[Closed] Farmer gets very very nasty toward mtb group, help required, please.

Complain to your local rights of way officer.

Option 1: Video him being abusive then report to the police
Option 2: Deploy extreme violence

Don't s'pose you know a copper who rides do you? This sounds like a very unplesent man, with a big chip on his shoulder.

Cinnamon Girl of these parts has had farmer issues in the past, maybe she can help?

EDIT
Whereabouts is this?

Police

Well, first you need to find his shoes... 😉

epicsteve's suggestion 1 sound right.

ROW officer in the local authority for the location of the bridleway.

Coppers I imagine ultimately if you think it's worth it and feel it's worth the hassle / waste of their time etc. Personally I wouldn't bother with the plod but hey ho ...

Whats the basis for his complaint?

Report the situation to the rights of way officer, and video the farmer on your next ride - then report to the police I would say.

I guess mention it to the police anyway, then if the farmer takes it further, you already have the upper hand in looking like you want the situation diffused.

I like the idea of finding a couple of coppers who ride. That would sort it out fairly sharpish I imagine.

Local rights of way officer should take an interest as well.

In the first instance, call your local ROW officer - they're usually quite helpful. THe police won;t be interested until things escalate, which you are aiming to avoid. Where are you based / riding?

Ignore him.

Local ROW officer in the first instance - our local ROW people take stuff like this very, very seriously.

not sure ROW officer can help unless he is actually obstructing the right of way

also not sure it's a waste of police time, surely we pay taxes so the police are there to deal with such things. Fair enough they are overstretched and understaffed in moat areas but that doesn't you just stop using the facility

Police.

Sounds unacceptable to me. That said, I'd try and find him during daylight and ask him what the problem is. It might be that they have had problems with crime at night- not unusual- and are very suspicious of any activity after dark. Explain that you're not up to anything dodgy, you're acting responsibly (make sure he understands that) you have can continue to use the bridleway with or without his blessing, but you'd prefer to keep things friendly and hope there aren't any problems in the future. If he continues to act like a complete nob-end then ROW officer/police depending on what form that takes.

If it is because he has a problem with crime at night and you can talk to him, point out that simply by being there, you reduce the risk of crime as your average tea-leaf doesn't want several sets of 1000 lumens highlighting his activities.

I had a similar scenario a while back. Did nothing at first which was taken as a sign of weakness on my part, and caused the aggro to increase. Didn't get confrontational, just got enough details and went to see plod informally. They went round and had an informal chat. No more trouble.

ride somewhere else?

its not worth the agro surely?

mrmichaelwright - Member

not sure ROW officer can help unless he is actually obstructing the right of way

Intimidation is illegal too. Seriously, ROW officer is your first port of call

I'd avoid videoing, you are only going to upset him more. Crouch_spud has the right approach. Go and talk to him during the day and find out what his problem is.

I have no problem with farmers getting aggressive and have over many years realized you get good and nasty people in all walks of life, however some of the people I ride with are just getting into mtbing and they felt very threatened by this farmers behaviour. My concern is that when new riders go out and navigate for themselves as is the ultimate aim they may be off trail or just not sure of their rights. This farmer in my humble opinion would crucify anybody who was mistakenly on his land.

The trail is below Gillamoor heading north towards Rudland Rigg on the North Yorkshire Moors. Anyone else on here had dealings with this chap.

Cheers Nick.

id invite him on local radio and have an informed balanced debate about it

what kind of abuse is he hurling?

get it video'd, show it to the police.

I wouldn't poke a video in his face but the RoW officer or the (good suggestion) "nod to the plod" sound positive ways to deal with it, rather than getting all hoity-toity.

ride somewhere else?

its not worth the agro surely?

Hardly shows any backbone or blighty spirit old chap 😉

This is your next step

http://www.northyorks.gov.uk/index.aspx?articleid=3042

Thanks for the help and just to make things clear.

This chap has over the last most recent 3 incidents driven up from his farm house to hurl abuse, swearing and general very aggressive manner, and then followed the group down the road to his farm turn off.

When I was ridding during the day earlier this year, I spoke to the man politely, explained what we do, why we ride here and that we would be using bright lights across his land probably once a month. I know I didn’t need to do this however I have done my utmost to avoid confrontation. He was still very aggressive but at least I tried and he seemed to accept my right to use this bridleway during that conversation.

I could just not use this trail but I have genuine worries for the safety of other mtb’ers.
Spoke to police and they are not interested so going to try ROW people.

