Will I have to buy a 29er next?

Airdrop Edit or Filter. Bird Aether 7.

As a previous 29er hater myself, when I needed to get a new bike I took the plunge and immediately knew I'd made the right decision.

Big wheeled bikes aren't crap anymore, like everything else the geometry has been mostly figured out now.

Not cheap, but…

https://singletrackworld.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/03/pivot-shadowcat-first-ride-review-lightly-outrageous/

Or there’s loads of 29/27.5 mullet bikes.

29ers are pretty well sorted now though.

Transition?

I wouldn’t write 29er off without trying a few. I was always against the idea but then my 27.5” fork died so I went for a 29er Transition Sentinel. It’s epic fun and so fast too.

If you want to go halfway why not try a mullet bike?

Vitus Escarpe comes in both wheel sizes if you can get one in stock.

Even if full 27.5 bikes die out, it’ll be easy enough to stick a 27.5 front wheel in the front of a mullet bike and increase the fork travel 10-20mm to correct the geometry.

Propain… still rocking 29 or 27.5 in the Tyee, Alu or Carbon.

Specialised Status 140 could be worth a look - it’s a a mullet and about the travel you’re after.

Slightly shorter travel and a chunk more expensive the new Santa Cruz 5010 is a mullet.

Probably too much travel for you but the Nukeproof Mega and Transition Patrol both have mullet options.

Transition Scout? Giant Trance X (27.5 version)?

Nukeproof usually do both wheel sizes in their bikes.

I've got a 29er reactor, but they do it 27.5 as well.

Unless you need quite a small frame, why would you want a 27.5? These days 29 just works.

https://vitusbikes.com/collections/escarpe/products/vitus-escarpe-27-crs-mountain-bike-2022

On top of the suggestions thus far

These days 29 just works

Sort of. The problem I still have with 29ers is that they're so damn fast across rough ground that you end up running heavy wheels and tyres to survive the battering (especially on something at the bigger travel end of things) and it completely kills the liveliness and flickability. Getting to the bottom as fast as possible - amazing. Winching up horrendous steepness pretty good. Noodling around on moderately challenging technical terrain, I'd rather have the ease of acceleration of the smaller wheels, thank you. Currently riding a Rocketmax and a gen V Soul, so I have both bases covered, but if it was one bike for everything, I'd be trying to lay hold of a (now out of production) 27.5 Longshot geo Flare, as that was an amazing bike for "just riding" (but too close to my Soul).

That said - if you want it for "Innerleithen and the Alps", then 29er...

Donmt rule out a 29er or mullet without trying one.

I think nowadays biking is moving away from classing bikes bumpy the amount of travel the have like 10 years ago when XC was 80-120, Trail (All-mountain) was 130-150), Enduro 160ish, Freeride/Super Enduro 170-180, 200+ DH.

Especially as shorter travel bikes are getting much more capable geometry/strength and longer travel bikes are pedalling really well.

Orange still make a few, 5 Evo, Alpine Evo and Alpine 6.

29ers are ace but I'm currently building a 27.5 HT because they are loads of fun too!

I had the exact same requirements in March of this year. I bought an Airdrop Edit v4, it’s an amazing bike!

I tried 29ers but chose the Edit for the reasons mentioned by JonEdwards.

I wouldn’t change my decision :o)

Unless you need quite a small frame, why would you want a 27.5?

Because I don't like them...

These days 29 just works.

It might for you ..

172cm tall here, 30" inseam, riding a Stumpjumper Evo alloy 2022 set up mullet, it's a good all-rounder, had 5010s and Blur TRC for 9 years prior and the Stumpy is more capable and more versatile.

It might for you ..

out of interest why? I feel like a lot of people have misconceptions about them not being "playful" or poor on technical trails but these days this is simply not true. Personally I think its more down to poor technique which makes people think this.

im currently in a similar spot my derailleur is on the way out its 11sp and most likely im going to end up with a 12sp because its all thats around.

Banshee Spitfire?
Though I'm on a Rune, it just rides like a bike. Originally a burly long travel bike, a recent crash diet means it's a lighter long travel bike I'd happily ride all day.

I think it's silly to say 29er wheels aren't playful, it's more the bike as a whole than the wheel size that makes a difference. My 29er hardtail is far more playful than my 650b full sus. It's more likely the extra bounce and longer reach that makes the 650b bike less playful.

The problem I still have with 29ers is that they’re so damn fast across rough ground that you end up running heavy wheels and tyres to survive the battering

Does this survive closer examination?
What is it that makes them fast across rough ground?
Is it that the larger circ rolls over stuff better and, dare I say it, smooths the ride?
Ie reduces the battering

Surely for the average rider the top speed is dictated by the battering transmitted through the bike to the rider. Which would be the same for a rider on a 650b as it would be for a 29er going a tad faster.

