UK Election!

“A party that has room for Elphicke but not for Abbott doesn’t have room for me either.”

Me neither, I shan’t be voting Labour whilst Starmer is leader. I do wonder where we would be if Rebecca Long-Bailey had won the leadership contest.

I do wonder where we would be if Rebecca Long-Bailey had won the leadership contest.

Looking forward to another Tory majority, no doubt

“A party that has room for Elphicke but not for Abbott doesn’t have room for me either.”

Is DA being kicked out of the party then?

do wonder where we would be if Rebecca Long-Bailey had won the leadership contest.

Lagging about 10pts behind the tories I expect

Me neither, I shan’t be voting Labour whilst Starmer is leader.

So, I’ll ask again….would you rather have another 5 years of the Tories than hold your nose and vote for a less than perfect Labour party?

Ernie, it’s tiresome reading many of your posts which attempt to denigrate and/or imply a sense of superiority

I can’t for the life of me figure out why you read them then – can you explain?

I suspect that what you are really trying to say is that you find it tiresome to see me posting opinions which you don’t agree with and other people might possibly read.

Btw you I’m loving your “imply a sense of superiority” comment after you inform everyone on here that all the media, all the political pundits, and all the Labour MPs giving interviews, are all wrong to treat Diane Abbott mismanaged mess as  important.

You personally have apparently decided that it not something which has any importance because it won’t be in the news forever – eventually, you inform us, it will “blow over”.

I am sure that Keir Starmer is hoping that it will blow over very quickly, presumably you also hope so for the same reasons. And why you want to derail the discussion by descending into personal bickering.

Let’s get back to discussing the current main election campaign issue.

“do wonder where we would be if Rebecca Long-Bailey had won the leadership contest.

Lagging about 10pts behind the tories I expect”

Possibly, but what difference does it make when you can’t see any difference between the two parties?

What change have Labour promised from the current rabble?

So, I’ll ask again….would you rather have another 5 years of the Tories than hold your nose and vote for a less than perfect Labour party?

This, with a thousand plus’s!

I’m an SNP Member but if Labour were likely in my constituency to beat the incumbent Tory I’d be voting Labour.

The Tories must be laughing their tits off.

Hunt with the silent ‘C’ had a dig right at the end of his interview* on the Today programme. I don’t know the significance of that, TBH. The whole drama is viewed by the Tories as a gift – whether anyone else gives a shit – well, we’ll find out on July 4th. Abbott isn’t going to take one for the team**, by the sounds of it, though. 🙄

Elphicke is also a gift to the Tories. I just hope none of this is significant out there in the real world.

*’Interview’ is being very generous.

**’The Team’ in this instance being the 99.9% of the 67m people in this country who need the Tories gone.

“Me neither, I shan’t be voting Labour whilst Starmer is leader.

So, I’ll ask again….would you rather have another 5 years of the Tories than hold your nose and vote for a less than perfect Labour party?”

I have no preference. This “less than perfect Labour party” are near indistinguishable from the Conservatives.

I have no preference. This “less than perfect Labour party” are near indistinguishable from the Conservatives.

Apologies if I missed it in this thread, “However, over the bank holiday weekend both the Conservatives and Labour pledged to introduce “dangerous cycling” laws if they are elected, suggesting legislation will be resumed following this summer’s election.” https://road.cc/content/news/labour-and-conservatives-pledge-dangerous-cycling-law-308553

What a Labour canvasser in Hackney North and Stoke Newington might find according to the Guardian:

‘I feel sick’: fury in Diane Abbott’s constituency at treatment of their MP

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/article/2024/may/29/fury-in-diane-abbott-constituency-at-treatment-of-their-mp

Although I don’t know how they might go about canvassing at the moment….”Good evening, I am canvassing on behalf of someone who has yet to be personally chosen by Sir Keir Starmer to be the Labour candidate, can we count on your support? They will do a great job, whoever they are”.

Apologies if I missed it in this thread, “However, over the bank holiday weekend both the Conservatives and Labour pledged to introduce “dangerous cycling” laws if they are elected, suggesting legislation will be resumed following this summer’s election.”

Yeah, but Labour will do it competently…

At the end of the day, who gives a flying **** whether Diane Abbot or Magic Grandad is a Labour MP or an independent MP or voted out and gets an allotment to keep them busy.