Thanks folks and cheers Nick.

suggest get local ROW officer to confirm is a bridleway (or other) before involving police unless it is clearly signposted
(funny how those signs disappear)
ROW people find it easier with Map references or similar email will be on Local Authority web site usually under highways you can then show response to police to support yr complaint and reduce any local police visit becoming a cosy chat / cup of tea / moan about poachers and people coming out from towns not understanding country ways etc etc etc

Nick
There is this:- [url= http://www.northyorkmoors.org.uk/content.php?nID=391 ]Rights of way feedback form[/url] - but in this case is worth the effort?
I should chill. Just accept thats what happens when riding that bridleway. He's never actually done any harm. I still cant work out how he gets his Land Rover to the end of the bridleway so quick, unless he is just sat there night after night waiting for us to come past....in which he has a v sad life and we win 🙂
besides gives us something to complain about for the rest of the ride.

which farm is it ? may be one we've had issues with as well

mart

B'jesus the forum is falling apart, where are the calls to pee in his boots or own him with bombers?
😆

Though I'd advocate videoing him, you don't have to stick a phone/camera in his face to get a decent video you can show people as proof, maybe if he reaslises you aren't going to be intimdated into stopping using the bridleway, and you will be following it up using every legal means he will get the message. Otherwise talk to the fed's [edit: I'd insist on talking to some-one like the duty sergeant because you believe this is could escalate into something worse - make a note of who you spoke to even if they won't do anything, you have proof you tried to deal with it] and your local Row officer, I'd do both so that if anything did escalate you have 'proof' you were trying to sort it out amicably pre any 'situation'.

Beat the living shit out of him and hang his head off your Thompson stem as a warning to all other farmers. (as he would do to a fox)

Is that better Zippy 😆

where are the calls to pee in his boots

I refer the poster to my original post up there.^

Mr p h the farm is marked on the map as Grays, to the left off highfield Lane heading NW out of Gillamoor, the bridleway is clearly marked and runs paralell to this lane from Faddell Rigg turning left 400mts before Grays where it changes to a footpath to Grays farm. It is a 100% clearley marked bridleway.

Cap Tang : This man is a danger to other mtbers and I intend to do something about him, his behaviour and attitude is not acceptable.

Nick.

Beat the living shit out of him and hang his head off your Thompson stem as a warning to all other farmers. (as he would do to a fox)

As he MIGHT do to a fox, surely?

not the one i was thinking off but he sounds a right tosser !!!!!!

I would certainly write a letter to the local police so that should things get worse, there is something on file. The police would generally have a word with him anyway after that just to let him know they're in the loop

C

Firstly, you're within your rights to use this path so I'd not be concerned once you can overlook the abuse. If the ROW office don't do anything then you're kind of on your own.

Secondly, having tried to be reasonable he's obviously still got a problem but he's obviously not prepared to share that with you, so that's his perogative.

My personal approach would actually be to use the path more often (maybe co-ordinate this with other riders so that the path is used every day!), I would expect that he'd soon get tired of hurling abuse if it became a weekly, or daily event! Petty, but ultimately entertaining.

If it ever gets violent of threatening then you're still in the right and then get the police involved.

Apart from the obvious, sensible suggestions - mass ride every night for a week. 😉

Result....ROW man very interested to speak to me further, this chap was already under watch ??
and on a lighter note…..Just an idea ? How about I get my lot, say about 20 riders, we then get 30 good folk of STW and do a night ride up this bridleway ? Probably meet the chap at the top of his lane and have a group hug

Thanks for all the help (and the funny aggressive bits) cheers Nick.

Cap Tang : This man is a danger to other mtbers and I intend to do something about him, his behaviour and attitude is not acceptable.

Fair enough ...just having a super mellow moment. Just give us a shout if ROW officer needs supprting statements etc.

t

Keep it legal initially.

If ROW man/Polis fall through, then take the piss. Mass rides, nail notices to every fence post detailing the relcvant section of the law, you name it. Try not to get shot mind.

Notice any interesting vegetation?

When people are unreasonably aggressive, I often find there is another reason.

In Oz this sort of behaviour would suggest he had an "alternative" crop and was wanting to keep people from seeing it. That he is on guard so quickly suggests he may actually be out every night keeping an eye on it.

It's not this c0ck is it ?

[img] [/img]

Get the police involved and let us know how it develops.

No probs Tangs, and if I need you evidence I will let you know.

Still on a lighter note “epicyclo” there was a large truck delivering stuff marked hydroponics, barns all lit up like 4th of July, large thick black power cables running everywhere, windows boarded up with black bin liners, 1000 bags of compost stacked ready to grow something in and I felt slightly dizzy when I got nearer the farm so , no nothing to suggest something dodgy going on…..lol

http://www.videojug.com/article/how-to-make-a-tazer-out-of-a-disposable-camera

I'd want to speak to the police and try and get something in their files. Even an email to your CPO. Mainly just in case he escalates and actually knocks one of you off.

