[Closed] Giant Alpecin taken out by car

Probably just making progress and then smidsy / sun was in my eyes excuse...

😥

more info here

http://velonews.competitor.com/2016/01/news/giant-alpecin-riders-injured-in-training-crash_393738

doesnt look good for the 6 of them.

Sounds nasty. Seen a picture of the bikes posted on Facebook earlier and it didn't look pretty.

There was a really bad crash in the Tour de San luis too.

Speedy recovery to all involved.

And here I was thinking from the thread title that a Giant Alpecin was some kind of rare animal I'd never heard of.

Little bit more info, via Google Translate...

Chad Haga , with a possible hip fracture, and John Degenkolb , with very deep cuts in their joints, it seems that both riders have been most affected by the incident but still no official confirmation. In addition, Le Telegramme reported, after speaking with the agent Barguil, the promising French rider had suffered a broken wrist and a major blow to the knee. "The car did not have time to stop and rolled them frontally. The impact was violent and cyclists could not do anything about it, " explained the French Barguil agent said medium.

[url= http://www.ciclismoafondo.es/competicion/noticias-competicion/articulo/Seis-ciclistas-Giant-Alpecin-atropellados ]Source[/url]

British police would probably be charging the cyclists with ... well, something.

Richard Moore ?@richardmoore73 15m15 minutes ago
Sounds like Degenkolb will keep his left index finger. He says on his Facebook page that it 'just hung on.' On his way to bigger hospital.

José Been ?@TourDeJose 31m31 minutes ago
José Been Retweeted Bart Ranke
Degenkolb already had many wounds stitched, now on his way to Valencia to get finger sewn back on. Almost severed 🙁

Sounds nasty.

John Degenkolb seems to have had a really bad run of bad luck, hopefully every one makes a full and speedy recovery and the driver is suitably prosecuted.

Idly scanning the thread headings here, I assumed a giant alpecin was some kind of animal and this would be Youtube footage.

A bit underwhelmed now. 😕

The bikes 😯

[img] [/img]

That's really nasty.

This is horrible.

Looks like it could* a case of forgetting which side of the road she should be on:

Emergency services on the scene reported that the car was driven by an Englishwoman who had driven onto the wrong side of the road.
Read more at http://velonews.competitor.com/2016/01/news/giant-alpecin-riders-injured-in-training-crash_393738#Vo5qj7D4yEPtcL92.99

*other reasons are possible of course

Stupid driver! Wrong side of the road?!

Should be banned from driving but will only have to pay for insurance claims.

Should be banned from driving but will only have to pay for insurance claims

Honestly should be in prison.

Hopefully the laws in Spain are a bit tougher than here, she deserves to have the book thrown at her for that one. That picture is awful. 🙁

That's potentially one massive insurance payout too. 6 bikes at what, £10,000 each. 6 world class riders who now cannot compete for maybe the whole season - loss of earnings on that must run in millions. Losses/damages to Giant-Alpecin if they can't field a team for the top races.

Best wishes to the team, just thankful that it wasn't as bad as it could have been.

Honestly, I can forgive someone accidentally driving on the wrong side of the road when abroad far easier than where drivers choose to drive recklessly/aggressively, like the case not so long ago where someone deliberatly cut a blind corner, hit a cyclist head on and blamed them for wobbling or something like that. And luckily it sounds like they will all make good recoveries.

I'm not a fan of convicting the driver before the facts are established. 'Reportedly' on the other side of the road, with no reason given as yet isn't yet a case.

Healing vibes to the riders.

I'm not a fan of convicting the driver before the facts are established

We have a VERY poor track record for this on this forum. Mind you, we haven't started victim blaming yet either.

loss of earnings on that must run in millions

Do they not get paid if they can't ride?

An English woman driving in Spain? I wouldn't assume she was on holiday or unfamiliar with the roads.

Do they not get paid if they can't ride?

Sure there would be considerable win bonuses with Degenklob targeting the early season classics again. Loss of advertising exposure too. A repeat of last season with wins at San Remo and Paris Roubaix would be hard to put a value on.

Assume Barguil was their man for the Tour too, media attention from a French rider doing well would be hard to put a figure on.

Honestly, I can forgive someone accidentally driving on the wrong side of the road when abroad far easier than where drivers choose to drive recklessly/aggressively, like the case not so long ago where someone deliberatly cut a blind corner, hit a cyclist head on and blamed them for wobbling or something like that. And luckily it sounds like they will all make good recoveries.

