UK Election!

Just wondering about those EU results…..

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/european-election-how-eu-says-russia-is-spreading-disinformation-2024-06-03/

^^ Theres no doubt there has been Russian meddling and on a macro level, including AI and China, democracy itself is in for a hard time.

Autocratic regimes are going to be able to handle this new age nore effectively and far better placed to exploit it.

Well the UK party that the Russians bankrolled for years appears to be about to be wiped out.

^^ Theres no doubt there has been Russian meddling and on a macro level, including AI and China, democracy itself is in for a hard time.

Autocratic regimes are going to be able to handle this new age nore effectively and far better placed to exploit it.

Theres also the perfect storm in terms of scheduling – much of the the worlds election cycles have aligned in 2024.  3/4s of the world’s democracies go to the polls this year. With elections coming so think and fast theres going to be so much misinformation and so little time to spot, address and reflect on it.

Well the UK party that the Russians bankrolled for years appears to be about to be wiped out.

Its served its purpose

Looking at the damage they’ve done, it represents  value-for-money Putin could barely have dreamt of

Front page of The Times ‘Time for the tories to embrace farage’ says braverman.

binners
Full Member
Looking at the damage they’ve done, it represents value-for-money Putin could barely have dreamt of

… and Brexit is far from done with us yet.

About the only positive of Brexit is that its mostly killed off the Leave argument even amongst the far right in the EU. They are pushing for reform now rather than leaving. Still problematic of course and not much consolation for the UK!

Farage and his coterie must be laughing like a drain at an endorsement from Braverman, Lewis Carroll couldn’t have done better.

Keir Starmer taking his lead from Sunak’s interaction whilst out campaigning when he was questioned by doctor a few days ago

Extract of interaction below in case Twitter link doesn’t work

This is the most disgusting thing I have ever seen from a political figure. A young girl described having to bundle blankets and wear a jumpsuit to bed because her family can’t afford the heating or “treats” anymore, and Keir Starmer laughed and said his son loves his onesie.

This is the most disgusting thing I have ever seen from a political figure.

A young girl described having to bundle blankets and wear a jumpsuit to bed because her family can't afford the heating or "treats" anymore, and Keir Starmer laughed and said his son loves his onesie. pic.twitter.com/hjZL0BoVqI

— Eyup Lovely (@eyuplovely) June 9, 2024

Richard Holden needs to pray he loses. Otherwise he’s going to be known forever as Billericay Dickie.

BillMC
Full Member
Farage and his coterie must be laughing like a drain at an endorsement from Braverman, Lewis Carroll couldn’t have done better.

The Tory party hollowed out from within by Brexit and on the verge of entirely being consumed by the Brexit cancer.

Front page of The Times ‘Time for the tories to embrace farage’ says braverman.

The Tory party doesn’t really exist any more, does it? The whole entity is just Nigel Farages gimp

Neil – the better reference is ‘Tricky Dicky’ by Ian Dury…

somafunk, we’re sleeping under extra blankets and in fleeces… in June… [ this weather is nuts ] … and do all winter… before, not just because of, the heating price jump.

If that really is the most disgusting thing that poster has ever seen a political figure do… they live in a different country to me. Awkward? For sure.

It’s not conspiring to have a journalist beaten up.

It’s not making someone you had an affair with a minister (or a shadow minister).

It’s not giving honours to your team and backers after leaving the office of PM, having throughly dishonoured it, with their help.

It’s an in moment failed attempt to connect.

Keir Starmer taking his lead from Sunak’s interaction whilst out campaigning when he was questioned by doctor a few days ago

Got to be honest, I looked at that and looked at the GP one and don’t see a huge lot of equivalence. I think the commentator is clutching at straws trying to stick one on Starmer and I know you don’t like him either and think you’re doing the same.

I wasn’t even that convinced by the GP one, it wasn’t Sunak, it was one of his hired placard carriers that actually made the comment.