No?

Yeti SB140?

Does this survive closer examination?

My thought too.

If you believed this, then the logical conclusion is stick to a 26“ so you have to ride slower and avoid battering the bike. Or just use your brakes to slow down a bit and enjoy the smoother ride.

The problem I still have with 29ers is that they’re so damn fast across rough ground that you end up running heavy wheels and tyres to survive the battering (especially on something at the bigger travel end of things) and it completely kills the liveliness and flickability

Mavic xa elite

Cheers all, seems like there’s a few about still, I’ll check them out. I’m in no rush so hopefully next year will be able to get to a couple of demos to have a ride.

That said – if you want it for “Innerleithen and the Alps”, then 29er…

Yes but trying to pedal more and use uplift less unless it’s on holiday and that’s only for a fortnight every year. My T130 has just coped very well in France, and a couple of days in Switzerland. I feel like it’s the fork that lets it down and that’s about to get an upgrade.

The only times I’ve ridden 29ers properly have been e-bikes, so not a fair comparison, but they did feel a bit tank like at first although admittedly something you get used to pretty quickly.

In my head what I want is something a little bit more capable without going full enduro and flattening the tamer trails.

I know the answer is to ride some 🙂

Nukeproof usually do both wheel sizes in their bikes.

Does look like they love the little wheels 🙂
Reactor looks interesting.

I’m a short arse and stubbornly stuck to 26” wheels until last year, largely because I didn’t want to ride a gate, little people shouldn’t ride 29ers, etc, etc. I’m now on a Spesh Stumpjumper and loving it. I can flick it around tighter trails no problem, and it possibly climbs better than the 26” Yeti ASR5 it replaced.

Surely for the average rider the top speed is dictated by the battering transmitted through the bike to the rider. Which would be the same for a rider on a 650b as it would be for a 29er going a tad faster.

Agree. On a nice smooth road my top speeds are approximately: Road bike 35kph, Gravel bike 30kph, MTB 25kph. Move to a heathland fire road type thing (bit of grass, bumpy, small ruts and potholes): Road bike 10kph, Gravel bike 20kph, MTB 25kph. That’s got absolutely nothing to do with wheel size or weight!

Think my next bike will be a 29er simply as that's clearly the direction the industry is moving. I currently ride a 650B Enduro, but rented a 29er Hightower for a couple of days, and honestly i couldn't tell you if it was vastly different anyway.

If you want something a little more capable but without making life too easy then I don't think wheel size is the issue. You're better off buying a trail bike rather than an enduro bike. Or even buy a hardtail, I ride my hardtail on more tame trails exactly because my full sus can just plough through and over virtually everything.

Scott Genius, run it as a 27.5+ or a 29er, you get to choose.

27.5+ isn’t appealing to me either. Tbh I thought it was more or less dismissed as a fad and not really a thing anymore?

Mullet? There’s loads of them around.

I like my 29 hardtail and haven’t found it be less fun that previous bikes. But I do also like my brother’s Commencal Meta HT which is 27.5 and equally fun (just a bit harsher but then they are a rather stiff frame).

Last years Santa Cruze Nomad was 27.5 and supposedly fun and capable.

Mullet? There’s loads of them around.

definitely not ruled out 👍

Bird Aether 7 has caught my attention now, and I’ve spent my time today watching as many videos as I can find about it… 🤔

The problem with video reviews is that they're all made by professional Choobers who need to keep the constant supply of free bikes coming. They're never going to heavily criticise anything.

Don't get me wrong I watch way too many bike videos on YouTube but I don't trust them for objective reviews.

Oh I know, I've never watched a bad review 😁 I've just watched one where the guy was riding with Bird themselves, he's never going to say that he's not loving it. Also though it's probably not easy to find an actual bad bike these days.

I do fully intend to ride anything that I'm considering buying. Well I did until I just spotted an Aether frame for sale.

I'd be after this if it was the Aether 9...www.ebay.co.uk/itm/284984215105

Perfect for you though.

Also Airdrop just put some bikes in the sale on their website.

Shh, don't put that on here I've already messaged him 😉

Without riding one I'm concerned the L might be too long and I'd really want an ML.

Sorry too late to edit! I've got ebay alerts set for Bird Aether. That one's actually in my old home town so if it was a 29er I'd be collecting it on Saturday morning.

Good luck though hope you get sorted.

Ha, no worries. Seller said he demoed the Large and he's 6'3 which is a fair bit taller than me at 5'11

FWIW my mate has a large Aether 9.  I’m 5,10 and ridden it, it was too big for me.

Too long?
I haven’t checked properly but assume they’re comparable size.

