[Closed] Although Titanium frames are expensive...

i read it on the internet somewhere so it must be true

lol, you stalking me again al? Will carbon last as long as Titanium al?

Depends what you're doing with it.

I do like that Brodie.

Depends what you're doing with it.

if two frames used for the same riding one from ti the other carbon, which would last longer?

Why oh why is there so much BS on the web?

Why oh why is there so much BS on the web?

Which bit is BS?

cynic-al - Member

Why oh why is there so much BS on the web?

Stop reading this forum, that'll help.

if two frames used for the same riding one from ti the other carbon, which would last longer?

Depends what kind of riding.

Why wouldn't a carbon frame last as long?
I see no reason why it wouldn't.

No frame is really forever anyway. Standards change. Geometry and design move on etc.

Cf is as good as anything else out there for longevity and performance.

Will carbon last as long as Titanium

I've got a couple of carbon fishing rods, one of which is well over 20 years old, the other a bit less (17 ish?) and both are still fine.

Conversely, I cracked a titanium frame that was about 10 years old at the time.....

The performance issue is not the point, i doubt if CF would last as long as Ti, in particular being used as a long travel HT, like the holeshot marketing quote al is calling BS. How many LT carbon HT do you see?

Will one last twice my lifetime and the other three times? It won't matter which is which as both will last longer than I want them 😕

cynic-al - Member
Why oh why is there so much BS on the web

i admit, some of it was me, but not all of it, not on your nelly

Zero - which is what you are using to justify your argument?

Conversely, I cracked a titanium frame that was about 10 years old at the time.....

Were you using it to fish with?

Ti 456 Vs Carbon 456

Which ones rear triangle fell to bits?

Zero - which is what you are using to justify your argument?

You were the one calling the BS in that quote, i just asked what was incorrect about the quote?

i doubt if CF would last as long as Ti, in particular being used as a long travel HT

Ahh, a great statement! Why? Becasue there can be nothing to back it up unless you have a Delorean with a flux capacitor between the seats.
Put 2 similar CF & Ti frames on test and we'll meet back here every 5 years to see how it's going, shall we? 😉

We get 25 year old carbon bikes in. In fact a mate of mine rides a 1990 Specialized Allez Epic every day. It's fine- there's not a blemish on it. And that's from when carbon technology in the bike world was a lot simpler than it is now.

Carbon will last as long as you want it to last, and I personally would love a carbon LT hardtail.

Mr A - No, but does it need to bend to 90 degrees or more every few minutes? 😉

The point is, is Ti more durable than CF, no?

No, it's whether ti frames will last a lifetime and cf ones won't. Full of so much generalising it's a joke.

Anyway you should be thankng me for the free publicity and for not discussing the sh value of the frames.

Why oh why is there so much BS on the web?

Oh the irony 🙄

cynic-al - Member
Why oh why is there so much porn on the web?

FAPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPAGETASTIC 😛

And that's from when carbon technology in the bike world was a lot simpler than it is now.

[yorkshire mode]

"Bluddy thing wor built like a plastic outhouse, it wor!"

[/yorkshire mode]

😉

Road bikes tend to go through less stress than a LT travel HT?

I don't mean to sound argumentative, but the OP was calling BS on a quote from Brodie about the Holeshot and the fact it is made out of ti and would be more durable than an equivalent CF frame. I know which material i would trust more in that style of bike.

I also trust Bruce Spicer's judgement (the guy who designed the Ti Holeshot) as he has masses of experience and knowledge.

CF is great, i sell bikes with CF so no beef against it, just disagree with the OP call on the BS from the quote 🙂

Full of so much generalising it's a joke.

The quote was about a particular style of bike, a LT HT, so not really general or a joke.

A good friend of mine swore by titanium, on that whole 'last a lifetime' line. The frame snapped on a fast downhill and the top tube went straight through his heart. So, not quite a lifetime, but maybe only a second short.

None of the above is true

Here's a clue Si:

NOT ALL FRAMES MADE FROM THE SAME MATERIAL ARE THE SAME

An you trust your main brand's frame builder? As if you wouldn't?

Oh and snaps - bring it. Where's my BS?

Although Titanium frames are expensive, they ... will last a lifetime; something that can’t be said of a lightweight carbon fibre frame

the problem with this is it's apples and oranges. a light weight ti frame will last as long as a light weight CF frame. a well built CF frame will last as long as well built ti frame.

the OP was calling BS on a quote from Brodie about the Holeshot and the fact it is made out of ti and would be more durable than an equivalent CF frame

read the quote again it's not about equivalent bikes - purposely misleading statement and therefore BS

I bet a carbon LT HT would last just as long as the Ti one, and if it does break it'd be much cheaper to repair.

The quote was about a particular style of bike, a LT HT, so not really general or a joke.

since when has the length of fork changed the material properties of a frame?

such a lot of balls is spouted on t'internets!
carbon frames and components have traditionally been built up as lightweight race machines and so pared down to a bare minimum, therefore are more likely to fail than overbuilt Ti hardtails.
As has been said, it is about HOW they are designed and built, not material alone.

NOT ALL FRAMES MADE FROM THE SAME MATERIAL ARE THE SAME

Really? why the shouting? I'm still not clear as to why the statement is BS though?

An you trust your main brand's frame builder? As if you wouldn't?

he designed it, some other guy made it 🙂

I bet a carbon LT HT would last just as long as the Ti one

Si, I'm sorry, I was trying to make is easy for you. It's very simple. What proof has anyone of the original statement?

i bet it wouldn't

why not?

It would. For the same weight too. It'd be built up more than a "light weight carbon fibre frame", but weight the same as a Ti frame. And like I say, when it does eventually break (as both frames could) the carbon would be cheaper to repair. Which I guess might mean it actually lasts longer...

