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How to save the High Street

65 posts & 36 voices | Started 5 months ago by lunge | Latest reply from RichPenny

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lunge - Member

Following on from the “High Street January Dead Poll” thread, I thought I would ask the STW Hive how we can save the High Street? I know Mary Portas has had a crack but I think we can do better.

So, I will start off with 4:

Longer opening hours – be open when people finish work
Better customer service – offer the kind of advice you can’t get in Tesco, remember people’s names, actually care
Offer “better” products – organic meat, freshly baked bread, home cured ham, that kind of thing
Free parking – removes the excuse for people just popping in

Posted 5 months ago #
5lab - Member

why bother? I personally never use my high street as its much more convinent for me to shop from home. If it was gone tomorrow I'd not miss it.

you could argue that not everyone is able to buy stuff online - that's a fair point, but education would not be hard to achieve. If that's not done, I think the highstreet will move to providing only those people who can't/don't want to shop online with a shopping experiance

Posted 5 months ago #
camo16 - Member

Short of enforcing a limit to online shopping there's not much that can be done. IMO, the Supermarkets, Amazon and eBay have already won this war.

Posted 5 months ago #
The Southern Yeti - Member

3/4 of your ideas will cost the shops money.
The other idea would probably cost them as well.

Posted 5 months ago #
clubber - Member

I reckon the answer's pretty simple. Sort of. Convenience is why people shop at supermarkets - people are busy and supermarket shopping takes less time than all the different shops plus they're easy to part at, etc.

So, local shops need to sort that aspect out. I often wondered if a bunch of smaller businesses could set up a 'supermarket' where there are still discrete shops but it's all in one big store so that you can get your trolley walk round and get everything and pay at the end just like in a normal supermarket.

Posted 5 months ago #
soobalias - Member

longer opening hours = increased overheads
could consider different opening hours, but how many people want to go shopping after a day at work?

points 2 & 3 seem to be directed at taking on supermarkets, who will always win on price even if they have to employ very dirty tricks

free parking, what everywhere? just for shoppers or employees?

Posted 5 months ago #
ourmaninthenorth - Member

Supermarkets have got massive because (1) we buy on price alone (and not quality) and (2) they are very effective at lobbying for planning law changes (which include opening times).

I actually don't think we have any way back.

Nothing will alter the inexorable decline of the high street and none of us will care.

Posted 5 months ago #
CharlieMungus - Member

why bother? I personally never use my high street as its much more convinent for me to shop from home. If it was gone tomorrow I'd not miss it.

you could argue that not everyone is able to buy stuff online - that's a fair point, but education would not be hard to achieve. If that's not done, I think the highstreet will move to providing only those people who can't/don't want to shop online with a shopping experiance

But what about when granny needs to pop out and get her prescription but all the pharmacists are closed because they are put out of business by the larger operators and what about if you want to buy a book from someone who has an interest in books and doesn't stock the same mainstream stuff covered by waterstones (and amazon?) and can make a sound recommendation, or the same for a bottle of wine. The high street is about more than buying stuff.

Posted 5 months ago #
don simon - Member

why bother? I personally never use my high street as its much more convinent for me to shop from home. If it was gone tomorrow I'd not miss it.

Like most problems, it's a bit more complicated than it first seems. The solution is simple but not easy, put people back into the city centres and then city centre shopping will become convenient.
When there are people, shops will provide for them. More shops - more competition, more competition - better service, better service - keener prices, etc...

Posted 5 months ago #
5lab - Member

So, local shops need to sort that aspect out. I often wondered if a bunch of smaller businesses could set up a 'supermarket' where there are still discrete shops but it's all in one big store so that you can get your trolley walk round and get everything and pay at the end just like in a normal supermarket.

the local flea market is like that, and it works well

I'm not sure it'd work against supermarkets as they still have the massive price advantage of volume - unless there's a way to fix that too

Like most problems, it's a bit more complicated than it first seems. The solution is simple but not easy, put people back into the city centres and then city centre shopping will become convenient.
When there are people, shops will provide for them. More shops - more competition, more competition - better service, better service - keener prices, etc...

