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I have disc and rim braked road bikes.
Whilst I find rim bakes fine in rain and for general riding for me the disc has a clear advantage in the wet weather emergency stop during commuting scenario.
The other advantages of discs can be negated by better anticipation on rim brakes but not a sudden stop in the rain.
I have found the down sides being the great joy of bleeding road discs and good old leaking Shimano calipers. Also hope calipers don't like road salt...
What rims/blocks/brakes?
I know you weren't asking me : ) but on that point I built a bike recently with Shimano R650 deep-drops, Kool Stop Salmon pads and a non-compressible disc outer for the rear and I'm really impressed by the brake power and feel, and how even they feel between front and rear. The only thing that's better with my Ultegra road brakes on the other bike is how the Shimano pad compound seems to build in power in the first few seconds as it heat up. Some magic stuff in those pads, they're amazing in the Alps.
Personally I’d want clearance for 32c
I am all for disc brakes on road bikes, but as for tyre size, do I remember incorrectly in thinking that the aero and drag advantages of larger tyres are lost after 28mm?
Brakes?
I have an Kinesis Aithein with Bontrager Speed Limit callipers and Swiss Stop pads. I ride in the Lakes and have never felt I absolutely NEED disc brakes on it.
BUT dropping down Honister there is no doubt in my mind discs would be a lot more 'comfy'. I also avoid riding my road bike in the wet!!! I have a mountain bikes and cross bikes for that (with disc brakes).
So for me the answer is it depends on the riding you do - if you only ride your road bike on sunny days in a relatively flat bit of the country I'd not bother with discs.
The only thing that’s better with my Ultegra road brakes on the other bike is how the Shimano pad compound seems to build in power in the first few seconds as it heat up. Some magic stuff in those pads, they’re amazing in the Alps.
Ditto, my Ultegras with stock pads on Fulcrum alloy are astonishing, I got a fright the first time I used them this year! They've never seen rain right enough
The only downside I've found with road discs is the noise. The Shimano on the BMC and the Sram on the PlanetX both scream like banshees. I've never had that a bad noise on an MTB.
I have my ‘nice’ road bike with rim brakes and carbon wheels. No issues with braking whatsoever. As has been said above it’s normally the road interface that causes braking issues.
I also have a CX bike with discs for winter, crappy weather.
Personally I prefer the look, simplicity and performance of rim brakes.
Also (not to preach) but if I’m approaching a roundabout in wet conditions I’ve probably already sat up and started dragging brakes…
Sure, but the whole point of disc brakes is that you don't have to signal to the engine room for reverse ten minutes before you need to stop.
For the most part, I find braking limited by the rubber/tarmac interface than how the braking force is applied.I’m surprised at all the people criticising rim brakes for power, I’ve always been able to lock the wheels, in pretty much any kind of conditions.
(talking average day-to-day riders here, not pros but...) You can overtake any rim-braked road bike on a descent because you can brake later and harder on discs.
There's plenty of descents near me (Peak District) where I'll be sitting up and dragging brakes on a rim-brake bike because they simply don't have the all-out stopping power and modulation of discs.
With discs, I can freewheel or pedal down it, brake far later and still slow down to the same speed to get round the corner. My DB CX bike is far faster on descents than my RB road bike, in spite of having lower gearing and much fatter tyres.
I mean, if a car salesman today said to you: "certainly Sir, would you like the Ferrari with carbon-ceramic discs or with drum brakes?" - which are you going to answer...?
I went for calipers when I got my (cheap) carbon road bike the other year as I was trying to get in to road work and wanted a bike as light as I could afford. They've been fine for what I need, good enough to not think I need discs. Saying that, I don't ride it that often and always in good weather. No plans to buy another but if I did I'd probably go disc unless the caliper option was significantly lighter/better spec'ed.
With discs, I can freewheel or pedal down it, brake far later and still slow down to the same speed to get round the corner. My DB CX bike is far faster on descents than my RB road bike, in spite of having lower gearing and much fatter tyres.
Are you sure that's not because fatter tyres, thus increasing the contact patch?
