[Closed] Black ice - so that's what the fuss is about.....

already had mine. 1st day of the freeze and haven't commuted since 😕

No black ice round here - the roads are too covered in deep snow and/or slush. Supposed to be -9 overnight tonight and a max of -3 all day tomorrow so it'll going to be a nightmare on the roads in the morning.

Totally crazy riding in this weather unless you avoid roads altogether. I was driving to work the other day and there was a woman on a bike that everyone was trying to avoid which just ended up with loads of cars skidding about as they had to move out of the ruts. Only a matter of time before someone slid into her. I commute in most weather but ice and heavy snow are just too dangerous.

Main roads round here are clear, the other roads are compacted snow now freezing over for the night, the Nutbrook Trail is still several inches of soft fluffy white stuff.

Winter studded tyres, bought or homemade.

Thread closed.

Us XC90 drivers are a considerate bunch. For christ sake dont cycle tomorrow. Its going to be black ice all over. Minus 8 in Leeds tonight. Not looking forward to commute to Harrogate tomorrow.

[i]Winter studded tyres, bought or homemade.
Thread closed.[/i]

Not closed at all. Can't see how a studded tyre will stop a car sliding into you.

Im finding the 2.3 slicks more predictable than the nevegals last year

Gary_M

Just like cycling without a helmet - personal preference - I have come down on black ice twice in the last 6 years of commuting - more embarrassing than anything.

I think therefore we should ALL stay in, not drive, walk, cycle, take the train coz it might be risky!

That's not quite the point foxyrider. There is no denying the fact that riding on the road in these conditions is extremely dangerous. If someone chooses to do it then that's up to them but that's just my opinion based on experience of attempting to ride in very bad ice and snow. Sometimes it's just not worth it.

It's the silence. You're riding along with the familiar scrunching from under the tyres and then suddenly you realise it's all gone quiet and you just know what's going to happen next... 😯

Then I would say don't drive as you may run down a pedestrian?

That said I will go off road as much as possible in this weather to have more fun and to avoid black ice!

Gary_M - Member

That's not quite the point foxyrider. There is no denying the fact that riding on the road in these conditions is extremely dangerous.

rubbish. I shall contine to ride around as I do normally. Get a grip 🙂

Why would you say than? Generally cars don't randomly fall over on black ice, if you're on a bike you do.

there is an art to falling.

the quicker you realise you are going down and just roll with it the less damage you do, it's going to hurt but not that much. it hurts more when you try and stop it and end up with limbs going in all directions!

avoid the main roads and just just enjoy the white stuff on the side roads/parks

Gary_M

That's not quite the point foxyrider. There is no denying the fact that riding on the road in these conditions is extremely dangerous.

It was in reply your your post:

I don't like falling on black ice - my point was that - not that I shouldn't commute to work in this weather because is Sooooo dangerous - I sort of agree with TJ but maybe not in quite a strong way.

Do you get what I mean - Black ice isn't nice when you come down on it - thats it 🙂

Gary_M - Member
That's not quite the point foxyrider. There is no denying the fact that riding on the road in these conditions is extremely dangerous.

Dangerous? I just had 3 days of the best commutes ever. Roads are quiet, everyone is very friendly, no one is in a manic rush. I wish it was always like that.

If someone chooses to do it then that's up to them but that's just my opinion

Yep - just your opinion.

Yeh whatever, just hope I don't come across you when I'm driving.

Dangerous? I just had 3 days of the best commutes ever. Roads are quiet, everyone is very friendly, no one is in a manic rush. I wish it was always like that.

Cool - nice one 🙂

I love the snow as its a good excuse to commute on my HT and go off road (and take a little longer) - not cars, few walkers loads a fun 🙂

Gary_M - Member
Yeh whatever, just hope I don't come across you when I'm driving.

If you're driving suitably for the conditions there shouldn't be a problem.

