Anyone started a 'proper' MTB Club?

wwaswas

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[#9807839]

Why did you do it?

How did it go?

Did you register with British Cycling or similar bodies (for insurance, other reasons)?

How do you deal with things like liability or non-members on guided rides?

Has being a formal club allowed improved conversations with land owners and/or local authorities?

What sort of membership charge do you make?

Would you do it again?

What didn't you think would happen that then did?

If you have any 'club rules' or formal documentation associated with being an mtb club (risk assesments?) that would be useful too - message me.

Anyone who knows me - this is to inform a choice, not an indication that one has been made!

Posted : 31/01/2018 9:08 am

nickc

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Yes, the C1XV

Seemed like a good idea, and Alex wanted to be the President of something

Yes, for insurance

Insurance, riders came on rides on their own recognisance

No, not really, but it was an advocative club

Honest, can't remember, It wasn't huge, but we did sell things like tee shirts and got some good deals for members of cheap stuff like inner tubes.

No

Every club eventually gets pulled apart, either through elements going in different directions or apathy

There were eventually some of that sort of stuff, I don't have it anymore, sorry

Advice? Keep it as informal as you can.

Posted : 31/01/2018 9:15 am

nickc

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Wasn't an adovcative club...

Posted : 31/01/2018 9:16 am

globalti

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By having a formal club you expose yourselves to raiders in the form of serial complainers looking for compensation. One club based around Blackburn was attacked and although the plaintiff's case was laughed out of Court, the club has disbanded and is now operated informally. Read this; it gives an insight into how the person operates:

http://eg-www1.lancs.ac.uk/ereport.php?ident=2775

Posted : 31/01/2018 9:28 am

wwaswas

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Ta.

Having read that thread:

Cheeky trails on club rides - yes or no? Insurance implications?

Currently about 80% of local riding is on 'tolerated/permissive' singletrack so this is important.

Was a bit taken aback to see Simon's name there after him not being around for so long - he was in fine form though!

Posted : 31/01/2018 9:40 am

Nobeerinthefridge

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No, clubs attract the wrong type, officious, power hungry bawbags. Just ride with some mates, call yourselves something catchy like ' Anal Pro-laps' or summit.

Posted : 31/01/2018 9:54 am

Nobeerinthefridge

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Yeah, agree re Barnes Was. Didn't suffer fools!...

Posted : 31/01/2018 9:57 am

finfhan

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Why did you do it?

-Few of us got together, six initially and it went from there. Set up a club charter, agree what we were trying to do and that was it really. Opened a bank account and joined the national cycling body.

How did it go?

-Well, we have grown the sport significantly in the area which is great. We originally set up also to assist in proper trail development - that one not so well as it is such a minefield and shit storm of mega proportions.

Did you register with British Cycling or similar bodies (for insurance, other reasons)?

-Yes, although we're through Cycling Ireland. Only way to do it really.

How do you deal with things like liability or non-members on guided rides?

-Very tricky one. We havent a good enough procedure in place to be honest. We want everyone to be registered with the national cycling body but not all are. Probably need to insist on this more actually. Some clubs have a one-ride without insurance policy.

Has being a formal club allowed improved conversations with land owners and/or local authorities?

-To some degree yes but it can also be a detriment. Really depends on the scenario.

What sort of membership charge do you make?

We charge €20 per annum + making sure our members are approved by national body.

Would you do it again?

-Absolutely

What didn’t you think would happen that then did?

-Expect a lot of work and people whinging at nothing and for no reason. Gaawwd but the whinging is hard to take at times. Just have it written down or embedded deep in your mind about why you're doing it and the whinging wont get to you as much.

If you have any ‘club rules’ or formal documentation associated with being an mtb club (risk assesments?) that would be useful too – message me.

Yes, shit loads of risk assessments for events, club charter, bank details and associated paperwork

Anyone who knows me – this is to inform a choice, not an indication that one has been made!

Posted : 31/01/2018 9:57 am

finfhan

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Sorry dont know whats going on with that formatting and cant edit it

Posted : 31/01/2018 9:58 am

wwaswas

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It's fine, I got the gist, thank you 🙂

Posted : 31/01/2018 10:17 am

MrSmith

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No, clubs attract the wrong type, officious, power hungry bawbags. Just ride with some mates, call yourselves something catchy like ‘ Anal Pro-laps’ or summit.

This^ In clubs you end up riding with people who either don't like you (and like to let you know that at every opportunity) or you don't like them. Riding bikes shouldn't have office politics if it's a hobby/pastime you wish to enjoy.

