not necessarily the suspension system as in VPP but

Long travel fork shortish rear travel
Slack angles (Long and low I think they called it?)
Big tyres

in full suspension I cannot think of anything?

from SC

The Blur 4X lives in some conceptual netherworld at the end of the Blur family tree, sort of like a Platypus, except with sharp teeth and the ability to both swim and fly real fast. It’s slacker, longer and lower than its brethren, and employs heavily gusseted top and down tubes that are much larger and thicker than even the Blur LT, making it able to handle everything from jumping to slopestyle stunts.

The end product is an overbuilt frame designed for a life of abuse, forming the basis of a rock-stable bike that can stick the ugliest lines as well as carve turns between gates with total conviction. For a bike to tackle sketchy terrain without investing in the extra weight and wallow of super-long travel rigs, the 4X is the perfect Platypus.[/quote]

Santacruz Tallboy LTc with shock bushes,angleset and a 160 fork.

[url=https://flic.kr/p/odFBnm]IMGP0159[/url] by multispeedstu, on Flickr

great picture

BUT

angleset and shock bushes so not stock….

ps how does it ride?

A Blur TRC
A Blur TR
A 5010

All 650b. 29’ers will never be even slightly close to a 4x.

29er’s anything similiar to a Blur 4x?

Starting point

All 650b

response………….. 😕

Why will a 29er not be like a Blur 4x? Hora I know you owned a few as well

Part of the blur4x appeal was its tight twisty quick response etc feel. I just dont think A big wheeler would be as agile (in the same way). The 4x was never about rolling quickly/over obstacles etc.

ps how does it ride?

It’s a replacement for my Nomad.
It does everything better than the Nomad did.

Maybe Hora means the 4x was easier for him to mince on. 😉

Banshee Phantom

Banshee Phantom, Kona Process 111, maybe a Spesh Camber Evo. All short-travel, slack and mostly short CSs too. Stu’s suggestion sounds pretty amazing though.

Singlespeedstu the nomad isnt comparable to a 4x.

Yep, I was going to say Banshee Phantom and Kona Process 111 as well.
Some people I know have shortened the Salsa Horsethief to achieve this too.

(I’m not sure than the ethos of the Blur 4x works on a 29er though – they just aren’t going to be as chuckable. I rode a Phantom and can say that it was about as chuckable as I can imagine a 29er ever being though)

The couple I tried seemed like a short travel Nomad to me. 🙂

OP Asked for.

Long travel fork shortish rear travel
Slack angles (Long and low I think they called it?)
Big tyres

In 29 flavour.
The TB LTc fits the bill.

Part of the blur4x appeal was its tight twisty quick response etc feel. I just dont think A big wheeler would be as agile (in the same way). The 4x was never about rolling quickly/over obstacles etc. [/quote]

See I think that is a real misconception my Rocky Mountain Element is really nippy through everything …with 95mm rear and 120mm front it is more trail so thinking what was the same as the Blur

good call on Camber know nothing on Banshee

Stu looks a great bike.

The MKI Nomad I tried felt v
Tall. The later one too much of a big bike compared.
For me the blur4x felt like a medium chameleon with abit of a softer rear.

I’d be interested in any cheaper 650b modern day blur 4x than the 5010/TR etc..

🙂

Never rode a Blur 4x, but looking at the numbers for the Banshee/Santa Cruz, etc, I’m going with tradition and recommending my own bike, A Devinci Atlas Carbon.

The RX build has a 140mm fork, (110 rear) and the reversible pivots on the seatstays drop everything by 1 degree.

FWIW, I find it pretty chuckable, good in tight turns, and generally not like any of the 29er cliches…?

I rode a Blur 4X for a few years and switched to a Tallboy (aluminum one) with a 1.5 degree angleset and a 120mmish fork. So it’s not stock, and 29ers do feel different to 26ers… so maybe that’s not helpful. However, it does do that “corner-smashing” thing a lot like I remember on the 4X, even though the BB isn’t all that low and the HA still isn’t all that slack. People speculate that the big BB drop on a 29er compared with a 26er gives it that low-BB feel. The slackened Tallboy is certainly very fun bike short-travel bike.

I also ride a Rune 26er which has that long, low, feel that Banshee aim for… not unlike the 4X, but feels longer – probably because it is. That Phantom looks really promising.

@ AlexSimon – what were your overall impressions of the Phantom? I’m considering onebut worry it’s too heavy for an all-rounder that I’ll want to long days on as well as rock tech.

To OP – Whyte T-129?

Niner Rip 9?

Sb95. But I’m slightly biased. 😀

I wouldn’t worry about a Phantom feeling heavy on long rides – my Spitfire 27.5 is a fairly hefty low carbon enduro gnarpoon build and I’d still rather do 100 miles of the South Downs Way on it than my Cotic Soul. It only feels heavy when lifting it over stiles or into the car but otherwise it’s a rocketship!*

* Owner sadly less so…

Banshee Phantom or a prime (if you fancy a touch more travel).

Prime probably fits the bill.

