I'm pretty sure more damped is [i]better[/i] (it's probably what takes away from feel, though). I mean logically, it means the tyre conforms to shapes better and improves contact, and generally adds control. But it also made them feel pretty lifeless. The Minions have a bit more bounce and response which if you don't like it, you'd call lack of control but if you do you'd call lively. It doesn't soak up lips the way the Bud does, if you want to gap off things or even just go light. (otoh the surlys were better at rock crawling, they always felt just like they had a little less air)

That's all a bit wooly but bottom line was, they're both really good tyres but I sold my Surlys and kept the Minions, because I like riding the bike more when it feels like that. Maybe it's just that it's more familiar and normal feeling, who knows.

Between them both:
which sheds mud better?
Drags more? I'm guessing the bud/lou as they appear a more aggressive tread pattern?
Are they both tubeless ready?

I don't think I ever rode the surlys in really sticky mud; they both clear pretty similarly normally- very well in fact, pretty open and all the tyre flex helps break mud up. But I don't know, one of them might be better than the other when it gets worse.

Drag I think the Surlys come out a bit behind. Not so much from tread I think but from hysteresis, all fat tyres I've tried get harder the faster you go but they [i]really[/i] felt it. As speed goes up you're pushing the distortion of the tyre basically. At noodling speeds, climbing etc, they're close enough that I couldn't tell you (the Surlys have a more aggressive tread, you're right but it's a wee bit more continuous)

I don't think the Surlys are tubeless ready but they worked just fine. Lots of rubber in the sidewalls, good beads.

Floaters - but heard the news today that On One appear to be knocking them on the head - what a bummer

WHAAAAATTTTTTT!!!!!!!!!!

Floaters
Or Nates if you want to spend 4x as much for no huge difference.

Thankfully I have spare floaters, I'd give up if I had to pay RRP for fat tyres!

If you are going to go tubeless, do that first.

Tyres will be off so a good price / performance and Tubeless ready option is Maxis FBF / FBR which are great for the price and look like lasting ages. they don't seem quite as draggy as Nates and the Maxis shed mud / snow easily and could be a contender for a year round tyre.

JJ's definitely for the summer and they go up TL very easily.

Tubeless here with Bud/Lou and Clownshoes. I won't pretend it was easy but it was easier than setting floaters up tubeless on OO rims! Then again, so was getting man on the moon.

I use Nates a year round but then I'm lazy when it comes to swapping tyres around.

I suspect that whether you prefer Minions or Bud/Lou depends as much on how you ride as where you ride. I bimble around admiring the view and find the extra security provided by the Bud/Lou (compared with JJ or with the Nic/Dampf combo on my 29er) quite amazing. I can hoon down slippery stuff without a care in the world. Maybe they do break away with less warning when they do go, but that's irrelevant to me as my nerve will give out long before these tyres do. Northwind, on the other hand, (I suspect) likes to play with the limits of grip more than I do, so will prefer a tyre that gives more feedback. Once again, it's all personal preference.

I use Vanhelgas but if you think Nates are expensive ...

The Vanhelgas are noticeably draggier on road and fire road than the Husker Dus that the bike came with but then the HDs were "interesting" when it got slightly muddy so something else was needed.

Remember that you need to consider chainline if you fit a wider tyre. I did think about the Bud/Lou combo but they are 4.8" and according to the manufacturer my frame will only take 4.7" so it wasn't worth taking the risk.

Regarding the chain line does anyone know what the width of a 4.8 JJ and minion is?
Thanks

I think they are both thinner than 4.8...in the real world.

Yah, I posted sizes in the Dune thread but they're pretty well buried. Minion is a 4.5 on 80mm IIRC, JJ a hair more, Bud a bit more again. (and bud is very stretchy- at higher pressures (bead mounting) it grew enough to foul the frame, at riding pressures it had decent clearance. So your pressures'll influence that on the surlys, not so much on the minions and jjs.

Bonty Hodags are amazing in mud and over tree roots have the 27.5" on my Farley.

Thanks for all the info guys... Think I'll try the minions, looked at the hodags but there £90 a pop..£70 is bad enough.

