Jesus CK, you sound like a Yank.

USING the drug doesnt provide any more or less knowledge of its dangers, only knowledge of its physical effects.

Bollocks, I know what a bad trip or smoking too much weed feels like. That’s what is dangerous about that type of drug, not it’s physical effects, which are non existent or negligable. And I’ll be able to explain that to my children should the time come a hell of a lot better than someone who hasn’t the faintest idea of how it feels.

I will always hold those views as I believe statistics are easily massaged and badly collected in this arena,

And TJ mentioned the American research that recently concluded that Cocaine was not when used in moderation dangerous. That study was mentioned recently in the Guardian, as it was suppressed by the US govt as it contradicts their official policy. So who’s massaging the stats?

Plenty of peope have taken, or do take illegal as well as legal drugs on a regular basis to no harm to themselves or others around them. Some people take something once or twice and it messes them up, or some people slowly become alcoholics or addicted to tobbaco, and rot. Talking about it is a good idea. Life and drug use isn’t as black and white as it it sounds like you think it is.

lol, arguing about drugs on the internet, can’t anyone see how futile that’s going to be?

BoardinBob

There was a respected doctor that came out couple of years ago and said it was possible for someone to maintain a heroin habit and lead a normal life i.e. marriage, job etc.

IME (not personal!) that’s completely true. I have a very good mate who’s been on the gear for over 12 years. He runs a sucessful business, is married to a lovely girl and has three well behaved, well brought up children.

I asked him very recently (at Inners, doing the XC route!) why on Earth he hadn’t kicked it into touch. He replied that he’s “self medicating”. And when I thought back to his pre-smack days, it’s true – he was a miserable sod – perhaps not clinically depressed, but certainly not far off. He reckoned the gear helps him stay motivated and maintain a positive view on life in general.

I still reckon he’s missing some of the best years of being a dad to his kids though – surely he can’t be ‘there’ properly if he’s in a permanent half-dream?!

And yes, he does have to deal with some truly scummy folk to keep his supply going – prohibit prohibition I say…

“No bird soars too high if he soars with his own wings”

– Blake.

As a kid, I went out raving a fair bit – whilst completely straight. I was entirely aware of what I was missing out on, but I just liked dancing to the new and strange muzak. Whatever their alleged benefits, I’d rather read a book.

All IMO, of course. 🙂

RichPenny

What I’m advocating is more emphasis on what drugs do, more knowledge about what is dangerous, rather than just a sweeping of the issue under the carpet. Look at the guy who took 2000 mushrooms! Proper education, wouldn’t have happened.

Cigarette packets have a big warning on the side telling people that cigarettes will kill them. It doesn’t stop people doing it though.

Always said this. Drugs in your 20’s. Cool/experimenting/living it up
Drugs in your 30’s+. Abit sad really as you are dependent/hooked/a user.

Drugs in your 30’s+. Abit sad really as you are dependent/hooked/a user.

Or just missed out on it first time round so therefore

Cool/experimenting/living it up

Hora – pish!

Have you stopped drinking? Its an addictive dangerous and toxic drug.

Mungechick – the point about heroin users I made was fairly obviously devils advocate – but the non chaotic users simply don’t come to the attention of the police.

How much police time is taken up with junkie wasters? IME a lot – and the judicial interventions actually don’t seem to achieve anything. this is why I would prefer to remove drugs in large from the judicial sphere and move them into healthcare – its a purely pragmatic solution to reduce the crime the junkies cause and to free up police time. It would be cheaper for us as a country simply to give them free smack of pharmacutical grades. Far less crime, far less health issues

There was something on the news the other day about Portugal (I think it was there) where they removed all the illegality of drugs a couple of years back. Now they have far less problems than they used to have. Probably just because its not registered as criminal activity therefore not registered at all, but crack on I say.

Sorry, its sad. It smacks me of someone trying to either reclaim their youth or someone who still hasnt found themselves. What next? Basball caps backtofront in your 40’s and wearing surf street clothing?

