Why Join Islamic State?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/turkey/11706383/Turkey-planning-to-invade-Syria.html

turkey gearing up to go in.

there are probably many reasons why they attract people from around the world, local grievances, local politics…

If a kid who was born and raised in England of Pakistani parents goes to Syria to shoot at Lebanese people…which locality are we talking about?

I’ve posted this before, well worth watching 3 mins long. Shows a class being given in Luton to British Muslim women about the benefits of the caliphate.

In France (nr Grenoble) a man has been beheaded and Islamist flag been found at the scene

And there we have it, one 3 minute video pretty much destroys every article stating “it’s not Islam”. It is Islam, it’s pretty much a reversion to the type of Islam practiced during the Muslim conquests. It’s the ideology that is driving ISIS and the desire for conquest.

On the other hand there is the Tunisian builder who threw roof tiles at the beach gunman to stop him, because “as a Muslim” he felt it was the right thing to do.

^^ or rather because some nutter was shooting people. I’m sure his first thought was not “what would Allah do?”.

Im sure many of us would have done the same regardless of our belief in ancient books.

^^ or rather because some nutter was shooting people. I’m sure his first thought was not “what would Allah do?”.

Possibly, but helping and protecting guests in your home or country, even potentially at great risk to yourself is deeply ingrained in Islamic culture.

The true account made into the ‘Lone Survivor’ film is the perfect example of this – Afghan villagers took in a wounded US serviceman and protected him against heavily armed Taliban at a massive cost to themselves.

A bit like the Dutch, French, Germans and Norwegians who protected allied servicemen and Jews during the war. It’s called empathy or at best looking after your own agenda.

Not sure those villagers wanted either the US or the Taliban on their village green, but saw that the US was preferable to the Taliban….. Perhaps.

Not distracting from what the roof tile thrower did, just saying it is something any one of us would have done regardless of our “religion”.

A lot of them died protecting the guy, so it didn’t immediately serve their agenda.

Obviously, there are lots of brave, decent, non-religious folk out there, but I think that instinct is reinforced by a strong culture of hospitality in certain countries which is actively encouraged by their religion.

it is not Islam, it is an interpretation of Islam…

All Islam is an interpretation of Islam. All Christianity, too.

It’s one of the more pleasant interpretations, I guess.

It probably culturally pre-dates Islam, though – looking at the Lone Survivor stuff again, in this instance the code of honour/hospitality is apparently a Pashtun practice which preceded the arrival of Islam in the region.

^^ or rather because some nutter was shooting people. I’m sure his first thought was not “what would Allah do?”.

The point I’m making is not all Muslims are fundamentalists in the way Tom_W1987 is suggesting. There are reactionary nutters in all religions who will apply their own very rigid interpretations to religious writings to support their own agendas.

Eh… That bit in Lone survior with the firefight at the end was made up. The villagers did hide him and Taliban did try & take him from the villagers, but the village elder told them to get tae.

Was it? Lying Hollywood bastards.

The guy did have to flee with his family under threat of death, though. Did he ever get asylum in the US?

Of course not all Muslims are ****. Not all Christians are ****, but then again enough of them are that you end up with the likes of the IRA and the shootings in the States.

As I see it, religion is the problem. Being nice to people is easy either with or without religious texts, but it seems there are an awful lot of nasty things done on the basis of what these texts say.

Obviously you’ll get nasty people doing nasty things, but I bet you the incidents would be much more isolated and would affect fewer people.

I agree religion is the perfect instrument to set people against one another

but as is the case with the secular (former Iraqi generals?) leadership of IS, they are adept at using religion and sectarian/cultural/racial differences to enable their own quest for power

As I see it, religion is the problem.

It’s not religion itself, it’s the people. Religion is great, until you let people get involved, as some of them will be dicks, and some of them will end up in positions of power, and then they will be dicks with power.

Then bad stuff happens.

If religion didn’t exist, humans would need to find ways to justify the nastiness and encourage the goodness. And I have no doubt they would find them.

The fact that religion, tribal codes and superstition sprung up independently in virtually every part of the globe supports this. It also supports the contention that it is a pile of tosh, naturally.

