Hogging? Absolutely not. I think I know when/how to safely get out of people's way.

GrahamS appears to be the only one that knows what they're doing here. It's all in the planning. If you are still gaining on the traffic and nobody is playing silly buggers behind you then it is best to just stay in the lane you're in as it cuts down on unnecessary maneouvres and therefore risk.

Also, if anyone wants any lessons you know where I am. It would give you a good excuse for a ride too.

GrahamS – How would you define 'when road ahead is clear'? Are you saying that if you can see another car on the inside lane regardless of how far ahead that may be then you will stay on the middle lane?

The Highway Code clearly states that in a car travelling at 70mph you should keep a distance of at least 75mtrs between your self and the vehicle in front. Therefore I would say that anything over 75mtrs between yourself and the next vehicle would be considered to be a clear road.

Have you got any other definition as to what a 'clear road' could be?

I knew a lad (used to work for us) who sat in the middle lane as it was safer (he could 'see' what was happening on both sides.

He also drove everywhere with his fog lights and main lights on. This was because drivers kept on pulling out of sideroads infront of him.

Ta-dah! The Troll appears.

Same lad- had a almost new Audi A4 convertible on HP. He couldnt afford to service or buy new tyres for the car so it was sat most of the time at home.

. Therefore I would say that anything over 75mtrs between yourself and the next vehicle would be considered to be a clear road.

You would?
The 75m is presumably set as the absolute bare minima rather than a desirable distance. So you class this absolute minima as clear road?

thats why i said 'anything OVER 75mtrs'

Like 76m?

Hora – I meant Trolling Zoo Fighter, not you.

I never drive my hairdresser's car in the middle lane – it's always parked on the pavement, on a pedestrian crossing, outside TanFastic whilst I nip in for a quick tan session.

😉

So if it was 76m would you pull in?

If they ever get round to bringing retesting in I'll be a millionaire.

What really gets my goat in medium motorway traffic is the drivers who think 'better jump into the fast lane now otherwise I'll be one carplace slower in getting to my destination'. So they shoe-horn their car into your safety space causing you to brake. You know they are going to do it as you've seen their poisturing/positioning upto this point through traffic but its still annoying watching them fling their car sideways quickly.

thats why i said 'anything OVER 75mtrs'

It was all going so well.

I was enjoying the gentle goading and mickey-taking, but to let this thread denegrate into mindless pedantry is just not on!

yep 76mtrs would be clear road. in the same manner as 70mph is within the speed limit whereas 71mph is braking the speed limit.

trolling zoo fighter – what is a clear road then?

Are you saying that if you can see another car on the inside lane regardless of how far ahead that may be then you will stay on the middle lane?

Possibly. Entirely depends on the context.

If I was obviously gaining on that car and the road behind me was clear then yeah, I would probably just stay out.

If there were cars behind me then I'd pull in if I thought I'd be in the inside lane for more than say roughly 20 seconds.

I definitely wouldn't pull in if I'd only be in the left hand lane for a "couple of seconds".

The Highway Code clearly states that in a car travelling at 70mph you should keep a distance of at least 75mtrs between your self and the vehicle in front.

Does it? That seems a little odd since the official stopping distance at 70mph is 96 metres.

Sure you don't want to go for those lessons? 😉

jim the saint – a clear road is a road with no cars on it. obvious really.

funniest- motorway down from Scotland, Sunday morning. 2 lanes closed two miles ahead so EVERYONE sits in one long queue for TWO MILES. Yes, filter upto the last 400m's say but why create the mother of all traffic jams?

mastiles_fanylion- Im thinking of buying the previous shape TT (1.8T) circa 2003 in dark grey. Not as flashy as yours but cheapy 😀

hora – let them do that. i really quite enjoy being able to go right to the front of that queue, past all the merge in turn signs, and watch the frustration building on the muppet drivers's faces.

in the same manner as 70mph is within the speed limit whereas 71mph is braking the speed limit.

One being safe and the other not?

What really annoys me is those idiots that pass me at speed in the outside lane, cut in like they'd like to take my front bumper off, pop briefly into the inside lane, then hop right back to the outside lane again…..
Its like they are trying to make a point or something…..
😉

As an aside – on recent frequent trips to Bristol and back I have noticed a correlation between (lack of) road manners / common sense and the presence of a 'Baby on Board' sign in the back – seems the sign is meant to be seen by other road users as another sort of indicator / special pass allowing the owner to move in and out of lanes / speed up and down at will and without warning…..

I think all of this argument stems from what one person (or group thereof) considers a clear road and another thinks is a sensible amount of space to warrant pulling in.

I would wager that the difference between the two won't be that marked really.

I can certainly understand what Graham S is saying – it is pointless swerving in and out of the inside lane at every possible opportunity. At the same time, if I could see a car half a mile up the road and clearly it was travelling at a sensible speed, I would pull back in and wait until I was right behind it before pulling back out to overtake.

