Ian – that might be a good idea, but Duty is paid by the producer*/importer, not the retailer so it would require some stiff policing to prevent on-licence sale product finding it’s way into off-licence retailer’s hands.

* One of the reasons that alcopops were “invented” was that brewers were producing 4-5%+ beers on which they paid the duty for the alcohol production, but they then reduced the alcoholic content of the beer to make it more palatable/sell better. The spare alcohol had had it’s duty paid on it, but was sitting idle. So some genius thought: “I know, let’s bung it in some lemonade/blue antifreeze and flog it to neds!” Bob’s your drunk uncle, a new market is born! 🙂

And really these prices only affect ‘at home drinkers’ (like myself). If you ahve a pub where the price per unit is less than 50p, let me know!

DrP

I don’t like it, as I like to responsibly enjoy cheap alcohol, but unfrtunately that’s the way it is folks!

DrP

That’s the way what is ? Is it the law that expert knowledge from the medical fraternity should determine how everyone else lives their lives ?

It might just be that some people would happily trade 5 years of their lifespan in order to drink and enjoy the 40 odd years of their adult life.

Just a thought.

tm – I insist on being patronized! Bring me doctors and socialists!

Shouldn’t the price of cheap booze, white lightning et al, be reduced rather than increased? that way, the knd of people who sit around in parks drinking themselves into oblivion will seriously reduce their life span and the loss of income through tax will be made up by not paying them benefits and looking after them in hospital later on?
Free packet of smokes with every bottle of special brew anyone?

As a matter of interest, what is the duty for alcohol atm?

Could this be the end of the road for:

Apparently this will have great benefits and longer lives.

Ultimately if we ban or price all “nasty” things out of existance we’ll end up with a country full of 1000 years bores heads all expecting to be looked after.

Maybe we should consider dropping the price so there are plenty of care home spaces available, and I can retire earlier….

but hang on… if we all stop drinking and live longer then the pension pot will fail big time 🙁

As a matter of interest, what is the duty for alcohol atm?

depends:

Low Alcohol beverages, wine and made wines (1) up to 4.0% £69.32per 100 litres
Low Alcohol beverages, wine and made wines (1) exceeding 4.0% but not exceeding 5.5% £95.33 per 100litres
Cider and Perry of up to 7.5% £33.46 per 100 litres (this rate was £36.01 between 29/03/10 and 29/06/10)
Beer £17.32 for every 1% of strength per 100 litres
Wine £225.00 per 100 litres
Sparkling Wine of 8.5% volume and above £288.20 per 100 litres
“Intermediate products” (like port and sherry) £299.97 per 100 litres
Spirits and spirit based – “RTDs (Ready to Drink Products)” (2) £23.80 for every 1% of strength per 100 litres (1) Excluding spirit based drinks – see below (2) – ie “made products containing distilled alcohol In the 2002 budget, the Chancellor created a new fiscal category by linking spirit based “RTD’s” to the duty on Spirits. Previously spirit based “RTD’s” had been dutied at the same rate as wine and cider based RTD’s.

Anti-government rant fail.

It’s not though Stoner. Even a rabid Tory like you can see that it’s simply a cynical attempt by this ConDemNation to raise revenue. So, a perfectly valid ‘anti-government rant’.

Introducing a minimum price on alcohol would save millions on NHS, police and local authority spending

…that they could then go and spend on dealing with issues caused by the inevitable increase in the use of other drugs, and illicit alcohol production.

Someone mentioned Scandinavia earlier; what they din’t mention, is the prolific amount of illegal alcohol production in those countries. Many folk, speshly in lesser populated areas, will brew their own hooch. It’s actually quite an ingrained part of their culture, it seems. When I visited Norway, my gf’s dad had a still in his basement. Totally illegal, and the penalties are very harsh. Doesn’t stop anyone! He would actually have tasting sessions with his friends, who all brewed their own too, including the local police chief…

Pricing the poorest users off alcohol would merely push them towards other drugs. Heroin is cheaper now than it’s ever been (British forces being in Afghanistan have nothing to do with this at all, of course…). In areas like the one I live in, alcohol misuse is rife, but nowhere near the socially destructive problem Heroin uses is. Cocaine is cheaper and more freely available too. Crack Cocaine is no longer a drug used solely by council estate ‘scum’, but in fact is now also being used by people with more ‘respectable’ lives.

So, the government’s claims to be concerned with the health of the nation are quite frankly a smokescreen. Like they actually give a toss about some old winos anyway ffs!