Norco Shinobi? 140mm front, 120mm rear. A mates got one and it’s a great bike. Not sure they still make them though so you’d have to find a 2013 model.

Kona Process 111 fo shizzle

(I’m not sure than the ethos of the Blur 4x works on a 29er though – they just aren’t going to be as chuckable. I rode a Phantom and can say that it was about as chuckable as I can imagine a 29er ever being though)

………..
[video]http://vimeo.com/80405210[/video]

intresting review of the kona

Transition bandit29?

If its owt like my 26″ version it’ll do all you need and more

I can vouch that the Banshee Phantom is chuckable, certainly more so than the Heckler I had before. I only realised recently that the wheelbase is actually shorter than a Spitfire with 650b wheels size for size. Plus it doesn’t have the floppy fork feeling that comes with slack 26/650b bikes.

Mine is set up with MRP Stage forks and Flow Ex / Rubber Queen 2.2 (loads of tyre clearance) and rides beautifully. 105mm rear, 130mm front. It is exactly the bike I wanted it to be: playful down and off things, big wheeler monster truck over chossy ground, nimble through the corners and a highly accomplished climber. It is also the first bike I’ve been able to manual properly since I rode a BMX!

No idea about weight though, although I suspect it is sub 30 lb based on how much easier it is to lift compared to my 31 lb heckler. With any 29er the first place to save weight is the wheels so if you can go carbon or Arch Ex size rims that would be most of the battle done. I don’t have any problem pedaling it about though, even on long rides, the suspension works incredibly well and is such short travel anyway that you are never fighting it up a hill. I suspect the Kona is similar and is probably a lot down to how 29er wheels “work”.

They should be landing in the UK at the end of the month (I got one early because I’m special…….and made enough of a pain in the arse of myself 😳 to Pedals Cycles in Edinburgh).

At the moment I suspect the Phantom or Process 111 are the only bikes that come close to your wishes. Not sure if the Orange Segment does anything for you, on paper it is similar to either of the other bikes. They are never going to ride in the same manner as a Blur TRc/4x, as they have bigger wheels and therefore require a different riding style, but they are certainly from the same school of thought.

If anyone who lives near Dundee fancys a go they are more than welcome to try it out (mine is large, Pedals in Edinburgh have a medium demo bike). Apologies to those that care about these things for having it in the granny ring for the photo. The shock is also on the other way round now.

Clink – Member

@ AlexSimon – what were your overall impressions of the Phantom? I’m considering onebut worry it’s too heavy for an all-rounder that I’ll want to long days on as well as rock tech.
I rode all the Banshee full sussers on the same day. Around the same loop.
They’re all on the heavy side, but then as soon as you put aggressive geometry on a short travel bike, you’ve got to build it so that it will take a bit of stick. It’s a tricky one.
The Phantom was great, but it was also the bike that made me decide that 29ers weren’t for me. This was because it was the most agile of the 29ers I’ve tried, yet still not as much fun for me personally as a 650b/26. Probably faster, and maybe even more fun in a straight line, but just not as much fun around corners and swapping lines.

I’m just not sure I’m ever going to feel like I’m on top of the steering on a 29er.
The rear end of the phantom was great though – felt a lot more than the 105mm and all the Banshees pedalled well. In fact they all pedalled so well that I found myself leaning towards the Rune and Prime more than the Spitfire and Phantom. Back at home, on paper, the weight seems an issue, but on a short tight, techy trail centre loop, it just didn’t matter.

AlexSimon – just out of curiosity, how tall are you?

I agree with a lot of what you say but I guess it depends on where you ride. Most of my riding is big, open moorland style trails in Scotland where it absolutely rocks. Not so much winding through trees. If it was tightly wooded twisty singletrack I suspect my opinions of the Phantom would be different, but probably due to wheel mass and acceleration rather than geometry (but then the Spitfire I tried didn’t feel great in those situations either, and that was the geometry effects due to the head angle). It also isn’t the bike I would choose if most of my riding involved styling it up off tabletops.

If “nimble” really is top of the list of qualities then the Process 111 is probably going to be slightly better than the Phantom due to the CS length, but there isn’t much in it (~7.5mm I think) and I guess you lose out in other quarters such as stability and climbing prowess.

I guess I have also spent 5 years riding a 29er hardtail (Swift) so had learnt how to handle a 29er. I’m also a broad, monkey armed, long legged 6ft which I suspect helps with handlebar wrestling.

vondally – Member
intresting review of the kona

Man who sells Kona extolling virtues of Kona.

Does chime with everything I’ve read on those bikes, to be fair. All the reviews have been excellent, and the bikes look “right”.

I’m not as convinced by the 111’s suspension as I am by its geometry – not much anti-squat so pedalling efficiency is lower, high anti-rise so it gets stiffer under braking and not much linkage progression so it’ll bottom out more easily. With a great shock and tune you can deal with most of that fairly well but not as well as with a good shock and better linkage kinematics. Phantom should pedal better, brake better and cope better with big hits.

Saying that the Process models all look awesome fun but I think all need careful shock selection and tuning!