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You know how orange did a belt drive P7 prototype, and a few people have been toying with it.
are the "sprockets", "chainrings" and belts bespoke pieces, or are they availible to us mere mortals.
if i had a regular single speed, with a freehub type wheel, and the capability of putting a belt in the frame, where could i get those parts?
or is it a case of pinching them off a knackered engine and making the ring and sprocket fit the cranks and wheel.....??
any thoughts?
xxx
Ol
I think you'll need to put your bodging gloves on.
take a look here:
http://wapedia.mobi/en/Belt-driven_bicycle
and specificaly here:
and here:
http://www.gates.com/brochure.cfm?brochure=7468&location_id=11347
I think you need to cut a gap in your chainstay or something in order to fit the belt for some reason, although I can't remember why.
A belt off an engine probably won't work - they're fancy special bike belt drives.
Joe
I think you need to cut a gap in your chainstay or something in order to fit the belt for some reason, although I can't remember why
because they are continuous
belts are endless, so the rear trinagle will need opening up to get the belt threaded.
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Surely it'll never take off as a concept then if you essentially have to cut your frame to change it..?
Unless they start designing hardtails like the old Funk and Alpinestars... :-/
Oooh, or an Ibis tranny, that'd work!
im thinking on a solid flair.
160mm suss frame, but with the pivot around the BB, so can run it SS, and a pivot on the seatstay so can break the frame to put the belt in.
those parts are indeed the ones enft.
i believe the bike belts are made by BMW especially for the job??
ill have a nosey around (theres still no way i can afford any of this at the moment)
The Orange one started to slip rather a lot, though, because (I assmue) of tooth wear in Northern grime.
There's still a question over bearing life based on the very high tensions you have to run them at, too.
I'm not sure it'd be worth the faff..
Hi,
Nobody has mentioned it so far but Trek have got a belt driven fixed wheel:
[url= http://www.trekbikes.com/uk/en/bikes/urban/district/district/ ]Trek District[/url].
I believe it costs £600, I was considering one as a commuting bike.
everyone knows that direct drive is (well, was) the way to go.
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I think it might go horribly wrong if you get a pebble or twig caught in there? Mind you, what happens with a SS without a tensioner when you get something caught? Does it snap the chain? I guess it is still fixable whereas a belt can't recover from a snap.
I would love a silent drivetrain though...
If you used a raised chainstay design you wouldnt need to cut the frame either.
hydraulic drive is the way forward in my opinion, but i dont think its working very well at the moment.
cannondale had a concept bike made up, but it hasnt got anywhere yet.
but a sealed, internal (in the frame) "drive chain" with no risk of knocking bits off it, a 300% ratio and NO maintenence......
its all about making the pumps fit in the BB and hub though 🙁
is that trek a fixed wheel ---it has brakes?
a belt driven fixie for the fakengers out there could be the next niche uber cool bike
trek seem to be buying into the new technology big time
the new Guardian bike podcast has a review of a hub geared Trek hybrid which uses a belt drive
hydraulic drive is the way forward in my opinion, but i dont think its working very well at the moment.
cannondale had a concept bike made up, but it hasnt got anywhere yet.
Isn't the efficiency of hydraulic drive about 75% or something silly low - i.e. it'd be like riding with your entire chain covered in mud?
Joe
some one at SSUK09 had a homebrew belt drive. ugly but very cool!
[url= http://www.trekbikes.com/uk/en/bikes/urban/portland/portland/ ]yuck look at this - couldn't they have fitted a proper set of mudguards[/url]
Trek did that cyclocross proto frame that split at the dropout a bit like the way the new Fuel EXs have the ABP.
[url= http://www.bikeradar.com/mtb/news/article/exclusive-look-belt-driven-trek-cyclo-cross-bike-18828 ]http://www.bikeradar.com/mtb/news/article/exclusive-look-belt-driven-trek-cyclo-cross-bike-18828[/url]
I think I remember reading somewhere about special belts being made that had a slight twist to compensate for wear? i.e it would tighten up as the teeth wore out, but surely it could get too tight. I'm not convinced about it being a great idea having ridden a tight chain after ruining my derailleur, which pretty much destroyed the freehub bearings.
The frames either need to have a split dropout, have raised chainstays or have a S&S type connector in either seat of chain stay. To be honest, I can't see any real advantages over chain drive.
