A little while ago I won a Carbon Expert Levo SL in a competition. Well specced with Code and other SRAM nice stuff. It had the Mahle motor and an extender battery.

Likes:
simple switchgear and the Mission control display which was unobtrusive.
good spec on this bike with upgraded suspension
fitted well

Dislikes:
Motor feel compared to Brose and it was a noisy motor in comparison
Range potential – some big climbs here in Germany and Switzerland
Battery had to be charged in the frame. Not removable.

We have two e-fatbikes with Brose and 630 batteries and compared to these based on motor and range the SL wasn’t going to cut it and I’m not afraid of doing the work. I just leave my current bike on eco mostly and get a bigger range or boost a bit on super steeps. When I collected it from Spesh they had a pallet stacked high (200) with the warrantied Mahle motors and I’m sure to a degree Brose are the same.

So, I swapped it for one and a half Turbo Levo Comp with a good/reasonable spec, Brose and 700Wh batteries. I’ll get Shimano stuff changed via Pinkbike and the classifieds before they get used. Like me, people have preferences and take stuff unused off new bikes.

FWIW, check out Sams Bikes on youtube for Turbo Levo / Levo SL objective insights.

Basically, a really nice bike but wouldn’t work for my circumstances.

I test rode an SL last week. The motor and amount of power was spot on but didn’t like the geo and it’s very poor bang for buck. The comp alloy is circa 19-20kg, you’ll have to spend a heap more for 17-18kg.

Just put a deposit down on a Rise H15 with Fox 36s grip2, upgraded shock and bigger rotors.

I had a brief spin on a Levo sl in the summer. Owned by a dad of one of my riding buddies (buddy is mid/late 30s, guessing pops is early 60s and not an mtber although no doubt “fit for age”)
Me, I’m a not very fit 51 year old carrying too much timber and some old injuries to knee and shoulder. Not exactly ill but def can’t keep up with the group now (could I ever?)
The levo felt like it wasn’t doing very much at all in eco on the shit bastard climb at win hill. That’s a horrid climb that I can clean on a normal bike with a large amount of effort. Sometimes give up and walk the last bit if it’s been a long one. Especially on my old 17kg gnarpoon, not so much on the lighter aether9. Needed the setting up from eco to feel it was much different to my regular bike. I don’t think that’s necessarily a problem but gives an idea.
I haven’t ridden a rise but to me they look more like what I would want should I ever succumb to temptation and get one.
There is only one regular eeb rider in my extended group of riders. If I was riding regularly with people on eebs I would have one by now I think.

I didn’t like it for probably the reason you’d like it – just seemed a compromise, still an eBike but no power.

This is what I don’t get with the “POWERRRR” guys on their eBikes, obsessing over outputs and getting their bikes derestricted… I don’t want to feel like I’m riding a motorbike when I’m riding a mountain bike. I’ve got a very powerful motorbike that I enjoy at times (KTM 1290 Superduke GT). I don’t get how 1/3rd of a BHP is particularly exciting for those trying to get their power fix… I’ve got 175 of them on my motorbike! 🤷🏻‍♂️

The Spesh demo-man suggested that the bike wasn’t aimed at me, but at someone less fit/able that wanted to ride with me. Sounds like what you’re after.

It’s coming down to it yes…

I have probably 3 distinct groups of MTB riding friends these days (oh god how much easier was it when all we had to worry about was the antisocial singlespeeders! 😂). They are…

-The full fat eBikers that are either very fit anyway and do a lot of riding along with those who are a bit less fit but have derestricted their eBikes and upgraded the battery capacities… I might stand a chance of keeping up on a 450 KTM basically!

-The die hard “eBikes are cheating” group who are mostly pretty fit. 18 months ago I had no problems keeping up with these guys, 3/4 years ago I’d sometimes even set the pace. For reasons stated in my first post, I need an eBike to keep up (albeit my full fat eBike in ECO is actually a bit much) at the moment.

-Those who have been MTBing for a very long time and have bought a lightweight eBike (Levo SL’s mostly) and are evangelical about them, but only tend to ride on their own or with others on lightweight eBikes.

I test rode an SL last week. The motor and amount of power was spot on but didn’t like the geo and it’s very poor bang for buck. The comp alloy is circa 19-20kg, you’ll have to spend a heap more for 17-18kg.

