[Closed] Bunnyhop Coaching

Why doesn't he just go out and play on his bike?

Bunnyhops aren't difficult.

If I can teach most U16yr old non bike riders to bunnyhop in an hour I can't see a compitent XC/CX racer being very difficult to teach.

Can't you bunnyhop?

Both of you sit down an watch this, drop your saddles and go out for an hour. you'll get it.

Tip:

Practice on the shortest bikes you have. It's way less effort on a shorter bike. 😉

That vid shows a totally different technique to the one I've used.  I started by getting confident with lifting the front wheel, then once the front wheel is up you push the bar away from you while unweighting the back and that rotates the bike around its centre of mass, lifting the back wheel.  No idea which one's best, but expect it'll be geex's 😀

FWIW I just went onto a quiet bit of fire road and mucked about until it clicked, then practised on most rides after that.  I was using flats and was convinced I'd be all over the place and end up shredding my shins/calves but it was all painless.  Wheelies though....

Where in the south?

John

What's happened to the art of 'pissing about on bikes'? Why is the default now 'pay a person'?
With YouTube on mobile it's more accessible than ever! Go out with him and piss about on a bit of waste ground for a few hours. It's how everyone I know learned.

Just do it on flats. Practice lots. It's frustrating, but it'll click eventually.:)

GMBN ,

https://www.gmbn.com/category/how-to

I started by getting confident with lifting the front wheel

Well for a start you shouldn't be "lifting" the front wheel.
the rest of what you've described (badly) sounds exactly what Duncan is teaching in the above video.

As weird as it sounds - hold the handlebars the wrong way round so your palms are pointing up & pull up, the rest should follow

I could not bunnyhop despite how much I messed around or how many videos I watched! 15 min with a coach explaining and telling you what you need to do differently changed everything!

What submarined said.

I'm franky surprised anyone'd even enter a CX or mtb race if they couldn't perform a basic maneover like a bunnyhop. and that is what it is. a basic skill. something every mtber should be able to perform without difficulty after a very short time riding.
There's little point arguing about it though and by all means pay for lessons if you'd rather.
There are tons of decent mtb coaches in the south.

As weird as it sounds – hold the handlebars the wrong way round so your palms are pointing up & pull up, the rest should follow

Yep. The spectators and other kids should certainly "enjoy" that each time the lad comes up to a cyclocross barrier.

;D

(Techniques) No idea which one’s best, but expect it’ll be geex’s 😀

That would seem to be his impression...

The South is a big area,Ollie is a good guy if your anywhere near him or where he coaches.

Live Biking - Coaching

My personal experience:
I was used for years to the typical (and ineffective...) xc rider english bunny hop by simply pulling the bike with the SPDs.
Half an year of flat pedals on the enduro bike was enough to learn easily how to do a proper bunny hop.

For me, the trick to understand the proper movement was simply standing next to the bike and grabbing the handlebar. You then start by pulling up the handlebar, lifting the front of the bike.
Next, do the same, but, when you reach the top of the lift,push the handlebar forward. The rear wheel should go up and you'll get the bike in the air for a moment.
Then do the same while riding, synchronizing a "jump" with that motion.

With flats, when everything is done properly, I don't even have to do the "scrapping" thing on the pedals, you simply go together with the bike

I’m franky surprised anyone’d even enter a CX or mtb race if they couldn’t perform a basic maneover like a bunnyhop.

I've done plenty of CX & mtb races without being able to bunnyhop (or manual, wheelie or any other gravity defying stunt)

Sure I can get both wheels off the ground at the same time but not with any control and definitely not a stylish front wheel up first followed by the back, more just yanking up with my pedals. Then again, I can't even ride around a carpark on a bike with flat pedals without embedding one or both of them into my shins 🙂

(Techniques) No idea which one’s best, but expect it’ll be geex’s 😀

That would seem to be his impression…

ermmm... that's not geex's technique, it's just how you do a bunnyhop. Quite surprised he teaches the two wheel hop first though.

a two wheel (or English) bunnyhop is incredibly easy to perform.
Teaching it first teaches non-cyclists/clueless people/complete beginners/stubborn old fools/fearties/ etc. (and those under pressure) how to pre-load and unweight a bike very quickly without messing with their head IanPV.

it also teaches foot placement and weight placement.

but... shhh....

i didn't tell you this

I think bunnyhops are easy to learn, but hard to master, most people can't be bothered to learn let alone practice them.

