TJ, examples of both please, this is the fourth time i’ve asked. I’ve googled ‘Joey Barton Loses temper’ and can find NO other incidents over the last two years. do you have a different version of google?

If you look at the Wikipedia page for Barton and scroll down to the section covering the past two seasons you can find plenty of incidents that can be described as unsavoury.

It would be fascinating if he did turn up at Arsenal although I cannot see him turning them into winners.

It’s like this TJ, I used to work as a plasterer, during that time if somebody had come up to me,sworn at me and shoved me, I would have punched him; I would also have ensured (if I was able) he was not going to get up and hit me back. It is the way us lower classes behave I am afraid. At no point, and I was from time to time in fights as a young un, did I see it as anything out of the ordinary,nor did anybody else,it is just life.
Sub training ground for Building site. Barton attempting to address this reaction to confrontation and recognising that he needs to walk away, and learning to do so,as even you can surely see he had done,is to be praised.

And as you are rugby supporter please don’t call the Pederson incident an assault. I still train with a local club and I can think of a couple of fights/punches thrown already in pre-season.

duckman – I am not having that. What Barton did was not self defence by any stretch of the imagination – he beat a semi concious man into hospital. He continued to beat him while he was on the ground, he had to be dragged off him by teamamtes and he clearly still considers this to be a self defence and a normal reaction.

Thats the point he still considers he was right and its acceptable to beat an semi concious man while he lies defenseless on the ground. Now I accept he claims to be trying to change but in that interveiw which was only a few months ago he clearly states that what he did was right and aceptable. He wishes he ha dpleaded not guilty.

in that interveiw which was only a few months ago he clearly states that what he did was right and aceptable

It’s even in the part that you quoted.

He admits to ‘going overboard’ in the way he defended himself, says it’s the way he was built, the way he was raised and something he now has to deconstruct. ‘It’s a work in progress,’ he says

And where I’m from, if you throw one punch you’re in for a penny, in for a pound. I can’t just come up to you and throw one punch and then say, “Hang on a minute” when you punch me back. Which was the way Ousmane wanted it. I knew when he was coming towards me he wasn’t coming to tickle me. We’ve obviously had words and I wasn’t prepared to take the chance and I defended myself. In my opinion he was the aggressor. Ousmane is not an aggressive lad, but he was the aggressor that day and it’s a deep regret of mine that I didn’t stick with the “not guilty” plea.’

That is not the reasoning of a changed man. He thinks what he did was right and that he was hard done by With that I will leave the thread. I don’t know how you guys can keep defending this guy.

And where I’m from, if you throw one punch you’re in for a penny, in for a pound. I can’t just come up to you and throw one punch and then say, “Hang on a minute” when you punch me back. Which was the way Ousmane wanted it. I knew when he was coming towards me he wasn’t coming to tickle me. We’ve obviously had words and I wasn’t prepared to take the chance and I defended myself. In my opinion he was the aggressor. Ousmane is not an aggressive lad, but he was the aggressor that day and it’s a deep regret of mine that I didn’t stick with the “not guilty” plea.‘

Sounds fair enough to me.

Because the reasons for the fight starting are perfectly plausible and reflect real situations that many of us have encountered in life, don’t confuse that with the extent of the damage he did which he does show regret for, and has taken actions to address.

No TJ he is saying a fight happened and he defended himself – and he accepts he went over the top.
How many people would defend themselves in a fight?

he also accepts he has to change again
I am out this is pointless you wont change your opinion but it will be fun reminding you of these quotes when you are being a bleeding heart liberal on rehabilitation in the future.

Junkyard – he hit a man from behind as he walked away, he continued to beat him as he lay stunned on the ground.

Its was not a fight – it was a brutal attack albeit with provocation.

he was not defending himself =- thats the point. He is justifying his actions by saying he was defending himself.

