Trampus, just what the armed forces need!!! Babysitting some stupid **** who doesn’t want to be there and has no interest whatsoever in the forces. I did 13years in the RAF and in my last 4 years noticed a definate change in the attitudes of the new airmen sent to my section.
“why do I need to clean that up, that’s what the cleaner gets paid for”
“this camp is crap, I’m going home for the weekend cos there’s nothing to do” gym, swimming pool, climbing wall, rugby/football/hockey/cricket/tennis/mountaineering/skiing/sailing/canoe/car maintenance clubs etc. all available free of charge. In fact if there wasn’t a club to do it, you could start one AND the service would provide ANYTHING you required.
Then when they did get back on Monday, trying to motivate them back into working was a nightmare.
In fact you’re correct, bring back National Service. Then they wouldn’t need en-suite, single rooms that they never leave to socialise or exercise. And I wouldn’t have been accused of “bullying” one of my charges by asking him repeatedly to return to his assigned duties instead of wadering around chatting to his mates (who were actually trying to get on).
I went through my basic training with one individual from Ipswich who was offered the choice of Prison or joining up. Luckily for us he was escorted from the base, after trying to bayonet someone because he was “wound up”. He didn’t recieve the nickname Psycho for nothing!

I’d much rather leave the little darlings on the street, but relax the rules that say the police have to be nice to them. You can’t pick up bricks if your fingers are broken.

Not often I admit to the yanks having a good idea, but chain gangs might make some think twice before damaging property or committing a crime “cos there’s nuffin’ to do”. IMHO 😈

Yeah, I think they just need a good beating to be honest.

My sister in law works in a maximum security prison. The prisoners kicked off the other day as they weren’t allowed a Playstation 3 ! WTF.

Bring on the revolution.

My car’s being fixed but I don’t want to brng it home now in case the ****s do it again!

Did you see the episode of Holloway in which one of the guests was asked nicely to surrender a cigarette lighter……….after setting fire to her bedding. They should have let the other guests ask for the lighter….they all lost their family visits due to the wing being locked down. HAHAHAHAHA
The “cells” they live in are bigger/better equipped/decorated than the room I was allocated when in the RAF. AND I had to pay for the priviledge of living in a room that measured 8×9 feet, with the heating switched off between April and October. Luxury, didn’t know how lucky I was. Preferred the first accommodation, 14 man room, always someone going out for a pint or down the gym etc.

I do miss home!

It may shock you all to learn that the vast majority of the kids I have taught, even in one of the lowest achieving schools in the country, have been quite nice (didnt all learn much but thats my failings mostly not there’s!!)

Saying the country has gone to the dogs because some morons vandalised your car is the worst kind of daily mail moronic idiocy in the world, how can you be so feeble minded to equate one incident with the whole country.

Also how do you know it was kids? Not long ago someone crashed into my parked car and left quite a few dents, should i just blame kids or adults? Could have been one of those idiot neighbours from yesterdays thread!!

Ok – Before my counter rant I would like to offer syympathy for the OP.

OMG – you lot don’t talk some piffle sometimes. Crime is significantly down.

Prisons are horrible places to be – I know I have been in them on both sides of the bars

We jail more of our population for longer for more trivial offences than comparable countries

What you see is a moral panic stirred up by the murdoch papers for political ends.

Every generation say “the country is going to the dogs” It is simply not true. You are less likely to be a victim of crime now than at any time in history ( except perhaps the 50s

Get real and stop swallowing neo con propaganda

Country is a mess, and I blame the welfare state.

While the welfare state provides a roof over someones head, medical care, enough money for food, cigarettes, and booze – many see this as an easy lifestyle, and they can always top up income with a bit of crime.

When you decide you don’t need a job, you realise you don’t need an education, and you realise it doesn’t matter if you get in trouble.

If it was turned around, and the welfare state provided a roof over someone’s head, warmth, and food only – absolutely no-one would want the lifestyle. They’d realise they need a job – therefore education, and need to stay out of trouble.

Unfortunately, too many think the better society treats people the better they act. This is false – many just take the piss, some humans are like that. There are no real consequences of this.

At the end of the day, many will have less fulfilled lives due to thinking the state owes them a living. Not good for them, not good for society.

I spent the last couple of days doing some fitting work in North Manchester Hospital A&E. You could at times get drunk on the fumes in there(this is daytime). There’s people asleep drunk on the floor, youths swearing their heads off in front of the elderly etc. Hospital manager saying everthing has to be secured down, chairs bolted together, plants caged, and she herself had been stabbed.

On the way home, I saw a middle aged woman walk in front of a car turning into a street. Driver pressed horn, and woman was straght at car window menacing hurling abuse and V sign.

Yep – country’s in a mess. There’s none so blind, as those that will not see!

It’ll all go back to normal after the school holidays … 😛

TJ – crimes are massively under-reported, especially low-level crime that people know the police can’t/wont solve such as the above. At my old place of living the local population (mainly well paid working class and professionals) were sick of the sort of crimes the OP has seen. After a few meetings with the local MP etc the police put out a leaflet saying “please call this hotline for ANY anti-social or criminal disturbance, no matter how small”. 6 weeks later the local bobby admitted they were totally snowed under with responses and they’d not expected so many things to be unreported and were effectively binning the lower level stuff like wing mirrors being kicked off, windows broken. Then, of course, when they do find the people involved they take it through to prosecution only to be told by the CPS that it’s being thrown out on a technicality that the defendants lawyer has found.