When you watch really good riders hop (particularly BMXers) the bars always end up in, or very close, to their laps before they shove, scoop and level out.

Pulling the bars into my lap with straight arms helped me gain height. Some people might find it easier to imagine thrusting their hips towards their bars, but it's the same deadlift type movement.

The Skills with Phill bunny hop clinic video is the best I've seen on YouTube:

Well for a start you shouldn’t be “lifting” the front wheel.
the rest of what you’ve described (badly) sounds exactly what Duncan is teaching in the above video.

OK I'll bite.

See that video just up there, the one with everybody getting the front wheel off the ground before the back wheel - that's called 'lifting the front wheel' in my world.  As in raising the front wheel off the ground.  Maybe in your world of awesomeness there's some fancy word for it, but most folk would understand what I meant.

I rode the boards last season in every cross race that had them and don't really know how to bunnyhop properly - could prob manage an ugly one on the MTB. Not sure your lad needs to worry about replicating a manual-style bunny hop on a youtube vid, it's a different proposition in a race - cross bike often on softish ground, contesting the line with other riders, you frequently have to muscle it over a bit but it's not difficult. Steaming into the boards fast, or dropping a huge Nys-like attack into them, is a different story but he can cross that bridge when he comes to it.

The thing to absolutely do is nail it in practice, as if you're doubtful about it you're unlikely to pull it out first lap with the prospect of fifty blokes riding over you if you get it wrong.
Guaranteed to give places around the level I race at, as we're not super smooth on the dismounts and remounts. At the front it seems more of a 50/50 proposition over the boards, but it can make a big difference to what comes immediately afterwards e.g. carrying momentum into a slope etc.

Thanks for all the replies and useful links. I probably didn't explain very well, he can bunnyhop pretty well, enough for roots and kerbs, and messes around on his bike on flats a lot. It's just fully mastering it to jump the double 40cm hurdles in cross races he wanted help for. I have said it'll come eventually with practice but wondered if there was someone who could help out. Surrey Hills, Swinley area is best.

Well for a start you shouldn’t be “lifting” the front wheel.

So when at 1:50 the bloke on your video says "you should lift the front wheel by using the handlebars, like this.." he's doing it wrong? That's probably not a great video to recommend then.

Think my Dad taught me to bunny hop, the 'English' version of course. Later I learnt the 'American' bunny hop.
But in answer to bunny hopping higher, another couple of useful videos:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q5zBbLWIhHY

It’s just fully mastering it to jump the double 40cm hurdles in cross races he wanted help for.

Back in the 90's we built one of those bunnyhop high jump things that you used to see at bike shows and I went from around 6 inches to my personal record of 38. This was in the space of a few hours outside my mates house. I thought I was a guaranteed trials legend.

Seriously, build something 40cm high that won't hurt when you crash into it, and just hop it for as long as it takes. Once he hones in on the technique he'll just go up and up.

EDIT: Actually, I'm gonna build one myself! I've got a mint jump bike but I've totally lost my pop. It's an essential skill for boosting jumps.

bunnyhopping a cx bike is a bit harder than a mtb or especially BMX - they're fairly long by comparison and have high saddles, neither of which helps.

I can BH an mtb pretty well but in all my (3 race) cx career I've never hopped the boards. I'm typically right in the middle of a massive bunch on lap 1 and that tends to slow to unfeasible pace for me at the boards. Next lap my effort's so high I can barely steer and that just gets worse as the race goes on. The amount of time I'd lose by failing a hop is way less than what I'd gain (and that's despite my remounts being a little bit shoddy too)

There's one of the top 10 pros who has a pretty suspect hop and for most of the races I saw he reverted to running. Lost barely any time and was actually consistently faster in one race.