The geo is subjective… Compared to modern LLS bikes then I agree with you totally. My 170mm travel eBike is 64/77 angles and 478mm reach and it’s not that long compared to some. But it’s also overkill on the trails I ride most. Also, the Levo SL geometry is very close to bikes I was riding 3-4 years ago and loving (Evil Wreckoning, Whyte S-150) geometry wise, and not actually much heavier!

Speaking of weight… Not concerned about value or the kit that comes on the bike, got everything sat waiting (Fox 36’s, X01 running gear, choice of brakes and wheels, carbon bars etc.) to upgrade one already. My mates XL Comp Carbon is 16.5kg on the nose, including pedals, on 2.6″ tyres, full X01, Hope V4’s, carbon bars and rims, Pro4 hubs. It staggered me how light it is, I have friends with heavier unassisted Enduro bikes.

Just put a deposit down on a Rise H15 with Fox 36s grip2, upgraded shock and bigger rotors.

The H15 looks good… A GRIP2 upgrade is a no brainer. But you’re up around 21kg now (might get it down under 20kg with some spendy upgrades) with lightweight casing tyres. It’s nearly a full fat eBike, albeit a well thought out one with an eye on the weight watching. It’ll be great I’m sure, but I can’t help thinking I’d be happier on something 4kg lighter with less assistance (EP8 RS has the same 60Nm peak torque of my current E7000, which stays in ECO 99% of the time). Oh and it looks like the H15’s aren’t shipping til July/August from what I can glean… H10’s are available imminently, but I’d immediately upgrade everything on that anyway…

Couldnt say for sure as ive not seen that Ad, but Evans have a habit of faffing about parts so its not such a good deal.

Evans, now owned by Mike Ashley remember, have a reputation of getting their listings wrong. They don’t have a history of buggering about with spec on bikes from experience. Looks to me like someone who doesn’t know what they were doing wrote the spec on that bike and got the spec from the 2020 bike not the 2021 (which had a fork, drivetrain and shock upgrade, but lost the carbon wheels)…

FWIW, check out Sams Bikes on youtube for Turbo Levo / Levo SL objective insights.

It was his massively enthusiastic review that got me thinking about one if I’m honest! I do find his Aussie idiosyncrasies quite amusing though, especially as he lives in Madrid! 😂

Basically, a really nice bike but wouldn’t work for my circumstances.

Fully get that. Sounds like you live somewhere a lot hillier than I do. My typical MTB ride is (or was) 25-40km with 600-1000m of climbing over a mix of terrain but with a bias of more flowing descents over super techy and mostly fire road climbs. I need something to take the sting off my right knee as I can’t put much pressure through it currently, but I can spin 80-100rpm no problems.

Anyway… I just know I’m talking myself into buying one, just can’t figure out whether to just pick up a cheap 2nd hand alloy one for around £3k and view it as a bike to get me through this spring/summer to help rehabilitate my knee before I punt it on again for not too much of a loss, or to put quite a bit more in and get a brand new carbon one on a deal and view it as a longer term purchase… Yes, I fully realise that there will likely be a replacement for the current bike sometime later this year, but sounds like it’ll just be going longer and slacker and gaining more power if anything, not necessarily things that would make me buy one anyway…

This is what I don’t get with the “POWERRRR” guys on their eBikes, obsessing over outputs and getting their bikes derestricted… I don’t want to feel like I’m riding a motorbike when I’m riding a mountain bike.

I know dozens of MTB ebikers, none of them do this, as it destroys range, obviously.

The only folk I know who do it are commuters.

kiwicraig wrote:

Just put a deposit down on a Rise H15 with Fox 36s grip2, upgraded shock and bigger rotors

ditto (though I didn’t upgrade rear shock as it is £70 for Kashima and nothing else really). Due 2nd of February all being well. Couldn’t choose colour as the local shop had got their allocation of a single large Rise back in May last year!

Both the bikes on the Evans site are 2021 colours. I thought that the spec was the 2020 one. I cant see Evans swapping parts off a new bike so I would guess they have the wrong year spec in the description
At the price for the Blue grey one if it has the 2021 parts I’m not sure I would even swap the forks, shock and drivetrain out.

@welshfarmer ooo interesting to know you have a specific ETA date of the 2nd of Feb, I read Feb 2022 and assumed it would be the end of the month.