Also did a bit of fact checking and the clip’s nearly a year old. And check the other output of the commentator….. I think you’d do well to distance yourself from that Somafunk

Also did a bit of fact checking and the clip’s nearly a year old. And check the other output of the commentator….. I think you’d do well to distance yourself from that Somafunk

I don’t follow them, it came up in a Reddit UK election thread, I hadn’t seen it before so I searched for the initial clip but couldn’t find it so thought it was a recent video. It turns out it’s part of a ITN video that wasn’t used (as far as I can find out in 5 mins of highly detailed and thorough research)

Interesting news from France. Seems Europe is in for a tough time.

Hope mental politics can soon calm down and become boring again.

j4mie
Free Member
Interesting news from France. Seems Europe is in for a tough time.

Hope mental politics can soon calm down and become boring again.

I think we are in an age of absolutism so I’m not optimistic.

At a UK level I hope the insanity subsides a bit though.

Also did a bit of fact checking and the clip’s nearly a year old.

Ok but is it out of context?

Afterall Sunaks defence about the d-day screwup was that it wasnt due to the itv interview he left early to attend but rather it was several months in advance he couldnt be bothered.

@susepic from Friday- apologies for not responding before now; it was nothing other than my personal view that a ‘seven way debate’ would turn into a shouting match.

Anything which allows for an meaningful interrogation of policies being promoted by any political party is to be welcomed.

If any of the debates produce more light than heat, that’s to be applauded.

I continue to leaflet and canvas; the countdown is on.

If any of you are not involved, please do get involved with your party of choice; mine is Labour so…donate, promote labour n your socials, deliver leaflets, talk to people on the doorstep.

There are loads of online resources available; if that’s too much of a faff, contact your local campaign team who will welcome you.

Pleae don’t do nothing; be active.

@dissonance

Ok but is it out of context?

Yes, very much so, there is a very good reason that clip wasn’t all over the news at the time and only occasionally appears online.

In that video of Starmer, context is absolutely everything here, full clip:

https://www.gettyimages.co.uk/detail/video/sir-keir-starmer-visits-worthing-england-west-sussex-news-footage/1661425045

If anyone watches that from the start and then, genuinely, thinks Starmer is trying to belittle the kid or her parents then I’d be very surprised.

It’s a short clip from a longer discussion and rather than belittling the kid’s concerns he’s actually trying to bring her into the conversation he’s discussing with the parents/ adults.

Pleae don’t do nothing; be active.

What metrics have you got that what you are doing is working against any larger things going on that sway voters (social and traditional media, TV coverage) and even smaller things (talking to friends).

How many people do you leave the door of with them categorically stating they are now voting Labour instead of xxxxx because you have convinced them?

How many people do you leave the door of with them categorically stating they are now voting Labour instead of xxxxx because you have convinced them?

In our local mayoral election a huge amount of people round our way voted for the Tory because he was the only candidate who visited the villages here, put up social media clips of it, had a team door knocking, had a team responding to questions on the social media.

Literally the only candidate who made an effort to attract our votes. Didn’t even know the name of the other candidates.

Perception is everything. He still lost overall.

Ok but is it out of context?

It’s difficult to say given the commentator ‘Eyup Lovely’ (never their real persona is it? ‘Verified new left journalist, joined April 24’) has snipped about 1/20th of the interview but as Poopscoop has noted, when in context of the whole discussion, and from a year ago, it’s quite different

Afterall Sunaks defence about the d-day screwup was that it wasnt due to the itv interview he left early to attend but rather it was several months in advance he couldnt be bothered.

The commentator, and on here, aren’t trying to compare the clip to Sunak leaving D-Day early. “Keir Starmer taking his lead from Sunak’s interaction whilst out campaigning when he was questioned by doctor a few days ago”

Starmer haters gonna hate which is fine, but don’t spread misinformation.

@kerley I don’t even think it’s as much as convincing people. The Tories’ ground game is notoriously bad even before they pissed off all their potential canvassers, and in a lot of places (like here, I think) a leaflet and someone knocking on the door is more engagement that people have had in years. The first step is convincing potentially voters that someone might be listening to them.

@morecashthandash I’m not saying it’s 100% reliable (and people will still vote based on other factors) but I suspect he did better than he would have done without door knocking, especially of other parties weren’t bothering.