People who don’t want to be governed by a deeply racist party ?

Meanwhile Luke Akehurst, Israeli lobbyist, has been parachuted into a safe seat in Durham.

This “less than perfect Labour party” are near indistinguishable from the Conservatives.

I still hold out hope that although they won’t change very much or make stuff noticeably better for the people who need it they won’t be such a vindictive bunch of arseholes.  As that is my only realistic hope it says it all doesn’t it.

“A party that has room for Elphicke but not for Abbott doesn’t have room for me either.”

They are both members of the Parliamentary Labour Party. The question is now whether they will be allowed to stand as candidates in the election. I doubt Labour will let Elphicke stand. Who knows what on earth they are doing with Abbott.

Looking forward to another Tory majority, no doubt

Lagging about 10pts behind the tories I expect

I love the suggestion that Liz Truss’s and Rishi Sunak’s premierships would have been hugely popular if it wasn’t for Keir Starmer.

Him alone, apparently, made first Liz Truss deeply unpopular with voters and then he pulled the same trick when Rishi Sunak became PM.

Starmer seems to have almost super powers.

@timba Evidence-based policy it is not, unless Lab are going to do it as part of a general review of roads offences. There was some stuff about making our streets safer but no detail, and I’d really like to know what their plans for ATE’s budget are.

I think Elphicke says she’s standing down and it seems although DA has been allowed back into the party she’s being deselected so is considering standing as an independent (whereupon I suppose she’ll be expelled from the party). Starmer’s doing a great job keeping all this in the news and his Israeli computer man is pretty whizz at tracking people’s ‘likes’ on X. Wowzers.

MPs in their 70s going for another 5 years isn’t a great thing, surely they have some protege who could take over the challenges.

Age and experience can be useful features in an MP – especially a back bench mp who is likely to give their own party a hard time!

she’s 70.  The oldest Tory is 79 and planning to stand again.  Tony Benn was 75 when he stepped down, Tam Dayell was 72 or 73.  Ken Clarke was 78.

She would make a good Lord, regardless of whether you like her politics or not.

I love the suggestion that Liz Truss’s and Rishi Sunak’s premierships would have been hugely popular if it wasn’t for Keir Starmer.

To be fair a lot of those currently shouting “if you dont vote for the glorious leader its a vote for the tories” would have been dedicating themselves to helping out the tories.

So I guess it is possible.

Age and experience can be useful features in an MP – especially a back bench mp who is likely to give their own party a hard time!

she’s 70.  The oldest Tory is 79 and planning to stand again.  Tony Benn was 75 when he stepped down, Tam Dayell was 72 or 73.  Ken Clarke was 78.

She would make a good Lord, regardless of whether you like her politics or not.

But what has she done in her 40 years in Parliament, i’ve not really seen her noted as being a minister for anything, or leading on policies to be mentioned in the same breath as Tony Benn, or Ken Clarke, and also interesting that both Benn and Clarke were backbench non entities whilst in their 70s?

Just had to look up who Tam Dayell is, which kind of tells the story, same with Peter Bottomley, backbenchers who do nothing of real note, you’ve basically named people who didn’t really do much in Parliament after they hit retirement age.

But what has she done in her 40 years in Parliament, i’ve not really seen her noted as being a minister for anything, or leading on policies to be mentioned in the same breath as Tony Benn, or Ken Clarke, and also interesting that both Benn and Clarke were backbench non entities whilst in their 70s?

A lot of that is to do with media reporting – as usual the only things media are interested in is clickbait, controversial views/topics and culture wars so an MP quietly getting on with the job of representing their constituents (often in fairly dull matters) is not really newsworthy.

As soon as one of them opens a can of G&T on the Underground though, they’re front page news for days…

Sums up the problem of election campaigning really. From both main parties, it’s just culture war, blame, accusation and argument. Nothing on policy (actual workable policy that affects day to day life, not Rwanda or Palestine), no vision, no aspiration.

A choice between:
Stick with us, the plan (which we’re not really going to explain to you) is working
or
We’re not as shit as the Tories but we’ve kind of got a lot of their policies because we think some might be popular

I have no preference. This “less than perfect Labour party” are near indistinguishable from the Conservatives.