Large Aether is a 505mm reach which is a pretty long thing.

I’m 5’9 with short ish arms and struggled with an ML Aeris 145 with a 481mm reach. Most normal proportioned people around my height would be on an ML I’d think.

Unless you are like an ape with short legs and massively long arms I’d think the Large would be too big at 5’10 / 5’11

Have you seen the Revel Rail frame on eBay? It’s 165/170 but it rides like a trail bike.

Unless you are like an ape with short legs and massively long arms I’d think the Large would be too big at 5’10 / 5’11

Cheers, yes definitely not the one to buy on impulse without a ride.

I’ll get myself up to Laggan for a demo when I’m allowed to ride again 👍

My bike’s away at my friendly mechanic, it’s going to come back with serviced suspension, +10mm travel, a damper upgrade, slacker headset and a nice new stem - it will nearly feel like NBD anyway 😎

Have you seen the Revel Rail frame on eBay? It’s 165/170 but it rides like a trail bike.

Nope but I’ll take a look ta.
I’m not actively looking for anything imminently, it was only because that Bird frame popped up on my fb & I’d been browsing them.

We all know that an entire 1.5in difference in wheel diameter is what separates the pros from the proles.

Too long?

Yep, at 5,10 I ride a 472 reach bike (large Megatower v2) and found the L Aether too long (his low rise bar doesn’t help either).

Have been on 29er's for about the last 7 years (I know, I was late to the party) but recently tried a longer travel 29er full sus for the first time. The thing I found was when landing jumps, my shorts would rub on the back tyre, even to the point to nearly wear through them. I'm 5'11" so not particularly short but this made me think that a mullet bike makes the most sense for longer travel full sussers.

There's the Trek Remedy if you fancy something a bit more mainstream
https://www.trekbikes.com/gb/en_GB/bikes/mountain-bikes/trail-mountain-bikes/remedy/c/B331/

The problem with video reviews is that they’re all made by professional Choobers who need to keep the constant supply of free bikes coming. They’re never going to heavily criticise anything.

best bet is to only look at comparison or shootout reviews. everything is still brilliant, but you can read between the lines to find where one bike is better than another.

I had the predecessor to the Aether 7 (the 120LT), really rate it and I beleive they fixed most of my (minor) gripes with the new model.

A little longer travel and a little heavier than you're perhaps looking for but the Geometron G1 allows you to try all set ups - 650b, mullet or full 29er. I've been running mine as a mullet but changed to full 29er just because I want to try it out. Very adaptable bike. Also depending on set-up its a playful machine and not just a plougher. Geometron are apparently releasing a kit which will allow you to shorten the travel as well, don't have any details yet though.

I had the predecessor to the Aether 7 (the 120LT), really rate it and I beleive they fixed most of my (minor) gripes with the new model.

Good to hear. I do like the idea of something from a smaller British co.

But

There’s the Trek Remedy if you fancy something a bit more mainstream

I’m not against mainstream at all 👍

I’ll look at the Geomotron but I’ve always thought they’re too much bike for me.

I loved my Geometron but it was a beast. I was always honest when people asked about it as it's not for everyone. If you want a nippy little agile trail bike it's not the one.

I've been looking at the Airdrop sale. It's so tempting to get sucked into a project but I don't get time to ride the bikes I have.

Stanton SwitchFS (second hand XL custom geometry one maybe 😉)

Stanton SwitchFS (second hand XL custom geometry one maybe 😉)

Probably also a bit big!

If you want a nippy little agile trail bike it’s not the one.

I’ve been looking at the Airdrop sale.

Probably somewhere in between nippy and a Geomotron I think?

Yeah Airdrop have been added to my list too 🙂

Different model of Bird but I'm 5'9" on a tall day with ~31" legs and regular reach and my M/L AM9 fits a treat.

Very flattering when pointing downwards and climbs well for a 170/150 coil bike.

Seeing as there’s a few Bird riders in here now, anyone know / ridden the 27.5 Aeris AM 160?

Propain… still rocking 29 or 27.5 in the Tyee, Alu or Carbon.

I know nothing about Propain apart from having vaguely heard of them.

Has anyone actually got one? Are they any good and will I be in for a world of pain if anything goes wrong wrong with it?

I love my Stanton fs160 doubt I’ll ever change it tbh, when they bring the carbon rear end out it will be perfect

@eddie the Stantons do look lovely but probably not going to happen unless I find a cheap frame somewhere.

So far I have a vague list, mostly for my benefit so I can find it again:

27.5 available as Frame only:
Bird Aether 7
Airdrop Filter (not convinced)
Vitus Escarpe
Propain Tyee (seem great value until you add shipping & customs charges)
Yeti SB140 (probably a bit £££ for a frame)
Cotic Rocket (an outlier, I love the look of them, not sure if I want a steel enduro bike...)

