Haven’t got time to read the whole thread, so apologies if this has already been pointed out…

Bear in mind that in Scotland the process is different to England & Wales – so the fact that he’s been charged by BTP doesn’t mean he’ll be prosecuted.

E&W – police gather evidence > evidence considered by CPS > CPS decide to prosecute or not (based on quality of evidence and public interest > if CPS decide to prosecute police are told to charge him.

Scotland – police gather evidence > if sufficient evidence to suggest an offence might have been committed then police charge him > report goes to PF > PF decides whether to prosecute or not (based on quality of evidence and public interest > if PF decides to prosecute then PF office cites the individual, otherwise NFA

So in this instance it’s still not yet been decided by the PF whether the big man will be prosecuted.

hora – Member

– The boy is also charged. With what? Not having a train ticket? wow, scary. The bloke who was being held up with everyone else whilst a little shit swore at a man who is probably older than his Dad grabbed and threw him off the train has the potential to gain a criminal record.Or you could always read the original article or the subsequent posts:

1. He’s not been charged, he has been reported to the Fiscal, who will decide if there is enough evidence to charge him.

2. He’s not been charged with failing to have a ticket. He’s been reported for trespass (presumably “on the railway”; i.e. refusing to leave when told to) and abusive behaviour. The fiscal is presumably waiting for the conclusion of this thread with eager anticipation!

TJ – However being an objectionable mouthy git does not mean you can be assaulted with impunity

probably just as well to preserve your good looks 😉

I have to say that the most odious character to come out of this is the chap who took the video in the first place.

I saw him being interviewed on BBC breakfast and he came across as an evil smug little f#cker. exactly the sort that eggs people on into fights for his own cowardly titilation.

IMO, no punches were thrown, there was no intent to physically harm, he was just trying to help the young chap off the train and the he tripped or wasn’t very stable on his feet due to being pissed…

I set ’em up Poly 🙂

I wonder how much the press have been responsible for the outcome so far as well. It seemed to have started with the kid being a bit pissed off but admitting it was a fair cop and enjoying his moment of fame on facebook. The train got to move and everyone got on with their lives.

Then once the dad was tracked down there starts to be talk of charges being pressed – without the dad presumably realising that his kid would also of course get charged and now rather than the whole thing being over, even if not necessarily legally correctly, it is only just starting. Pretty crap result for everyone other than the papers really

The youth was told by the ticket inspector to leave the train, he refused this and responded with verbal abuse.
This then made him an ‘undesirable'(should be in terms and conditions booklet)and as such, the undesirable can be ejected(using reasonable force) from public transport.
The fact the undesirable put up resistence to being removed, caused him to get a little scratch.
The big guy did not throw punches or kick the undesirable, so what is the limit of reasonable force?

i bet the guy who filmed it is feeling pretty special about now. it’s unlikely this would have gone anywhere without his footage.

I bet he was filming on an I phone too.

It would be funny if big man was not charged and fare dodger got done, I suspect that would be a great outcome for common sense.

Groundhog Day is on the telly at the moment.

@ Druidh…

Groundhog Day is on the telly at the moment.

‘Twas on yesterday too.

It would be funny if big man was not charged and fare dodger got done, I suspect that would be a great outcome for common sense.

Unfortunately, this country is shallow on the good stuff, hence big-man being charged.

What about if I was walking down the street and saw some nob cycling through a red light because he thought he knew better than everyone else.

I hoof him off his bike onto the pavement to stop him breaking the law, because I was protecting the other people using the junction from harm in a collision caused by the arse who thought the law only applies to other people.

Would that be ok. Or am I going to be in the dock next to Big Man ?

That would be unilateral action.

The big man asked the ticket inspector first.

[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-d4jQxREBnU&feature=related[/video]
[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HafWTDb_Tpg[/video]
Don’t mess wi the Big Man

I’d like to help out here.
Click here, click my link at the bottom, then click the link above again and you can go round in circles to your heart’s content.
For added enjoyment, you can click here and read all the same bollocks again…

totalshell – Member
a bloke stands up, helps out a public servant and HE gets arrested and charged!!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-edinburgh-east-fife-16288101Quite right too, and I hope the conductor gets punted too, for allowing and going along with the assault. Big **** was just taking liberties.

Wunundred! 😀

Can’t be much fun for Big Man, having this hanging over him for the Festive Season.

Oh whell.

At least he should have time to reflect on the consequences of his actions.

Who knows if the kid was telling the truth and had two singles and showed the wrong one, he wasn’t exactly given the chance to prove himself.

Either way, the force used was a little excessive. You can see in the video he was pretty much thrown on his face in a completely unprovoked attack, he was sat there, it’s not like he was kicking off and pushing people about.

Surely the evidence of any purchased tickets can be produced, either by the Student or Scotrail.

If ticket was bought and Scotrail issued incorrectly, there should be full apology. However, student could have bought correct ticket on the train and complained later.

If student bought incorrect ticket by accident then well, HE should have apologised to ticket inspector and bought correct one – they do sell them. He could have got refund on his incorrectly bough one later.