I also think recreational drug users in their 30’s probably live with their parents or with their mates. The reality is they probably dont but its the image of lack of responsibility IMO.

Sorry, 20’s. Yes, 30’s abit creepy.

Hora – The usual lucid and well thought through contribution. You’re just too tight to pay for coke when we’re out in town. And pissed off cos none of us lot will give you any of ours 😛

Drugs in your 30’s+. Abit sad really as you are dependent/hooked/a user.

Or just missed out on it first time round so therefore

Lets just get one thing straight… plant hallucinogens are very different to street drugs such as crack, pills, speed & heroin etc. Plant hallucinogens are naturally occuring and used in the correct set and setting are very beneficial to individual taking part.

Hora… It is impossible to get hooked on psilocybe semilanceata (that’s the name of mushrooms which I ate btw)

..and for the record Im forty years old and have had an interest in the psychedelic experience for at least twenty two years – I know what I am doing. It isn’t about ‘getting of your face’ It actually takes a bit courage to use plant hallucinogens and they should not be taken without consideration and care.

Kev

binners and keva earlier

Jesus!!! I’ve just had a thought. Can you imagine the conversation with Hora on Drugs?!!!

I thought he was – given the drivel he posts.

Because I dont bang the right-on drum or big up drugs? 😐

I guess Hora is the Manchurian equivalent of Rab C Nesbit – living in Chorlton and goes out drinking in posh Didsbury…

He doesn’t actually live in Chorlton. He lives in what the estate agents refer to as Chorlton Borders, and what the rest of us refer to as Stretford

but crack on I say.

I hope that was deliberate?…

Dunno, is this the older drug-gang trying to gang up on a non-addict?

Often in the Northern Quarter of Manchester I see the detritus and suffering that drug abuse brings.

Often in the Northern Quarter of Manchester I see the detritus and suffering that drug abuse brings.

What? Graphic designers?

I think you will find that drug is mainly alcohol.

Hora – the reason you are having the piss taken out of you is you post stuff that is demonstrably wrong and you show your ignorance all too often.

FWIW I have made no moral judgements about drugs at all – good or bad. Merely tried to present some facts about drugs and my opinions on how to deal with the issues around drug use.

It is a fact that alcohol causes far more problems than all other drugs put together and that some drugs have very little in the way of adverse effects

Hora just sounds like a parent in the making, I bet he ‘dad dances’ already…

Just say no…

Often in the Northern Quarter of Manchester I see the detritus and suffering that drug abuse brings.

What? Graphic designers?

Quite funny for you 😆

TandemJeremy, I’m not going to bother responding.

is Hora a bus driver for Magic Bus…

your not very sensible if you are still into drug related self abuse at 40, (same with booze). For those though that have been sucked in it because of an adictive personality of have related psychiatric problems need sympathy and good treatment. Portugal has started possibly one of the best approaches to drugs but it’s not a free for all, they are really serious about what they are doing and treament for adiction is part of the approach. You should take a look at it, wish we had the same here.
Remember the law on drugs (and other things) is there for all, it may be miss guided at times (for you/me) but there are some people that need protection whats out there. Johnny Cash had a good song about this (Why I wear Black?), but the best is Neil Young (Neddle and the damage done?). For some life get really tough when it goes wrong and I’m not sure that the debate on drugs (here or anywhere) ever gets to the issues.

is Hora a bus driver for Magic Bus…

No, but Ive been around sometime and seen alot. Ive seen too much to want any part of any form of recreational drug. Especially now that the LSD/etc that we knew is now a total different sort of quality and can be mixed with other drugs.

Alot of people need protection from drugs. Some are more susceptible than others to addiction etc. Same with alcohol. Although alcohol isnt seen as risky or cool beyond the age of 13yrs old is it?