I'm in the Peak District too, and have both disc and rim braked road bikes. For the most part I don't think that discs make too much odds. If anything, the rim braked ones descend better, but I think that's geometry rather than braking performance.
With discs or rim brakes, I'm always more worried about braking hard and sliding off the road than lack of power.
Rim brakes look nicer. That’s just an objective fact.
They look shit and old fashioned. They’ve been superseded and will hopefully disappear in a few years.
Rim brakes look nicer. That’s just an objective fact.
You need a new dictionary mate. You’ve just just stated it’s influenced by your opinion FFS.
Disc brakes have greater power and modulation. Rim brakes are lighter. Both objective facts.
I think <anything> is subjective.
IANAET.
Personally I think it depends on how you intend to use it.
For me I don’t need discs, because I’m not commuting in all weathers, and I’m not riding for fun in crap weather.
If I was then discs are definitely better, they work better, they don’t need much in the way of maintenance and you don’t wear out you rims.
Rim brakes are lighter, cheaper and easier to fettle.
I’ve got discs at the mo, because I got it for commuting originally.
I’ve have a road disc bike and road rim brake bike - both decent quality.
My observations:
Braking - Disc are more efficient, that’s not up for discussion imo.
Rim wear - Disc will not knacker your rims.
Tyre clearance - if you want to run bigger tyres discs will enable this.
However........ I prefer my rim bike, it feels more lively for some reason, but on a long ride I take the disc bike as it’s more relaxed. (Both bikes are hand built with very similar geometry so in theory should ride the same).
Someone was mentioning road disc setup.
Personally I think it depends on how you intend to use it.
For me I don’t need discs, because I’m not commuting in all weathers, and I’m not riding for fun in crap weather.
Exactly, which is why there is no right or wrong about it. The type of riding I do mean I don't need any brakes other than my fixed wheel (boo, hiss, brakeless fixed gear rider)
If I rode where I needed to actually slow down quickly or even stop I would run a calliper brake.
If I commuted all year round I would run a disc brake
As many have said for commuting or lots of riding in poor weather discs win.
How much of a fair weather cyclist are you? I generally only take the road bike out on decentish days. I’ve got ultegra discs on my nice bike but if I was buying again I’d get rim brakes. The asymmetric front wheel is a horrible thing to look at as you cycle along and for nice weather cycling rim brakes are great.
The asymmetric front wheel is a horrible thing to look at as you cycle along
Possibly the weirdest objection to disc brakes I've seen…
People look down at their front wheel ? Is that how people ride into parked cars and the like.
How much of a fair weather cyclist are you?
OBJECTION! 😉 2 of my 4 rim brake bikes are designed specifically for the miserable conditions (yes, I have the luxury of a winter bike AND a shoulder season bike 😎 )
People look down at their front wheel ?
I do, gives me a good indication of how squint my pelvis is if I can see more of one side of my front wheel, or the other 😁
So coming back to the OPs use case.
He's already stated he's looking for a year round bike, which would tend to nudge most people towards discs and was sort of looking at the trade off (VFM wise) between his current budget either covering Ultegra (with rim brakes) or having to drop down to 105 to get discs...
And I think if I were in the same position shopping for a new road bike I would choose the 105 disc option myself, despite being happy enough with rim brakes and their performance in various conditions, the world is heading towards roadbikes using hydraulic disc brakes and overall that's a positive thing...
What I certainly wouldn't choose now would be mechanical discs (I have BB5s on my gravel bike and IMO/IME they're not that great). Fortunately mechanical discs are appearing less often on spec sheets, but there are a few companies still using them to hit a price point...
I’m still a big fan of cable discs and have no desire to use hydraulics; for me there’d only really be disadvantages. That’s just me, though 🙂
The world does appear to be divided Bez
Those who can set up cable disks and those who miscall them at every opportunity 🙂
I can set them up, they've been on my gravel bike for almost 4 years, I used them this afternoon and I am still alive, but they are more faff, requiring more maintenance and more frequent adjustment and (IMO) aren't that much better than a cable rim brake for feel or 'power'...
If you're going to have disc brakes why opt for the inferior version? (aside from cost, which is ironically enough why I have them)...