I completely agree. Though as said, very little is known about the facts. Hopefully it's properly investigated anyway.

[quote=theotherjonv ]'Reportedly' on the other side of the road, with no reason given as yet isn't yet a case.

Do you think it's likely the reports are inaccurate? I'm happy to be as charitable as possible, because it seems most likely it was a "driving in a foreign country" mistake, in which case I'm with thecaptain - it's easy to get distracted by the severity of the outcome when any punishment ought only to reflect her actions.

As others suggest, I suspect she might be hitting the limit of her insurance company's 3rd party liability with that - the value of the bike is trivial, it's the losses to the riders and the team which could run into multi-millions.

I said reportedly because that's what the article I read said. I don't think it's in question myself, but if it isn't correct then you'd have to assume that the cyclists were on her side instead.

What I'm not happy with is the assumption of guilt before any investigation. [i]MAYBE[/i] she'd swerved to avoid a child who'd run into the road....... or she was texting her friend. We don't know yet and until we do deciding her sentence is pointless.

Not wanting to jump to conclusions but the description from Ludvigsson doesn't exactly say anythiong good for the driver.

"It should never have happened"

Ludvigsson said via Twitter that the accident should not have happened. Emergency services in Spain said that an English woman was driving the vehicle and perhaps invaded the opposite side of the rode, hitting the six Giant-Alpecin riders.

“It's a shock that will sit for a long time, should not have to happen, completely straight road and a car driving on the wrong side of us, impossible to protect themselves,” he posted on Twitter in Swedish, adding in English: “For all who wondering, I'm after all pretty good with nothing broken, just pain, I'm lucky we all are alive,Thank you for all messages!!”

Honestly, I can forgive someone accidentally driving on the wrong side of the road when abroad far easier than where drivers choose to drive recklessly/aggressively, like the case not so long ago where someone deliberatly cut a blind corner, hit a cyclist head on and blamed them for wobbling or something like that.

Healing vibes to the team...

Isn't this a case, though, were 'presumed liability' (I don't know the correct term!) will apply, and the driver will be on the hook for this unless she can prove the riders were in the wrong??

Paging Bez...

Every time you get into a car, drive or anything like that you have to be aware, have to be concentrating and have to accept responsibility for your actions.

This.^

A truly horrific accident and a miracle no one was killed. A similar accident happened in these parts a few years ago but the driver hit the Australian women's road team and two or three died.

Edit. Sorry it wasn't two or three it was one , Amy Gillet, and five seriuosly injured.

I think it's amazing no one died - even if the car driver was only doing 30mph the cyclists were probably not far off the same speed (being top pros in the world probably means they weren't doing a tea shop bimble!). More than likely a 60mph plus combined collision speed - I would have expected a far worse outcome.

Sounds like they will recover, albeit maybe slowly over a long time for one or two, hope that they can get back to doing what they love soon.

For me this completely undermines the situation, hey it's OK they were not familiar with the roads or got distracted, they didn't mean to plough into a group of innocent people. Every time you get into a car, drive or anything like that you have to be aware, have to be concentrating and have to accept responsibility for your actions.

I'm not sure anyone's saying it's OK, or acceptable. It definitely isn't. But we are all human and each and every one of us makes mistakes occasionally, including potentially dangerous ones. And it's a whole lot more forgiveable than when people drive knowingly dangerously.

The circumstances do sound very odd though from the descriptions offered up so far. Apparently the driver lives in Spain for 6 months of the year too, so it's not like she's not used to it.

The biggest mistake people make is not realising a car is a seriously dangerous piece of machinery and a moments I attention when controlling it can kill people. Gross negligence is a more appropriate phrase than a moments in attention.

Seems she spends 6months a year in Spain.

Can you imagine the tabloids if a foreigner did that over here, they'd be frothing between locking them up and deporting them.

Horrible for all involved in the crash, my grandad has just given up his licence, I'd dred to think what he would have been like driving on the continent.

Horrible news.

Big fan of Giant Alpecin, hope the riders are gonna be OK.

Regarding the driver - I'm more confident of justice being served in Spain than here.

Can you imagine the tabloids if a foreigner did that over here, they'd be frothing between locking them up and deporting them.

They'd be too busy blaming the cyclists for riding more than single file 😐

I'll start by saying that I know nothing about the incident described above and I won't speculate on the cause. Neither am I attempting to place the blame with anyone other than the driver if what has been reported is accurate. But let me tell you a story......

