Forum menu
I see the fastest time up the Alpe du Zwift is 28mins at 503W.
But it's not by people verified on zwiftpower? so it doesn't count IMO. Not sure how much faith id put into those results, could have hacked trainers, use trainers that give watts too easily etc. I haven't seen anyone getting close to those numbers on zwiftpower and we're looking at the top guys up to 100 kg.
An absolute machine like Filippo Ganna will manage 500W for 10 minutes but his power output is on a different level to even most of the other pros https://www.strava.com/activities/3567142726/analysis/5290/5871
525 watts for 13 minutes actually, beast.
Not if you weigh 95+kg it won’t. Wattage is pretty meaningless it’s W/kg that matters as soon as the road is anything other than flat.
True. I meant it as an example of how hard 500W is, for the previous poster who asked for a football pitches measurement, and it's true that a pro level 85kg rider wouldn't find it so intense, but it's still out of reach for almost everyone whatever their weight.
500W for anything longer than a minute is absolutely hauling
Quoted for truth. I can't even do it for a minute (65kg).
Sounds like a ridiculously high figure to me, and I'd be very impressed if any non-professional could achieve that.
Apart from Daffy, who must put out those kind of figures on his commutes, obvs.
😉
500W for anything longer than a minute is absolutely hauling
Quoted for truth. I can’t even do it for a minute (65kg).
If Wattbikes are accurate, I could maybe hold it for five seconds or so.
I have managed 450w for one minute, 323w for 5 minutes. I think my power curve is quite flat though. I am aiming to hit a 300w ftp - I don’t think I am for off. There is a dip in my power curve at about 18.5 mins which means a bit more endurance and I should make it (in theory).
Couldn’t imagine doing 500w for 5 mins!
In recent years 502 is my one minute best, 365 my peak 5 min. 68-73kg depending on beer. Not that close to those numbers this year...349w peak 5 min and about 450w peak 1 min
Around 500W for 5 minutes for the British Hill climb champ at 65kg just messing around for the cameras
Slightly longer segment with a bit of flat at the top and Feather did it at 462W for a little over 6 minutes.
https://www.strava.com/segments/1393060
So anyone here who isn't porky and reckons they have a 500W 5 min CP should be right up there with the National best
My 5 min CP is 4.5W/kg which Coggan's chart has me as "Good" (which is consistent with my FTP but my 1 min CP is way off) and I can tell you that is not anywhere near 500W even at a higher than average weight 🙂
My numbers are super flat - 400W for 1 min and 300W for 20min. Not even held 500W for 15 secs.
Need to work on my strength! 63kg weakling ;p
I surprised myself in April, up the final nasty little incline I sometimes do on the road bike, often the way I come home from work too on the commuter because I'm sadistic. Easily my best 60-75sec power of the last few years, 578W scaling down to 503W (7.5 to 6.6 W/Kg at the time), 500W+ 1min efforts are definitely not my forte!
https://www.strava.com/activities/3347515536/overview
Checking my intervals.icu my PB 5min is 482, but it was 502 for about 3m50. I was about 75 at the time. My power trails off pretty quickly though; down to around 340-350 threshold. That's on about 4-6hrs a week on avg?
As a student I could do 400W for 8 mins, it was a standard test (and not a particularly impressive number, plenty could do better). On a rowing machine (2500m on a CII erg), which may or may not be easier/harder than cycling but I'd expect about the same.
30+ years later quite pleased to be not all that far off at 350 for 8 mins cycling. And I'm 5kg lighter.
I reckon if I was sensible (not going OVER 500W) I could hold 500w for a minute..
Will see as on zwift currently...
Just doing a workout.. Will try after..
DrP
Edit...Ok... about 520w for the 30 second free ride section... yeah... a min will be tough!
According to Strava my best for 500w this year was 1:37 at 71kg, the climb ran out (and I started much higher than 500) so maybe I could have done a little longer at a steadier pace but 5 minutes is insane! FTP is about 300w for what it's worth.
Can you translate for those of us who aren’t roadies? How much is 500 watts in football pitches?
It's approximately the weight of an adult elephant.
@DrP - should be easy for you, just use the ‘other power meter’ that takes you up the epic KOM in 5 mins
Going back to the Coggan's chart, a straight line across would be a theoretical all-rounder. In fact real riders can't read straight across, your performance moves around in the rows depending on your particular strengths. Power Profiling
So it is possible for say a track sprinter to have a power output near the top of the left hand column but lower down for the longer durations. That's why yohandsome's 700W for 5 minutes guy couldn't win the TdF.