Front drive is available in 50 or 46t and costs £75, rears come in 28 or 24 and cost £69. Belts are all £50, but come in a variety of lengths.
You must be able to split the stays to fit a belt and need to keep them under quite a bit of tension.
[i]To be honest, I can't see any real advantages over chain drive.[/i]
so you want a flexible drive that you are gonna drag through raid mud and sh!t
come on, 1 piece of carbon reinforced rubber*
vs
a hundred small plates with a hundred little bushings and held together by a hundred little pivots**
because chains do the job well enough no one can be arsed to develop something that could in fact be much much better
* or whatever a belt is actually made of
** i have no actual idea how many parts are in a chain either but lots for sue
The belts are made by Gates. Gates make cam belts for AUDI, BMW and the like. There were problems with wear on early prototypes, like the Orange, but now the cogs are ceramic coated, I believe. Fixie Inc. had a beautiful fixie with belt drive at the cycle show last year. Wooden tub rims, stainless fittings with a wood insert around the headset, rust-patinated frame, and stainless S&S coupling in the seatstay to allow the belt to be changed or to change to a freewheel. Lovely bike. I can see every point to a belt drive; no oil or dirt, little wear, silent, very light. What's not to like? If I had the money I'd stick a coupling in the seatstay of my O-O 567, and put a belt drive hub gear on it. If it was possible to adapt a Hammerschmitt front to belt as well that would be perfect. Virtually zero maintenance drivetrain with huge ground clearance and no sticky-down gears to catch branches. Brilliant.
There is an issue with stones getting stuck in the belts On motorcycles with belt drive they have fairly complex guards to stop stones getting between the belt and the pulleys - and also no trailside repair available in the unlikely event of breaking a belt.
Hydraulic drive is interesting even if it needs loads of development before its practical - it opens up the possibility of infinitely variable drive to both wheels.
leggyblonde - Member
some one at SSUK09 had a homebrew belt drive. ugly but very cool!
That was my homebrew Penance Aberration. 😀
That frame was too flexy at the BB. Fixed it since by running a preventer pulley 1mm above the belt.
TandemJeremy - Member
There is an issue with stones getting stuck in the belts
I've done thousands upon thousands of miles in outback Oz on belt drive motorcycles and never come across this mythical happening, nor do I know anyone who suffered it. It is about as likely as a stone getting wedged in your chain.
I've done a number of conversions now. Here's a pic of my Pompino rear end. You can see how I chopped it to fit the belt.[img] http://forums.mtbr.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=455548&stc=1&d=1242205347 [/img]
The belt is a bit long in this photo, but I have since got a shorter belt.
Some more photos:
[img] http://forums.mtbr.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=455543&stc=1&d=1242204901 [/img]
Template for the cut.
[img] http://forums.mtbr.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=455544&stc=1&d=1242204901 [/img]
Connecting plate trial fit
[img] http://forums.mtbr.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=455545&stc=1&d=1242204901 [/img]
The cut. Did it V shaped to help prevent fore and aft fretting.
[img] http://forums.mtbr.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=455549&stc=1&d=1242205347 [/img]
Finished job.
It's important to check all dimensions for fit before cutting a frame. I chopped a brand new Scandal only to find I could not get the belt line up correctly. Oops!
Here's the Gates stuff:
http://www.carbondrivesystems.com/whycds.php?lang=us
Looks like you can buy chainrings and rear sprockets:
http://www.carbondrivesystems.com/forbikemakers.php?lang=us
Just need to slot your frame!
And mud?
richmars - Member
...And mud?
That's a good pic. I can't imagine why anyone would think it's preferable to run a precision piece of machinery like a chain through that muck when they can use a belt instead.
epicyclco - that on harleys? IIRC they have rather comprehensive guards to stop stones going into the belt - same for BMWs with belts - and why the offroad models use chains not belts?
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On Harleys. Used to remove all those covers otherwise they would clog with mud which would dry like concrete.
I think the guards are more to stop loose clothing and dangling bungy cords - been a few nasty accidents like that. Also to stop a broken belt/chain hitting the rider or passenger.
Could never understand why BMW went to belts when they had a perfectly good shaft drive - My R75/5 and R75/7 were much better in mud than any of the trail bikes of the time* 🙂
*I'm talking about on long rides from mining towns out west - used to have to cover 700 miles on dirt (plus the tarmac leg) for a weekend on the coast - usually just deep bulldust, but if it rained then deep misery and exhaustion.