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No idea. Saw a pic of the set up, no further info, save that he was touring the UK. Guess it’s not ideal for night rides.
No idea. Saw a pic of the set up, no further info, save that he was touring the UK. Guess it’s not ideal for night rides.
how bigs this trailer.
2*200watt panels (roughly 2mx1) would just about fully charge an average 48v ebike battery over the course of a British summer time day.
Given that would discharge over half that time it's unlikely this is a self sufficient set up.
Probably looking at 3-4 times that set up for anything useful and that doesn't account for the good old temperamental British weather .
We were offered a "touring trailer ebike" setup a couple of years ago. The trailer had 1 panel of about 2 square meters and housed a lead-acid motor battery. This then had to be used to recharge the bike battery when it had run out of charge. I was tempted to take them up on the offer and then do an endurance test on the NC500 but the whole contraption seemed ridiculous so we let the opportunity pass. I'll never know what it would have been like trying to get that lot up the Bealach na Na.
how bigs this trailer.
4ft by 6ft, from memory. Side by side wheels too.
Heres the thread on pedelecs
https://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/threads/solar-trailer-rides-again.43566/
Not the majority, but I am seeing more. I knocked out 47km/917m climbing before a late breakfast this morning, on an old Lava Dome built out of a couple hundred quid of second hand bits. Went spanking downhill past one fat guy a fair bit younger than me (55); the usual bolt upright John Wayne stance on thousands of pounds worth of e-bike. This is definitely happening more than it did. Is it really ‘Moar Fun’ going downhill slowly on a very expensive bike because you lack the basic fitness that comes from climbing without a motor doing the work? Seems a shame people (feel they) need to spend that amount of money to ride a bike. I’d feel a bit embarrassed, to be honest.
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I ride a '97 Lava Dome - owned from new (catching the trend, not catching up with your parts bin bike JFTR), a PP Shan, until (fairly) recently a YT Capra and wait for it...... an E-bike - 180mm travel Spesh Kenevo
I can guarantee a few things - I couldn't match you on a morning ride, but at the same time I couldn't care less. I have more fun on a bike than you and I'm definitely more fun at parties than you.
Other things I can't guarantee are true, but probably are - I could still probably beat you downhill, I'm better looking than you, my dick is bigger than yours and I don't smell of wee as much as you do.....
Of course more eBikes are being seen, that is because people are buying them so they are increasing each year.
Still 100's of MTBs for sale at a massive price range from from a £500 Vitus to an £8K high end thing. More people will be buying the £500 - £2000 MTBs than are buying eMTBs.
2 things will be the sign of ebike becoming more dominant....
Firstly....that a bike with a motor is the first with a talked about non motor feature - a first bike to have new cutting edge geometry or something about the suspension design (other than engineering around the practical implications of a motor). It seems to me so far that ebikes are not trail blazers, but are rather followers of concepts developed first on conventional bikes.
Secondly....at the lower end of the market, a conventional bike designed around a ebike ready frame with some sort of insert to take a conventional chainset where the motor would go. I.e. a manufacturer that elects through scale of production to produce a few non ebikes using the ebike ready frame they use for all their other bikes.
Firstly….that a bike with a motor is the first with a talked about non motor feature – a first bike to have new cutting edge geometry or something about the suspension design (other than engineering around the practical implications of a motor). It seems to me so far that ebikes are not trail blazers, but are rather followers of concepts developed first on conventional bikes.
Secondly….at the lower end of the market, a conventional bike designed around a ebike ready frame with some sort of insert to take a conventional chainset where the motor would go. I.e. a manufacturer that elects through scale of production to produce a few non ebikes using the ebike ready frame they use for all their other bikes.
1st point is a good one, something I'd got interested in mainly for transport bikes. E-MTBs already have different suspension dynamics and handling a heavier bike is different. It makes sense to look at the layout with fresh eyes, though that doesn't mean the result would/should end up different.
2nd point, so you can upgrade to an e-bike later? At the higher niche end it's something Jeff Jones' E-MTBs do. They'll be scoffed at for all the usual reasons but his thinking and the result is pretty spot on imo. There's also the new Skarper system that converts a disc brake bike to an e-bike, along these lines.
It's does make me laugh when people go on about battery's on ebikes while posting from a phone/laptop.
I'm presuming these folks don't own a car, have kids or pets?
I ride bikes because of the simple reason I like them.
I don't try and dress it up as anything else.
Is it really ‘Moar Fun’ going downhill slowly on a very expensive bike because you lack the basic fitness that comes from climbing without a motor doing the work?
A quick glance around any triathlon transition will demonstrate that acquiring fitness is nothing to do with bike handling skills.
Seriously though I think that reasoning is flawed. Said 55 year old e bike rider would probably not be out at all.ifnit weren't for the e bike. So he's going slowly - so what? Why do you care? Perhaps he is having fun? Perhaps he's full of a sense of achievement when he gets home? Still struggling to see the negatives.