29er complete bikes
Orbea Occam
Bird AM9
Canyon Spectral 160 (also available in 27.5 still)
(any other current "Trail" which will probably completely meet my needs).

I probably need to start by deciding how much bike I want.

My T130 has killed it's shock & the frame looks out of alignment (I have another thread for that) but I'm hopeful I can get that useable again to see me in to the summer.

Consider a Norco Optic or Sight if you can find one. My Sight A1 is the bike that convinced me 29ers can be fun to ride. I'd have to take up slopestyle or something to justify smaller wheels now.

Might have already been mentioned as I've not read the first page but Starling have the Swoop for a full 650b enduro bike.

@phil5556

I had a Bird Aeris 145LT which is essentially the same as an AM160. I think the 160 perhaps had more rear mud clearance but not too much else.

With an air shock it was reasonably lively for a longer travel bike, but on more roller / berm style flat terrain it was a bit harder work. I had the M/L though which I’d say was always a touch long reach for me. A few of my pbs are still on that bike - although mostly they’re straight / fast rocky sections where the 170 fork / 160mm rear travel and long reach monster trucked over the lot. I prefer my 29er sentinel in pretty much every way.

I had the Aether 7 in M size straight after the 145 and loved it. At places like Antur you got more of a battering on the aether than on the Aeris - but it was more fun more of the time for me. I ran the aether with a 150mm Lyrik and a coil shock on the back and it was ace.

Consider a Norco Optic or Sight if you can find one. My Sight A1 is the bike that convinced me 29ers can be fun to ride. I’d have to take up slopestyle or something to justify smaller wheels now.

same, my Optic was my first 29er and i wouldnt dream of riding anything else now. The Optic absolutely rips. I love it. I have put the short travel ripper through all sorts (Megavalanche, Ard Rock, Southern Enduro Champs) and it just keeps on ticking.

I can sell you a Trek Fuel ex9.8, full carbon frame, carbon wheels, bars. Fox 36s. 150mm air shaft in it

Re Occams - See my recent NBD posts but - whether you consider it a plus or minus - even in LT it’s quite a supportive ride in general - it’s not a sofa level jumps and berms bike, it’s a trail bike. Having said that it’s exciting, has a sublime balance and when it does open up through compressions and off jumps it’s very comfortable and balanced, and turns in at speed with such a confidence and calmness it actually shocked me.

The reviews use the word “efficient” and “engaging” on the trials and for me it sums it up perfectly.

At the weekend I need to ride my race bike for specificity prior to an upcoming race, and I’m actually worried that a few weeks absorbing Occam based habits will mean I’m having a lie down in a forest floor at some point, before I adjust.

Buy Weeksy’s bike.

@Kryton57 nice little review cheers, I was watching your thread 🙂

Buy Weeksy’s bike.

I probably should but I’ve said no. It is on my eBay watch list though… 🤔

Well there’s a Bird Aether 7 ML frame winging (🙄) its way to me 🙂

If I don’t get on with it I’ll try something else, but I like the sound & look of it.

I’ll get my fork up to 150mm for it (and get some new stickers 😎)

I can see 27.5 forks being obsolete in a few years, or sliding into a new mullet bikes for kids market, bikes still available in 27.5 today will probably be mullet in their next incarnation.
There could be a market for more headtube extending lower headsets to make 27.5 forks usable on mullet frames, I can only find wolftooth doing zs56 extenders at the moment.

[img] [/img]

🙂

Can't fully build it yet until Whyte send me my frame back with some important bits still attached 🙁

I can see 27.5 forks being obsolete in a few years, or sliding into a new mullet bikes for kids market, bikes still available in 27.5 today will probably be mullet in their next incarnation.

Yeah it's definitely going that way, as I've found on from my recent search for bikes. Although if manufacturers really wanted to make 27 bikes they could presumably design them around a 29" fork with a 27.5 wheel, it's only about 15mm difference A2C isn't it?

The only times I’ve ridden 29ers properly have been e-bikes, so not a fair comparison.

The issue there is obviously they are ebikes which weigh a ton and built like brick sh..houses. The wheel size is lost in a handling comparison.

Well it’s Pretty much ready to go 🙂

Whyte still have my frame so I’ve borrowed my wife’s cranks & pedals (they’re sending me mine back while waiting to get the shock in stock) and it’s got mismatched brake levers.

I’ve ridden it up the street and it feels good 😁

The fork is now 150mm but it looks surprisingly long compared to when it was 130mm, I wonder if it’s just because the new damper and airshaft sit right at the top of the travel with no weight on the bike? My other thought was that Tredz sent me a 160mm air shaft - hopefully not!

Some quick pics 😎

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