Look pretty tricky. Is that the one that hardly anyone can actually ride? (and is a footpath)
correct.
it's very steep, and techy, i wouldn't ride it.
but if you're into cheeky, there are [i]better[/i] descents all over the place.
What do I like about the Peaks 'trail centre'?
You can ride early morning and not meet another soul. You could wander across across a few hills and only see two other riders mid morning and 99.9% of the walkers are friendly. Nay on Cavedale/Beast/Cheeky they even GRIN.
Give me that any day.
I understand why we probably won't have anything like the North Shore of Vancouver in this country because of land ownership problems, access rights etc.
And lack of mountains. The lowest peak in the north shore is nearly double that of the highest in the peaks and there are 18 of them. In Vancouver. Nowhere in the UK has the mountains to match that.
Looking at ladybower, it does seem quite straight and wide. I can see why you wouldn't like trail centres if that's your thing. I ride allsorts; natural, trail centres, DH. I like all of it.
superficial - have you ever been to any of the scottish trail centres? they are not all bland.
FWIW I find riding the eroded messes that pass for trails in the peaks rather dull. One eroded cart track after another.
...lack of mountains...
who needs mountains?
the main lift at Whistler has a vertical wotsit of about 300m.
the main lift at Chatel bike park? - about 300m.
you just need a hill.
you don't even need a chairlift: the chatel bike park lift takes about 10mins (assuming no queue...), and rewards you with a 10min descent - if you ride very slowly.
i can show you rides with better climbing/descending ratios than that from my back door.
mountain bikers are easily pleased imho; give us a scrappy bit of wooded hillside and we'll have [s]hours[/s] years of fun.
TandemJeremy - Member
superficial - have you ever been to any of the scottish trail centres? they are not all bland.FWIW I find riding the eroded messes that pass for trails in the peaks rather dull. One eroded cart track after another.
TJ - i will open the invite again - come down and ride - i will show you teh good areas that are not balnd. How many trails have you ridden here/how many times?
200km of lift-serviced descending mountain bike trails.
Gondola to shuttle bikers to around midstation, at 1,200 m
Got this from your door?
Well, yes, sort of. I'm very lucky though - most of my riding recently has been from my front door.Mountain biking, for better or for worse, has developed a dependency on the car and trail centres are an extension of that.
superficial - have you ever been to any of the scottish trail centres? they are not all bland.
Yeah, I've ridden most of them over the years (Never been as far as Laggan though). I quite liked Innerleithen as I recall. I rarely ride any eroded cart tracks these days.
And lack of mountains. The lowest peak in the north shore is nearly double that of the highest in the peaks and there are 18 of them. In Vancouver. Nowhere in the UK has the mountains to match that.
As ahwiles says - the vertical elevation in use isn't actually that impressive. The top-to-bottom of the trails on Fromme in Vancouver is only 300m. There are plenty of hillsides with that sort of elevation + gradient across the UK.
And what hora said.
A tiny percentage of my riding is trail centres but I've enjoyed every one I've been to. They are what they are. If you can't have fun at one I suspect you'd be best off quitting riding bikes and just stick to posting online...
Yep, I'll do that.
I'm not saying I can't enjoy riding my bike at a trail centre, but I will say I much prefer to ride it somewhere more natural. My point is more about my frustration that trails centres are so much more boring than they could / should be.
If you can't have fun at one I suspect you'd be best off quitting riding bikes and just stick to posting online...
Its driving to one, the time spent in transit to get there that makes me expect something 'good'.
Then you get the cafe like at CYB where the staff need to learn the importance of how fast lightning moves (or at least try moving fasting that a sloth).
The top-to-bottom of the trails on Fromme in Vancouver is only 300m. There are plenty of hillsides with that sort of elevation + gradient across the UK.
What about the other [b]17[/b]?
Dunno, is there riding to be had on all 18? As far as I know, all of the original and well-known stuff is at Fromme, Seymour and Cypress. You might imagine that there's riding everywhere but it's such a dense rainforest that it requires a lot of perseverance to build anything. Canada doesn't really 'do' bridleways like we do.
All this just because I fed the troll a couple of pages back. 😕
hora - MemberYou can ride early morning and not meet another soul. You could wander across across a few hills and only see two other riders mid morning and 99.9% of the walkers are friendly.
Sounds like most trail centres, except with more walkers.
TJ - read your ****ing invite
Bored now.....make it stop.
It's definitely the apostrophe abuse that gets me.
cruzhecklerTJ - i will open the invite again - come down and ride - i will show you teh good areas that are not balnd. How many trails have you ridden here/how many times?
I will take you up on that next time I am down that way ta muchly.