I normally ride to work off road so cars not an issue, yesterday the snow was just too deep on the off road route so went up the dual carriageway where it was easier riding. Didn't have a single car pass me. Roads busier this morning, but not slippy at all. I'm not looking forward to tomorrow morning though, they're predicting -11 eek.

I lost a very good friend a few years ago who slid on black ice when going around a corner and went under a bus. He was trapped under one of the wheels and died within minutes.

A dark day, and the reason why I don't cycle on the roads when the weather turns as it has.

Gary_M - Member

"That's not quite the point foxyrider. There is no denying the fact that riding on the road in these conditions is extremely dangerous."

Behold: "Riding on the road in these conditions is not extremely dangerous". Somehow we keep miraculously surviving.

Nowt wrong with commuting in this weather, providing you're using the right gear. I.e. either studded or very grippy tyres, and avoid the ice, of which there's none at the moment, it's all snow. Same as a car really.

Yeh whatever, just hope I don't come across you when I'm driving.

I doubt you will as I'll prob be off road 🙂 And if you do just keep your distance behind and when you overtake 🙂

Got sent this [url= http://www.dutchbikeco.com/_blog/Dutch_Bike_Co_Weblog/post/Seattle_Snowpocalypse/ ]link[/url] earlier, wondering if I should get the cable ties out for tomorrow

[img] [/img]

you lot are mental, why don't you just drive?

I lost a very good friend a few years ago who slid on black ice when going around a corner and went under a bus. He was trapped under one of the wheels and died within minutes.

A dark day, and the reason why I don't cycle on the roads when the weather turns as it has.

Not wishing to sound unkind but there's dozens of people killed by being hit by vehicles in non-snowy conditions, is it sensible to stop all activity?

ebygomm

Be interested to see how well they work. All they'll do is aid braking and accelerating, you're still screwed on corners.

coz we like biking, its cheaper, its faster, keeps us fit, its fun......

BTW I ruptured my spleen skiing 2 years ago but I have not stopped skiing. I understand the risks but happy to take them. I can tell you I have had more near misses, offs and hit by cars when the driving conditions were A1 !

..and I got rid of the car

lol I can't drive my car is snowed in at the end of our culture-de-sac the bikes easier

chrisdb - Member
you lot are mental, why don't you just drive?

Same reasons as normal. The bike is quicker, cheaper and keeps me fit.

It's also a lot more fun.

my commute is impossible, 8 out of 10 miles are on extremely quiet country lanes most of which are ice bound. i'll happily throw myself down lustleigh cleave every weekend but i'm not brave enough for the lanes at the moment.

I'm loving riding on the roads in the current conditions, although more ice would be even better as i'll wear my studs out less quickly.

If i get splatted by an idiot, thats just the way it goes.

chrisdb - Member

you lot are mental, why don't you just drive?

I don't own a car - as well as what Druidh says.

some of us are cyclists. some are car drivers who cycle sometimes 😉

chrisdb - Member

"you lot are mental, why don't you just drive?"

Well... Something to do with this:

[img] [/img]

Mind you, that was back on monday, we've had about another foot since then.

Much better:

[img] [/img]

Living is dangerous, riding bikes is dangerous, but you can't cover yourself in cotton wool even when the world looks like it's covered in cotton wool. With the reduced traffic on the road just now I don't doubt for a second that it's safer than normal to ride- it'll be when the roads seem clear and we're off our guard, and the traffic's back, but there are still ice patches that things get hairy.

coffeeking - its a personal choice of course, and I'm not preaching everybody does it. I am also not stopping all activity, just cycling on potential icy roads.

Sure, people lose their lives everyday in unexpected ways, but I have never fallen of my bike commuting, and feel I am increasing the probability of an accident in these conditions if i ride...so don't, which I think is sensible (for me).

I am also not sure what you would have recommended as 'right gear' for my friend who lost his life?

Anyway, we all have freedom of choice, and live with the consequences.

