Debating whether to run a middleburn crankset with a royce or shimano sq taper bb with 1 ring (maybe rs7 with dual spider and 1 44th chainring) alongside my rohloff. Cliff at royce can make sure I get the 54mm chainline I need. Not sure what chainline I will end up with if I stick with a shimano sq taper BB? 1) Is the £160 royce price tag vfm long term 2) how important is the correct chainline? Cheers

If you are using a derailleur chain then the chain line doesn’t matter too much.

Shimano BBs are available in various lengths so you should be able to get it spot on if you use your head or get good advice.

I don’t see the benefit of Royce TBH, shops unlikely to have the proper tool, 10 x the price, not much lighter…but for some the niche-ness is enough.

Definitely nichetastic.

I run a Royce on my xc/ commute bike and its worked great fro a couple of years.

Hard to justify the price. Just ordered a shimano for my sons bike for 10 pounds. Have a spare Royce that is too long for me (68 shell and 123mm axle). Drop me a line if its suitable.

the 54mm chainline can be done with any 113mm axle width square taper BB, with the drive chainring mounted on the outside of a spider.

Its what I have for all my SS and rohloff setups. I keep it 54mm so I can switch rohloff between any of the SS builds.

If you want to use an UNO chainring on the other hand, you will need to go for a longer axle as the Uno has a chainline of 47.5mm (which is the same as running a chainring on the inboard side of the spider arms) so to get to 54mm again you’d need a 126mm axle BB.

Id love to run a royce but just never justified it. I do have a Phil Woods in one of the bikes a UN72 in the other and a UN54 in the other three.

Shimano is the sensible option. Fit, forget, throw away every once in a while. Steel and plastic, Japanese, quite heavy, does the job for a reasonable amount of time rather unglamorously.

Royce is the pimptastic option (fitted on all 4 of my bikes….) aluminium and titanium, super quality bearings. Absolute things of beauty, super light, super shiny and user servicable. And you get a whacking great big Royce sticker! When it needs servicing, which isn’t very often, (10 years and counting 😉 ) drop in and see Cliff.
If you’re concerned about chainline I’m sure Cliff would help you with that if you can take the frame down to him. He did a great job for me.

Which is for you? How deep is your wallet?

I have a Royce bb that is in constant use and was fitted in 1995 and has been in various frames with the same cranks. I have never replaced the bearings and it is as smooth and play free as new.

Low mielage serial bike swapper? 😉

Thanks for all the advice guys. Matthew at middleburn had suggested I go with a dual spider to get the right chainline and downhill solid ring as it was also designed with hub gears in mind. Obviously, being a rohloff owner, I don’t mind spending a bit of cash on gear, but only if the lifespan is suitably impressive and justifies the spend. >10 years with no servicing on a royce bb is quite phenomenal – what is the warranty like on them, in case you end up with a dodgy one? Good to know that shimano set ups can be easily worked to fit too. Going to scratch my head, sell a few more items on the forum and see what is in the coffers at the end 🙂

I’ve got a Rohloff and like you don’t mind spending money on stuff that lasts. The thing is though with the UN54 you can both spend very little money and still have something that lasts a very long time. My first did I think 4 years and the current one is 2 years old and this is on a bike used for off road commuting all year round which is never cleaned.

I would only be looking at the Royce option if I was looking to minimise weight which isn’t a consideration for me on that particular bike.

Cheers avdave2 and stoner, having just had another baby, I think 4 years for £15 is a no brainer right now then. if I can double check though: My surly ogre has a 73mm shell, so if I go for a UN54 to get a 54mm chainline with rs7 cranks using 1 ring on a dual spider, do I definitely go for the 113mm axle width square taper BB? Are there any good websites that run through this calculation? Thanks everyone for your feedback, thoughts and ideas!

Sheldon “the omniscient but sadly departed” Brown, knows all
http://sheldonbrown.com/chainline.html

if your’e using a middleburn arms with a dual, you want the ring on the outer position with a 113mm axle to get a 54mm chainline.

BUT!

if you use a <42Tish chainring, you might need to file it down for the arm to get past.

All mine are 36T, because of my Rohloff ratio, and so I have to adapt my chainrings for the outer position.

[img]https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-xTgY4TrZVXE/TxK9a3cjh6I/AAAAAAAABCE/pg2LC3cmfck/s400/P1010399.JPG[/img]

Cheers Stoner, £14 on CRC for that BB, I think I’m going to go for it now and will put my desire for pimping with the royce to one side until such time as I can justify it to my dearest. Currently running 16th on the back and 48th up front, but don’t get the use out of 13-14th gears, so I was thinking of trying 44 th up front, although I’m not sure if that will be enough of a drop – I guess I’ll just have to find out 😕 Like the look of that goldtec ring…

Going from 48 to 44 drops all the gears by about 9%. Rohloff gears are spaced 13.6% apart. So you likely still won’t use 14 much. The new 13 will be close to but slightly higher than the current 12.

If you know what gear range you want you can play about with cogs, crank and tyre size variables at a gear calculator.

http://onehillside.com/hub.html#

I run 40 x 16 and still rarely use 14 off road. When I need to change the rear cog I may actually go to 17 to give the lowest permitted gearing though I don’t use gear 1 very often either. However it does mean a little bit more time in the higher 7 gears which are more efficient. Not that I’ve ever really noticed that while riding. The downside with changing will be that I’ve been riding with the same ratios for 6 years and got very used to them especially on the commute.

My chainring is in the outer position and a 113mm axle gives a perfect chainline. This is another very useful on line gear calculator from Kinetics

The Shimano UN54 is a fine BB and will last for years.
But, it is heavy.

Consider a Token TK866CM BB with carbon tube and hollow steel axle at 219g for a 68×113 size.
Price on ebay/google was approx £20 and mine are working very well.

PaulD

Thanks for your help again with gear ratios – you’re absolutely right, dropping to 44T would not be enough. I reckon 40×16 could be just the ticket. What are your thoughts on the rings then – are goldtec going to outlast middleburn downhill rings? Think Middleburn are going to bring out a reversible ring soon? Any other suggestions – don’t mind pimping this bit as not going to break the bank, unlike a fancy BB 😉

rings is rings TBH

That one up there ^ is abit freaky as its one-key courtesy ofTazzy

TBH you’re getting very excited about a very simple set up. Ive got half a dozen singlespeed 36T rings I use on the bike. They’re all fine. They last, because theyre SS, not because they’re hewn on the the thighs of Devonian chicks.

But at 36T I need to cut them back for the middleburn arms.

TVBH any ss ring is fine for the job – I have E13, Goldtec and Thorns on mine.

Thanks for your help guys – v happy with the end product. To get the right chainline, I ended up having to fit the chainring to the inside of the dual spider, but that was no big deal – not sure why it didn’t work out though? Just need to get a chaintug as the axle keeps slipping, otherwise pretty much finished with the build 😀

A white saddle on a bike that looks set up for the worst of the winter filth. 😯

UN 54 on my main mountain bike as I got sick of replacing external BB’ s and also went the heavy but reliable square taper and lovely Middleburn route.

No complaints at all. Buttery smooth for well over 2 years?

I though Middleburn gave a 48 mm chain line so I got BB with a slightly longer axel if that makes sence. As I don’t have a “big ring” I guess it’s not as critical anyway.