Not as flashy as yours but cheap

Nice – I still like the look of the old shape ones. But then again, they match my perm and false eyelashes.

"The Highway Code clearly states that in a car travelling at 70mph you should keep a distance of at least 75mtrs between your self and the vehicle in front."

Does it? That seems a little odd since the official stopping distance at 70mph is 96 metres.
It actually suggests you should leave at least 62.5856m at 70mph 😉

Of course in reality those HC stopping distances are based on 2/3g deceleration under braking, and pretty much any modern car should be able to do better than that.

trolling zoo fighter – i presume you're a driving instructor. do a lot of your students fail due to undue hesitancy? do you really think the highway code defines a road as being clear when there are no cars on it at all?

Jim The Saint – Correct – none have failed on that. None have ever had a fault on a dual carriageway either.

Clear road – not a term I would ever use.

highway code states 75mtrs braking distance and suggests a thinking distance of 21mtrs. distance chevrons painted on motorways are painted at 75mtrs apart.

and your point is what?

distance chevrons painted on motorways are painted at 75mtrs apart.

Actually, no they're not. I'm not really sure why you think the braking distance is particularly important in terms of the gap you should leave either (compared to the thinking distance).

I think all of this argument stems from what one person (or group thereof) considers a clear road and another thinks is a sensible amount of space to warrant pulling in.

Quite possibly. How about expressing it in time instead? What is the minimum amount of time you'd bother pulling in for? I rarely bother pulling in if I'll be in for less than 20 seconds (unless of course some **** is driving up my exhaust).

I would pull back in and wait until I was right behind it before pulling back out to overtake.

But then you are too close surely?

It actually suggests you should leave at least 62.5856m at 70mph

Huh?

Official typical stopping distance says 96 metres or 315 feet here:
http://www.direct.gov.uk/prod_consum_dg/groups/dg_digitalassets/@dg/@en/documents/digitalasset/dg_070645.pdf

And Rule 126 says "The safe rule is never to get closer than the overall stopping distance (see Typical Stopping Distances)"

And Rule 126 says "The safe rule is never to get closer than the overall stopping distance (see Typical Stopping Distances)"

Is that all it says? 😉

my last comment was aimed at grahams.

what i was trying to illustrate is that the highways agency seem to suggest that 75mtrs is a safe distance to have between cars travelling at 70mph. so you could also surmise that a distance between cars in the middle lane and approaching cars in the left hand lane far exceeding a distance of 75mtrs could be seen as contravening the highway codes suggestion that you should occupy the left hand lane when the road is clear.

What is the minimum amount of time you'd bother pulling in for?

I don't think I could answer that – I think the decision changes constantly dependant on road conditions, overall traffic flow and speed, awareness of what other road users are doing around me.

Totally agree with Hora's comments on clowns pulling into the safe space I leave – especially when the traffic is slowing due to congestion and they are swerving from lane to lane to attempt to stay in the one magical lane that *isn't* congested.

what i was trying to illustrate is that the highways agency seem to suggest that 75mtrs is a safe distance to have between cars travelling at 70mph.

Actually, no they don't particularly.

a distance between cars in the middle lane and approaching cars in the left hand lane far exceeding a distance of 75mtrs

Define "far". More than 1m? More than 10m? Enough that this strange 75m figure which seems to be your mantra is basically irrelevant?

Is that all it says?

Ahhh.. I was wondering how you came up with such a precise figure.

jim the saint: I agree that 75m is an arbitrary and pretty generous stopping distance for cars which are travelling along in the same lane at the same speed.

But you can't just decree that as the blanket safe distance to pull in at, without first considering the relative speeds of the vehicles.

I was wondering how you came up with such a precise figure.

The silly precision was intended as a hint!

Regarding stopping distances, there's fair chance that in an 'inicident' of some kind on a motorway the objects in front of you won't stop dead in which case you'll have a damn site more than 75 metres to haul out the anchors **. Having said that it's impossible to legislate for the great and interesting variety the world offers (though the current govt would like to think otherwise) so I'm all for guidelines such as stopping distances – also because they stop traffic bunching so much which is probably (but I don't know this) one of the main sources of 'sheer weight of traffic' hold ups on the motorways.

** Of course something could come off a bridge, a foreign truck might pull out when you're in his blind spot, or stuff could fly over the central res in which case even mr cautious might have a lot less than 75 metres to play with.

So you can all screw your precise figures and just apply basic guidelines and common sense and there in lies the flaw in my argument….

I'm a lorry driver and they really pi$$ me off. I can only do 56mph it's shocking the amount of people who do less than that in the middle lane…

…and don't get me started on the idiots that enter the motorway at 45mph aaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh……………….