Whilst I had my dropper posted full suss bike my confidence and skill was building.

Now I have my seat up my arse, clipped in carbon rocket my confidence has taken a knock after a pretty sizeable off.

I am looking for some skills vids with people on bikes without there post in the frame / droppers.

I was managing drop offs fine with my post out of the way but now struggle a bit.

Cheers

Not videos, but…

Steep? Check.
Seat up? Check.
Nino

Fixed seatmast in this one

Some great pics there – where’s the first one? It looks awesome!

Having ridden for years without touching my seat post I now lower it a lot. No wonder I was over the handlebars so often before. If I did more riding I’d get a dropper for sure.

Rob, it’s at Pietermaritzburg, SA.

S.A. WC XC race in Pietermaritzburg, bit like the Olympic course, they didn’t have a mountain, so just went a bit nits with the trail building instead.

[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bl5w5oK9Tr8[/video]

Don’t let the camera tom foolery trick you, that first picture isn’t as steep as it’s made to look!

It’s just practice.

Trying to remember a couple of points helps me when i swap between by All Mountain Missile with low saddle and my XC race bike with saddle up in the trees:

1) High saddle = smaller cockpit. As a result, you can’t get your mass as low between the wheels as easily, and you will have to exaggerate your front/back movements to compensate on steep terrain. As those pics^^^ show, the top riders have their belly button literally rubbing the saddle!

2) Go faster to maximise inertia! Slightly contrary to what you might expect, the faster you go, the less time there is for you and your bike to rotate around your combined CofG. If you drop slowly off a step, for example, you have to move right back to keep your CofG over the rear wheel to prevent yourself rotating forward (as the front wheel can’t hold you up, being in mid air) If you are going much faster, you can remain in the middle of the bike because the rotational moment of inertia prevents you from rotating forwards around your combined CofG. So, with the seat high, don’t slow down and try to trickle over stuff, go in fast, hard and with confidence!

I spent some time on the pump track yesterday, pretty good for honing your technique. Going fast is really about carrying more speed and being smooth. Some of the guys are really impressive on the pump.

I find it’s fine as long as you get the right size bike, if you try and ride an XC bike that you bought that was too small, or with a tiny stem then there’s no room to get your hips forwards and knee over the top tube in a corner.

Steep stuff is just a matter of using proper technique rather than relying on the bike to move around under you you need to anticipate where it needs to be, e.g. in that last pic of the Scott, push the bike forewards at the bottom of the rock to stop you going over the front, whereas on a small bike you could get away with remaining centered and when the bike crashed to a halt at the bottom absorb it with your legs.

It’s just practice.

Of course it is, watching anyone it’s just about practice!

light hands,heavy feet, drop your heels, do not go so far back that your arms are straight, keep your elbows bent. head up and look ahead.

But if you are ridding the bike for fun then saddle down is OK

I bet five english pounds that if you rode repeated laps on any reasonably technical XC course that you’d be quicker with a dropper than without – and that riders are using them at the next Olympics. Even if you’re not any quicker I’m sure you’ll crash less!

To be honest, I think it’s merely fashion and old habits that are keeping people from using dropper in XC racing.

Yeah, after getting a bruise just bellow my nipple from the back of my saddle (I didn’t come off, I just have a high saddle!), I’m getting a dropper 😀 .

I think it’s merely fashion and old habits that are keeping people from using dropper in XC racing.

Yes,I’m sure racers who’s careers depend on their results think “I know I’d be faster with a dropper seatpost and get better results but it’s not fashionable so I’ll not bother” 🙄

There was a video on pinkbike earlier in the year of some swedish/norwegian (or something like that) xc racers tackling a freeride course including big gaps on their xc rigs as set up, though I can’t find it now.

My opinion – stuff riding with a saddle in the way. It’s so much more fun once it’s slammed.

Rorschach – Member

Yes,I’m sure racers who’s careers depend on their results think “I know I’d be faster with a dropper seatpost and get better results but it’s not fashionable so I’ll not bother”

You don’t think fashion plays a part? Lots of people were slow to adopt 29ers then jumped all over them once they were winning races. Dropper posts in downhill were the same, none for ages then as soon as they gained a little traction people tried it and found it could work.

I’ve got no athlete’s mentality, but if I’d spent years perfecting the skills required to ride around the limitations of a high seatpost, I’d maybe not be too keen to make all of that worthless by fitting a dropper. Especially if I felt I was better than the competition as it stands.

Dropper posts WILL appear in world cup and other international xc racing in the coming couple of years. I guess they don’t use them thus far as the mentality behind weight-saving is so ingrained in everything they do.

You’ll only see dropper posts if they are faster, and for the top XC guys, it’s pretty clear that they can ride the stuff they ride without dropping.

Dropper posts seem to have become de rigeur for leisure riders, but best not to forget that XC racing is about going fast all the time, not just down hill.

crikey – Member

You’ll only see dropper posts if they are faster, and for the top XC guys, it’s pretty clear that they can ride the stuff they ride without dropping.