Between the 2nd and the 4th they say. I will believe it when I see it mind!!

If you go through the Orbea website, choose the model, size and colour you want and begin the reservation and buying process it lists all the shops with available delivery slots across the UK. If you are lucky you may still find one for first Feb week delivery. My preferred colour was an August delivery with my local shop but the one I have chosen is not too bad. I note that their next one in the same spec is now not due until October.

I know dozens of MTB ebikers, none of them do this, as it destroys range, obviously.

I know plenty. The one I rode last weekend cruised at nearly 30mph on the flat according to the Garmin. Out of the 6 regular ebike riders I know, 5 are derestricted. None commute on them.

At 30mph, you’ll be topping out the gearing on an MTB. Those 10/12t sprockets aren’t really designed to have 500+ watts put through them on a regular basis and they won’t last very long.

I know plenty. The one I rode last weekend cruised at nearly 30mph on the flat according to the Garmin. Out of the 6 regular ebike riders I know, 5 are derestricted. None commute on them.

Mibbe different in the flatlands of the SE.

I personally wouldnt want to ride at 30mph. No protection, coming off its serious body damage even death.

Yeah I ummed and arrhed about shock but they only had black available so thought it might add a bit of colour. Due April 22nd (in NZ). Dealer was saying they usually fly them in but they put in such a chunky order they’re coming by ship.

All the carbon models are sold out apparently.

@welshfarmer
Do you know if Orbea “delivery” dates are when something leaves the factory or when it should arrive with the dealer (taking into account different shipping times for different countries and vagaries of post brexit deliveries from Europe to Uk)

I have no idea sorry. I am happy to ask my supplier though.

Mibbe different in the flatlands of the SE.

I was in the Midlands at Cannock.

It was slightly tongue in cheek Weeksy, but the point stands. Derestricting an ebike takes away the whole point of it for me, and I know all my mates feel the same – cutting out the uplift and as such, more descending. At the levels required to hit 30mph on one of my local climbs, you’d get one descent in.

If you live near Swinley or cannock, then I suppose battering round those beyond the limiter may be your bag.

Let’s not derail this thread though with yet another ebike argument.

Let’s not derail this thread though with yet another ebike argument.

That wasn’t my intention

I know, just saying before others start up, as usual.

cutting out the uplift and as such, more descending. At the levels required to hit 30mph on one of my local climbs, you’d get one descent in.

Just a point of clarity, legal ebike motors dontonly have a speed limiter, they also have a power limiter, which limits nominal output to 250w. So if you take a legal Ebike motor and put one of those devices on it that remove the speed limit, it’s still limited to 250w nominal, so on a hill of any significant steepness your still not going to go up it much faster than with the speed limiter. There’s hills round here that it doesn’t matter if you have the speed limiter in place you can only go up it at 10 ish mph because the motor is pegged by the power limiter not the speed limiter.

Tldr: removing the speed limit does not necessarily mean 30mph uphill speeds are acheivable,because there are other limits built into the motor.

It does annoy me slightly that most reviews of these bikes are comparing them to full fat ebikes, where they should be compared to normal non ebikes.

Essentially it’s me but with an extra 5kg of weight* (which tbh I’m already carrying!) and with an FTP of 400+w, not 210w.

*I know, weight on you isn’t the same as weight on the bike but it makes for an easy comparison.

I know dozens of MTB ebikers, none of them do this, as it destroys range, obviously.

A weekend at BPW or FoD (cycle centre) and you can pretty much tick every single e-biker stereotype out there.

Full fat bikes, derestricted, tearing up the fire road with the saddle down, in turbo doing 45rpm.

Then riding down the trails slower than they go up 😆

Generally they have multiple batteries & swap them out.

I don’t get it, at all, but hey, we’re all different right.

Hob-Nob
Free Member
I know dozens of MTB ebikers, none of them do this, as it destroys range, obviously.

A weekend at BPW or FoD (cycle centre) and you can pretty much tick every single biker stereotype out there.

Fixed that for you

Fixed that for you

Very true, but the obvious **** charging up the busy pedal/push up at 25mph resulting in constant near misses as they overtake, tends to stick in the mind.

