[Closed] Cotic Demo Day - FoD - pics and thoughts

Interesting, I'm trying a the rocketmax and flaremax in big wheel variety at Hopton tomorrow. Can't quite decide how much travel I'd want.

Sam'll sort you out. For me the RocketMax is just too much bike for the Forest. If you're going mental on the cheeky trails, fair enough but for me the Flare is a better bike. My Rocket 26 was fantastic but I never got close to finding its limits.

What's it like on the ups?

It's good. Not as good as the non chubby version but not far behind. What it is is very comfy. There's a bit of a magic carpet ride over roots when you're climbing. For some reason the large felt really letharegic compared to the M but maybe that was because I'd already decided I preferred the M 😉

Was this the 'demo day' where there were no 29ers available for tall people?

Ta. If the weather had worked in my favour, I'd have tried to get to the Long Mynd demo day on Sunday. They'd have had to bring some small bikes along for the shortarse market though.

We've got Sam coming up to the Tweed Valley for a private test too, next month. Looking forward to it.

Chopwell end of September as well...

I'm doing Hopton tomorrow on a Rocket and a RocketMax on the Mynd Sunday, very much looking forward to it.

At 5.11 and a half, I am currently in the middle of building up a Large BFe,

Your post has me terrified it's gonna be too big! Although Cy said M would have been all seat post and stem.

Just built my large Bfe and at 5'10" and 32" inside leg it's spot on .

Thanks Pete! What length stem?

@NW-Alps: There was at least one L 29er as Kelvin was riding it! There was also an XL.

@jm - I'm sure it'll be fine. I'm 5ft 11 but with short legs/long torso so bike fit is always a bit of a challenge. I had a M soul and solaris. For me the trade off is the bike might look a bit small but is better than the larger on 90% of the time.

At 5.11 and a half, I am currently in the middle of building up a Large BFe,
Your post has me terrified it's gonna be too big! Although Cy said M would have been all seat post and stem.

It definitely won't be too big!

One thing I forgot. I'm used to low BB's and it's a bit of a pain in the forest clattering roots etc. The Cotic has not BB drop but I still found it pretty low. I'll definitely be going 170mm cranks and some thinner pedals than the fat nano's I was using for the demo.

I'm trying a the rocketmax and flaremax in big wheel variety at Hopton tomorrow. Can't quite decide how much travel I'd want.

I got the RocketMax29er. The X-fusion rear shock is really good - not just for the usual suspension stuff but the blue lever thing does a great job of firming up the travel. Feels like a short travel bike on firm and a long travel one on soft (with two further options in between). I've had shocks with this kind of adjustment before - but i could hardly tell the difference in either setting. Cotic did a great job on the custom tune for this bike. Also, forks are internally adjustable from 120-140. I know this as they accidentally shipped my in 120 setting.

In short - get the 29er - it's potentially more versatile

I was on the large Flare Max set up chubby, loved the magic carpet ride and so much grip, conditions were wet but it didn't matter we were all having so much fun. Tried the medium Alex was using but at 6'1" the large was the better fit for me, that said the medium felt quicker....

Sam the man from Cotic did a great job of making sure the bikes were properly set up for each of us, for me the Flare Max one of the best bikes I've ridden ... Very very impressed with the frame quality and the attention to detail.

at jmatlock , 50mm Rental Duo .

Love that red they're using for the Rocket max...

@pete...

I'm putting a 50mm Renthal Apex on mine. Thanks for the info Sir.

Oh my, the rocketmax is awesome. I thought I'd go for the flaremax and as one bike it'd be grand but I think the extra travel would be what I was after.

It was a bit hard to compare the two as the forks on the flaremax were very basic and on the rocketmax top spec. Made it hard to tell if it would be possible to tune something to suit or whether it was just too short travel. That and hopton doesn't really push either of the two bikes fully.

I'll be putting my existing Yari on the FlareMax. That'll suit it I think.

Hey mrhoppy. Must have been you me and my pal met.

I've just posted in the other thread but saw this one.