I think that what is happening here is a lot of knee jerk reaction to the new. There are plenty of sports that use technology to make things easier. Do any of you e-bike haters go downhill skiing? That's vastly worse on all the metrics you all seem to scorn e bikes and yet it's fully accepted to the point where it is indeed the default form. It's what people think of when you say skiing and other forms have to be prefixed.
So does my preference for bike accessed alpine touring (ideally in scotland or the lakes) validate my dislike for electric motorbikes?
Firstly, it is entirely workable to support 'this' or 'that' environmental / ethical cause without simultaneously rejecting every trapping of modern life. I couldn't do my job without a mobile phone - an eMTB is a leisure luxury item (which is why I always differentiate between these and e-bikes for commuting). Driving an RSQ8 to a trail centre to ride my non e bike and getting on my high horse = bankrupt. Having kids does not mean you can't try and 'do less harm' at the same time.
Secondly, there's a vast difference between destructive and ethically regressive technology in a sport and the incremental improvement of the basic tools of the job, and to suggest they're just the same thing seems a bit dishonest to me.
My Scarpa Chimeras are better than EB Ballets for sure, as are my Totem Cams vice choinard friends. That doesn't mean putting a jetpack on and flying around north Wales means I onsighted the Indian Face.
I knocked out 47km/917m climbing before a late breakfast this morning, on an old Lava Dome..Seems a shame people (feel they) need to spend that amount of money to ride a bike. I’d feel a bit embarrassed, to be honest.
I'm poorly so I'm grumpy, but this is some of the most self-absorbed patronising horse-shit I've read for a long time on the forum.
Having kids does not mean you can’t try and ‘do less harm’ at the same time.
Neither does riding an ebike.
I don't own a car or have kids/pets and moved to Scotland so I didn't have to keep traveling here to ride.
Don't try and imply you're somehow greener than people you know nothing about.
It's easy to pick faults in other people's choices isn't it...
I ride because I love riding I don't try and wrap other stuff in with it.
I’ve been riding over 20 years, still not particularly fit or skilled/fast. I ride with people who are athletes and supremely skilled. My Levo now allows me to ride with them at their pace, and often towe them up hill. Never really enjoyed killing my legs chasing after them uphill, so I had dead legs for the main event on the way down. People who hate on ebikes need to get over themselves FFS. So what you can ride 4000ft and 50 miles on an old shed. Big deal, nobody gives a shit. Sorry to piss on your chips.
Yes ebikes allow inexperienced people to get to places they could get out of their depth. People soon learn, and we all have to start somewhere. There has always been those of a smug/self righteous attitude in MTB always will be. But the more people on bikes the better. And your fun, isn’t any better or valid than somebody else’s fun, neither is your opinion.
The price barrier to MTB, is just lack of knowledge. Simple.
I have sourced super bikes for people, from £100 to £900. Depending on what they want to do and their budget. Ebikes are expensive yes, but they are new tech. They are not a prerequisite for riding, neither is AXS, Kashima, or full suspension. The media shout’s about all this fancy kit because most riders love it, even if it is beyond our budget. You/we don’t need it. Those that look to people who are not particularly fit/ skilled/experienced on expensive bikes and hate on them are simply just jealous. It’s pathetic. It’s easy to laugh at the person who has dropped a ton on all the matching hope anodised bits, computers, lights on their S-works Levo, but really who gives a shit. They are loving it. Be nice say Hi.
I'm sure STR's post seemed like a good idea in the early hours after a skinful.
For the rest, from the top:
Don't have kids or pets, moving this week so I can go carless. Also vegetarian and don't fly (saves you the trouble of coming up with more whataboutery).
You can't run a phone without a battery. You can ride a bike without one, but when people give reasons for why this might be a better thing, it seems to attract lots of whataboutery and personal attacks based on, y'know, assumptions. Almost like it's touching some nerves.
Continuity, attempts to draw parallels with climbing ethics are wasted here, mate.
I tend to get my morning rides in early to beat the rush, but today people were wisely out to beat the heat. So, back to the OP's query, my observations were: two skinny older guys on 'analogue' bikes - and four fat people on e-bikes.
Just sayin,' like.
Don’t know what any of that has to do with your better than you attitude to ebiking, or ebikers? And climbing ethics? WTF is that? Bull shit
Just saying like
Lots of people find surfing difficult and it prevents them from enjoying the sport.
So motorised boards just make things easier. It opens it all up.
The other advantage is that you don't need big waves. In fact, you don't need any waves.
But you still need a basic ability to stand on a board so it still takes some skill.
The boards are obviously much more expensive and need charging and all that.
Some claim that it's not actually surfing and that it misses the point of what surfing is/was about.
But who cares when you see the joy on the face of a surfer astride his brand new £5,000 eboard?
my observations were: two skinny older guys on ‘analogue’ bikes – and four fat people on e-bikes.
My observations from my ride yesterday
Saw a couple of walkers and about a dozen folks on a combo of e and manual bikes.