It’s a gateway to Siryon ownership 🤦‍♂️

I just know I’m talking myself into buying one, just can’t figure out whether to just pick up a cheap 2nd hand alloy one for around £3k and view it as a bike to get me through this spring/summer to help rehabilitate my knee before I punt it on again for not too much of a loss, or to put quite a bit more in and get a brand new carbon one on a deal and view it as a longer term purchase…

I guess you have two obvious factors to consider: one is the nature of your knee problem and the prognosis for full recovery. The other is whether, once your knee works again, you’ll have any interest in riding the Levo SL.

I haven’t touched the borrowed Turbo Levo sat in the corner of the room for around six weeks now because once I’d recovered from long covid and started riding normally again, I found I just wasn’t really that interested. Tbf, no-one I ride with regularly has an e-bike, so there’s no pressure on that front and I like riding normal bikes. Actucally I love riding normal bikes.

If the SL is just going to be a stop-gap before you get back to normal riding again, then why blow a load of dosh on it, probably makes more sense to get something cheap-ish and sell it on? If you’re going to carry on riding it, then maybe a pimped out carbon-framed SL makes more sense. Of course you could go with option A and then upgrade later if you decide it’s worth it. All of which is very obvious, but sometimes it helps to break the reasoning down and see past the emotional ‘want nice stuff’ reflex thing 😉

I’m kind of intrigued by the whole half-fat thing, but I find the range restriction irksome. I’m pondering a big Cut Gate / Roych loop and considered the Levo, but have little confidence that it’ll make it round even with some strategic power settings.

It’s all fun, those two places are just a result of the success of biking and centres over the years.

As for the SL, I looked at them but they aren’t in that area I was looking, I went full ebike as I do like the ebike uplift stuff and suffer the extra weight on trail or play stuff, it’s just about what you want as a middle ground, there’s definitely a place for them, but you have to buy it with the ability in mind I’d say.

This is what I don’t get with the “POWERRRR” guys on their eBikes

The EP8rs is only 60nm, that’s hardly POWERRRR-ful.
Simply though, if your priority is lightness, the Levo Sl wins.

It’s a gateway to Su-ron ownership

Which last about 2 minutes before they find they can’t ride anywhere.
#realshame

I haven’t regretted buying my 19 month old Levo SL. Reasons: Age 74 (64kgs) with increasing painful arthritis in my knees & a dodgy back injury from 30yrs ago was limiting my off road riding to 15-18 miles . I first looked at ebikes early 2019 but discounted them due to their heavy weight in lifting up & down into cellar & car.
2020 arrived with Covid & the new Levo SL. I had a demo SL over 2 days use in the Yorkshire Dales. What a revelation! I loved every minute of each ride doing 20+ miles & 2500ft elevation. Knee pain was hardly noticeable & didn’t have to stop for backache. Mulled over alloy or carbon for a couple of weeks then ordered the carbon. A mate of mine rides a Trek FS and we’ve done a fair few rides together. He wins on the big climbs but chases me downhill. Rarely ride trail centres so mainly XC in the Dales, North York Moors, Lakes, Calderdale & my local stuff.
So far ridden over 4000 miles with only normal wear & tear drivetrain replacements. Motor fine & battery still 100%. Upgraded fork to Fox 36 160.

Superb pennine 👌🏻

Many thanks again everyone for chipping in… Quite a few things to think about.

I have had a go on a friends Levo SL now, only very quickly but was enough to tell me the motor assistance is as much as I want and will do enough to take the pressure off my knee during recovery and enable me to go out with my regular riding friends on their regular bikes whilst I recover. His bike was an XL and didn’t ride it off road so can’t really comment geometry wise as it was too big for me, but it was useful nonetheless.

@pennine… Great news! Glad to hear it’s made such a difference. 👍🏻

@BadlyWiredDog you make some good points… The doc has said I should make a full recovery with physio and being careful with it, but it won’t be soon. Maybe another 6-9 months at least (it’s over 3 months since I damaged my knee). Would I wish to ride a Levo SL as my primary bike if I was 100% fit and healthy? Probably not to be honest… So I think dropping £6k on one (even if it was £9k) for a high end model is probably unwise. I have been offered a used Alloy model that has covered all of 20 miles for £3500, which would make more sense, could put my Fox 36’s and wheels on it, ride it until my knee is recovered, then return it to stock and hopefully get most of my £3500 back still… Potentially! Albeit it has raised another question about what would I ride ideally if I was 100% fit and healthy right now anyway… Which brings me back to what Hob-Nob has been saying… Possibly.