Which is fair enough, I think there’s a few like yourself that will find themselves voting for “Brewster”, but you were probably of that mind already a year ago(?).

The remainder of this week will be interesting now, as we’ll discover just how tolerant of lefty slapping the remaining core labour voters and those swing voters actually are.I’ll admit I did think this was one of those things SKS could roll straight on through, but it feels like a far more significant gaff now. 

The metaphor of choice for Starmer is someone carrying a Ming vase across a polished marble floor in their socks isn’t it, the handling of Diane Abbots case is currently a big slip, right now he’s teetering on the edge of getting stable again or tumbling on his arse.

This is all ammunition for the press and Lil’ Rishi in that first televised debate, and it all does the best thing possible for those opposed to him, chips away at image and character. Nevermind how many voters he’ll alienate.

The metaphor of choice for Starmer is someone carrying a Ming vase across a polished marble floor in their socks isn’t it, the handling of Diane Abbots case is currently a big slip, right now he’s teetering on the edge of getting stable again or tumbling on his arse.

Yup, the Diane Abbott issue is a huge distraction and a gift to the Tories. Starmer could however end it instantly by simply saying that of course the sitting MP for Hackney North and Stoke Newington will be the Labour candidate. That would pretty much be the end of the matter.

Although he really should not have that level of power in a democratic organisation, no one should.

All those old lefties wanging on about Diane Abbot again.

You do realise that this is a factional fight instigated by Starmer and labour rightwingers don’t you? And in the middle of an election campaign after a successful first week. The labour right would rather damage their campaign than pass up the opportunity to purge a few more lefties.

I’m not sure why you keep post that scotroutes they are an inherent part of our politics now

Starmer could however end it instantly by simply saying that of course the sitting MP for Hackney North and Stoke Newington will be the Labour candidate. That would pretty much be the end of the matter.

Not for everyone it wouldn’t…

Although he really should not have that level of power in a democratic organisation, no one should.

Let’s be fair, he does though. The timelines and press gossip suggests this was pretty much done with in December, DA apparently finished a mandated awareness course in February but the haggling point WRT restoration of the whip was her agreeing to deselection at the GE. It’s arguably more concerning if SKS wasn’t pulling some strings.

I understand the current leadership’s urge to break with the Corbyn legacy and marginalise anyone backed by momentum, but Diane Abbott was probably a step too far, I also think they thought there was more time. You’re right the most expedient route now, would be to allow her to run (it’s an almost guaranteed seat too) so they must really be keen for her not to be present in the next parliament…

Let’s be fair, he does though.

Absolutely he does, and he uses that undemocratic power to his full advantage.

Today Starmer organised the deselection another left-wing brown-skinned woman critical of Israel, whilst simultaneously had a white right-wing committed zionist man parachuted into a safe seat.

Faiza Shaheen :

https://labourlist.org/2024/05/chingford-faiza-shaheen-general-election-2024-labour/

Luke Akehurst :

https://www.webelieveinisrael.org.uk/our_team

And for clarity:

Luke Akehurst has been Director of We Believe in Israel since its foundation in 2011.

 

Luke is not Jewish but has been a committed Zionist all his life.

You’re right the most expedient route now, would be to allow her to run

Anyone dare/care to comment on the nature of the offence that got her suspended? You think she was right or making a valid point?

I’m not sure I can gather up enough **** to give one either way on her fate. I’ve always found her persona unlikable which made listening to or respecting what she actually had to say quite hard. She’s like one those people arguing on the same side as you in a conversation who manages to make even you question your own views because they do it in such a teeth itching way. I’m not sure her grumbling away on the backbenches would have done a lot of harm. The far more interesting element of the story is the lack of savvy Starmer has shown with the way he has handled her and the whole Elphicke shambles. When your political opposition has basically got the gun out of the drawer and inserted the muzzle in their own mouth and all you have to do is make as little noise as possible so as not to disturb them whilst they pull the trigger, you have to wonder how he managed it.

@kimbers

He thinks he is being clever,  a bit like the drunk old fella in a bar is best ignored

A party that has room for Elphicke but not for Abbott doesn’t have room for me either.

Agreed. They both have terrible political judgment and offensive views. Neither should be an MP by 5th July.

