456 SS or EVO???

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This topic has 17 replies, 10 voices, and was last updated 12 years ago by cookeaa.

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456 SS or EVO???
cookeaa
Full Member

I’ve decided my current HT is too short up front and the Head angle is too steep.
So I’m in the market for a slightly longer, slacker angled HT which I’ll most like fit a 5″ fork, middle-weight parts and a 1or2 x 9 drivetrain to…

I’m currently drifting towards some variant or another of steel 456 simply because of the pricing and geometry on offer, but I’m a little hung up between the Summer season and EVO versions at the minute…

at 5’10” I think I need something in the 600 – 620mm ish top tube range which means either the 16″ version of the SS or 18″ version of the EVO, Slacker is better in my book which I think is where the SS would certainly edge it, but it also seems to generally come up as a longer/lower frame, anyone have a go on both yet? how do they compare generally? is the EVO really a 6″ only frame (that’s sort of what the website suggests)…

Posted 12 years ago

Zedsdead
Free Member

I built up my SS last weekend and I am absolutely loving it!

18″ for me and I’m 6ft tall. 5″ Shivers and it’s the dogs danglies!

Posted 12 years ago

pickle
Free Member

hat is your current frame then? the problem is, i don’t think they have sold any EVO’s yet have they? so trying to get a comparison might be hard. I’ve run a normal 456 with 130’s up front and it was nice, found the SS a bit to slack for me but might just be personal taste.

What’s wrong with a normal 456?

Posted 12 years ago

a11y
Full Member

18″ Summer Season here, 6’/185cm tall and find it bang-on with an 80mm stem. I wouldn’t want to be any smaller riding this size so think you’re right in considering the 16″ size.

Love it. Best-riding bike I’ve owned, only downside being the weight but I can live with it. Bang-on 65deg static head angle with 140mm Revs, still climbs better than my old Genesis Altitude @ 120mm.

And since we appear to be doing pics:

(ignore the decals – was originally orange but had it powdercoated and has these decals spare…)

Posted 12 years ago

steelfanboy
Free Member

I don’t have a chace to build it yet but hey! it looks mean

Posted 12 years ago

cookeaa
Full Member

My current frame is a Size Small Solid Acer (17″) – the HA is horrifically steep, I’ve muddled by with it for some time now, but the list angle is 71.5* I measured it at closer to 70* but that is still just not suiting my riding.

The TT is 575mm, a longer stem improved things a while back it climbs OK now, but it’s still not right for me, it’s simply become a turd polishing excercise, I think really I’d just like to switch turds now… and some version of 456 or another could be what I need

Nowt wrong with a regular 456 at all but I really am feeling like something much slacker would suit me, I likes my descending much more than my climbing, it’s not like it would cost me the earth to switch frames at a later date either so the SS is the current front runner…

Zedsdead – I love those forks, Shiver SCs are ace in my book, looks like a tidy build, how you finding the slackness?

Posted 12 years ago

Zedsdead
Free Member

I’m loving it! It looks even slacker there because of the way it’s sitting.

I’ve always been a cross country kind of guy. Rode a Fat Chance for years (still do on occasion) and then an Airborne Lancaster. I love those bikes and how they climb and handle. The SS is very different. It’s probably me getting older but I stopped properly riding mtb a few years ago due to me riding BMX. I went from 20″ wheels to 24″ as it’s more stable and now I’m back into mtb I’m finding this great fun. Don’t get me wrong, I love the Airborne and Fat but this is great for me. I like the HA on it. It doesn’t feel like it’s about to flop over in a chopper style but at the same time it’s not mega steep -I think they got it pretty spot on.

Others seem to rate them quite highly too. Sure they’re not the lightest but I’m not caring right now…

Posted 12 years ago

snowslave
Full Member

18inch ss, wearing uggs.

IMG_2782 by snowslave, on Flickr

Posted 12 years ago

cookeaa
Full Member

I spent last weekend sorting out my DH bike; offset shock mounts, sofened the rear shock, dropped the forks ~25mm in their crowns, the net result was a huge improvement in handling by slackening the bike out and slightly increasing the wheelbase… different bike I know but the excercise just made me realise what was so wrong with my HT…

I’ve had a DMR Exalt in the past which was probably a bit too much of a compromise the other way (It was intended as a DH HT really), that was significantly heavier than the 456 would be (~7lbs for the frame alone!), plus I had boxxers on it which really wasn’t a good move, I guess I’m after a more sensible, but fun HT, what I’ve got right now is a weird cramped XC bike, where what I need is a trail HT that I can bimble up hills on and blast back down on…

And yep the pics above just confirm it for me the SS’s Slackness does what I’m looking for wheelbase wise by extending it a bit further forwards but keeping TT length sensible… I think the SS will be my first choice, Assuming on-one can restock the 16″ in a slightly nicer colour than “Mint Sauce” which I’m not too keen on TBH….