I have ridden a few trails around there but not a lot. I have also seen a few on videos. including trails people rave about.
However I just do not particularly like riding eroded cart tracks which a lot of the riding in that area appears to be. One persons rocky technical challenge is another eroded cart track
What I do like about trail centres is the guaranteed ridability. I've lost count of the number of times I've gone to a new area and what looked great on the map is a bogfest of walking or technically too challenging or the weather conditions on that day make it impassable or its just plain dull. Of course finding new stuff can be a blast and it feels like it's "yours" (even though thousands have probably been before you) but for the time poor they definately have their place. Also, as I suspect not one of the most technially competant of the cycling community, I like the fact that the obstacles put in front of me have been deemed possible by someone better than I - so if I can't do it I know I should be able to and can challenge myself to do it again (and again, and again, and again).
What I don't understand is why trail centres in the UK have to be so unmitigatingly dull.
There are hard technical section dotted around trail centres that proves it's not an H and S issue. Airs rock is really daunting to a moderately skilled rider, and it's an optional line on a [u]red[/u] trail.
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Consider who commissions trails. The remit is often to make trails that are accessible to novices - a fine principle. Clever design can make them fun for both novices at low-speed, and more skilled riders at high-speed. But everyone needs a challenge so I would like to see more proper black-graded optional sections on UK's built trails.
The Parkin Clough trail looks really great - loads of bits that would make me sheet my pants!
The usual Peaks what everyone knows can be alot of cart tracks,which i cant be arse with.Years ago(was the norm) i used to ride it until i found better trails there.
But for those who know the area ****in shit loads of nice tech,but no not BW's.
But everyone needs a challenge so I would like to see more proper black-graded optional sections on UK's built trails.
We're kind of arguing the same point. I'm all for providing a nice environment where people new to the sport can try it out and go for coffee/ cake afterwards, that's great. And when those people progress a bit, they can try the other bits they struggled with previously.
But then what? You can either go all Jeyboy and try and do faster laps, but for people wanting more of a technical challenge there aren't many options in trail centres - riders are forced to find / build DH tracks elsewhere.
In my mind trail centres are just bike parks without a chairlift - They're a place you drive to, to ride your bike on purpose-built trails, then come home. So why can't we have riding that's as technically challenging as some of the stuff at E.g. Chatel bike park / Whistler etc?
hora - Member
If you can't have fun at one I suspect you'd be best off quitting riding bikes and just stick to posting online...
Its driving to one, the time spent in transit to get there that makes me expect something 'good'.Then you get the cafe like at CYB where the staff need to learn the importance of how fast lightning moves (or at least try moving fasting that a sloth).
You could always take your own lunch, that certainly would expedite things and leave you more time for riding.
I went to Brenin yesterday and had a blast. I took a friend who rented a FS and we rode some trails. The fact you can go somewhere and rent a very decent bike (fuel ex8) and ride is brilliant. It makes it fun and accessible for people who want to get back in to riding.
In my mind trail centres are just bike parks without a chairlift - They're a place you drive to, to ride your bike on purpose-built trails, then come home. So why can't we have riding that's as technically challenging as some of the stuff at E.g. Chatel bike park / Whistler etc?
Isn't this just a matter of time, I'm sure most centres have pland for expansion as well as skills areas/pump tracks we could start petitions for more advanced trails.bsince we are their customer base, I'm sure they would listen.
So why can't we have riding that's as technically challenging as some of the stuff at E.g. Chatel bike park / Whistler etc
cos the UK is health n safey mad?
I've CYB but the cafe (food and service) is crap. I'd be equally happy if trail centres didn't have cafes.
Whoever named the "beast" breakfast must have been wetting themselves.
cos the UK is health n safey mad?
And we don't have any mountains as big, nor the tourism, nor the space (the redsockers would shit if an area was taken away from them), nor the high demand for a bike park etc etc
Another thing I've noticed is that all the black trails I've ridden here seem to focus on rocky techy rough stuff rather than fast and flowy with proper jumps on them. If the Llandegla blacks had decent jumps they'd probably be my kind of trail!
Sugest that UK Trail Centres could have riskier features and that blaiming health and safety is wrong
Alot of my riding is trying to keep my son and niece interested in biking. I think trail centres are great for this and have enjoyed all the ones I have tried
If the Llandegla blacks had decent jumps they'd probably be my kind of trail!
The Llandegla black isn't really anything more than a XC course, is it?
Dunno. It's fast and flowy but the jumps are too easy to overshoot.
Dunno. It's fast and flowy but the jumps are too easy to overshoot.
Hmmm! I'll admit I've only done the new black once, but what jumps? 😀
cos the UK is health n safey mad?
As I said before, America, the land of the lawsuit, has plenty of bike parks. It's not about litigation.
