UK Election!

BBC Headline

Diane Abbott says she’s been barred from standing as Labour MP at election

But in the article it says:

In a post on X, Ms Abbott said she was “delighted” to have been readmitted to the parliamentary party.

“I will be campaigning for a Labour victory,” she said.

“But I am very dismayed that numerous reports suggest I have been barred as a candidate.”

“Numerous reports suggesting” is not the same as “I have been barred”.

Starmer now says she’s not been barred but that’s not to say she’ll be selected. Strikes me there’s a lot of face-saving going on here. There’s good chance Corbyn will get elected, I’m sure Starmer doesn’t want a repeat of that in Hackney.

Fromm the BBC…

Earlier today, Abbott texted the BBC’s Joe Pike to say: “Although the whip has been restored, I am banned from standing as a Labour candidate”

Now, she’s written on X: “I am very dismayed that numerous reports suggest I have been barred as a candidate”

Her first comment suggests she hadn’t been told she couldn’t stand but had simply heard as much. Her second comment is a bit more measured and probably reflects the facts better.

God help us….

Sir Keir Starmer described the Welsh Government as providing a “blueprint for what what Labour can do across the UK”.

The Labour party’s UK leader spoke at Welsh Labour’s conference in Llandudno, the first in-person conference for two years but which has been largely dominated by developments in Ukraine.

Welsh Government as providing a “blueprint for what what Labour can do across the UK”.

Just inviting David TC Davies to start going all swivel eyed about 20mph limits and war on motorists.

Latest YouGov Westminster voting intention (27-28 May)

Con: 20% (-2 from 23-24 May)
Lab: 47% (+3)
Reform UK: 12% (-2)
Lib Dem: 9% (=)
Green: 7% (+1)
SNP: 3% (=)https://t.co/w6g5bmbt8K pic.twitter.com/XNmjxZViaJ

— YouGov (@YouGov) May 29, 2024

Meh.

Nothing will change really will it?  Labour are no more conjurers of the impossible than the Conservatives.

We’ll get what we deserve.

Oh yeah, people will be happy for a bit but it will make bugger all difference to our lives in any significant way.

Itll be a while before its fixed Labours 5 year target to get waiting lists down is at least a realistic timeframe

A long way to fix the damage of the last 14 years

That yougov poll is the first since Tories announced national service & quadruple lock, its not good for them at all an their under 50 numbers are bonkers

? NEW: YouGov's under-50 voting intention

Labour: 59%
Greens: 12%
Conservatives: 8%
Reform: 8%
Lib Dems: 6%

YouGov's over-50 voting intention

Labour: 36%
Conservatives: 30%
Reform: 15%
Lib Dems: 10%
Greens: 3%

— Politics UK (@PolitlcsUK) May 29, 2024

Starmer now says she’s not been barred but that’s not to say she’ll be selected. Strikes me there’s a lot of face-saving going on here. There’s good chance Corbyn will get elected, I’m sure Starmer doesn’t want a repeat of that in Hackney.

Sounds very pragmatic.

And even if they did both get in as independents, what difference would it make, they were both un-whipppable anyway.  All that changes is Starmer wouldn’t have to deal with Mail/Telegraph headlines “2 Labour MP’s rebel already over his 1st Kings Speech”.

broadly the same as STW

How do Mumsnet users feel about Rishi Sunak & Keir Starmer? We asked MumsGPT, our AI-powered question tool, to summarise the words Mumsnetters have used the most when talking about both leaders since the general election was called last week ? pic.twitter.com/Y34buQh34c

— Mumsnet (@MumsnetTowers) May 29, 2024

Hope Andrew Fienstein kicks Starmer in the nuts (figuratively, but literally would be acceptable) in Holborn/St Pancras and Diane Abbot stands as an independent in Hackney and wins, top it off with a Corbyn win in Islington and that’s about it for my Election wishes south of the border.

Surprised the C word didn’t show up, it is mumsnet after all and not some over sensitive forum where I cannot even say ****.