His inevitable excuse of 'I didn't expect bikers to be around at that time and didn't see him' will be far less credible.

Chr1st I'm pessimistic today! :-/

We had a similar problem (the farmer's wife actually) that was solved via ROW officer. She'd padlocked the gate blocking a BOAT so there was concrete evidence when the ROW chap visited.

RicB - that's not 'Screaming Farmers Wife' @ Bramhope(ish) N.Leeds by any chance, is it?

There used to be a similar farmer around here. He used to threaten people with shooting while holding a shotgun under his arm.

He did it to a group of bikers once to often. One was a firearms rozzer who had him in the back of a van within 30 minutes, and he was sent down for it.

Bingo.

I'd video him; the more irate he gets, the better the footage.

I've been on that track this summer, but it was during the day and had no trouble,which is good as i was on my own.

Are you truning right to join the road before it turns into a footpath (sorry to ask such an obvious question, as i'm sure you can read a map). Just interested as i plan on doing that route again soon.

Its also on the Hutton le Hole route in the VG North York Moors route guide, so i'd expect he should see quite a few bikers about.

[i]He generally brings his “large son” in a land rover to the end of the bridleway, waits until we have gone through the last gate and then starts to get abusive and confrontational ?, before following the group back to the main road hurling abuse from his vehicle.[/i]

beat him up ?

Abuse.. what does he say?

Blackflag; Yes I definetly keep to the bridleway and not the path, as the path goes straight to his farm and the bridleway intersection is clearly marked.

Gruenermoench: He uses several expletives but seems to struggle with large words. On the funny side he seems to think we are on the whole a bunch of freaks how hang around the moors in large groups in the dark covered in copious amount of mud …… hang on a minute he may just be correct ? It takes all sorts to make a world.

Lord Greenville- yes that was indeed the one and only Screaming Farmers Wife!

I think it was Jules who sorted it all, I can't take any credit.

Our local Police became involved (were really very good) when people felt threatened, had a chat and no probs since.

Given the increase in countryside crime how does a "poor"farmer judge who are the good guys and who is not??

Not excusing him in any way but my countryside living mate has just had the radio stolen out of his van parked beside his house overnight. ironically his son is a PC and so is his neighbour..................
Seems to be a bit of an outbreak around here recently of farm thefts.

Some areas of North Yorks/Lakes have set up a neighbourhood watch style patrol system to monitor the lanes and hills, can`t remember what it is called.
[url= http://www.countrysidewatch.org.uk/ ]This maybe?[/url]

If he is agressive try a good old fashioned letter copied to the chief constable, ROW man, council chief,any other local farmers co-operative/organisation and your/a solicitor.
Must be a local branch of http://www.nfuonline.com/x2630.xml

invite horse for a ride with you - not only is he huge hes also a bobby (in settle ) g

STW forum ride, 49 people may trump his 'large son'.

Report it to the ROW oficier and the police, then video it and repeat the complaint. Bit like nasty dogs really, need to attack at least twice before it is taken seriously 👿

[i]Spoke to police and they are not interested [/i]

Not good enough. What he's doing is illegal. That's not civil, 'Rights of Way illegal' it's 'criminal' 'police action required' - 'behaviour likely to cause a breach of the peace' at very least due to his language.

Who did you speak to? Local plod? PC on the phone? Which force are we talking about? I'd call the switchboard, ask to speak to the Duty Inspector and explain again politely that you'd like them to give him and son 'words of advice' at the very least.

Tell him you will poison his sheep and burn his house if he doesn't leave off?

Tell him you're going to report him to the police and local firearms officer for abusive and threatening behavior if he continues. Maybe the thought the loss of his guns may calm him down a bit.

What's the "local firearms officer" got to do with all this ? No mention of guns by the OP.

Chop off a sheeps head and leave it on the drivers seat of his landrover.

Phone and ask to speak to his son, tell him your his boy friend.

Phone the police and say he said he has a gun and will shoot you if you don't stay off his land.

Or perhaps not.

If a gun license holder has been threatening/abusive the police have the right to take away his gun license therefore he can loose his guns. As I was told by three people this week at work who all shoot.

Ah, I see - good point.

To keep you good people informed:

No doubt this farmer and probably his son have a big gun each with the appropriate licences. I am not looking to cause a massive issue here and make these peoples life’s more difficult or to become vindictive , I just feel there must come a point where he is told by the relevant authority that his persistant abusive behaviour is unacceptable and he must allow groups to use this bridleway without feeling the need to cause confrontation.