Maybe it is the redsockers. Surely there are some privately-owned hills where they can't complain?
Re: The gap at Mabie. It's OK - but it's only one feature in a fairly big loop of XCish singletrack stuff. But you're right - it's a start and it proves that perceived risk isn't a good reason not to build this stuff (Particularly as that particular feature is miles from the trail head and about as far from civilisation as you can go in the UK!).
Hmmm! I'll admit I've only done the new black once, but what jumps?
my point exactly 😛
so...given that you don't pay other than to park, what are y'all doing to recreate Whistler in the UK?
Seems, once again, that mountain bikers have that sense of entitlement that leads to them riding anything they want; taking but not really putting anything back.
...and so people buy bigger, burlier bikes then complain that things are a bit tame and then go and trash yet another bit of the countryside.....which will lead to access being limited and soon enough, you'll only be able to ride in .....trail centres..
The non classical peaks riding is really awesome, im lucky i can get out my front door and be in peak district in 15-20 minutes. I have one of my favourite local descents within 30mins ride of me.
A lot of the peaks is "eroded cart tracks", it's nothing to really sing about. It's really nice getting out and clocking up some miles in the great outdoors, enjoying the scenery, i really enjoy it, but enjoyment of the actual riding is limited. It's just various eroded tracks with a vary types of gravel on top, no working of the terrain, just sitting back and trusting that you can roll over the gravel.
But the in the peaks, if you go solo or have the right group, you can get in a serious amount of very good technical riding, especially if you're a little bit cheeky. However these kind of routes do involve a lot of road hacking or "eroded cart track" riding which can be very dull if you're after a full-on testing day.
Trail centres have their places. I know i said they're nothing more than "canal paths with features", but if that's what you enjoy, what's the problem?
As for the whole peaks vs trail centres, the riding standard between the classical peaks routes and trail centres is very similar, but the peaks has an idyllic environment that's a pleasure to be in.
Trails centres you're always guaranteed a certain level of riding. In the peaks there can be better to be had, but you certainly have to work for it, a lot of time spent riding stuff no better than a trail centre, but environment makes up for it.
I don't buy "canal paths with features" in the slightest, unless you count practically everything as a feature... Canal paths being generally flat, wide and pretty straight. Glentress green is like a canal path but no other trail centre I've ever ridden is, features or no.
But it's a fair point that most trail centres have up-and-down difficulty, you'll have easier bits with occasional hard bits rather than the more constant challenge you tend to get with interesting "natural" trails.
To me it's like the difference between racetracks and great roads... Sure, there are places you can go to drive or ride that are better than trackdays, but they're generally far away and you get a lot more crap bits in return for the occasional very good bits. I could ride to the bealach na ba but more than 9/10ths of my riding time will be dull as ditchwater whereas I can ride to knockhill and 9/10ths of the riding time will be great- just more repetitive and maybe not quite as good at the best.
Superficial
Have you been to the scottish trail centres? Plenty of difficult stuff there if you want it.
It's utter nonsense, CyB is rubbish cos it's all man made trails, Peaks is miles better cos it's all ROWs. Next time your at CyB about to do Pink Heifer. Ride a bit further up the hill and on your right you come to a Bridlepath heading down. As steep and lairy as anything you'll find in the peaks and one of many in the area.
Ride a bit further up the hill and on your right you come to a Bridlepath heading down.
So what you're saying is that if you go outside the trail centre trails, there are some good bridleways?
Have you been to the scottish trail centres? Plenty of difficult stuff there if you want it.
Yes, I've been to Scotland. I actually quite liked Innerleithen as I recall. It's been a few years though. I don't want to do the whole "Elite rider on your left" thing, but there's not much that I would call particularly difficult. Perhaps things have changed since I went.
[i]So what you're saying is that if you go outside the trail centre trails, there are some good bridleways? [/i]
I'm saying CyB has everything that the peaks has and more.
Superficial - MemberI don't want to do the whole "Elite rider on your left" thing, but there's not much that I would call particularly difficult
Out of curiosity, did you just do the XC route? Innerleithen's pretty dull that way but that's not even half of the riding that's there.
I strongly suspect that if you don't find trail centres sufficiently interesting then you're not riding fast enough.
Crikey i'll be getting a bmx again to ride the local skateparks and dirt jumps. I would like to help out with digging at woburn but can only get there on my days off where I'd rather be riding than digging all day.
I think that mountain biking is becoming so fashion led that people buy big burly bikes and [i]then[/i] look for somewhere to ride them, rather than buying a bike to suit the terrain they are actually riding on.
It's like me buying a snowmobile and then complaining that I can't ride it in Manchester.
Crikey +1