CharlieMungus
I like yer style

You can not claim a new model is durable without evidence of years of use. You can surmise that it should be durable because you have engineered it to be but to say it is more longer lasting than somethin else when there is no valid comparison is foolish to say the least.

On that basis, bikechain. Do you reckon your carbon bike would last longer than my pasta one?

Guessing there's some 'history' here...

Do you reckon your carbon bike would last longer than my pasta one?

Surely that depends if you ride it in the rain or not?

No cause penne is teh Ultimates material. Facto il forno.

as we all know nothing is ever constant in the MTB world, so i can never say for sure that Ti would do something the CF wouldn't. But for me the Ti would likely take heavy impacts better, and whilst i realise Ti is quite brittle as a metal Ti would bend rather than just give way, like i have seen CF do. I am sure some people have seen Ti give way, though i would say that is very rare.

I am no expert, but is there more people who can repair CF than Ti? I would have thought (I am aware that Ti is not easy to work with) that there would be more people who can weld, than people who can lay CF, especially over a fractured piece of CF?

than people who can lay CF, especially over a fractured piece of CF?

I've heard there's a lot of people in the surfboard(?) and kayaking business who do that kind of stuff regularly.

Me and my bestest mate have both cracked our Ti frames.

😥

Was there not some CEN test for frames?
Ah yes thats where the BS that cynic-al mentioned for BS EN 14766 came from.

carbon has been chosen on fishers sugar and c'dales scalpel specifically because it CAN flex. All about engineering, rather than supposition innit.

I am no expert

at last. And all agree that the original quote is BS?

Of course you can say something like that, If both were brand new materials with no prior knowledge then fair enough.

al, you are right and i am wrong. happy? 🙂

Pretty easy to find CF repairers-

[img] [/img]

[img] [/img]

Quiet day in the bike trade bad weather causing everyone to have SAD too it appears. 🙄

Nope. Day off. And sunny for running.

Retailers arguing on the web isn't very good for company image is it though?

Don't think any of you buy owt off me anyway!

Arguing?

More like discussion non? Lack of spoken tone will make it look like arguing I suppose. Point taken.

as we all know nothing is ever constant in the MTB world, so i can never say for sure that Ti would do something the CF wouldn't. But for me the Ti would likely take heavy impacts better, and whilst i realise Ti is quite brittle as a metal Ti would bend rather than just give way, like i have seen CF do. I am sure some people have seen Ti give way, though i would say that is very rare.

Does the ti frame come with a book on carbon fiber myths to reassure you in your purchase?

Don't sell niche 29er fixies with bar mounted pipe holders then Spokes? 😀

Lol at rs

It's jus healthy debate 🙂

Not even a surly hipflask in our shop. I think the most nichecore thing I have is one of them orange sticks with reflectors on to keep cars away from you. It's been there since the punic wars.

Who'd buy a Jo Burt themed pipeholder off us, though?

Oi I have hipflasks. But ain't niche.

Did you get hame ok btw?

orange sticks with reflectors on to keep cars away from you.

i want it - no-one on here has one of those. oooh i can see the thread now. everyone will be so excited - i might even fit it to my funny sized wheeled fixie mountain bike!! 😉

Yeah, I have returned to no bikes, nothing to do and bugger all in the fridge. So I've been playing on here and watching Dave.

It's not too disimilar to the heady world of bike shop staffing 😉

Heh I am on laundry and housework duties but hurled my left foot on run so on couch 'taking the weight off it' of course.
Where are your bikes anyway?

Who'd buy a Jo Burt themed pipeholder off us, though?

(if it's Ti)

(or carbon - whichever's stronger really)

Well, I have the road bike, but I've done about 600 miles on it in 4 weeks and if I have to place my head below my arse again before October I'll be reet grumpy.

The others are at the guy who drove us to Moray's house and the Evil needs a headset fitting. I'll be back on the bike tomorrow evening though.

http://www.singletraction.co.uk/index.php?fn_mode=fullnews&fn_id=105

Carbon fibre bike lasts 17yrs, shock horror!

Back in 93 I really want one of those or a Kirk Magnesium 😯 Now there's a frame material.

Lol. Apparently the test is whether a bike will last under Dawn French.

What's the conversion factor for one French in Nm?

met a bloke the other week on a GT plastic bike (sts ?) that must've been well over 10yr old. said he rides it every week (California, so dry but even so, pretty good going)

Fatally, however, it's not a LT hardtail - thus inadmissible 🙂

WTF? Have I entered the twilight zone whilst reading this thread? I do like the sound of that bike with the pasta frame though!

Tubes formed from pasta sheet and filled with custard's is the next big thing

Yeh, how did Lenny stand it so long?

the past bike filled with custard would provide a good argument for the person who's horsey friend in a thread the other day said at least if my steed breaks down in the middle of nowhere i can eat it to survive.

well I've got a broken titanium frame, an Airborne Lucky Strike. a 'friend' succeeded in splitting th top tube where it joins the seatpost.

the reason given by a frame builder was the force put on that area by the frame's extended seat post design. I was amazed at how thin the tube was at that point. Any frame is only as strong as the design coupled with the quality of manufacture. Ti is another material that can be used and is generally very durable. I shall have to see how long my other Ti frame, an older Airborne Lancaster which is a much more traditional design lasts.

Si: I'm sure people have long since stopped caring, but

I'm still not clear as to why the statement is BS though

People (al) were calling BS because of the "titanium will last a lifetime" line. As you pointed out, Ti has certain characteristics which, if used well in a design appropriate for intended use, is likely to last a long time. Same could be said of CF, but they will both have certain pros and cons that will have more to do with the design, build and use than the material alone.

'Ti is magic, anything made from it WILL last forever' is a bit too far from the truth.