If you ask me, there should be a maximum price on booze. No more than £3 a pint tops. That way, I wouldn’t have to mug some middle-class wine aficionado to get the money for my next fix. 🙂

Thanks for that, certainly clears it up.

I can see why the govt want to be seen to be doing something to curb the drink culture in the country, and lets be honest the state some people get in is pretty dire to put it mildly. However why should the rest of us get penalised enjoying a quiet bottle with our Sunday lunch?

it’s simply a cynical attempt by this ConDemNation to raise revenue. So, a perfectly valid ‘anti-government rant’.

you’re turning into TJ what with that phobia about reading stuff Fred.

Announcing the plans for England and Wales, Home Office Minister James Brokenshire said it acknowledged “concern over how cheaply some alcoholic drinks are being sold” and the link between alcohol and disorder.

“Banning the sale of alcohol below the rate of duty plus VAT is the best starting point for tackling the availability of cheap alcohol and will send a clear signal to retailers and the public that government takes this issue seriously.”

there is no mechanism in the proposls to raise revenue for the government. So you also get an “anti-goverment rant fail” sticker. I’ll print of some more for you, I reckon I’ll need them…

hang on, i’m confused, how does this raise revenue?

i’m stupid, and fragile, please be gentle…

careful now, I have spare sticker here for you 🙂

It doest raise revenue. That’s the point that Fred missed so spectacularly.

itsa not a revenue raising exercise

I do find it funny that in Scotland this was blocked by an alliance of labour, tory and Lib Dem.

I am for it myself – some of the drinks the alcoholics like such as frosty jack or tenants crucial brew are very very cheap per unit of alcohol. Screaming drunk for a couple of quid?

It wouldn’t affect me as I buy expensive alcohol – £3.20 pints in my local

jimster – Member

Thanks for that, certainly clears it up.

I can see why the govt want to be seen to be doing something to curb the drink culture in the country, and lets be honest the state some people get in is pretty dire to put it mildly. However why should the rest of us get penalised enjoying a quiet bottle with our Sunday lunch?

It won’t!

£3.20 pints in my local

That’s socialist champagne prices for you….

Looking at that graph on the first page,

Has no-one else spotted that the most expensive items on there (by a hefty margin) are Breezers and WKD, with Smirnoff Ice bringing up a close third?

Surely that’s proof positive that a minimum price isn’t going to affect binge drinking and alcohol-fueled violence and stupidity one jot? I don’t remember the last time I saw someone thrown through Woolies’ window after a couple of lads been on the Merlot a bit hard.

that was my original point when I first published the graph.

A 50p floor would hit CabSav Englanders far harder than BuckieNeds

well, “CabSav Englanders” are just as capable of drinking too much…

Has no-one else spotted that the most expensive items on there (by a hefty margin) are Breezers and WKD, with Smirnoff Ice bringing up a close third? ………Surely that’s proof positive that a minimum price isn’t going to affect binge drinking and alcohol-fueled violence and stupidity one jot?

Don’t the yoofs / binge drinkers all drink cheap vodka and cider before they go down the pub so they’re pretty Brahmsed before they go out to save money, so I think it would make a difference.

Don’t the yoofs / binge drinkers all drink cheap vodka and cider before they go down the pub so they’re pretty Brahmsed before they go out to save money, so I think it would make a difference.

Would it be cynical of me to suggest that the only thing it’d make a difference to is shoplifting statistics?

*Get’s ready for Stoner’s sticker.

If you increase the duty and VAT raised on the extra duty, and ban the sale of loss-leading drinks by supermarkets and the like you won’t increase revenue?

Also these are duty prices before manufacturing / distribution costs are taken into account.

duty is payable on the product (i.e. its a fixed amount based on the nature of the product and it’s alcoholic content – see the duty rates quoted up there ^ a bit), not the costs of production.

fixing a minimum equal to the duty & vat just means that the retailer isnt allowed to subsidise the consumers bingeing by discounting into the tax part of the product price. Doing so undermines the public health policy objectives of the rate of duty.

whenever you raise taxes, you raise revenue. The existence or otherwise of a duty-linked floor to the retail price makes no difference. This policy does not in itself intend to raise the rates of duty. That would be done separately in a budget,

LOL – sums it up nicely IMO.

Raising alcohol prices will reduce consumption – just like it has with petrol.

Do prohibitive measures ever do that much to curtail drug use ?

It’ll just create a black market and extra criminality IMHO.