Clutch Mech & Wide/Narrow Single Ring (ala XX1 but 10speed!)

righty who then is running the above combo with NO front guide?

have you dropped the chain? what sort of terrain area do you ride?

ive just ordered a raceface singlering narrow/wide and am contemplating taking my top only guide off running with a clutch rear mech

just wondered who else has actually taken the plunge and ditched their front top guides but still riding the same stuff as usual?

I run an XX1 32T front ring on my cannondale hollowgram cranks with Leonardi spider. This is in combo with XTR shadow + rear mech with XX 10 speed cassette.

Worked beautifully on a coast to coast rides across the lakes, dale and the moors, the peak district and the surrey hills. Chain has not dropped once.

mashie – no front guide at all?

sounds a nice setup that! i think im just gonna ditch the front guide for a test ride when i get this ring, worst case is i stick the guide back on, but im hopeful it will hold up in the peak district

ps any close up pics of setup?

no guide, no pics either but very similar to this

Covered it in the other thread but yeah, 1×10, 11-36 cassette, XT clutchy mech, Works chainring, no device, no bother on a world cup downhill track. I’m sure it’ll come off eventually but then, it occasionally came off with a standard ring and a chain device.

(for comparison, I had to briefly try with a clutch mech, no guide, and an E13 non-XX1-type single ring, it was absolutely useless, dropped the chain about every 100 feet all the way down an easy red trail)

I’m having dirty thoughts about getting one for the downhill bike and losing the bottom roller off the guide, just to see what happens ;)

i’m running an absolute black ‘xx1 style’ front chain ring. but with 9 speed and a non clutch mech. Never dropped the chain, do get a bit of chain slap though..

riding mainly in the peak and the odd trail centre.

cheers NW – does sound inspiring then really as you’ve tested both ways and it didnt work without the profiled chainring

ianfitz – are you saying you dont even have a clutch mech and NO front guide? or just no clutch mech with a guide and the absolute black??

if so where abouts in the peak do you ride, for comparison?

Worth noting that despite some conflicting statements the only Absolute Black ring to work without a guide is the XX1 style 104mm BCD ring, their SRAM spiderless one requires a guide.

I’m really keen to try one, be interested to see if SRAM manage to get their patents through, I hope not frankly!

I have a works components alternating thickness chain ring, XT clutch mech, 11-36 SLX Cassette and KMC X10 chain on my Rocket. It’s covered over 100 miles so far on mostly lakeland trails, not one dropped chain with no guide either.
Also I destroyed the mech and hanger on a rock so had to go back to using non clutch XT mech for a week until replacement arrived, it still didn’t drop the chain. I’d recommend one to anyone.

njee – yep id seen that in the other thread – luckily im a shimano man! but it was a bit confusing reading his thoughts on it IMO too….im guessing the sram one he has doesnt have the thick/thin profile, so how does that make it any different from a normal chaingring, unless im missing something?

the xx1 type rings he does im guessing are just a copy of the xx1’s pretty much like the works components ones and raceface ones? (thick thin?)

superfastjellyfish – wow, now that does definitely inspire confidence, as lakes is probably as rocky as peaks and the fact you’ve ridden it with a standard mech too really does say it all!

id guess with no guide at all it would literally be completely silent

im guessing the sram one he has doesnt have the thick/thin profile, so how does that make it any different from a normal chaingring, unless im missing something?

Agreed, there’s a lot of confusion about it. I’m not interested in slating AB’s product Tehan has fulled the rumours here in the first post:

The ultimate solution for Sram cranks that feature a removable spider. Spiderless chainrings allow for flawless single speed or Sram 1×9/10/11 drivetrain setup. These chainrings save more than 150g over regular spider and chainring combo. Reliable, extremely light, stiff and clean looking on the bike

Chainring tooths optimized for great chain retention while riding in rough terrain!. In almost all cases chainkeeper is not necessary…

…Please note that thick-thin profile is not necessary to hold chain like XX1. We have discovered that simple principle with new tooth profile which allows to bring the costs of manufacturing down and keep the chain like on XX1.

Wolftooth 30T with a Zee mech. No bash or guide. No dropped chains so far.

njee – yep that to me would suggest the sram one was almost as capable as the XX1 type chainrings without a guide, maybe hes lost in translation somewhere? (im assuming he’s/his company are not english/american language? not being offensive just maybe he hasnt got such brilliant use of the language) but either way that reads like it should be capable of retaining the chain

mackem – good news cheers! ive just compared pics of the tooth profile from the raceface one and the works components one and they basically look the same, so my raceface one should be pretty much identical in terms of performance, which is most of the above success stories are using!

ahhh no more lining up a chainguide – that would be bliss!

Hmmm, does anyone make to suit middleburn cranks?

What bolt pattern? Nowt special about Middleburn cranks. Plenty of 104mm options – Wolf Tooth, Works, Race Face, Absolute Black.

I mean spiderless like the uno chainrings

I run a 1×10 – XTR clutch mech, Middleburn cranks and Middleburn 32t unramped chajinring.
Not dropped my chain in over a year of riding this set up on a fully rigid bike.
Not downhill but Dales, Peaks and South Downs mincing

Whilst mine came off when I rode off a curb!

yep cant imagine not running a top guide around here with a normal chainring up front, not a chance even with a clutch mech….

im hoping (and it looks like it works as above posts!) that the profile on the teeth acts as both a top guide and sorts the retention of the chain! it does appear to from the above posts anyways

I run an E13 G-Ring (normal, no big/small stuff) and a Zee Mech, but i do have a bash. I’ve not lost the chain once. Only on a HT, but the first few rides I tried to lose the chain and it wasn’t interested.

righty who then is running the above combo with NO front guide?

