How can a Canyon bike with Ultegra be about 200 quid cheaper than other brands? Is it just by taking out the middle man? And also, is this road bike by them any good? The Ultimate CF SL 9.0

What do people make of their bikes in general? I don’t think I’m a huge fan of their looks but I’m trying to convince myself I like them!

They are excellent bikes.

They cut out the distributor and the retailer.

Bike is sold by manufacturer to importer for £500
It’s sold by importer to bike shop for £650
Its sold by bike shop to you for £1000
Canyon miss out the importer and lbs.
Even the likes of giant/trek/specialized who run their own uk distribution still have large premises and staff (rep,marketing,warranty,management) to pay for.And they have to do it in every territory.

Canyon must have higher customer service overheads than traditional brands, but it seems obvious where the saving comes.

Who do you think is being exploited, out of interest?

Also it’s volume discounts on components….. Germany is a chuffing huge market in itself, would be interested to know their market share across Europe.

I’ve had two Canyon Strives, great bikes at half the price of the bigger brands with equivalent spec, some people even buy them for the bits and sell the frame on.

£200 difference doesn’t sound enough to be honest.
Assuming that the extra £200 buys you local service from a shop you like.

No middle men, no demo, no bike shop to fix issues, no setup it’s all cost cutting that means if you don’t want it you don’t need it

exploited

No ones being exploited?

ex·ploit

verb

past tense: exploited; past participle: exploited

/ik?sploit/

make full use of and derive benefit from (a resource).

“500 companies sprang up to exploit this new technology”

synonyms:

utilize, harness, use, make use of, turn/put to good use, make the most of, capitalize on, benefit from;

informalcash in on

“we should exploit this new technology”
use (a situation or person) in an unfair or selfish way.

“the company was exploiting a legal loophole”

benefit unfairly from the work of (someone), typically by overworking or underpaying them.

“making money does not always mean exploiting others”

synonyms:

take advantage of, abuse, impose on, treat unfairly, misuse, ill-treat;

They’ve just removed a few links from the distribution chain, a bit like On-One/Planet-X. The dowside is if it goes wrong you have to box it up and wait for it to go to germany and back, rather than just walk into your LBS.

Assuming that the extra £200 buys you local service from a shop you like

Depends what kind of ‘service’ you need/want, if somethings broke then there’s not much a shop can do other than send it back to the distributor, who might send it back to the manufacturer. Makes little difference whether you post it yourself to Canyon or the LBS posts it to the distributor. And minor stuff like setup they do do, and post the bikes out in some huge boxes with just the pedals to fit!

Where (IME) the direct sellers fall down is the inbetween stuff. I’m having some minor issues with a bike bike form a direct seller at the moment (headset won’t stay tight), and LBS might have been able to fix it (my guess it the headtube needs facing) but now it has to go back to the bike company for isnpection/repair.

who is being exploited…

these chaps, that’s who.

happy now?

No middle men, no demo, no bike shop to fix issues, no setup it’s all cost cutting that means if you don’t want it you don’t need it

+1. No one is being exploited.
Canyon works the same way that Bird, YT, Rose, Solid, On-one (sort of), and now Commencal operate.

is this road bike by them any good?

love mine, comfy, quick, light and great handling what not to like. 🙂

😆
😆 😆

Yep – no-ones getting exploited (Except maybe me) with the Bird/Canyon model. Infact, like Canyon as we assemble here in the UK (Canyon in DE) then arguably we cut out some of the possible exploitation as you might see it as there isn’t a generic bike assembly line somewhere in the far east that _could_ have some unsavory working conditions. Most bike co.s are based out of Taiwan, which has generally high standards of living and work environments across the board, whereas places like indonesia, china and Vietnam (where some brands are assembling) I am not so sure…. not saying its necessarily bad, just saying that our model (and Canyons) actually closes the loop a little more, with a tighter, more defined supply chain, likely raising the bar a little.

Same business model as YT. I purchased a tues pro recently and with the exchange rate it came to 2.5k. I am going to strip and sell my older dh bike and I don’t think il be too far off 2.5k.

Where (IME) the direct sellers fall down is the inbetween stuff. I’m having some minor issues with a bike bike form a direct seller at the moment (headset won’t stay tight), and LBS might have been able to fix it (my guess it the headtube needs facing) but now it has to go back to the bike company for isnpection/repair.

Not always. We pay your LBS to fix a bird if it goes wrong. Doesnt happen often but when it has we’ve been able to turn around forks/reverb replacements in under a week from report to fixed and back out on the trails. Your LBS would no doubt wait a week just to get an answer back from the manufacturer. Sometimes being direct will speed this kind of thing up not slow it down.

Same business model as YT. I purchased a tues pro recently and with the exchange rate it came to 2.5k. I am going to strip and sell my older dh bike and I don’t think il be too far off 2.5k.

YT is slightly different as they manufacture in the ‘traditional way’ using Taiwan/wherever agents that produce the bike completely and box it up I believe. The net result meaning a little less flexibility in what and when you can launch, how many models you run etc. Hence why a Canyon (or indeed Bird) can run 7/8/9 fairly tightly priced lines on any given model where as YT has say 3. Its not necessarily a good or bad thing, just a thing.