.....I used to live and work in Switzerland. I drove the 10km to and from work almost every day for 2 years and never had any problems with adapting to driving on the right hand side of the road. I considered myself to be an normal, competent driver. One Friday evening, after a difficult week at work, I managed to drive almost all of the way home on the wrong side of the road. At one point I remember seeing a car in the distance heading towards me and I thought to myself "What is that fool doing?" A quick swerve to the right and I avoided a 100kph+
head on crash.

Hadn't been drinking, wasn't asleep at the wheel, I had other things on my mind but that's hardly an excuse. I just made a potentially fatal mistake.

Now whenever I get into a car on the continent or in the States I repeat my new mantra: Drive on the right, drive on the right.

On my honeymoon I was riding a motorcycle with Mrs Taxi as pillion on route 101 just North of San Francisco. Seeing a Cafe on the left hand side of the road I pulled over for a break. Riding up to the entrance we saw the closed sign and without stopping I pulled back onto the road.... On to the wrong side, it was a rural road with nothing to jog my mind to get me over to the right. Within seconds a car appeared and we had a collision, fortunately the driver actually managed to stop and I nearly did, so nobody got hurt. But I still think about it 26yrs later and what might have happened.
I have no idea what happened in Spain nor does anyone on here, but we all make mistakes. Not saying you shouldn't be accountable for them, but we all make them. Healing vibes to all the Giant boys and no doubt if culpable the driver will be punished, but don't forget we're all human and all fallible 🙁

Looks like taxi25 and I got away with our errors but this driver in Spain didn't.

I hate to say it but it might just be a case of the Giant team being at the wrong place at the wrong time.

I'll welcome driverless cars to eliminate this weak link.

Took my test in France in 1994 , and then moved to the Uk in 1996 .
so I have driven a lot more in the Uk than France but I still get confused , not often but I do .
When I have a doubt where I should be driving I need to think of my house in france and which way the cars go .

I once had about 8 riders attached to the front of a Land Rover, In Rural Yorkshire.........

I'd pulled over to let another vehicle past and before i could pull out of the pasiing place a group of riders appeared around the bend taking up the width of the single carriageway road. The leader saw me and shouted and then with precision i watched this group of around 30 riders approach, As they did each rider took his hand off the right hand bar stuck his arm back flicked it in and shouted "IN"

I watched as this was passed back two thirds of the way where the weak link was looking left and talking....
He rode straight into the front of me, then several other riders rode into him, into me and into other riders, The riders at the back had no idea and suddenly came to a very abrupt stop.

I was stationary throughout, something which the group were thankfull for, the vehicle i stopped to let past had given them a hard time. I'm not saying who was at Fault in Spain but Hopefully there's some footage captured?

Good to read...

http://velonews.competitor.com/2016/01/rider-journal/chad-haga-journal_394094

Emotional stuff.

Didn't realise the driver had veered out of her lane directly toward the riders.

😯

Didn't realise the driver had veered out of her lane directly toward the riders.

That's not quite what he says. He doesn't imply it's deliberate, he says that crossed his mind.

The road curved left gradually, and the black SUV was coming over at us.

A back of an envelope sketch suggests it could have been lapse in concentration and failing to turn for the corner...

[img] [/img]

Full marks for the envelope sketch, like that!

Interesting read, sounds like, all things considered they've all been ridiculously lucky.

That's not quite what he says. He doesn't imply it's deliberate, he says that crossed his mind.

True, I didn't mean it was deliberate either though.

I was thinking driver maybe fell asleep or suffered a medical issue.

If so it's terrible, terrible luck for the riders.

Nice to see Degenklob back racing at the ToC...

http://velonews.competitor.com/2016/05/news/degenkolb-finger-eyeing-france_406861

Having to learn to shift and brake with a different finger. Do wonder if he'll ever manage to get back to his 2015 best, best of luck to him, certainly hope he does.

They could probably have stopped in time to not hit the car if they had been using disk brakes...

"They could probably have stopped in time to not hit the car if they had been using disk brakes..."

Stupid comment of the day.

anyway exactly the same happened to my dad last year in france on his motorbike - him doing a GPS camera verified 30mph before a van didnt turn the corner and wiped him out.

Van driver tried to blame "ze english"

Lucky it was all caught on camera.

Stupid comment of the day

I'm guessing the intended humour was lost in the ether....?