@morecashthandash I’m not saying it’s 100% reliable (and people will still vote based on other factors) but I suspect he did better than he would have done without door knocking, especially of other parties weren’t bothering.

Oh yes, I was trying to support the use of door knocking, apologies if it didn’t come across. It’s Monday.

Looking at the damage they’ve done, it represents  value-for-money Putin could barely have dreamt of

Absolutely . Who needs next generation fighter aircraft when you can easily meddle in the internal politics of the west – whatever that means?

A few years ago I saw a report on Syria that postulated at the end “we still don’t know what Russia wants in Syria”. I thought at the time it was an odd thing to say. It revealed a bias towards the west, quite reasonably, wanting an end to the conflict and some kind of resolution. But it completely misunderstood Putin. He’s all about constant destabilisation that allows nationalist-populists to sow fear in western Europe.

Putin got (and continues to get) exactly what he wants out of Syria – a constant flow of Muslim, brown-skinned refugees into western Europe where they can then be pointed at by the far right as an easy target and used to sow fear.

The UK has proven to be incredibly good value for money for him.

Do we think Sunak will surface today?

Or will he now be kept hidden away apart from very select, stage managed events?

Also bonkers that both Tory party chairman & Scots Tory leaders can’t do interviews because of their banana republic style seat selections

Putin got (and continues to get) exactly what he wants out of Syria – a constant flow of Muslim, brown-skinned refugees into western Europe where they can then be pointed at by the far right as an easy target and used to sow fear.

Well an interesting  theory – Putin is deliberately forcing brown skinned into western Europe to do a favour to the far right. It’s not one that I have heard before.

Syrians aren’t very brown though and why doesn’t he care about eastern Europe?

Russia’s use of borders in Eastern Europe to stoke social and political unrest around immigration issues are well documented.

I think it’s more realistic that Putin is just funding (directly or indirectly) disruptive politicians across democratic countries (currently this is the far right, but if the right we’re in power it would be the far left I think) and also funding bot farms to flood social media with disruptive messaging.

The Syria theory is a bit far fetched.

Russia’s use of borders in Eastern Europe to stoke social and political unrest around immigration issues are well documented.

Ah, so he does care about eastern Europe!

Syrians aren’t very brown though

Nor were the people on Farage’s Breaking Point poster.

Brown enough, though.

a constant flow of Muslim, brown-skinned refugees into western Europe

As theories go, it’s a erm..wild one. Given that Russia’s long standing, very successful – and cheap use of bot farms to stoke the culture war on line and beyond, that has worked probably beyond their wildest hopes, the use of the City to launder cash, their stock piles of cheap gas, to bribe German industry and politicians, and up until very recently an open door to Boris Johnson’s house, it seems a bit far fetched to me at least that they’d go to that sort of lengths when they have cheaper and more successful models to choose from.

Brown enough, though.

Yeah but if the reason that the Russians are Syria is to force brown people into western Europe, as you claim, surely they could have found a country with browner people?

Btw your claim that the UK has proven to be incredibly good value for money for Putin is quite insulting to Keir Starmer. Was keeping Corbyn out of Number 10 also part of Putin’s plan?

As theories go, it’s a erm..wild one. Given that Russia’s long standing, very successful – and cheap use of bot farms to stoke the culture war on line and beyond, that has worked probably beyond their wildest hopes, the use of the City to launder cash, their stock piles of cheap gas, to bribe German industry and politicians, and up until very recently an open door to Boris Johnson’s house, it seems a bit far fetched to me at least that they’d go to that sort of lengths when they have cheaper and more successful models to choose from.

It is the single biggest issue behind the growth of the AfD in the 2010s/2020s – that is a view I share with the majority of political analysts as far as I know.

I saw that Ursula von der Leyen made yesterday what amounted to a victory speech in English. From rostrum the she individually thanked colleagues in English.

It seemed rather bizarre considering that no EU member state has English as its official language.

Von der Leyen strengthens reappointment bid as right-wing triumphs in elections

that is a view I share with the majority of political analysts as far as I know.

It’s the first time I’ve heard that theory. Have you got a link to a political analyst who claims that Russians are in Syria because Putin wants to help the far right in western Europe?