I disagree. for some folk its about convinience, but I live ~2 miles from the shopping area (which, being Brighton, is well 'stocked' from a shops perspective) and work even closer (~3 minute walk to the edge of the shopping area). The only reason I ever go in is to

visit the bank if there's something I can't do online (mainly paying in cheques).
go to one of the many, excellent pubs.

I'm a young, high earner with lots of disposable income (no kids etc), so I should be just the kinda person that they're reaching out to, yet I don't know any of my (male) peers who'd voluntarily go into town 'shopping' either. The information available on the internet makes the whole experiance far more pleasant.

Posted 5 months ago #
flip - Member

So, local shops need to sort that aspect out. I often wondered if a bunch of smaller businesses could set up a 'supermarket' where there are still discrete shops but it's all in one big store so that you can get your trolley walk round and get everything and pay at the end just like in a normal supermarket.

Like an indoor market?

EDIT: Beaten to it ^^^

I think the High st is dead, online is the future, small shops (inc. my 2 LBS never have the stock) all we need now is for the Post Office to sort their game out and we'll be ok, the queues to pick up parcels at my local sorting office are a joke.

Posted 5 months ago #
CharlieMungus - Member

I think the High st is dead, online is the future

Perhaps, but would you buy shoes online?

Posted 5 months ago #
TandemJeremy - Member

Easy - stop / close out of town shopping centres and limit the size of supermarkets

Posted 5 months ago #
stilltortoise - Member

Stop trying to compete with the supermarkets and focus on offering something unique.

That said, in Leek we do have an independent store on the High Street that offers all sorts of foodstuffs at a good price. Long Live "Home and Colonial"

Posted 5 months ago #
flip - Member

Perhaps, but would you buy shoes online?

Yes i know my size.

Posted 5 months ago #
The Southern Yeti - Member

The high street is about more than buying stuff...

Yep, it's about getting face to face advice and recommendations. It's abotu viewing the product first hand, trying it on or trying it out. Then ******* off and buying it cheap from Wiggle and the like.

Posted 5 months ago #
CharlieMungus - Member

all we need now is for the Post Office to sort their game out and we'll be ok, the queues to pick up parcels at my local sorting office are a joke.

So online shopping saves us having to leave our homes and queue up to buy stuff, oh the technology!

Posted 5 months ago #
CharlieMungus - Member

Perhaps, but would you buy shoes online?
Yes i know my size.

in that case i'm sure nothing could go wrong

Posted 5 months ago #
vinnyeh - Member

Not sure why we can't accept that the High St as you're thinking of, with a few exceptions, is largely dead.

Affluent communities, and those too small to support a Tesco Express can get by, but for the majority the lowest common denominator is the best fit in terms of convenience and value for money.

limit the size of supermarkets

I know you don't see branding, but have you noticed what's going on in the real world? I Just did a search for my closest Tessco, out of interest, we've moved to a new town, and 19 of the first 20 results were for Express/Metro type stores. The penetration for these things has been phenomenal.

Posted 5 months ago #
CharlieMungus - Member

Affluent communities, and those too small to support a Tesco Express can get by, but for the majority the lowest common denominator is the best fit in terms of convenience and value for money

Perhaps, but that is pretty short-sighted. We'll be left with these soulless housing communities

Posted 5 months ago #
hels - Member

My local high street seems to be thriving, its dead busy on a weekday afternoon. Only one empty shop and that is because the local town council take a close interest and are very fussy about who they let operate.

That and the fact that half the town are retired people. So there's the answer, a time machine back to the 1950s.

Posted 5 months ago #
Frodo - Member

I quite anjoy a pootle up the high street on saturday mornings. Butchers, bakers, greens, hardware shop and stop by the LBS for consumables.

Obviously if I'm away at the weekend this doesn't happen.

So the best option would be to open until 7pm on one or two days a week. Dr's Surgery does this why not shops?

Generally I find the meat, braed or veg to be far better than the supermarkets.