I'm loving it at the moment, going out in the evening when most of the traffic is gone for the obvious reasons. With my spiked tyres. That'll I'll post an image of again..........because they're my best bit of kit as I made them myself.

[img] [/img]

I do avoid the roads as much as possible it has to be said.

[i]some of us are cyclists. some are car drivers who cycle sometimes[/i]

Yeh for sure. I've ridden over 6000 miles this year. I'm fairly sure that qualifies me as a cyclist. I'm just not bloody minded about it though and know when it's a stupid thing to do for me.

And northwind I find it very hard to believe you ride anywhere in half a metre of snow.

Waderider - did you put anything between the inner tube and the tyre?

i'm a cyclist when it's possible to cycle

Now now - lets not get upset 🙂

Picture the scenario of a snow covered two lane road narrowed by snow, busy with traffic on both lanes. Cars driving slowly due to the conditions and due to ruts it's very difficult to switch lanes, applying brakes obviously presents it's issues. Now add a bike into that scenario and you have a very dangerous situation for all involved. Why would you put yourself in that position, apart from stubbornness?

Bailed today due to blizzard conditions, heading out in the morning again, got my Schwalbe spikes on and they rule.(5.45 commute so not many cars in Leeds to run me over hopefully)

Spikes....it's the future!

Gary_M some of us live in villages with hardly any public transport, especially in this weather, I can use the car the odd day but I wouldn't be able to get it off the drive. I do my 11mile commute almost every day, What you to do, walk??

Regarding argumentative folk on this thread I've been out ploughing through hub deep snow. The snow round here is ethereal! Anyhow, why are folk arguing about road dangers on a MTB forum? Try Bike Radar/Cycling Plus/RoadCC

Of course ultimately the danger comes from the one and a half ton vehicles out of control, so they should be left at home 😆

druidh - I was lucky enough to have an old set of ultra light one inch conti MTB slicks lying about for lining. Can't think of much better for the job.

Used [url= http://www.wickes.co.uk/Self-Tapping-Pozi-Screw/invt/510793 ]these[/url] screws.

I made these tyres last winter and they've done a few hundred miles with no punctures. The screws need to go through the blocks for support. Achieving this screwing from the inside of the tyre was difficult, so I had to first screw the screw from the outside to create a visible hole in the casing, and then remove it and place correctly from the inside. Mainly because of this it took ages.

Gary_M - Member
Why would you put yourself in that position, apart from stubbornness?

druidh - Member

The bike is quicker, cheaper and keeps me fit.

It's also more fun.

Waderider - very clever!

Gary-M, i'm quite capable of making decisions for myself thanks!

Cars behind me can wait until a spot to pass appears, and i'll do anything i reasonably can to help them do so. Just like cycling in normal conditions.

Gary_M - Member

Picture the scenario of a snow covered two lane road narrowed by snow, busy with traffic on both lanes. [b]Cars driving slowly due[/b] to the conditions and due to ruts it's very difficult to switch lanes, applying brakes obviously presents it's issues. Now add a bike into that scenario and you have a very dangerous situation for all involved. Why would you put yourself in that position, apart from stubbornness?

So then you simply keep up with the cars and demand your space on the road. take one of the ruts. It helps I have studded tyres. At points I have been faster than the cars - even overtook a couple.

I have pulled onto the banked up snow on the verge when I was holding a line of cars up on a climb to let them past.

You are adamant its dangerous - IME this last week cars have been going slower and have been more courteous.

Oh - and as Druidh says again

No I don't walk cause my commute is 20 miles each way, which I'm really missing riding this week. Took the car yesterday and bus today and same tomorrow.

Many of you must live in a utopian society where cars and bikes live in harmony,everyone can ride at a decent pace and all car drivers ooze awesome car handling skills.

stuartlangwilson clearly you can, even stupid ones.

We had great fun cycling home from nursery today.

Gary_M - Member

"And northwind I find it very hard to believe you ride anywhere in half a metre of snow."