Course they can. But can they do it faster? Safer? With less stress on other parts allowing maybe lighter tyres or wheels? Or just easier, letting them save a little energy? It’s more complicated than “can they do it” or even how many or few seconds it might save per descent.

chiefgrooveguru
I bet five english pounds that if you rode repeated laps on any reasonably technical XC course that you’d be quicker with a dropper than without

I don’t get you logic?

Generally speaking, XC riders can ride around the courses they compete on, without falling off. So how does having a dropper post they don’t need to use help them?

A current a XC course is about pedaling like ****, not sending it large off 10foot hucks, and after something like 50km of max attack pedaling, i fail to see how making you bike heavier can help you go faster?

But can they do it faster? Safer? With less stress on other parts allowing maybe lighter tyres or wheels? Or just easier, letting them save a little energy?

I can’t help feeling that you are rather over-selling the effect of a dropper post.

They move your saddle down a bit.

C’est tout.

Well the top XC guys seem to take jumps and small step downs with the saddle up without any issue and they’re far faster than any of us will ever be… so you’d assume they know what is up and have a little bit of skill up their sleeves. Nino, Fontana and a few others have raced some Enduros pretty successfully too so it isn’t as though they are too jey to experiment or lack any descending skills. At the end of the day they have the skill to not have to fanny around with yet another lever and extra weight for the few seconds of technical riding per lap it might actually be of marginal use.

If a dropper post makes you quicker downhill and/or round corners, or saves you energy in those situations, then it can make you faster as long as the gain is not offset by the weight penalty causing an equal or greater loss. The smoother the flow downhill the better the rider is rested come the next climb.

“It just lowers your saddle a bit” is a silly statement. Lowering the saddle radically improved the centre of gravity of the system and the arm/leg range available for better self-suspension/cornering/pump. I’m sure I remember crashes in the 2012 Olympics XC. Would they have happened if the rider had been in a far better position for technical riding?

Nope, it just lowers your saddle a bit. Sorry, but it’s true.

Your CofG is exactly the same, the saddle is just a bit lower.

Your arms and legs stay exactly the same.

I’m pretty sure all top level XC riders are well aware of the dropper post, and I’m also sure if any rider wanted one they would be using one.

This however is a moot point as people should never compare themselves to pros

Nope, it just lowers your saddle a bit. Sorry, but it’s true.
Your CofG is exactly the same, the saddle is just a bit lower.
Your arms and legs stay exactly the same.

Don’t agree, the position your body is quite different with a dropper, body position is lower thus centre of gravity is different.
Without a dropper my rear end is much higher, lower with a dropper.

From your statement it sounds like you keep your body in exactly the same position with a dropper or without, which for me me completely defeats the point of having one. The point for me is that you can move around, whether that be up, down, left or right. All of those movements have an impact on your centre of gravity.

Without a dropper my rear end is much higher, lower with a dropper

I think that’s a function of how you ride; look at the pics above.

We shall see, but I suspect that we won’t see them in pro XC because they aren’t needed.

With the way the courses are going I’d be surprised if we don’t see them at some point. There was some massive stacks this year in the World Cup that I’m sure wouldn’t of happened if people were running them. With the women I think races were lost because droppers weren’t used by the less technically able.

I think that’s a function of how you ride

Exactly and that lowers my centre of gravity. As it does with the vast majority of people who ride droppers.

BTW I don’t think droppers are necessary for xc racing.

Nope, it just lowers your saddle a bit. Sorry, but it’s true.
Your CofG is exactly the same, the saddle is just a bit lower.
Your arms and legs stay exactly the same.

If you honestly believe this is true then either you have horribly poor technique or what you think you’re doing is completely different to what you’re actually doing. Or maybe you’ve never lowered your saddle?

The geometry of XC bikes doesn’t really lend itself to a dropper either. I can’t say I’ve given it a go myself but I wouldn’t have thought the pros would be able to modify their body position too much with the saddle moved 4 inches- The long reach and low bars (especially on a pro set up, rather than the average STW mincelite XC set up) contribute a lot to the descending position IMO and moving the saddle a bit likely changes very little especially on the average XC course. I wouldn’t have thought its the same effect as a slack, short reach frame where a more descending friendly body position is more possible.

If you honestly believe this is true then either you have horribly poor technique or what you think you’re doing is completely different to what you’re actually doing. Or maybe you’ve never lowered your saddle?

See the above pics.

I totally understand the benefits of a dropper post, and do use one sometimes… But I’ve not felt the need to use a dropper on a UK race course (not ridden Hadleigh).
But I think World Level will be different.

The main thing at the moment is the weight. They need to come nearer 300g. Plus 125mm drop is too much. 30-50mm is plenty for XC.

See the above pics.

There are no dropped saddles in those photos.

What mtbmatt said

Riding at night with people who known the trails more than me has helped me. It’s probably based on not having time to over analyse stuff and just having to deal with trail features – you learn to trust your gut and go with the flow. Went out in the light today and flew around.

Switching to 750mm bars and a 70mm stem has probably helped but I def trust myself more.

As you were. Back to the dropper posts arguments.