Hope Andrew Fienstein kicks Starmer in the nuts (figuratively, but literally would be acceptable) in Holborn/St Pancras

Abbot & Corbyn I could see winning as independents (Abbot especially)

seems absolutely bonkers to think Starmer wont win his own seat tho  https://ig.ft.com/uk-general-election/2024/projection/?constituency=E14001172

Interestingly Sunak is far more vulnerable

https://ig.ft.com/uk-general-election/2024/projection/?constituency=E14001444

its strange that none of the polls include this mysterious hard left mini-party which so many think is going to be a real thing.

short memories – whatever your personal thoughts on Corbyn’s Labour, the electorate demonstrated very very clearly that it was unelectable.
I doubt that would be any different in 2024.

Hope Andrew Fienstein kicks Starmer in the nuts (figuratively, but literally would be acceptable) in Holborn/St Pancras and Diane Abbot stands as an independent in Hackney and wins, top it off with a Corbyn win in Islington and that’s about it for my Election wishes south of the border.

I’m conflicted on Fienstein.

On the one hand I can see why protesting against Starmer is the logical thing to do if you want to influence Starmer and Labour.

On the other hand, why split the vote? Why not go upto Yorkshire and kick Sunaks nuts?

It’s opposition politics in a nut(kicking)shell. Would he rather be in opposition complaining about everything, or in government doing something but not everything he wants?

If in the unlikely event he wins, he doesn’t “win” anything.   We’d have a non-existent constitutional crisis, and Starmer would have to be elected in as an MP by having someone in a safe seat quit.  Technically he doesn’t even have to do that (you can be PM from the Lords), it’d just require a reimagining of how PMQ’s, statements to the house and liaison committees would work if he wasn’t an MP and 5 years of Mail/Torygraph/Murdoch headlines about it.

short memories – whatever your personal thoughts on Corbyn’s Labour, the electorate demonstrated very very clearly that it was unelectable.

Not as short as your memory.  Corbyn 262 seats, May 318 seats – hardly what I would call a very, very clear deomonstration that Corbyn’s Labour was unelectable.

short memories – whatever your personal thoughts on Corbyn’s Labour, the electorate demonstrated very very clearly that it was unelectable.

A concerted and organised media campaign throwing shit at him had a lot to do with it

On the other hand, why split the vote? Why not go upto Yorkshire and kick Sunaks nuts?

Given what Starmer is/stands for and how he’s an authoritarian arsehole I feel it’s entirely justifiable,

  Corbyn 262 seats, May 318 seats – hardly what I would call a very, very clear deomonstration that Corbyn’s Labour was unelectable.

Sorry.. which party was elected to govern the country?

Interestingly Sunak is far more vulnerable

If only we could persuade a few more to vote Reform.

If only we could persuade a few more to vote Reform.

more likely to convince Lib dem or Green voters to vote tactically.

Sorry.. which party was elected to govern the country?

Neither party was.

Which is why one party had to seek the support of another party. Do you honestly not remember?

But be that as it may it is irrelevant to the point that was made, which was:

the electorate demonstrated very very clearly that it was unelectable.

In the general election being mentioned Labour did considerably better than it did under both Gordon Brown and Ed Miliband.

Would you describe Labour under Gordon Brown and Ed Miliband as “very very clearly unelectable”?

Do you describe every political party which fails to win a general election as “very very clearly unelectable”?

Given what Starmer is/stands for and how he’s an authoritarian arsehole I feel it’s entirely justifiable,

That’s the problem with 2 party politics, even if they actually stuck to some sort of consistent political beliefs you’re still stuck with trying to represent a multi-dimensional ideology in a binary choice.

For example if we had an Authoritarian Left government then maybe our rivers wouldn’t be so polluted.

But then you have to get into a nuance of what’s even meant by authoritarian.   A policy of Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions against an oppressively Israeli government would require a high degree of Authoritarianism too. And before long you’re stuck in an Animal Farm sort of Authoritarianism where everyone is equal, but some are more equal than others.