As I said ROW office is now looking into the matter and I would assume they will let me know the outcome in due course.

If get my head blown off next week please give my cycle to charity .

Nick.

If he hasn't threatened anyone with a gun, it's not fair to accuse him of this. A gun on a farm is an essential tool.

>If he hasn't threatened anyone with a gun, it's not fair to accuse him of this. A gun on a farm is an essential tool.

Yes but as above you want level-headed reasonable people to be licensed to hold/use firearms. Not loons who repeatedly threaten/intimidate people going about legal activities.

[i]it's not fair to accuse him of this[/i]

It's not fair for him to be abusive. As far as I understood it a gun doesn't have to be present it's the abusive behavior of the individual, but I could be wrong.

Have you actually tried talking with him and tried to understand him? From experience some blokes can be confrontational on the trails, particularly in a group situation.

It's easy for us to forget that the countryside is a place of work for many, they don't see it as a playground. The point made about countryside thefts of machinery etc is a good one.

Non-riders do not understand why anyone would want to ride a bike in the dark. Why not explain to him that it's fun. Perhaps it is his livestock he is concerned about, particularly if they need to be moved, or are pregnant, or are youngsters. Talk with him.

As mentioned earlier, I did have "discussions" with a landowner cos I objected to his two Great Dane pups continually jumping up at my wheels and him not keeping them under control on a bridleway that ran through his land.

He ranted then turned his back on me (I was on my own) but I had a long discussion with his wife explaining how frightening their behaviour was. Eventually it came out that they disliked mountain bikers and a mountain biker had even kicked their dogs! What a surprise!

This person was known to some of the Chiltern locals on here. I eventually reported him to the Rights of Way Officer and he now seems to have disappeared.

ride naked. problem solved, no one dares argue with the naked cyclist!

How many of you ?
Just all of you keep saying all right or evening
in the end he has no right to block or stop you.

Wouldnt bother chatting to him/them
there is no reason as you have done no wrong

cinnamon_girl

Good morning, it would help if you read my earlier posts on this matter.

I live and work in the countryside and during my limited spare time I ride and seek to promote responsible useage of trails and bridleways by mountain bikers both old and new as I passionately believe in mountain biking and cycling and the benefits it can bring to peoples fitness, attitudes and life styles. It allows us to play like kids again on bikes, talk mtb bollocks and have fun.

I know it can be tuff being a moor land farmer and that they work hard. I have great sympathy and respect for all that they do as custodians of the country side.

I have however no sympathy for his aggressive, nasty verbal and intimidating actions when we use the bridleway across his land. I assume he just does not like mtber’s but this fact alone doesn’t justify his continued aggressive actions.

As I said in early posts, thanks for all the good advise and ROW people involved now.

Nick.

I eventually reported him to the Rights of Way Officer and he now seems to have disappeared.

I think they exceeded their authority there - I don't think they're alllowed to off people.

A gun on a farm is an essential tool.

A quick one on this. As a police officer and an MTBer i would suggest that a mobile phone video of him being abusive is great. He will be commiting an offence as the bridleway is a public place and if you or your fellow riders are feeling alarmed, harrased or distressed by his action, or indeed even afraid of physical harm, then you should definately report this individual to your local constabulary. After all as law abiding member of the public you are entitled to use the bridleway as long as you respect his livestock and do as you say, close gates and the such.

I hope that your local police force will look into this. Do they have Police officers on bikes where you are (they do round here) Might be a good idea if they do to invite one along when he is on duty one night.

Hope this helps.

Organise a flashmob sponsored by Lupine?

I don't suppose this farmer may be involved in dog fighting or some other sinister activity? He may be wanting to keep observant eyes away!

spray a shitty apollo hardtail white and stick some 'POLICE' stickers on the downtube.
when he starts his tirade of abuse just point at the frame.
You might get done for impersonating a police officer , but only as likely as someone wearing Police sunglasses.

From experience i would suggest informing your local constabulary. They have at there disposal (depending on force area a number of tools to hand) one being a harassment warning. This is basically a piece of paper which describes what harassment is and checks his/her understanding as to what harassment is. This serves to do a couple of things. 1) it brings him to the attention of the local neighbourhood policing team 2) it removes his defence that he didnt know what harassment is/was. Although an harassment warning isn't an admission to the offence it states that the course of conduct they have been using is deemed to be harassing by the receiving party.
If however things were to escalate after the warning has been given there are various sections of the Public Order Act (POA) that cover situations like this. Basically anything that causes that person or any other person present to feel harassment/alarm/distress would fall under sections 5, 4A and 4. Google the various sections for a full explanation.

vario_99