Cheers All…

Posted 12 years ago

brant
Free Member

Assuming on-one can restock the 16″ in a slightly nicer colour than “Mint Sauce” which I’m not too keen on TBH….

SS is now discontinued though there may be a few frames floating around in the system.

Evo is only 456 model going forward.

Posted 12 years ago

Mugboo
Full Member

I may have the answer for you.

I have a custom metallic black SS with subtle grey graphics (it’s even called Slacker) & a pewter headbadge.

As long as you can wait a week or two till I can swap the parts to my c456 (with slackset..)

Email in profile.

Posted 12 years ago

BoardinBob
Full Member

5’11”

18″ Summer Season

70mm stem

120mm Rebas

I absolutely love the bike

Posted 12 years ago

messiah
Free Member

63.5 deg of headtube angle slack enough for you?

Throw in a lovely low bottom bracket for huge cornering fun, add a twist of 71 degree seat angle for climbing… wrap it all up in a frame at just over 4lbs. Serve with some mud.

It’s a bit of weapon!

Posted 12 years ago

a11y
Full Member

I spent last weekend sorting out my DH bike; offset shock mounts, sofened the rear shock, dropped the forks ~25mm in their crowns, the net result was a huge improvement in handling by slackening the bike out and slightly increasing the wheelbase… different bike I know but the excercise just made me realise what was so wrong with my HT…

I’ve had a DMR Exalt in the past which was probably a bit too much of a compromise the other way (It was intended as a DH HT really), that was significantly heavier than the 456 would be (~7lbs for the frame alone!), plus I had boxxers on it which really wasn’t a good move, I guess I’m after a more sensible, but fun HT, what I’ve got right now is a weird cramped XC bike, where what I need is a trail HT that I can bimble up hills on and blast back down on…

Now that you’ve said that I’d say the slacker the better for you. My Glory DH’s currently 64.8 HA static and I suspect I’ll think it’s too steep after riding my 456ss for a while! However, my 456ss doesn’t feel as slack as my measured figures suggest, so I’d not be put off by the super-slack figures. Just factor in a powdercoat and buy the mint green colour – my original fluoro orange was fading badly, hence the opposite-end-of-the-spectrum dull grey finish now.

Posted 12 years ago

cookeaa
Full Member

SS is now discontinued though there may be a few frames floating around in the system.

Evo is only 456 model going forward.

I see, and would I be right in thinking that an EVO with a set of ~130mm forks would be more in the reigion of 66-67* Head angle? Slacker than a regular 456 but not as slack as the SS?

Edit: – Mugboo – Size and pricing?

Posted 12 years ago

Mugboo
Full Member

16″

Drop me an email dude 🙂

Posted 12 years ago

brant
Free Member

I see, and would I be right in thinking that an EVO with a set of ~130mm forks would be more in the reigion of 66-67* Head angle? Slacker than a regular 456 but not as slack as the SS?

Correct. Splits the difference between the two up front, but has a steeper seat angle than both and a lower BB.

Posted 12 years ago

cookeaa
Full Member

Cheers for the response Brant It’s interesting comparing the EVOs numbers (to me at least);

Just about everything on it seems to have been tweaked slightly (Although the reported figures are based on a longer fork)…
It looks like the sizing affects more than just seat and TT lengths now too, the chainstays grow marginally on the 18 & 20″, and the Head tubes are a Bit longer on the 16/18/20″. Reach seems shorter overall though (or is that an effect of measuring based on a 150mm fork?) I take it the changes were all in response to customers “Constructive Criticism”…

One question Brant Why didn’t you opt for a EC/ZS44 or Tapered Head tube as part of the EVO updates?
They seem to be growing in popularity on various frames now and obviously add the option of an Angleset for those with the desire for a slacker HA, do they add significant cost and/or weight?

Posted 12 years ago