There is no right answer.  Unless you want to join a political party, build a coalition of likeminded people around you, launch a leadership bid, win, hang on for / pressure the incumbent government into an election and win that.  If you can manage that you can mold the party whatever way you like as long as you take enough people with you, as that’s how democracy works.

Reform still giving the Tories a headache

?EXCLUSIVE?Lucy Allan in talks to stand for Reform after being suspended by Tories.

?The Telford MP said she would stand down at this election, but may stand in the neighbouring constituency of Wrekin for Reform.

By me for @theipaper https://t.co/A9okzRwBcD

— David Parsley (@DavidParsley50) May 29, 2024

Given what Starmer is/stands for and how he’s an authoritarian arsehole I feel it’s entirely justifiable,

Authoritarian?

He’s a bit boring, perhaps paying the price for trying to bully the left of the party into compliance, and obviously he’s currently scared of his own shadow just in-case a well timed gaff costs Labour their poll lead. But I’m really not getting the “Authoritarian” vibe TBH…

Id say he’s far more ruthless than anyone gave him credit for, you have to be to lead a political party, a large part of the Tory implosion has been due to internal divisions

arguably Cameron placating the headbangers with a referendum to ‘settle the EU problem’ has led them to the state the country and their party is in now

You need to look at the purge of progressives from the labour party, which many centrists seem to have welcomed with glee as a good thing. God forbid he should actually listen to some progressive voices instead of finding excuses to purge them from the party and replace them with disgraced right wing tories. But it is clear that it speaks to his political ambition and  character and likely actions when stepping up to the big job.

Do you describe every political party which fails to win a general election as “very very clearly unelectable”?

no but JC4PM led to new and unexpected levels of tory voting particularly in the NW.  I’d be surprised if i cant level the same accusation at Sunak in early July (although bit part credits to Boris’ parties and Truss economic advisers)

Would he rather be in opposition complaining about everything

I mean, this sums up several regular posters on here.

You need to look at the purge of progressives from the labour party, which many centrists seem to have welcomed with glee as a good thing.

Still hardly Authoritarian though is it?

There probably is a bit of ruthlessness to his leadership, but British politics is a bit more centrists now, it has been for the last couple of decades. And of course the current goal is to get elected rather than being in permanent opposition, SKS is going to have to keep Labour within the Overton window.

If this is the flavour of Labour we are going to get for the entire next decade or not depends on a lot of things really, I think there’s still some room for more progressive figures, but quite honestly keeping them quieter during this campaign fends off the sort of hyperbolic ‘Anti-lefty’ criticism in the RW press that definitely damaged his predecessor. 

“Wrekin for Reform”

It’s like Mystic Meg is writing the campaign pamphlet.

Shh don’t be talking sense!

The problem for labour atm seems to be that it’s all noise about Tory policies (not bad in itself if they are unpopular) and now it’s all about Abbot

Whoever leaked this to the Times has done a very good job of undermining the Labour campaign

You need to look at the purge of progressives from the labour party, which many centrists seem to have welcomed with glee as a good thing.

I’d rather a centrist* government that wasn’t doing things like Rwanda, Bibi Stockholm, neutering Renters Reform Bill (none of which have anything to do with actual left Vs right economics, and only the latter is related to curtailing the free market), cutting spending at every opportunity and generally doing everything in a way that I’d consider wrong.

*I mean, we’ve still discussed nationalizing, or taking large steps away from fully privatized models, more of the economy than at any point in the last 30 years, but if you still want to call that centrist then carry on.  Although I’d like to know what policies you’d like to see that could definitively be more left and still leave them electable?

Whoever leaked this to the Times has done a very good job of undermining the Labour campaign

Fair point, I think they’re weak on the handling of Abbots case. But perhaps it’s better to get it out of the way this week than in another two.