If student has not bought a ticket at all and chanced getting away with it, then he is a lying wee toe-rag.

In either scenario he should have been more polite to the Inspector, bought a correct ticket or got off the train. He acted incorrectly and I have absolutely no sympathy for him.

The Big Man took the law into his own hands without knowing if any law was broken or what the consequences would be. It should have been left for teh Police to get a full understaning and take appropriate action. There was no violence before (but maybe some abusive language) so there was absolutely no need for this downright assault.

2 days prison over Xmas for both of them will soon let them reflect on their behaviour.

I’m with TJ, elf and Realman.

Epic’s psychic ability to predict violence is a joke, and his argument that big man’s actions were ok is laughable, you simply can’t have members of the public using force when they feel it’s appropriate to enforce what they think is right. Chaos would ensue.

Epic’s psychic ability to predict violence is a joke,

Not sure about the rest of the UK but in Central Scotland the line “whit ye gonnae dae abit it?” is pretty aggressive and you don’t need to be psychic to figure what comes next.

He really said that?

He’d hit an old man, a public servant, in front of many witnesses with no escape?

Few of them are that thick.

Hard to hear on the video, but that was what was reported.

Anyways, both of them have been reported to the PF which is probably the correct thing to do in the circumstances. I doubt any prosecutions will follow.

He really said that?

He’d hit an old man, a public servant, in front of many witnesses with no escape?

Few of them are that thick.

Aye?

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-stories/2011/12/17/train-inspector-stabbed-after-challenging-ticket-less-youths-115875-23642021/

Scottish Tory justice spokesman Mr McLetchie said the case had “polarised opinion” across Scotland and that any trial was “unlikely to please everyone”.

He said: “This may be a case where a warning letter to Mr Pollock would suffice and draw a line under the matter.”

— http://www.scotsman.com/news/scottish-news/edinburgh-east-fife/fare_trial_guaranteed_big_man_faces_charges_over_train_eviction_1_2019665

Bob…you’ve found 1…which surely qualifies as “few”?

Good old Crowe

“Once again it shows the dangers that transport staff face every day and particularly over the Christmas and New Year period.

Nothing to do with the time of year or the guys job. The scum are just that, scum.

Bob…you’ve found 1…which surely qualifies as “few”?

So that fact that only a “few” do it, the general public should turn a blind eye to an old man getting harassed and intimidated while trying to do his job.

And here’s a “few” more incidents

http://www.brmb.co.uk/news/headlines/train-staff-attacked-in-birmingham/

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-71035/Attacks-rail-staff-soar.html

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/drink–and-late-trains–fuel-attacks-on-rail-staff-1191097.html

http://www.theargus.co.uk/news/9406290.Police_appeal_after_rail_staff_threatened/?action=complain&cid=9894399

etc etc

Where did I say a blind eye should be turned? Please don’t imply bullshit like that.

My point was it was unlikely that it would turn violent in the circumstances…do the circumstances in any of your links apply? If so, they may be relevant, but you’ve only provided isolated stories…how about statistics?

My point was it was unlikely that it would turn violent in the circumstances

Unlikely in your opinion.

Which luckily counts for f’ all, as does mine.

I have no evidence, I didn’t look, but it has to be less likely than in the generic scenario, and a few Daily Fail style headlines don’t change that.

“whit ye gonnae dae abit it?” is pretty aggressive and you don’t need to be psychic to figure what comes next.

“F’kken Moooooan ‘en” IME.

And yes, you’re quite right, he definitely did say that (not the 2nd bit).

Wasn’t just a Bliar Bush style preemptive strike?

Excellent to see that the Law relating to ‘reasonable force’ has bin applied effectively in this case, and Justice has bin served. 😀

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-16299750

Violent scum getting what they deserve; losing their livelihoods.

Good luck down the dole office lads! 😆

cynic-al – Member
…Epic’s psychic ability to predict violence is a joke..

Wish I was psychic 🙂 If I was shown that as evidence as a jury member, I’d stick with what I’ve said unless there was compelling evidence to the contrary.

cynic-al – Member
…you simply can’t have members of the public using force when they feel it’s appropriate to enforce what they think is right. Chaos would ensue.

What? not even when it’s an ‘Arab Spring’?

Excellent to see that the Law relating to ‘reasonable force’ has bin applied effectively in this case, and Justice has bin served.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-16299750

Violent scum getting what they deserve; losing their livelihoods.

Good luck down the dole office lads!

Being violent is part of human nature, no amount of education will ever curb violent behaviour.
Oh! an while you spout yer do-gooder nonsense, what about the old grannie hitting the junkie(who stole her handbag) on the head with her umbrella, should she be charged for violent behaviour?

Epic that’s scary how you would let your prejudices take centre stage as a juror – and of course it doesn’t make you right, just prejudiced.

And as for the Arab Spring, I guess I could have qualified my statement to “within a democracy” but I didn’t realise how desperate you are to point-score…