The correct use of the chart is to test yourself for each of those durations to find your own profile which then tends to indicate where your strengths lie (if you don't already know).
I can't do it these days, but looking at my notes, my best 5 minute power was 481 Watts, which was about 7W/kg. I only really took notes of (not tested) 5 minute power during the hill climb season though, which is when I was lightest.
Someone won a Zwift race I was on recently with an average power of something like 360W. Impressive, but he was listed as 105kg. If you're all muscle then you will be producing big numbers but it won't make you a pro because you weight so much.
Making big numbers whilst weighing 65kg is the trick!
That’s why yohandsome’s 700W for 5 minutes guy couldn’t win the TdF.
Let's make some guesstimates here. Conservatively estimating FTP to be 80% of 5 minute power = 560W and bodyweight 100 kg.
Let's say the avg gradient of de tour is 2.5%, then for each 10 kgs weight loss a rider has to do 5% less work. A 60 kg rider would need to do 20% less work than our 100 kg beast, to best him they would need a 450W FTP.
The beast's watts pr kg is still just a meager 5.6, whereas the 450W FTP 60 kg climbing god would need to hit 7.5 watts pr kg to beat him.
Watts pr kg only makes a big difference on steep hills and is a silly way to compare riders' capabilities outside of pure hill climbing.
That is wrong on so many levels especially when related to *Le* Tour, the dynamics of riding in a team, where stages are won, how the GC is won, how W/kg work, etc, etc but hey 🙂
The conclusion is still likely right even though the details are let's say grossly simplified. 700 watts for 5 minutes is so insane and there's no way this person also wouldn't have a beastly FTP (you need good endurance for 5 min!).
People focus too much on watts pr kg..
For a flat, non technical road race, racing as an individual (eg flat TT) then mega Watts regardless of weight is a huge advantage but the less powerful lighter rider *could* also still be faster due to being more aero. Whatever scenario you dream up total power never trumps everything regardless of all other factors. You can take your argument further to say people focus too much on power and fitness as the only judge of progress or success is race results and that is all anyone should focus on 😉
Let’s say the avg gradient of de tour is 2.5%, then for each 10 kgs weight loss a rider has to do 5% less work. A 60 kg rider would need to do 20% less work than our 100 kg beast, to best him they would need a 450W FTP.
Can someone explain these numbers to me?
Or are they junk?
Ballpark correct based on the equation:
Power needed to go up a hill (watts) = gravitational constant 9.8 (m/sec^2) * gradient in %/100 * total mass (kg) * speed on the road (m/s)
To take a more realistic comparison, comparing Ganna (rider 1) assuming his FTP is 480 watts to a lighter shorter 65 kg rider, it actually looks like a smaller rider like Remco _could_ beat him if they can hit 400W FTP due to aero advantages (Cd the same, A calculated from height and weight).
Comparing a 20 km/h climb it actually looks like you'd need to get well above 10 degrees for Remco to gain an advantage over Ganna.
In road racing there's normally a kick to establish a gap before the 5 minute effort. So you have to stand up, hit 8-10W/kg for long enough to get a gap then sit back down and hold 5-6 to grow then settle down to something you can maintain for the duration of the race.
It's what makes Pros so impressive. You look at their 5 minute power and realise they can do it at the end of a stage on week three of racing. Or the numbers they put out in sprint are after a threshold effort in the last few km.
I think weight is less of an issue amongst lean riders as it is mostly just down to height and body type. It's more likely a problem amongst us mere mortals where its a bit of extra padding.
Let’s say the avg gradient of de tour is 2.5%, then for each 10 kgs weight loss a rider has to do 5% less work. A 60 kg rider would need to do 20% less work than our 100 kg beast, to best him they would need a 450W FTP.
The beast’s watts pr kg is still just a meager 5.6, whereas the 450W FTP 60 kg climbing god would need to hit 7.5 watts pr kg to beat him.
Watts pr kg only makes a big difference on steep hills and is a silly way to compare riders’ capabilities outside of pure hill climbing.
The maths there might be right, I haven't checked.
But that's not how a grand tour is raced. It isn't a few hundred km of a gradual slope.
The flat sections are dominated by riding in a peloton where on,y those on the front are working. Those drafting are saving energy & trying to avoid silly crashes taking them out or losing them time.