Obviously I'm not riding in half a metre of snow 😕 What's your point? The roads have less snow due to ploughing but are still mostly ice and snow, only one short stretch of my commute is more or less down to slushy tarmac.

Car park at work:

[url= http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5046/5226851315_dce52424e6_b.jp g" target="_blank">http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5046/5226851315_dce52424e6_b.jp g"/> [/img][/url]
[url= http://www.flickr.com/photos/53860438@N06/5226851315/ ]If a car park has no cars in it, is it just a park?[/url] by [url= http://www.flickr.com/people/53860438@N06/ ]Northwindlowlander[/url], on Flickr

IME this last week cars have been going slower and have been more courteous.

Ditto, had a conversation with the lass in the coffee shop about this today. She was saying how nice her drive was with everyone taking it easy and paying attention!?!

IME this last week cars have been going slower and have been more courteous.

Yep, same here.

[url= http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4031/4259257981_f49e52d7cb.jp g" target="_blank">http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4031/4259257981_f49e52d7cb.jp g"/> [/img][/url]

Snow chains from last year. Little 3" lengths of bog chain zip tied around the tyre. Worked pretty well, but needed a few more to be more effective. even just plain old zipties helped too - with the knobbly fastening bit facing downward to dig in a bit.

I am with druid and tj. I've been cycling in all week in Newcastle. I'm thinking about routes, staying off road where possible. I cycled in all last year when the conditions were the same. There is a risk but there is also a risk when the weather is fine. I actually think drivers are more cautious in this type of weather and behave more considerately.

Driving isn't an option, buses are unreliable, it's too far to walk and besides cycling in in fatastic. Coming along the river as the sun rose and cycling through the trees covered in snow is stunning.

My trainers did freeze solid though.

Hey, could you put drawing pins through the zip ties or tape?

Dont worry Gary M, I'll be sure to give your car plenty of room as I overtake it on my death trap pushbike 😆

Another awesome tyre mod there....but who has bog chain anymore? It's just sparked a debate here on flushing power.

I'm with Gary_M on this one.
I went out on the bike in the snow earlier this year with my camera to get some pics around the local area. The snow had fallen quite heavily, but there were slushy ruts in the road that the cars were using.

I was trying to take up as much road as I could to try to stop people overtaking dangerously, but they still were. I tried riding in one of the ruts, but people were just driving even further out of the lane to pass. You could sense a few people attempting to overtake and then pulling back, then trying again, and again before finally just gunning it past.

Cars behind me can wait until a spot to pass appears

I decided on knocking it on the head after a few dodgy miles.

I'm have no doubt in other situations when there had been slightly more snow or slightly less, then it would have been safer. But, in this particular situation it was not particularly safe and the risk of a collision seemed a lot higher than being worth it.
Each situation needs weighing up on an individual basis.

I love riding in the snow, but i did bail out on the commute yesterday. I walked up to the "main" road, watched as two cars failed to stop at the roads and slithered across the junction and ended up on the opposite side, followed by another car turning right, which lost grip and then mounted the pavement again on the opposite side of the road. They were all travelling too fast for the conditions and I didn't feel comfortable with sharing the road with idiots like that, paticulary when you see some of the cars driving around with 7 inces of snow on the car and just a little porthole cleared in the windscreen for them to see out of.

Still, a day off work allowed me to go proper riding in the afternoon. Riding in the snow rocks!

its quite simple, if you think its too dangerous for me to ride wtf are you doing driving?

why should i or anyone else accept the 'fact' that everyone should be allowed to drive all the time regardless.

I'd say that you are much more vulnerable on a bike, and in an accident (and the odds of having one must be higher in winter conditions I would say) you will more often come off worse, even if it is not your fault.
For nobody to use the roads in winter isn't going to happen, and I for one opt for the extra protection of a car in these conditions.
Each to his own of course...

Forced off the back lanes / sustrans route and onto the main road this morning due to snow depths.