Crime figures mean very little in the real world.

how can you be so feeble minded to equate one incident with the whole country.

I suspect no-one is quite so naive as to equate one incident to a national increase, usually its based on seeing a trend in their area. Which does have significance.

yep, things are bad now, every other time they were tip top!

1910’s WW1
1920’s everyone poor
1930’s everyone rich (mostly, we’ll ignore the poor now, its a fool proof plan)
1940’s everyone poor again, blame it on them (points wildly and starts a war), ends war with atomic bomb
1950’s everyone glad thats over, teenagers steel rock’n’roll,
1960’s spliff anyone?
1970’s drop acid not bombs! miners strikes
1980’s british industry is best in the world, if they ever went to work, and could build something worthwhile if their lives depened on it?
1990’s england goes to the pub to watch the football, and ahs a fight while its at it
2000’s more war, less oil, were’all dooooooomedddddddddddddddddd

I suspect no-one is quite so naive as to equate one incident to a national increase, usually its based on seeing a trend in their area. Which does have significance.

Nationally, does it hell, I fear you dont know the meaning of significance. And anyway he did in his rant. Shit happens get over it.

Also do we think no crime went unreported in ye oldenie days, I would imagine what with more insurance now more crimes are reported, especially as you are not able to find the little scally and give him a slap.

oh yeah and bin the wlefare state, it works in the USA. Which countries have low crime rates, I’ve no idea myself but expect Scandinavian countries do better than us.

a_a – percentage of unreported crimes these days to “olden” days – obviously I cant know that info but considering only 20 years ago around my old way you’d be hoiked off and your parents brought to the station to fill in paperwork just for walking down a quiet street with a bull-whip and two girls (dont ask) and these days the police drive past people cobbing glass bottles across the road at each other, in the same town on the same roads, I suspect its leaning more toward my argument. That said, 50 years ago I suppose you’d just get a clip round the ear and told to go home rather than have it written up, so it could be swings and roundabouts.

Oh, and for international crime comparison purposes (not taking sides, just found it):

You’ve done time TJ?

Soory about your car OP, that sucks!

But regarding the whole “youth of today” rant:

The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers.

    — Socrates (469–399 B.C.)

I do believe that there is a small part of the community that no longer has any link with ‘respect’.
I’m not sure how to make myself clear on this, but if for example I did something wrong in society in my youth my parents would have come down on me as well as the authorities.
Now you have small numbers of kids who’s own parents would’nt dicipline them and probably would go so far as to protect them from the concequences.
However, as someone said kids are pretty good in general. I coached youth football for eight years and had many known ‘problem’ kids on my team and some that no other clubs would accept and none of them gave me any real trouble. In fact I had more abuse and disrespect from the middle class kids.
Generalisation over.

Love the quote GrahamS.

My father was one of 7 brought up in poverty(his father a coal miner),he, and his siblings aspired to a better life, tried at school, and largely kept out of trouble(probably scrumping apples being as bad as it got).

They were far worse off than those on the dole know, and were subject to corporal punishment both at home and at school.

They all grew up to be decent citizens, five did very well for themselves. How different to those being brought up today in far better conditions on welfare?

I’m not sure how to make myself clear on this, but if for example I did something wrong in society in my youth my parents would have come down on me as well as the authorities.
Now you have small numbers of kids who’s own parents would’nt dicipline them and probably would go so far as to protect them from the concequences.

I agree, but I’m not convinced this is a new phenomenon.

gangs

>but thats my failings mostly not there’s!!)

So it would seem from the above evidence 😉

TJ – crimes are massively under-reported, especially low-level crime that people know the police can’t/wont solve such as the above. At my old place of living the local population (mainly well paid working class and professionals) were sick of the sort of crimes the OP has seen. After a few meetings with the local MP etc the police put out a leaflet saying “please call this hotline for ANY anti-social or criminal disturbance, no matter how small”. 6 weeks later the local bobby admitted they were totally snowed under with responses and they’d not expected so many things to be unreported and were effectively binning the lower level stuff like wing mirrors being kicked off, windows broken. Then, of course, when they do find the people involved they take it through to prosecution only to be told by the CPS that it’s being thrown out on a technicality that the defendants lawyer has found.

But the British Crime Survey isn’t on crimes reported to the police – it is a survey. So it counts unreported crime like the above (I guess that’s how they calculated reported vs unreported crime rates?). If you don’t know about it and it’s methodology, you can read more about it here – http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/rds/bcs1.html

Joe

No not new at all really.
I had a discussion with my wife expressing my concerns for the almost certain trouble my lad would at sometime face.
However it seems that my kids and their friends express a far greater intolerance towards trouble than my contempories had.
In my short time at school two kids were stabbed that was in the seventies, I had a knife pulled on me at school.
(I must tell you about that. The kid pulled ut a small knife and all I could think about was that I was going to get stabbed by a piddly penkife with a naked mermaid on it) I finaly did get stabbed in the hip in 1982.
Also racism was rife back then, and if you had a handicap well that was it.
So in a way it’s all a bit ****ed up in an odd way now.

True Joe, and a fair point. However:

…crimes against businesses and people aged under 16 are excluded. The BCS also excludes crimes termed as
victimless (e.g. drug offences) and crimes such as murders (where the victim cannot be interviewed).

😕

And anyway I know what the root cause of todays evil is.

Sweet shops & garages selling booze. It is I tell you.