Me – medium cage SLX clutch, Works ring, cheapy chain on a Solaris

have you dropped the chain?

No, and I haven’t been delicate with it – in fact, it works better than with the top guide I had, as occasionally I used to drop a chain on back-pedalling to set myself up for something technical

what sort of terrain area do you ride?

Quantocks, Exmoor (usual) + Long Mynd so far – fairly rocky and rooty in places but not taken it to the Lakes yet…

EDIT: The ring seems to stop the chain from oscillating wildly from side to side too much IGMC…

oxym0r0n – Member
righty who then is running the above combo with NO front guide?
Me – medium cage SLX clutch, Works ring, cheapy chain on a Solaris

have you dropped the chain?

No, and I haven’t been delicate with it – in fact, it works better than with the top guide I had, as occasionally I used to drop a chain on back-pedalling to set myself up for something technical
what sort of terrain area do you ride?
Quantocks, Exmoor (usual) + Long Mynd so far – fairly rocky and rooty in places but not taken it to the Lakes yet…

EDIT: The ring seems to stop the chain from oscillating wildly from side to side too much IGMC…

:lol:

very clever sir, one applauds you!

sounds great though, i agree just lately backpedalling with my e13 top guide has caused it to come off, so i guess it sounds like it should be better again!

great stuff,

Most of us who have tried it (usually XX1) have found at first it’s great, then as the ring wears it’s next to useless.

Generally its quite a sandy base where we are, so that happens quickly. For the sake of a top guide & never having issues, it’s not worth it IMO.

So if I were to get one of these magic thick/thin rings, with a non-clutched XT shadow mech, what subtle guide would be the perfect complement for hassle free riding?

Wolftooth 30T with a Zee mech. No bash or guide. No dropped chains so far.

Similar to above: Wolftooth 30T, 36-11 Cassette, XT Clutch mech, KMC Chain. No bash or guide. No dropped chains. Riding in the Dark Peak.

Furious sounds great as riding dark peak to so that’s promising, one Quickie is it pretty silent or noisy with the thick thin chainring? I’d assume it should be pretty silent with your setup but unsure whether the chainring may cause some noise?

Works 34t, 11-36 XT cassette, Zee mech, KMC chain, Hope top guide, lexan bash ring. The guide may be superfluous at the moment but as its silent and frictionless I can’t see a reason to remove it. It’s very quiet, like running a singlespeed – the only time I hear the transmission is in bottom gear when there’s some tooth on chain noise.

tested yesterday in pretty much ‘anger’

no chainguide, raceface wide/narrow chain ring and xtr clutch mech

no drops at all, its deadly silent climbing other than the usual ‘whurring’ chain sound and i tested it on all the usual stuff i do (rocky descents, steeps steps, fast descents, jumps etc) and not once did it drop, by the end of the ride id actually stopped thinking about checking it was still on

i havent adjusted my clutch in about a year, so when i got home i checked the tension (after the first test ride) and it was still not actually tight or done up as tight as can be, so i adjusted it even further to have less slack again and i’d imagine that will be even better/less chain slap!

the only time i could see it maybe coming off in that setup is on really rocky descents in 10th gear (1×10 setup), as obviously the chain is at its slackest point then, but to be honest very very very rarely would i be descending/have a need to descend the mega rocky stuff in that gear, so worth noting if you descend rocks alot perhaps worth shifting up a few gears (mid cassette) to make the chain a little more taught

didnt really think it would work that well, im massively impressed TBH, i cant honestly imagine any xc racers losing the chain on pretty much any course ive ever seen, given what i rode it on yesterday in the peak district at speed

time will tell if the wear on the front ring will cause issues with the chain drop but so far 1 ride in its pretty mint!

i do think the xx1 and wolftooth chainrings look like they would hold the chain even better, the works and RF ring looks pretty much like normal chainrings other than the thick alternating teeth, where as on the xx1 and wolftooth ones they look alot deeper the teeth, sort of like the chain would sink/mesh deeper onto the chainring…that said the RF has proved fine so far!

so if i was to want to obtain one of these thick/thin alternating tooth rings, where would i look?
and would the hope single ring be suitable? i’m a total novice when it comes to this 1×10 thing and i’m still only halfway through getting all the bits i need (got an SLX clutch mech and XT crank arms, still need the ring and cassette).

What happens when these chainrings wear a little?

We will find out I guess. It doesn’t strike me that it should take particularily accelerated wear- the shape’s more complicated but it’s not that much in conflict with the chain, it manages it rather than bullying it. But I’m sure once it loses its prominent shape it’ll stop working as well or at all.

At £35 for Works I don’t mind if it needs somewhat more regular replacement than an E13 or similiar.

Will it not only need minor wear to stop working as it should?

Don’t know yet. My gut feeling is that it needs to lose quite a lot of material to be a problem, it might lose the defined edges but it seems it’s the thickness rather than the exact shape that’s doing the job. We’ll see eh. I’ve only got a hundred miles or so on mine so nothing really.

hmmm i thought about this a bit over the weekend – im not sure it will, i think its down to the WIDTH of the wider teeth that obviously give its tight grip on the chain

im not massively sure the width of the teeth will actually wear though? yes they will get notchy/pointy at the top of the height, but the width should’nt really change all that much?

thats why i think the wolftooth and xx1 rings will be better long term than the works/raceface ones, as the height of the teeth is more so meaning in my mind it will take alot longer for the chain to come out of its ‘safe’ position in the teeth when worn…again only my thoughts

plus my hope ring which is a normal single ring, never actually ever looks worn compared to a new one really (at no point have i had the point teeth like i used to on shimano rings), the only reason i knew my hope ring was shot was because of chainsuck when putting a new chain on (and it sounded awful), so wear was not visible on that which im hoping the teeth stay pretty much the same on this