Bit of a gamble perhaps, but it’s a Wednesday and Lil’ Rishi will no doubt want to chuck another dead cat down on Friday to “control” the weekend news cycle…

When’s the first TV debate?

Neither party was.

Which is why one party had to seek the support of another party. Do you honestly not remember?

Quite. The point made  was that Corbyn was unelectable. I’m not sure pointing to an election where he wasn’t elected as evidence that he was in fact electable is terribly convincing.

Still hardly Authoritarian though is it?

What about his treatment of anyone who early on raised concerns about the Israeli bombing in Gaza?,

Quite. The point made was that Corbyn was unelectable. I’m not sure pointing to an election where he wasn’t elected as evidence that he was in fact electable is terribly convincing.

No, the point made was that Labour under Corbyn was “very very clearly unelectable”.

I’m not sure that doing better than under both Gordon Brown and Ed Miliband is terribly convincing.

Unless we all agree that under Gordon Brown and Ed Miliband Labour was very very clearly unelectable?

Corbyn himself is perfectly electable, which is why he has been an MP far longer than just about anyone else. And why he still stands a fair chance of being an MP after July 4th.

Look, I’m not saying he’s perfect, far from it, but five weeks out from a GE I’m more comfortable with Starmer than Sunak as a future PM. And a socialist Labour would just be too scary for those swing voters they’ve coaxed back.

Nuance has gone from public discourse, He’s afraid of the picture the press will paint, and they’re still merrily labelling anyone marching against Israeli air strikes on refugees as “Hamas supporters” so yeah SKS’ statements over the last year have been very disappointing at times.

Labour is as factional as any other party, to have wrestled them into something that looks almost like it’s unified in time for an early election is a feat. If Sunak had gone long the infighting could have helped erode Labours lead.

What about his treatment of anyone who early on raised concerns about the Israeli bombing in Gaza?,

That’s just political expediency.  Because like it or not the Labour Party has had a problem with anti-Semitism recently. They don’t have the moral capital to expend on that issue.  And what would they do anyway. Better to keep your mouth shut and appear powerless to stop something than open it and remove all doubt?*

You can argue till you’re blue in the face that being pro-Palestine is not the same as being pro-Hammas or anti-Israel and that being anti- the current Israeli Government isn’t inherently anti-Semitic.  But it will just drive voters away, and then we’ll spend another 5 years in opposition and things we can actually do something about like the Rwanda scheme, health and social care, and education will keep going in a direction we don’t like.

*”All that’s required for evil to succeed is for good men to do nothing” is all well and good, but in this case either way we’re not going to do anything beyond support the humanitarian relief effort.  We can’t stop Israel’s bombing, but we could lose an election and then really would be doing nothing.

Is there any chance we can keep the Gaza discussion on the Gaza thread?

Nuance has gone from public discourse,

There is absolutely zero nuance in current Labour policies, voters are effectively being given the choice of two right of centre parties that both seem hellbent on NHS privatisation

To believe that Labour are for any sort of change of direction is delusional, they are openly and explicitly taking us down the same path Thatcher started us on.

They have told you they will deliver more privatisation, they have told you there will be more deregulation and they have been quite open that there will be more public spending cuts.

They are telling you loud and clear that they will deliver “ironclad” Thatcherism, you are giving a mandate to more privatisation of the NHS, look at Peter Theil/Palintir’s interest in NHS data, more public money going into private pockets, less public money going into public services, deregulation to enable more profits. You are giving a mandate for more of the self same neoliberalism that has taken this country down for decades.

Labour have already told you that any of their promises are conditional on growth, this is the self same trickle down economics we’ve had for 50 years. Labour’s self imposed fiscal rules are identical to the Tories and can only have the same effects because of that with the addition that Rachael Reeves had made an ”ironclad” promise that will not permit public money to be spent on public investment, she has promised to pay down the deficit and the debt, which will mean less money going into the economy, not more.

I’d love to believe that once Starmer gets in to #10 we see the real Labour emerge but that’s not going to happen, what we see now is exactly what we are going to get.