The amount of time I’d lose by failing a hop is way less than what I’d gain

err, other way round, obvz

Seriously, build something 40cm high that won’t hurt when you crash into it, and just hop it for as long as it takes. Once he hones in on the technique he’ll just go up and up.

We did this, we just leant a strip of ply around a foot and half (aaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh! Imperial! What's that, around 450mm?) tall against a wall so that it'd fall forward if we caught it on the way up. I was able to clear it on my old Soul 26 but I just roll through it now on my FS [sad face smiley]

If the lad knows how to bunnyhop already getting them consistently higher won't be difficult.
All he has to do is preload harder, raise the front wheel higher, pop more and tuck (legs) more.
SPDs are far easier to hop a bike with fully extended seat post high.
Find a 40cm wide plank. Of wood you can balance on its side to practice on (once he's noticeably improving)

Be careful choosing a skills coach. I know a few who'd struggle to hop a CX barrier on a CX bike.

Worrying but true.

Maybe when he's mastered it your lad can help nickc. Nick loves to try and have a pop at every opportunity but hits the barrier every try.

bunnyhopping a cx bike is a bit harder than a mtb or especially BMX

It certainly is but that just means you won't be able to get the same height as easily. I can bunny hop okay. Learnt as a kid by turning mates BMXes upside down and hopping over them so a good incentive to clear the bike as it tended to hurt when getting it wrong!

And while I wouldn't attempt to do that on a CX bike I wouldn't need to get to that height.

Pretty decent name for a coaching business.

Thanks, think preloading harder sounds like a good tip. He can lift the rear wheel in flats high enough, just needs to get the front higher. Already built a plastic pipe hurdle he takes to the park in a rucksack.

The problems I find with the “just go out and practice” attitude is it usually comes from people that MTB tricks come naturally to.

Often just going out to practice can reinforce bad habits and make things worse. My natural response to bunny hops and jumping in general was the dead sailor bar tweak and it’s taken a lot of work to try and try and correct that.

Now I have a nice plaster cast to show for it and can’t ride for 6 weeks. No more jumps until I’ve had some coaching :/

Yeah whatever you do, DO NOT let your child just go outside and play on his bike. Qualified coaches and risk assessments all round.

^^ Ha ha! What a great pic that is.
The '70s summed up in one pic.👍

Good thread by the way. I used to cheat with spd's but riding flats I'm gradually getting there. Outs much more rewarding being able to do it with flats too.

I'll always be s*** technically but it's fun trying to improve!

All those saying it's easy and can be taught in an hour ??

It is hard.
I have been trying for 5 years and still can't hop properly.
I can just about get onto a kerb and that's about it.
I ride regularly as well and still don't get it. I can do very techy descents yet I struggle like mad with trying to bunny hop, manual or do Endo 180's.

Endo 180’s.

I haven't seen anyone do one of these for about a decade!

But seriously, I learned how to do 180 endos to 180 out in my tiny back garden when I was about 15. It's an evenings effort at best.

I learned to manual in B&Q car park. One car parking space at a time until I could hold it as long as I wanted. This was on a BMX with no brakes.

You can watch as many YouTube videos as you want but you won't nail anything until you put the hours in.

Disclaimer: I can't do any of this stuff now. It's hard as a grown man to find the time to do wheelies around your closest car park and I totally get that.

Does spending a couple of hours practising wheelies, manuals, bunny hops and Endo 180's in a Carpark on a FS count as 2 more hours towards the 50 hours where the suspension all needs servicing again ??

Does spending a couple of hours practising wheelies, manuals, bunny hops and Endo 180’s in a Carpark on a FS count as 2 more hours towards the 50 hours where the suspension all needs servicing again ??

😆

What tyres and pressures for playing out?