Guard against the assumption that a higher means less exploitation. Very little of the purchase price actually gets through to the end of the chain, if the price is higher then more gets skimmed off beforehand.

Its stopping someone from making a large cut out of the supply chain.

Having hated a few bikes that people rave about I couldn’t buy again without testing so that rules direct sales out for me however tempting the deals are.

OP, yes that is a very good bike. Got mine last summer and love it.
Watch the online size calculator though. Put my measurements in and it came back with a small. At 175cm this surprised me, so I compared it with my previous bike I knew fitted and others I’d been looking at and had tried for size. Went for the medium in the end and very glad I did.
Also, get the vcls seatpost upgrade and make sure you order a spare mech hanger as well just in case.

chestrockwell – Member

Having hated a few bikes that people rave about I couldn’t buy again without testing so that rules direct sales out for me however tempting the deals are.
Yes, this for me too. Thankfully Bird were really helpful in this regard.
OTOH I had no chance of getting a ride on a Canyon or a Codeine. There is now a correct-size Capra in my riding group though, so it can all come down to things like this.
I don’t know whether I would be as fussy with road bikes or not. I was glad I tested the Croix De Fer though as it definitely wasn’t for me.

AlexSimon – Member

Assuming that the extra £200 buys you local service from a shop you like.

Don’t disagree with the point but I’ve never had £200 worth of local service for a bike, never likely to need or want it. YMMV of course.

Well as long as they’re not being assembled by a 6 year old kid in a factory in India or something like that 😀 . Joking aside, I’d like to be sure all staff workers involved are getting paid a fair wage. But if they are cutting costs by only leaving out the middle man and lbs, then there’s probably more chance they are all in good working conditions etc. Don’t have the conscience to buy a bike if workers involved are getting a crap wage…. same reason I’m wary of buying super cheap clothes.

How can a Canyon bike with Ultegra be about 200 quid cheaper than other brands?

Looks at Rose Bikes for similar prices.

They buy bulk, build them up in house and sell them direct.

Don’t have the conscience to buy a bike if workers involved are getting a crap wage

Don’t buy from an lbs then!! 😀

Well as long as they’re not being assembled by a 6 year old kid in a factory in India or something like that .

I don’t know if they are or not, but if they are then likely the other bike for another two thousand quid is assembled in the same place at the same labour cost.

Don’t buy from an lbs then!!

Touche!

Northwind – Member
Don’t disagree with the point but I’ve never had £200 worth of local service for a bike, never likely to need or want it. YMMV of course.

I definitely have from Tim at Sideways Cycles.
I haven’t from any others though.

Don’t buy from an lbs then!!

Good point, well made.

I’d buy a Canyon. No other brand can get close to their offering in terms of value (and they’re by no means poor frames either).

AlexSimon – Member

I definitely have from Tim at Sideways Cycles.
I haven’t from any others though.

Hmm, I don’t think I explained myself well. It’s not a knock on LBSs, it’s just that for big issues you’ve still got Canyon as support (and most warranty jobs will go back to the manufacturer regardless) and for little issues I’ll do it myself. And £200 saving will go a long way in shop labour for anything else.

I’ve had way more than £200 worth of service from LBSs! But almost none of it the sort of thing you get for buying a new bike.

It’s more like £2,000 for high-end MTBs though, tbh.

For me, the downside is a perhaps a lack of demo bikes. Besides that, I’d happily buy a Canyon et al.

Having people like Benpinnik (helpfully) stick their nose into a forum gives me a massive confidence boost. He may be a faceless STW’er, but it still gives me a feeling I’d be able to get in contact with a company or their rep. quickly and get an issue sorted.

I’ve seen the hassle and turn around time it took to get a Giant (rear dropouts were both bent) replaced. It was bought through an LBS. A current model. It still needed to be re-boxed, sent to someone, checked out, apology email sent, replacement sent out…. probably took no longer than an issue with a bought-direct bike.

I know I’ll be looking at Rose or Canyon when I’m next splashing the cash.

Obviously, god does kill a kitten every time you buy something without going to your LBS, but eff the furry wee shites!

I’d buy a Canyon. No other brand can get close to their offering in terms of value (and they’re by no means poor frames either).

TBH- I had a go on STW’er Scapegoats and within 10metres of swinging a leg over it I’d gone off a 2-3foot ledge without even thinking about it.

**** ugly looking thing though and I like my bikes purr-retty 8)

**** ugly looking thing though and I like my bikes purr-retty

Not much wrong with those IMO.
Consider the competition;

Germany is a chuffing huge market in itself, would be interested to know their market share across Europe.

I think it’s Europe’s biggest bike market

I’d buy a Canyon. No other brand can get close to their offering in terms of value (and they’re by no means poor frames either).

Except Rose and the other brands mentioned on the thread 😉

**** ugly looking thing though and I like my bikes purr-retty

Purr-retty? That brown bike and the hideous yellow and black paint job? Beauty is indeed, in the eye of the beholder!

Except Rose and the other brands mentioned on the thread

I don’t think they can, or at least don’t.
I can’t see a rose (or any others) with a bike equipped with fox/reverb/XT/SLX/DT Swiss for £1700.