Found most cars were giving me plenty of room (more than usual) and were waiting for their chance to overtake rather than forcing past. I am sure some of them became frustrated / angered by my presence but hey-ho.

Yes there were risks and hazards but the car is currently abandoned at the bottom of my road in deep snows, the train is being canceled / severely delayed and 18-miles is too far to walk.

extra protection for who?

oh, you, oh thats alright then.

[i]if you think its too dangerous for me to ride wtf are you doing driving[/i]

I think it's too dangerous for me to ride, I'm not fussed what you do. My commute is 20 miles each way across a moor, I tried it in the snow in January this year and it wasn't nice, I felt very vulnerable and no doubt about it I was a major hazard on the road. If your commute is a bimble across town then it doesn't really compare.

Yeh riding a bike/driving a car don't really compare in the vulnerability stakes do they? Hit a very small patch of black ice on a bike and you're down, hit the same patch on a car and it isn't an issue.

Anyway as I said I got the bus, much less stressful.

Out of interest to those that do carry on riding in these conditions what do those that care about you think? My wife, who isn't normally a worrier, said the other day that she was so glad I'd chosen not to ride as she worries herself sick if I ride when it's icy.

I've ridden to work all week, except today when I took the car as the roads weren't as bad and I had to dig the car out last night to go and do some shopping.

In the mornings I was significantly faster than the traffic I was held up quite a lot by traffic crawling at 10mph on main roads that were no more than slushy, so who was an inconvenience to who?

On the way home the traffic was sparse and generally gave me plenty of room.

I have never felt so close to death as when I was riding down the bus lane from Hyde Park Corner towards Knightsbridge, on a Brompton, in the snow, with a double-decker ten feet behind me. One mistake and game over...

My wife came off her scooter on black ice last year - so slippery there wasn't a single mark on her clothing, despite the copious bruising.

Well a lot of people on here moan about the state of the driving on the roads and then take their bike out in the ice (fair enough the people that have no real alternative) but why put yourself in that position when you can avoid it, after all we are all our own safety men so why put yourself at the mercy of some idiot in a car.

falkirk mark - do you wrap yourself in cotton wool and never leave the house?

Now that's my kind of party

No but I do not want to end my life under a bus on a frozen road TJ

[i]falkirk mark - do you wrap yourself in cotton wool and never leave the house?[/i]

From the man who's scared of lap dogs and classes throwing a snowball as assault 🙂

THIS IS A MOUNTAIN BIKE FORUM, NOT A ROAD CYCLING FORUM.

Mind you, I've just been out and can no longer plough a furrow off road.

Its all down to personal preference - I suggest we leave it there 😉

Waderider thats such an insightful post, although why you've bothered posting on this thread is kinda beyond me.

TJ from a man who rides through red lights to avoid 'dangerous junctions' I just don't get you sometimes.

TandemJeremy - Member
falkirk mark - do you wrap yourself in cotton wool and never leave the house?

TJ - am I wrong about this or is it you that often talks about risk assessments for whether to wear a helmet or not, depending on the terrain etc??
If so, why the comment about fm wrapping himself in cotton wool? He's made the judgement (risk assessment) that it's not worth the risk to his own safety to ride in the current conditions.
No need to make snide comments.

I for one have not ridden in the evenings on the road since the weather turned bad. Mainly as I came off last year on some black ice that was on the far side of a humpback bridge. By the time I saw it, it was too late to stop, so I did my best to stay upright but went over on it. I then slid into the centre of the road and carried on for about 10m or so. If I had been on a main road with a car behind me I probably would have ended up underneath it.
So thanks all the same, but I'd rather 'wrap myself in cotton wool' and sit this one out.

Nice personal attacks folks. Ta

HA HA HA

TandemJeremy - Member
Nice personal attacks folks. Ta

Pot. Kettle. Black??

Or did you not type this:

TandemJeremy - Member
falkirk mark - do you wrap yourself in cotton wool and never leave the house?