A friend of mine came off his road bike this morning when a combination of a speed-induced wobble and completely ineffective (rim) brakes in torrential conditions caused him to hit his son and take both of them down.
Yes, there's a pile of things that were probably done wrong - too fast for conditions, poorly seated tyre (seems to have been the starting point), poor/worn out brakes and the fact that he's not the world's greatest descender, but the reality is that, had he had disc brakes, a gentle application of the rear brake would have been guaranteed to stop the wobble in 100% of conditions.
Speaking personally, I've had a car pull out in front of me in wet conditions and I only just managed to avoid a collision thanks to some pretty heavy emergency braking. Had I not had discs, in anything other than perfectly dry conditions with a perfectly configured rim/brake setup, I'd have been pulling teeth out of her bonnet.
Yes, they can squeal a bit in the wet (blow torch!), but I'll take a bit of noise over expensive dental repairs any day of the week.
What I certainly wouldn’t choose now would be mechanical discs (I have BB5s on my gravel bike and IMO/IME they’re not that great). Fortunately mechanical discs are appearing less often on spec sheets, but there are a few companies still using them to hit a price point…
Went to an LBS earlier this year and was really disappointed to see piles of Giant bikes with their daft mechanical/hydraulic hybrid system. I thought that this had been relegated to history by proper hydraulic groupsets, but it seems that Giant must still have a warehouse full of them and are determined to use them up. It would certainly put me off buying any of these bikes!
Thanks again for all the many responses, I'm definitely saving up and going for discs. If anyone has any interest left, are Ultegra discs significantly better then 105?
Cheers
If you’re going to have disc brakes why opt for the inferior version? (aside from cost, which is ironically enough why I have them)…
Two fold.
1. Cost.
2. Ease of maintainance.
I have them on the touring bike because most faults can be repaired with a single hex key.
My hydraulic ones are better but the mechanicals are still streaks ahead of the rim brakes. (6600 and 6700 and Mavic sac's on carbon rims. )
Yes, there’s a pile of things that were probably done wrong – too fast for conditions, poorly seated tyre (seems to have been the starting point), poor/worn out brakes and the fact that he’s not the world’s greatest descender, but the reality is that, had he had disc brakes, a gentle application of the rear brake would have been guaranteed to stop the wobble in 100% of conditions.
I really don't get how you reckon disc brakes are the answer.
Worn out brakes affect discs too, and I really don't get how it helps with a poorly seated tyre.
are Ultegra discs significantly better then 105?
No
Two fold.1. Cost.
2. Ease of maintainance.I have them on the touring bike because most faults can be repaired with a single hex key.
A friend on TransCon used cable disc brakes, her reckoning being that as she wasn't very mechanically minded, she'd find it easier to work with cables (and local shops probably more able to supply cables) than potentially ending up with a hydro leak or other problem.
Ended with her up at about 3000m in some mountain range in the pouring rain, bitterly cold as she tried to unfreeze cables and adjust pads. Hydros would just have worked.
IME, cable disc brakes are the worst of both worlds.
I have things the wrong way round. My all year round commuter bike (Genesis Equilibrium) has rim brakes - TRP-RG957s. My nice bike, which only really sees the summer months (Canyon ultimate) has disk brakes.
Tbe genesis gets ridden in all conditions - rain, sleet and the small amount of snow we might get in London. The TRPs are actually excellent - so no you don't NEED disks, but if I was buying a bike, I doubt I'd be looking at rim brakes. Disks are better, they modulate more effectively and make a lot more sense. I've had some high speed scares with cars turning across me on the canyon and managed to avoid crashing - I don't think I would have avoided the crash with rim brakes.
Just got a new bike and gone from 105 to Ultegra - can't say I've noticed any real improvement in braking or shifting to be honest.
My swop to road discs was based on regularly descending a local hill...found consistently faster and happier on mtb
...long single lane rd with unmarked junction at bottom and a bridge that could only see on coming traffic very late...on road bike always scared of grabbing too much brake...know shouldn't but for me easy in an emergency speed kill...mtb with discs more modulation more confident could safely kill speed...so discs it was for me with the benefits of wider tyres and not checking rims...