Unless it's a cross tail wind when it's chaos & fascinating to watch.
Rarely is much time made between favourites on the flat stages.
The TTs have some relevance to the data above, but really they're down to aero not power output alone.
Then there's the hills - the steepest bits ridden at the slowest speeds and with least aero benefit from drafting have a disproportionate affect on the outcome, and that *is* down to w/kg and to the ability to recover.
I realized that Remco has beat Ganna 3 out of 3 times, and it's said his FTP is up to 420w so that makes sense.
I reckon I could nail 500 wotsits in 5 minutes, easy.
I think I'm a competent club cyclist. My best 5 min power was about 5 watts per kilo, or close to 330 watts at 66kg. Scaling that up I'd need to be 100 kg to put out 500 watts at the same watts per kilo. There probably aren't many 100 kg roadies out there.
However..
I reckon a good competitive amateur roadie would be able to put out around 6w/kg for that period of time (coggan's chart appears to agree with me). To hit 500 watts they'd then need to be around 84 kg, which whilst big for a roadie isn't unheard of.
So yeah, I reckon 500 watts for 5 min is probably doable by most large built cat 1 roadies out there.
For me it would be a distant dream however.
Here's 1927 watts for 25 seconds
No chance for me. Too light at 58kg.
Let’s say the avg gradient of de tour is 2.5%, then for each 10 kgs weight loss a rider has to do 5% less work. A 60 kg rider would need to do 20% less work than our 100 kg beast, to
Why 5% less & 20% less?
He's 4x10 kg heaver so 4x5% = 20%. It's ballpark correct even when factoring in the probable height and in turn drag difference, look:
I’m very average club rider but heavier at 90kg and short surges is what I’m best at
Managed 500w for 2:24 in the last couple of weeks
5 min power was 420 but that’s not max as 10 min power was similar
These were indoor rides on a Kickr
My peak was 5 mins @ 482w @ 66kg. My 5 minute has always been my killer duration, no short hill Strava KOM is safe, haha!
Since I became a hermit this winter, I've been using the basement gym here and its single, aged, knackered bike. I can just about average 400w over a 5 minute period which, with my weight and that chart in mind is about 4.8w/kg.
The thought of upping that to 500w over 5 mins fills me with dread, fear AND nausea. So I am going to try it on Thursday and see what happens.
I think 500 for 5 is definitely possible but it just depends on weight really. I just started cycling 1.5 months ago and have done about 1500km. No previous cycling or endurance sport experience and have just turned 20. Just got a coach so I'll see how I go but 500 for 5 is definitely a minimum goal for me. I did maximal power testing the other day to set a baseline for my training and that has my best at 400 watts at 76kg (or 5.26 w/kg). Race weight goal is 72-73kg.
Edit: In saying that, I could quite possibly just have good genetics. My brother is a youth player for a professional soccer club and the testing guys told him that he was one of the fittest players he'd seen. He's got a resting heart rate of 31. Fingers crossed I've got some similar genes hahaha
I think 500 for 5 is definitely possible but it just depends on weight really. I just started cycling 1.5 months ago and have done about 1500km. No previous cycling or endurance sport experience and have just turned 20. Just got a coach so I’ll see how I go but 500 for 5 is definitely a minimum goal for me. I did maximal power testing the other day to set a baseline for my training and that has my best at 400 watts at 76kg (or 5.26 w/kg). Race weight goal is 72-73kg.
Hang about. You've been cycling for one and a half months and can already put out 5.26 watts for 5 min??
Either you are bullshitting, your power measurement is way off, or you will likely be a pro within a year.
500w for 5 mins at 76kg puts you into 'domestic pro' territory on the charts 🙂
https://www.cyclinganalytics.com/blog/2018/06/how-does-your-cycling-power-output-compare
In saying that, I could quite possibly just have good genetics.
Is that 400w measured on an elite muin or a wheel on turbo?
Did the test on the road with Assioma Duo Power Meter pedals that I re-calibrated between each test I was doing so the numbers are correct from what I can see. From what I've seen I've learned there is a lot more to the sport than just your power i.e. race craft, personality, working well within a team etc. It's possible that I could just have a high starting base but not as much room for improvement. Only thing I can do is give it a crack and see how it turns out
Unless you are already a superstar runner or some such, i think your claim is rather based on fallacy