With regards to range anxiety though. My mate whose I had a go on last night, he sold his range extender as he never used it! He says he regularly gets up to 30 miles and around 1500m of climbing out of it using the assist sparingly, and would only need the range extender if running it with the power turned up trying to keep up with normal eBikes.

The EP8rs is only 60nm, that’s hardly POWERRRR-ful.

That’s what my E7000 has currently, and I have never used that much. Trail mode has only been used a few times, but isn’t necessary. Eco is more than enough and gives me roughly 20Nm of assistance, but that’s on a 25Nm full fat bike. 18 months ago I was dropping some (admittedly fat and unfit) eBikers up climbs on my XC bike in the Wyre when I guided them round… Yes I worked my bollocks off doing so, but I’m happy to work to get back there. I just need a little assistance in the meantime I think and have also realised I really don’t like the effect and extra 10kg of weight has on the handling of an MTB.

May I suggest for those chasing bigger and bigger outputs from their eBike motors, to go and spend a day on a 450 KTM or similar… Seriously!

Hob-Nob will PM you in a bit, have some questions for you. Cheers.

I have been offered a used Alloy model that has covered all of 20 miles for £3500, which would make more sense, could put my Fox 36’s and wheels on it, ride it until my knee is recovered, then return it to stock and hopefully get most of my £3500 back still…

Jesus, I’d rip their hand off at that price!!

I’ve been pricing up the cheapest kenevo SL, there’s no way I could justify keeping my 150/160mm travel jeffsy along with a kenevo sl, or even s rise, so in a couple of years when I’m ready to swap I’ll look into it.

Jesus, I’d rip their hand off at that price!!

It’s a private sale, and also depends what you want doesn’t it… I am still working that out.

I’ve been pricing up the cheapest kenevo SL, there’s no way I could justify keeping my 150/160mm travel jeffsy along with a kenevo sl, or even s rise, so in a couple of years when I’m ready to swap I’ll look into it.

Exactly that… Wondering if a KSL isn’t a better long term option, and I get rid of my Geometron G15 too… I don’t want or need a 170mm travel 29er, but 5mm spacer in the rear shock will reduce it to around 155mm travel, and drop fork travel to 160mm and run the BB in the high setting along with lighter wheels and fast(er) rolling rear tyre, could be a good option for general use, then swap some heavier wheels and tyres in for heavier duty riding possibly…

I’d leave the shock and fork alone, swapping wheels out will make the biggest difference to rolling speed and handling. you could well end up buggering up the kinematics of the back end.

Nowt

Demo booked for this Saturday coming thanks to Ace cycles in Monmouth.

Sizing is a tricky one though. Swung my leg over an S5 and it felt huge, on paper should be the same size as my G1, are spesh true to their word or doing a Trek with fudging the numbers slightly ?

A little while ago I won a Carbon Expert Levo SL in a competition.
fitted well
……
So, I swapped it for one and a half Turbo Levo Comp with a good/reasonable spec,

Am I right in thinking you swapped it at Specialized themselves?
Im pretty surprised/ impressed they did that, as it’s not a great look for them that someone won their high in the range e-bike and said they didn’t want it even for free and swapped it for something else…
(Though I guess it probably happens quite a lot in that type of competition…)

Sizing is a tricky one though. Swung my leg over an S5 and it felt huge, on paper should be the same size as my G1, are spesh true to their word or doing a Trek with fudging the numbers slightly ?

If it’s any use to you I also have a G1 in Longest and ride a Kenevo fullfat in S4.
I didn’t even try the S5 as I’d not have been able to get a 180 dropper in.
The S4 does feel a tad small to me but I soon adapt to it.

I bought a new SL Expert in battleship grey last week after selling my 2014 Camber. Used the Evan’s promotion to get the price down ( not to £6000 mind, but close). My mate who has a Kenevo SL Expert bought his GF the same bike through Evan’s. They both have 36 Performance and DPX2.

Anyway, lovely bike, plenty of punch out of the corners, enough assistance if you spin fast and just feels like a fun bike out of the box. I need a new seat and I’ll probably swap the gears to XX1 AXS next time im in Europe but for now ( having just lifted it onto my tailgate bike rack without hurting myself) I’m really chuffed with it.