So just ride with your mates (we are called VC-Tourette's due to swearing and banter but nobody gets offended)

Posted : 31/01/2018 10:26 am

qwerty

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For ideas, check out my local http://www.bigfootmbc.co.uk I'm not a member but have ridden with them a few times, seem pretty organised, nice bunch, but to take on the running of such a set up must surely attract complainers.

Posted : 31/01/2018 10:26 am

Paceman

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Wwaswas, I have lots of risk assessments for rides around the local area as well as further afield in Wales from when I've led school groups on MTB rides. You're welcome to copies if they'd be helpful. In terms of liability, the school staff leading the rides (me and John) were backed up by the County Outdoor Education and their liability insurance for rides that the Outdoor Education Officer has approved (via an online system); we also had to gain MTB Leader Awards before they would approve us to run the School MTB Club and take the kids out on rides, particularly for the more technical rides and on more mountainous terrain in Wales. If we ran any sort of competitive event it had to be classed as a 'challenge' rather than race or competition. We were also an affiliated to club to British Cycling.

Posted : 31/01/2018 10:37 am

Beagleboy

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+1 for Mr Smith's view. I loved riding with my local club until it all got a bit cliquey and politicy. So I left! Funnily enough, after a few years I've rejoined this new year, but I'm not interested in riding with them....I just really like the kit and always feel a bit funny wearing it but not being a member. I actually went out on a couple of 'club runs' last summer (was tricked into it by a mate), and realised, like Mr Smith said, that a lot of club riding involves riding with folk you wouldn't want to sit down and have a pint with. Not for me, but I do like their kit! 🙂

Posted : 31/01/2018 10:53 am

matt_outandabout

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I would avoid any contact with British Cycling at all costs.

Posted : 31/01/2018 11:01 am

Garry_Lager

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While it's sobering to see people like that actually exist, you're not seriously arguing for that as a reason not to do it, are you? Talk about risk-averse eeyore-ism. I could try and set up something new that will be really positive for loads of people, around the sport we all love, but don't think I'll bother because there's a remote chance someone disruptive might join.

Posted : 31/01/2018 11:02 am

stevenmenmuir

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I went out on a local club ride. One guy, think he started the club, was a keen xc racer. He told us he'd been out for a training ride so was going to take it easy but it didn't take long for the group to split with him leading the way. At the end of one wood we discovered Mr xc racer and one other had gone, didn't bother waiting. Somebody waited for the rest of us and told us where they were headed and that maybe we could try and catch them up. I headed home, that's not my kind of ride. I heard other rides went the same way. The club then split, maybe some financial irregularities, somebody had their car tyres slashed and received anonymous threatening text messages. My only other experience is a kids club. Started out as an alternative to other race focussed clubs but soon headed in the same direction, driven by parents that wanted their kids to race but I know it put off my kids, they'd rather just ride with me and family friends for fun.

Posted : 31/01/2018 11:14 am

andybrad

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Tbh i dont think that lady was being disruptive. Probably just doesn't want to get her ass sued off. Its a valid point though. We had the same issue with some 14 yr old lads wanting to join us. They were hebden locals and could ride the wheels off their bikes. Unlike the likes of me. Everyone said come along and it all got a bit shitty when i said that we shouldn't because you end up taking responsibility for them (if you like it of not) when i asked for someone to step up and say they would look after them it all went a bit quiet and some folks got a bit nasty about it all.

were effectively a group of mates no committee funds or anything. We had some tops printed for a laugh when we all tried to enter ard rock a few years back.If you take money off folks i would want it watertight legally though and tbh it will end up being a right hassle.

Posted : 31/01/2018 11:21 am

scotroutes

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I'm not a club person but I recognise that the lack of a club structure does mean we seem to lack any voice when it comes to trail access etc.

Posted : 31/01/2018 11:40 am

mikewsmith

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You need to work out what it's for.

Australia is full of them, you basically have to join one of the local ones when you get MTBA membership - which you basically need to do anything organised (but the insurance is good)

If it's to organise events, races and that sort of stuff all good, if not a Facebook group deals with all the lets go for a ride sort of crap without any of the hassle.

Posted : 31/01/2018 11:47 am

andybrad

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what mike said.

Posted : 31/01/2018 11:51 am

rone

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Yes - we founded Sherwood Pines Cycling Club (MTB only in 2010 - still going)

Didn't have much to do at work. Fancied the crack.