On alcohol, It killed my bestfriends Mum at 41yrs old.

your not very sensible if you are still into drug related self abuse at 40, (same with booze).

sticking needles in your arms is not very sensible no matter how old you are.

Kev

your not very sensible if you are still into drug related self abuse at 40, (same with booze).

Define ‘into’. I like a drink at 41 – does that make me a self abuser? Or are you talking about alcoholism, which is no ‘better’ or acceptable no matter the age of the alcoholic.

your not very sensible if you are still into drug related self abuse at 40

You are not sensible if you are abusing [anything] at any age but when exactly are we all expected to become clean living and give up tea, coffee, alcohol, recreational drugs etc?

Remember the law on drugs (and other things) is there for all, it may be miss guided at times (for you/me) but there are some people that need protection whats out there

I agree some people end up addicted to gambling therefore we ahould ban it despite the fact the majority dont./ Surely the law should be for the majority who partake without any serious harm to themselves rather than for the minority who do develop issues

We need to ban MTB I know people who have hurt themselves permanently doing that craaaaazzzzyyy stuff man….etc

viewing anything as black or white in your 40’s is a little naive to say the least.

Jesus CK, you sound like a Yank.

Errr, I’m not sure how I manage to sound “like a Yank”? What trait of Yanks do you associate with what I’ve said?

Lets just get one thing straight… plant hallucinogens are very different to street drugs such as crack, pills, speed & heroin etc. Plant hallucinogens are naturally occuring and used in the correct set and setting are very beneficial to individual taking part.

LOL. I can’t think of anything LESS beneficial than hallucination. Enlighten me, what exactly is it that is so beneficial?

the PROBLEM with drugs (in my personal opinion) is due to its illegality.

the industry has been driven underground, and so isnt regulated.
people have been brewing stronger and stronger strains of alcohol since forever, which in my mind is no difference from growing stronger and stronger strains of weed or whatever.

but at least its written on the bottle of alcohol!
theres ALWAYS going to be some moron who thinks its a good idea to kill himself through excess, with alcohol, or speed or whatever.

legalise it all, write on it what strength it is and educate people as to how it messes them up, after that, leave them to it, and dont spend excessive public money on mopping them up.
i hate drugs, and havent touched anything other than alcohol (on the recreational front i mean) but the problems with illegal drugs always seem to be deaths through dirty needles, addicts not being able to afford the drugs and spending all thier worldly money on the stuff, or people no knowing whats in it surely!

and dont spend excessive public money on mopping them up.

But thats where the problem lies. We as a society can’t do that, we feel compelled to piece people back together regardless (rightly or wrongly), that will never change.

TBH almost all the problems I’ve seen with drugs have been permanent psychological changes in people from relatively minor use, not death – that was a one-off. I’m not convinced education works, or that people who are young enough to experiment are capable of taking that education and using it to make a rational decision. While looking at the current situation of alcohol age limits – what you find is teens thinking its “cool” to go out and get smashed because a massive number of the general public do too. Convert that to drug world – some kids try light drugs, very few try hard drugs. Legalise the lot and see how soon that changes, and how soon the kids drunk on the corner become dead kids on the corner. And considering the known psychological problems linked to drug use, see the ticking timebomb coming in the future…

If you need drugs to hit the ‘highs’ I thoroughly recommend concentrating on your orgasms more. i.e. Prolong and intensity. Go tantric etc.

Abit icky but when you know how to give and receive proper orgasm’s then you’ll see drugs as ‘artificial’.

…and used in the correct set and setting are very beneficial to individual taking part.

Same with Ecstasy(which was going to be called Empathy but it wouldn’t sell as well)/MDMA.

Empathy and an open mind can be a wonderful thing.

There’s some significant ignorant bullshit on here, but arguing either for or against something that is a personal choice is silly so I ain’t going to get involved.

But, pmsl at Hora and his ‘Go Tantric’ advice. Classic

[Yorkshireman]Its free to practice[/Yorkshireman]

Hora’s sexual guru