Posted 5 months ago #
5lab - Member

in that case i'm sure nothing could go wrong

also buy my shoes online. In fact, being size 14, this is one place where online outdoes 'real' shops by a huge margin. The only place in my City I'm aware of selling shoes in my size is high and mighty. That's fine for the one pair of smart shoes I buy every 3 years, but for the trainers I wear day in day out, Amazon keeps me supplied in the styles I like, at prices I like. If they don't fit (never happened, I guess I'm not that fussy when it comes to the fit of shoes?) I can just send them back and get one in the next size up/down?

Posted 5 months ago #
wwaswas - Member

Interestingly Crawley council are resisting a John Lewis opening an out of town store as their preference is for retail to be concentrated in the town centre to keep shoppers coming into the middle.

Posted 5 months ago #
IanMunro - Member

Yep, it's about getting face to face advice and recommendations. It's abotu viewing the product first hand, trying it on or trying it out. Then ******* off and buying it cheap from Wiggle and the like.

Don't forget it's also about being told 'We can get that in stock for you next week' too

Posted 5 months ago #
sugdenr - Member

Mary Portas is correct. Not suprising as she is the retail expert with donkeys years experience (and wearing rather well too).

You cant compete on price/convenience with online, you need to increase the motivation for people to got to town (footfall) and the increased spending comes as a side effect.

I hate going shopping, not because I object to spending the extra, but because shops and high streets and shopping malls and out of town centres are all boring inane banal places.

Posted 5 months ago #
CharlieMungus - Member

That and the fact that half the town are retired people. So there's the answer, a time machine back to the 1950s.

What and be surrounded by people with entrenched views, telling you how hard they've had it and that less is more how you need to toughen up. With occasional casual and overt sexism and racism. occasionally....

oh! hold on!

Posted 5 months ago #
5lab - Member

here's an easy one then - if towns want people to come into town - make it *very* attractive for delivery companies to house their 'pickup points' in the city center (even with a storefront). I'm forced to go to my local post office sorting office once a week because of deliveries. Its on the edge of the shopping area so I skip round it. if it was in the middle I'd have no option other than to visit

Posted 5 months ago #
LMT - Member

Don't forget Tesco own One-Stop as well, and Mills Newsagents most people have one of those if not 2 or 3 nearby.

Posted 5 months ago #
thomthumb - Member

Stop trying to compete with the supermarkets and focus on offering something unique.

this.

Posted 5 months ago #
clubber - Member

Like an indoor market?

Exactly like that but organised so that to practical purposes it works like a single big shop that covers everything that supermarkets sell which IME indoor markets don't.

Posted 5 months ago #
CaptJon - Member

sugdenr - Member
Mary Portas is correct. Not suprising as she is the retail expert with donkeys years experience (and wearing rather well too).

You cant compete on price/convenience with online, you need to increase the motivation for people to got to town (footfall) and the increased spending comes as a side effect.

What is convenient about buying something online, waiting for the postman to deliver it while you're out, organising a re-delivery to your local post office, then heading to said post office on the high street to pick it up?

As per hels, my local high street is booming. It was dying, but after Sainsbury's moved in the footfall has increased dramatically and other shops have benefited. It has even prompted new shops to open, and this is during economic stagnation and in the North East. It also demonstrate the idea that supermarkets are all bad is myopic. The situation is very complex, and i imagine there are local factors at play which can't be captured in a general report for the government.

Posted 5 months ago #
CharlieMungus - Member

here's an easy one then - if towns want people to come into town - make it *very* attractive for delivery companies to house their 'pickup points' in the city center (even with a storefront). I'm forced to go to my local post office sorting office once a week because of deliveries. Its on the edge of the shopping area so I skip round it. if it was in the middle I'd have no option other than to visit

So you want you delivery office to be in a place where you need to walk to it?

Posted 5 months ago #
CaptainFlashheart - Member

What is convenient about buying something online, waiting for the postman to deliver it while you're out, organising a re-delivery to your local post office, then heading to said post office on the high street to pick it up?

The item in question might have been a whole £3 cheaper online. Think of the massive saving!

Posted 5 months ago #
5lab - Member

So you want you delivery office to be in a place where you need to walk to it?

I don't want it there, but for towns it'd be good. Most stuff that's delivered isn't as big as not to be easily carried - you'd obviously need some other solution for the stuff that is..

Posted 5 months ago #