Yeah, I rode the medium Rocket. Sam was great, really taking time to set the bikes up to our tastes.

All set up, we blasted off down the first descent. I have to say that within about 150yards I was loving the bike. It felt so playful, lively and poppypoppy. I couldn't help but boost off everything going and slam it into the berms. That back end is solid!
Such fun.

I've currently got a 2012 Mega, and.....I don't think I'll have it much longer.
LOVED that bike. 😀

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Love that red they're using for the Rocket max...

This red? [i](Any excuse to show mine off)[/i] 😛

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That red is gorgeous.

I had a go on Longmynd today, really interested in the Flare, only a medium available, I'm 6ft so should really be on a large.

But the medium didn't feel cramped or silly to me, despite Sam and others saying I looked better on the Large Rocket. I don't think I'd use all the travel of the rocket, I'm just not that gnar........

The flare felt great, really fast, fun, poppy, spritely, confidence inspiring. I need to try a large now, just to make sure the large gives the same feeling.

My soul, 26", is a large, it's got nearly a kilo of front tyre, so I don't know if that's contributing most, but it doesn't feel half as playful, it's not easy to lift the front, bars are reasonably high, 70mm stem.

That is a stunning bike Euro. Perfection.

kayak23 - Member
Hey mrhoppy. Must have been you me and my pal met.

Aye, that was me. Good to meet another forumites, you not bought one yet?

Wish we'd had today's weather though.

Thanks a good read. I felt the wallet twitching as soon as I read the Flare launch, probably best I haven't been on a demo 🙂

That is a stunning bike Euro. Perfection.

Thank you kindly, but i only bought it - it's Cotic who deserve the praise 😀

I did a little review of it on a separate thread (with more pics) - didn't want to hog this one. Might be worth a read if you're toying with getting something bouncy from the big C.

Aye, that was me. Good to meet another forumites, you not bought one yet?

Got to send the Mega back I accidentally bought first yet! 🙂

Read your review Euro, really good write up. Love reading honest reviews like that, so much more trustworthy than most magazines.

You have nudged me towards a red Bfe pal!

@core - I'm the same. It tried both as I said ^^ and the Large is a better 'fit' but I prefer the M. Iw as riding the Flare Max. Talking to Cy, he told me when he was riding in the FoD testing, he went down a size (from XL to L) and preferred it on the tight,twisty trails we have here. He also said he didn't design for a 170mm dropper as no such thing existed when he started the work on the new drop link bikes!

My view on the M v L is for 90% of the riding I'll do, the M will be a better bike if not a better fit. So I'm going with that. The issue with being a SLC (Stumpy Leg Chimp (c) Kelvin) is there's always going to be a compromise on bike sizing. The Flare being a bit longer than my old 26 rocket is the deal clincher for me.

Also - if you come back to the FoD, drop me a line, I'll show you all the non trail centre goodies...

Well the order is going in, just having some conversations around dropper posts and which extra bits I need. My plan to kind of build it through re-jigging the current bikes has been modified after my better half said 'oh just buy the bits you like'. Not going to look that gift horse in the mouth!

What shock you going for?
I'm just waiting to get a refund on the other frame I accidentally bought, and then I'm sticking an order in too. 😀

I'm dithering. But I think I'll go with the x-fusion. It's kind of simple and so am I. The Cane Creek DB Air CS I have on my Aeris just does my nut in. I know there's a good setting somewhere but I can't seem to make it work the way I want too.

Sam@Cotic tells me the CC App is very good for setting the shock up but if I'm honest I'm not good enough to feel £250 worth of difference!

Alex
The Cane Creek DB Air CS I have on my Aeris just does my nut in

It's really not difficult to set up, you just need some basic testing and a degree of rigour in your twiddling. Randomly twiddling in the hope of getting it right isn't going to work.

Put aside 10 min on your fav trail section, to session that section and bracket through the settings. After just 5 runs you should be pretty close. Then you can refine with a click here and there slowly after you have ridden more and got a longer term picture of the shocks reaction to other trails etc

Alex

Also - if you come back to the FoD, drop me a line, I'll show you all the non trail centre goodies..