Everyone was pleasant chatty and smiling.
Thankfully we didn't come across any sneering dick swingers.
Some claim that it’s not actually surfing and that it misses the point of what surfing is/was about.
"my arms and legs are all the suspension I need"
Some mtber c. 1990
‘I can lock my wheels with canti brakes, why do I need disks?’
-that same MTBer, 2 mins after the above.
Some claim that it’s not actually surfing and that it misses the point of what surfing is/was about.
i had a great time bodysurfing a shorey at rinsey last week, what do I win…
I’m sure STR’s post seemed like a good idea in the early hours after a skinful.
😉
Leaning back towards the OP - go in JE James and it's wall to wall e-bikes. Any normal bikes are tucked away in a corner
Dom
I'm not showing you round again if you swing your dick in my direction.😂
😂😂😂
2nd point, so you can upgrade to an e-bike later?
Not so much that (but that is a thing too). More that a company needs to order say 5000 units of a medium frame base model hardtail. If/when the non ebike need is sufficiently small it might make financial sense for the manufacturer to make them all motor compatible rather than setup two production runs. Then add an insert into the motor cavity for a conventional BB.
So does my preference for bike accessed alpine touring (ideally in scotland or the lakes) validate my dislike for electric motorbikes?
I got the climbing references in your post but it still didn't make a lot of sense.
You are allowed to dislike e bikes, but you shouldn't look down on others for liking them because it's still a constructive activity and doesn't really affect anyone else. The environmental impact is still pretty low.
Unlike jetskis which make so much noise that they piss everyone off along miles of coast. Or motorbikes which are big heavy and much faster. And noisy and smelly.
@tjagain:
Elitist shite
Balls. I'm not elitist at all - but between myself and my girlfriend we've been crashed into THREE times by inexperienced ebikers in the past few years. My g/f picked up a nasty gash for her troubles. And there've been near misses.
We've never been crashed into by anyone else.
So I stand by it. It's safer for people to work their way up to things. Ebikes remove that requirement and are therefore dangerous.
And people are seeing it - increased trail aggro. You can't just dismiss the argument.
between myself and my girlfriend we’ve been crashed into THREE times by inexperienced ebikers in the past few years
I'm an experienced biker and I once crashed into someone. I hurt them too. It's because I was fit enough to be going much too fast. It was up a short hill too.
So I stand by it. It’s safer for people to work their way up to things. Ebikes remove that requirement
I don't see how being unfit up hill stops you careering down hill too fast. This was certainly my default downhill state when I started out.
I thought it was pretty simple but here it is more simply.
I disagree. eMTBs (as in, eBikes for leisure rather than to replace an ICE journey) are not constructive. I similarly disagree that 'more people out on two wheels = better', when the people you are adding, as @chevychase has experienced, are often unsympathetic to either the environment or other people (if they were, they would be on a bike not a motorbike). They massively increase wear and erosion to the small amount of poorly protected natural open spaces we have in the country, and the environmental cost of charging and lithium mining and disposal has an unanswered moral component. The benefit they offer? Immediate gratification without effort. This is the point about climbing ethics that I think you didn't understand - there is a moral principle that you don't cheat your way to the top or demand that the outdoors be sanitised so that you aren't challenged - bolted where you could place gear - you train and practice so that you have the capacity.
eBikes are Jetskis mate - you just happen to like these ones.
Immediate gratification without effort.
Who says you need to earn gratification? That is the attitude that makes you look like a snob.
I might watch TV tonight. What do I need to do first to deserve it?
I like riding up hills by the way. I'm going for a run later, because I want to be fit. But I don't think everyone else needs to think the way I do.
As for the rest of your comments - CE.baxl with a complete study of benefits against costs of e-MTBs. Your anecdotes aren't enough.
there is a moral principle that you don’t cheat your way to the top
Climbing is full of snobs also. True, you don't cheat your way to the top and claim you climbed the route. But e-MTBers aren't doing this, they're not cheating. They aren't playing the same game as you, and they know it. But you apparently don't.
Climbing is about doing set challenges. Everyone knows what grade they can climb and people talk about it. You're rated as a climber based on this. There is no equivalent of this in MTBing, except maybe Strava but that is nothing like climbing.
The benefit they offer? Immediate gratification without effort.
I genuinely fail to comprehend why folks get their knickers in a twist about how other people have fun. It's never not going to be weird to me.
Every time someone calls eBikes motorbikes I just think “Jeffery Steadman”, have a little giggle and get on with enjoying my life.
Fortunately you are in a small minded minority and your sweeping generalisation of ebike riders is bullshit, and you know it. Nothing is being sanitised and there are no climbing ethics in the way you get to the top, as you say. You can redline and blow out your arse climbing an ebike, just as you would on a normal bike. Except you will be climbing steeper more technical trails which you would be probably pushing up. If it’s not for you fine. But don’t wrap it up in a load sanctimonious bull shit.