As soon as one of them opens a can of G&T on the Underground though, they’re front page news for days…

The person you are discussing is not well. The drinking alone on a commuter train; the difficulty dressing themselves; the confusion; the erratic and provocative behaviour; the shaking hands. They have endured appalling abuse and awful developments in their private life. It’s time for them to retire and have a less stressful job.

I’m not saying that just because I disagree with them politically. I do also think they should make way for being totally wrong on almost every issue, just like I do about Corbyn. But Corbyn by all appearances seems in perfect health, very vigorous, and is as sharp as he has always been. The same is not true for the other person.

Just had to look up who Tam Dayell is, which kind of tells the story

I think it might say more about you than Dalyell!

She would make a good Lord, regardless of whether you like her politics or not.

Weird comment – obviously people are entitled to disagree about whether a peer’s politics are sensible but you can’t pretend their politics are separate from their role as a legislator.

There is a weird meme that Lords are loveable, effective and apolitical reviewers of Commons legislation. I don’t think any of these things are true.

But what has she done in her 40 years in Parliament, i’ve not really seen her noted as being a minister for anything, or leading on policies to be mentioned in the same breath as Tony Benn, or Ken Clarke, and also interesting that both Benn and Clarke were backbench non entities whilst in their 70s?

Its interesting that you think the only way you get things done is by being a minister – on that basis once cabiner are appointed everyone else should go home.  She did server on many a commons committee (how stuff actually gets done in the commons) and was a shadow minister at various time. She’s been a thorn in the side of the labour party – and consistently re-elected presumably her local constituents think she is a reasonably decent MP.

Just had to look up who Tam Dayell is, which kind of tells the story, same with Peter Bottomley, backbenchers who do nothing of real note, you’ve basically named people who didn’t really do much in Parliament after they hit retirement age.

Tam Dalyell is the “author” of the West Lothian question – probably the most fundamental point (still unresolved) about the consequences of devolution on the UK “Constitution”.   I “knew” him as a columnist in the New Scientist in the 1990s where we was regularly found discussing government-science related issues.  But he made a career of being, not a minister or major post holder but rather being a particular pain in the arse who felt no need to tow the party line.  I’d put Benn, Clarke and Abbott in the same camp.  These type of MP who feel no need to do as they are told to follow a career path are hugely valuable to democracy.  He got thrown out the house for asking tricky questions about Blair’s dirty dossier.

I used Peter Bottomley as an example because he is the current oldest MP, and has said he will stand again.  He’s been around since the Thatcher years – not many of them left, consistently getting re-elected, again whilst he might have a safe seat he gets reselected and reelected so he’s doing something to please his constituents.  Thats what I want in a back bencher.

Yup, the Diane Abbott issue is a huge distraction and a gift to the Tories.

And quite frankly makes zero difference to 99.9% of us – stop being distracted you gullible idiots (or you DO want a Tory Govt).

If you’re happy for a Tory Govt, give us tips for how you’re going to afford, for example, to pay for private healthcare to cover ALL your needs please.

Oh, and IMO a vote for a Tory MP is a vote for continued corruption – they’re taxing you to give it to pals & backers, and you’re happy with this.  Or are you also on the make?

And quite frankly makes zero difference to 99.9% of us – stop being distracted you gullible idiots (or you DO want a Tory Govt

Well I think you will find the views of STWers makes a negligible difference to 100% of the population.

The people currently being distracted by the huge Starmer created cockup are the media, political pundits, and Labour politicians who are being asked awkward questions in TV and radio studios.

I used Peter Bottomley as an example because he is the current oldest MP, and has said he will stand again.  He’s been around since the Thatcher years – not many of them left, consistently getting re-elected, again whilst he might have a safe seat he gets reselected and reelected so he’s doing something to please his constituents.  Thats what I want in a back bencher.

wearing a blue tie seems to be the bar for getting voted in as a Tory MP round here…

stop being distracted you gullible idiots

Such a winning argument there.

(or you DO want a Tory Govt).

The question is vs what. Starmer was busy today welcoming a lifelong tory voter having spent yesterday purging the left. There was no mention of the tory having changed their political views but simply finding Starmers party now acceptable to them.

Twitter links aren’t loading/embedding at the minute but I imagine the delightful Luke Akehurst will not be standing for Labour, good, he’s a nasty little *****