This ^^^^ sounds good! 😆

Oi, no hijacking my guided ride! Unless we can arrange a (very) small STW ride.....

@maxtorque - or you tell Jake at Sprung Suspension (based in the FOD) what you don't like and he tweaks it and like magic, it's a loaf better 🙂

Happy to lead a ride, would need to be a small one tho....

I'm dithering. But I think I'll go with the x-fusion. It's kind of simple and so am I. The Cane Creek DB Air CS I have on my Aeris just does my nut in. I know there's a good setting somewhere but I can't seem to make it work the way I want too.

If you're average weight and speediness then the base tune should work pretty damned well. Apart from a few months early on with the HSR slower on my Spitfire I've had it in the base tune for a few years.

Note that twin tube shocks tend to feel a bit calmer than ones where the damping fluid has to reverse direction vs the valving, which I presume is due to much lower turbulence or cavitation. So a Cane Creek may feel less poppy but it usually isn't, it's just a bit more planted through all the little jitters.

I tried the XL RocketMAX on Friday evening and came away very impressed. For reference I’ve spent the last 3 ½ years on a Nicolai Helius AC 29er, with 150mm/140mm Avalanche tweaked Pike and DHX air, so big wheels aren’t new to me, and I’ve been spoiled by the Avalanche kit, but I think the biggest compliment I can pay the Rocket is that I immediately felt at home on it. The Drop Link suspension felt pretty damn good, even when pushed, and it felt surprisingly playful for an XL.
Compared to my large Nic the XL Cotic is approximately 35mm longer in TT, 25mm in Reach, 40mm in wheelbase and with similar 140mm forks it is 1deg slacker. The longer wheelbase was immediately noticeable through the tight twisty stuff, but it wasn’t unwieldy, and I soon adjusted, helped in part I think by the extra length in the TT and Reach which allowed me more room to move around. The 448mm stays didn’t feel as long as I thought they might (453mm on the Nic), easily managing to pop wheelies and manual over stuff, the rear end felt plenty stiff enough, and the slacker HA improved confidence on the steeper stuff without feeling too floppy climbing back up. So far so good.
On paper I thought the 505mm seat tube might have been a bit long and I had concerns about being able to fit a 150mm Reverb, but I think the demo bike was fitted with a 150mm RF Turbine dropper so if that was the case I should be ok. Need to double check with Cy or Sam though as I wouldn’t want to go back to a 125mm dropper.
Not sure what else I can add. 90 minutes on familiar trails is a great way to get a feel for a new bike and although I would love to have taken the Rocket to my local hill, which is a bit more DH orientated, I don’t think I would have any hesitation swapping the Nic for one.

The spec of the bike was as follows.

RocketMAX XL in red
140mm X-Fusion Trace with Roughcut damper
X-Fusion 02 shock (140mm travel)
XT Brakes
XT 1x11
WTB Ci24 rims / Hope hubs
WTB Vigilante front / Trail Boss rear
RF respond bars – 785mm
Stem – didn’t check but suitably short
Turbine Cinch cranks (I think)
Turbine Dropper

Overall weight – don’t know, but it didn’t feel any heavier than my Nic which is currently sitting around 31.5lbs.

Other things I learned. The new X-Fusion kit is very good, especially the Roughcut fork which was supple and very well controlled, and I think I would really need to be going some to faze the O2 shock. Oh, and I still don’t like Shimano brakes.

So, apologies for the ramble as I tend to struggle to convey in writing what I feel on a bike, but it was a cracking Friday evening out with Cotic and I learned a lot from it. I think there was 13 of us in total and everyone seemed to enjoy whatever bikes they were riding, whether 650, 29 or chubby. Plenty of swapping going on too. A big thanks to Joe at Bike Remedy in Stonehaven for organising, and thanks also to Sam at Cotic for taking the bikes up and listening to my ramblings.