Much of Western Europe has replaced religion pretty much with a series of unwritten and written codes of moral conduct backed up with a legal system, which increasingly gets involves in even pretty mild instances of poor behaviour. But that’s really only happened because the idea of a deity has got a lot less plausible as a means of societal control.

We’re still bombing the shit out of innocent people, finding ways to justify it, so who needs a god?

so time for the west/saudi to ally with Hamas?

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/jun/30/islamic-state-threatens-hamas-gaza-strip

^^ or rather because some nutter was shooting people. I’m sure his first thought was not “what would Allah do?”.

Im sure many of us would have done the same regardless of our belief in ancient books.

what about the hotel staff who formed a human shield to protect more tourists from getting killed?

i agree that its simply not a case of “what would Allah do” but a case of doing the right thing…but more often than not we are seeing more vilification of Islam when thing like this happen.
the media is very quick in identifying them by their religion first…the same didnt happen when Anders Brevik went on his rampage, neither did religion come up when reporting on the recent US shootings…had it been a muslim involved though it would have been all over the media that bad people are muslims.

Anders Brevik is an evil nut job who happens to be christian, the guy who killed those churchgoers was the same. the guy who carried out the shooting in tunisia was also an evil nutcase who happened to be muslim.

bad people will do bad things, regardless of their religion.
its just that religion gives them a convenient justification for their evil actions.
by the same token good people will do good things regardless of their religion, however this can be reinforced by their religious upbringing and knowledge whch encourages such good behaviour

bad people will do bad things, regardless of their religion.
its just that religion gives them a convenient justification for their evil actions.
by the same token good people will do good things regardless of their religion, however this can be reinforced by their religious upbringing and knowledge whch encourages such good behaviour

Spot on.

On the other hand, I’d join so long as their website forum was free of obtrusive pop up ads.

Some things are deal-breakers.

Spot on.

On the other hand, I’d join so long as their website forum was free of obtrusive pop up ads.

Some things are deal-breakers.

you get a free bandana (ISIS Buff) and a sticker

I really wish people would stop talking about all of this in terms of religion. It just detracts for the real issues.

I really wish people would stop talking about all of this in terms of religion. It just detracts for the real issues.

people talk about it terms of religion because its being spoon fed to them by the media and government.
just look at the comparison between a crime committed by a muslim and a non-muslim. 9 times out of 10 when its reported in the media the word muslim will be inserted first, whereas for a non-muslim there is no reference to their religion.
this is a systematic vilification of an entire religion based on the actions of a twisted minority

we need more people like this lady…

Lets see:

[list][*]wears black

[/*][*]big beard (male)[/*][/list]

Obviously rides a fixie and is into coffee in a BIIIIG way. Freaking hipsters get everywhere!

http://moroccantimes.com/2014/07/6414/nsa-documents-reveal-isis-leaderabu-bakr-al-baghdadi-trained-israeli-mossad

http://topinfopost.com/2014/08/08/isis-leader-al-baghdadi-is-a-jewish-mossad-agent-french-reports

Apparently we may be offering a free 1 way ticket soon:

Britain should lay on charter flights to take wannabe British jihadists to Syria so they don’t fester here, a former counter-terrorism police chief has suggested.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/terrorism-in-the-uk/11722736/77-anniversary-Britain-should-charter-flight-to-take-wannabe-jihadists-to-Syria-says-former-counter-terror-chief.html

Just need to arrange for the plane to run out of fuel somewhere over the Atlantic….

🙂

The fact that religion, tribal codes and superstition sprung up independently in virtually every part of the globe supports this. It also supports the contention that it is a pile of tosh, naturally.

Does it? Couldn’t it point to genetic memory?

Surely if you repeat an experiment multiple times in complete isolation and get the same result that doesn’t mean that all the results are wrong does it? As surely thats the complete opposite of how results are normally assessed!

Well, I wouldn’t join. I don’t like the taste of their gels.

Its a very serious issue and at times like this I often find it best to ask what would Tony Blair do. Its at this point I reach for a lump hammer and smack myself.

often find it best to ask what would Tony Blair do.

mention God and then invade a foreign country, preferable one full of Arabs?

When did Tony Blair become a Knight of Malta anyhoo?

These religious types don’t half get around…