Still going but I'm nothing to do with it. Generally went well. Committees are a pain, what with some talkers and some do'ers etc.

Yes, it wasn't my bag though and I'm not sure it was correctly applied. I.e thinking we were covered for insurance based on assumptions.

Initially just run with it but most of our leaders became MIAS Level 1/2. That's the best way. Lots of debate of who should pay for it. I personally think the club should pay half. But we paid our own.

Non-members. 3 rides and you've got to pay subs.

We worked with the Forestry commission who I don't think overall at the time were that interested in us. They did support us in some ways though.

Very contentious but £15. I think it should've been a fair bit more. But there wasn't the same line of thinking as me. Ultimately guides should've been paid etc. It's a lot of time and responsibility. But mountain bikers piss me off with there expectation of 'free-things'.

Nope. See the end of the last paragraph. Also it's time consuming if you just want to ride.

The amount of fall-out over wannabe racers (egos), satellite clubs that pop up for free to compete - and general lack of loyalty. Also members complaining about rides, pace and difficulty when you're doing it all for free. The expectation is completely unreasonable.

The amount of parents that put their kid in your club (if it's not performance orientated) because they think he or she are amazing and use the club as a training etc. Not on.

Be clear on your mission.

It's great to help beginners - just the mid-pack riders are a pain in the arse.

Posted : 31/01/2018 11:56 am

rone

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I can't fix anything about my post. Says it's missing! Soz.

Posted : 31/01/2018 11:57 am

wwaswas

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Topic starter

As an aside - it's amazing how unusable for a general conversation the forum now is.

This is all very useful, thank you.

Posted : 31/01/2018 11:59 am

thomthumb

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"I loved riding with my local club until it all got a bit cliquey and politicy. So I left! "

Splinter club for the win. Invite only.

Posted : 31/01/2018 12:02 pm

warpcow

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Another "what mike said". We started one recently as a local advocacy group mainly. All riding is done informally, racing is taken care of by another club in the area. We do the bare minimum needed to be recognised as a club, including not charging a membership fee (we've 'crowdfunded' the few things that needed to be paid for, such as sending people on trail-building courses). With this done, our time can be focused on more useful things like developing relationships with landowners and local authorities. It's worked very well so far.

Posted : 31/01/2018 12:14 pm

TheBrick

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See team shithouse as a perfect example

Posted : 31/01/2018 12:16 pm

davesmate

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Wasn't involved from the very beginning but got involved very early on. Our club was formed to be an official body to raise funds to build and maintain a local mtb trail. In the beginning this meant applying for funding/grants etc. So we affiliated to both ctc and BC as everything had to be above board for official funding applications. It grew much faster than anyone expected. I remember the treasurer saying he'd had 50 plastic membership cards made and we'd be doing well if we'd used them all by the end of year 1. They were all gone in the first 3 months! By the end of year 1 we were somewhere around 200 members and at it's peak around the 300 mark. We were thought by some in the industry to be one of the biggest mtb clubs in the country at that time. One of the hardest things to do is make members understand why the club does what it does the way it does. Rules WILL creep in, as an affiliated club we couldn't be seen to be riding illegally. A particular bone of contention as much of the better riding around here is cheeky. As somebody else has pointed out the issue of junior riders is a massive issue, everyone wants it to happen but nobody wants to take responsibility for it.

Almost 10 years down the line now and on the whole it was worth it. Membership has dropped to roughly half of what it was at its peak but we got that trail built and much more importantly, we created a local mtb scene. I'm less involved now than I was but I'm very proud of what the club has achieved and hope there are enough people with enough interest in it to take it forward. There are certain things I wish we'd done differently. At times I found us to be somewhat over officious and found ourselves tangled up in so much red tape but its been mostly good times.

If you've a genuine reason for starting a club then go ahead, it's hard work but mostly rewarding. If you just want to put together a local riding group then my advice would be to keep it as unofficial as you can.

Posted : 31/01/2018 12:18 pm

Trimix

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If you like rules, arguments, compromises, responsibility and disappointment, start a club.

If you just want to enjoy riding your bike with your mates, you really don't need a club.

Things like insurance can be bought individually. Discounts on stuff are all over the internet, a club is unlikely to be better for getting discounts that beat what you can get on the internet.

Posted : 31/01/2018 12:40 pm

nickc

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Reading that Bog Trotters things made me remember what an arse Simon could be.

Posted : 31/01/2018 1:26 pm

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