On another note anybody gone tubeless is br2250 rims? Is it relatively easy?
I'm hoping this 50mm Tess tape will be wide enough, or I'll run 2 or 3 overlapping strips around?
https://www.shandhigson.co.uk/tesa-packaging-tapes/535-heavy-duty-strapping-tape-tesa-4289.html

Your right there Fat tyres are crazy prices at present you can buy a trials/Enduro motorbike tyre for £50 madness mind the Hodags have not worn hardy and have used it on the road few times to get to local trails in mud they wont get touched for years!! I hope so at that price 🙂

@Golddigger, the rim's not ideal for tubeless- it has really good tubeless-ready style beads, but getting the tyre inflated is trickier than it could be (there was supposed to be an optional tubeless kit for the BR710 but they cancelled it)

But once inflated it's perfect. I find that with the compressor I need to use the cable-ties-round-the-outside trick to tighten the tyre on. Track pump, I think i'd probably need to add foam or something.

I can't comment on taping because I used a stupidly overcomplicated method so I could have the yellow pvc tape showing at the cutouts 🙄

Best/easiest way I've found for inflating fat tyres tubeless is to use a standard 26" tube & stretch it over the tyre all the way around it. Make sure it's in the middle & the bead is pulled out as far as you can get it,

Cough ......I have a pair of Nates looking for a new home ..... Cough ..... Very limited use....... Cough ...... Drop me a mail if interested ..... Cough

I must get that cough looked at 😉

Letmetalk - message sent 😉

I converted to tubeless on my dude no problem with the 3.8 JJ,s (originally using duck tape then waterproof joint sealing tape, used in wet rooms , much lighter and wider) but struggling now with the 4.8's simply because of the extra volume of the tyre (they are also quite 'baggy' on the rim), even with an airshot.

Vote for fbf / fbf here. Found then cheap on nextdaytire on line but watch for this versions. Told you want the 120 this which is what I have. My legs give in way before the grip in South Downs velcro mud 😉

James

Guess I must have been lucky as I've had no problem setting up 4.8" JJs or Bud/Lou on that rim using an Airshot. Just wrapped a couple of layers of fairly wide duct tape to seal the holes, but will probably switch to a more "plastic" tape at some point.

I've run the Bud as low as 3psi and it went round corners as fast as I dared to go on hard frosty ground with no burping.

Tubeless seems very rim dependent.

I have a Bud and a Floater on 80mm Nexties and the go up easily with a track pump. Without removing the valve cores.

Getting them off on the other hand...

And the Bud / Floater combo is fine in mud.

Yes must be - the JJ's on the On One rims were that slack it would have been like chucking a chipolata up an alleyway.

Got floaters front n rear on my fatty trail hope they last I'm to tight to by new fatty tyres.
floaters on emmental rims front tubeless easy rear on the other hand bloody night mare still loosing about 1-2 psi over 48hrs when standing need to see what the next ride brings

but really happy with the feel of the tyre grip and rolling not noticed any difference really to my magic mary and ardent combo on the full suss skinny wheeled bike

@golddigger having thrown wheels about the garage in frustration trying to get them set up tubeless with various gorilla, duck, pvc tape combos, with pints of stans, i went with fattystripper.com. latex strips you stick to rim. Up first time with floaters and no loss of pressure over time. Delivered from US really quickly too.

I was wrong about the tyre size on the canyon, there 4" not 4.8.
But the wheels are surprisingly lighter than I imagined. I'll weigh them later to see the weights with tubes in.
Might not make much difference in weight trying to get them tubeless..
[img] [/img]

Looks great. Now get it muddy 🙂

As I understand it, there is one model of the Dude that comes with 4.8" tyres (with the dropouts in the rear position), so you've got the option to go bigger if you want.

I think somebody published some tests showing the rolling resistance decreased a fair bit when you went tubeless on a fat tyre, so it's not just the weight saving to consider.

Anyway, have fun with it.

Looks lovely that does. So close to getting one it was only the 20% off the Fatty Trail on Crimbo Day that stopped me.
No regrets though - for all that's been said about On Ones own rims - I bloody love it. Out again today and had a blast.

Not found any increased drag tubeless. All depends the pressures you run i think.

I have a Dune and I'm running Floaters at the moment. I also have the Juggernauts that it came with. Do I need Jumbo Jim's while they are cheap?

On my FS I run a minion or Shorty up front and a minion or crossmark at the back.

I imagine I'll keep a Floater up front all year but will a Juggernaut do at the back for summer or will a JJ be better?

Dunno about the JJs but I've ordered some to find out. I swapped my rear Floater for a Maxxis Mammoth (£39.99 at On-One) in the summer for a noticeable decrease in drag. It's a bit slippy in the slop, though.