Now a reformed character would be accepting his guilt and apologising for his actions. Not attempting to justify them on spurious grounds

Edit – of course I believe in rehabilitation. My pint here is simple Warton and others claimed he was a reformed character. He is defence of his actions that day and his refusal to accept guilt, his actions since on the field show that while he may be trying to reform he is not there yet.

well done you sucked me in but my previous statement still stands

whilst I would just love to debate how bad he was in the past , no one is diputing this. We are debating whether he has reformed or whether he has not , or whether he should be sacked for his past acts [ you may have changed from that now for all I know]

What we are discussing is whether he has reformed, whether he has tried to reform , whether he should still be employed as a footballer.
Discussing repeating this at elength will not add anything to this debate.
As does this

I am out this is pointless you wont change your opinion but it will be fun reminding you of these quotes when you are being a bleeding heart liberal on rehabilitation in the future.

He is no saint and wont win liberal of the year but he is trying to turn this around and he has committed no offences and not drunk for 2 years. You can condemn him for this, say he is going trough the motions, suggest he should not be employed because of the past if you wish but I would rather encourage his rehabilitation process.

You have helped addicts did it all go easily from the moment they quit or was it a rocky road to recovery. Changing the habits of a lifetime is not that easy and anyone who tries deserves some respect and encouragement IMHO – overall he seems to be doing quite well

Newcastle manager Alan Pardew has suggested that Joey Barton’s Newcastle career is not over. Barton has been made available on a free transfer after criticising the club on social networking site Twitter, but Pardew said: “I’ve never closed the door on anyone and I’m not closing the door on Joey.”

Joey Barton on Twitter “Does anybody have Isambard Kingdom Brunel’s number?”

anything is better than going to Stoke.

Joey Barton on Twitter “Does anybody have Isambard Kingdom Brunel’s number?”

My money is on him having a team of writers. As that is top drawer material.

My money is on him having a team of writers. As that is top drawer material.

I did think that reading some of his twitter stuff yesterday if he was getting help with it. Man U seem to have handled the twitter thing better than most clubs, its pretty clear that some of their players tweets are coming from the press office.

When I googled “joey barton twitter” yesterday, one of the first results was an article from a journalist, who had just interviewed him, saying how surprisingly intelligent he was.
Did make me wonder if part of his problems was that coming from the background he did, and going into a football academy, he missed out on a lot of education that he was capable of.

My pint here is simple

Can you get a pint of Simple? What does it taste like?

I don’t think it’s available in pints, only metric amounts such as for example two hundred and fifty millilitres.

In’t ‘millilitres’ a weird word to look at on screen/in print? Bit of a mouthful to say, an’ all.

Elfinsafety – Member

Can you get a pint of Simple? What does it taste like?

Very very bitter, with a sour aftertaste……

Pint of simple to wash down the humble pie? Can’t see it myself.

I remember seeing Newcastle score after being 4-0 down to Arsenal. Who went and picked the ball out of the net and told his teammates to “come on, we can do this” (or words to that effect)? And what did he think after the game? “We should have won 5-4” 🙂

I dunno, I suspect TeeJ’s backed himself into a corner on this one and has now turned his back on us and started to talk out of his lower colon.

He’s a typical scouser (and I say that as one), I’d be happy to see him at LFC, esp as Gerrard is gonna miss a fair bit of the season. He has that same combativeness and fireyness that typifies the best players from Liverpool, it’s no accident that Gerrard and Rooney have that same attitude and spark. Barton just doesn’t always channel it in the right way. But you can’t doubt his commitment and quality. If he can keep a lid on and walk a tight line, as Rooney and Gerrard just manage to do, he would be an asset to any team in England.

putting yourself on the market may not be too wise at the moment

gobshite…

yep a big mouth seems to be a common trait in both the player and his supporters.

You just had a player sent off you cheating gobshite. I hope you are proud.

Well. I have two points to add.

For those saying he’s the best English midfielder, LOL.

Also, he yet again proved his colours. At least now we won’t get these bollocks rumours about him coming to Arsenal. Horrible little man.

i know getting stamped on by one arsenal player and hit by an another WTF was he thinking off?

He tucked up that Arsenal lad nicely. His next dive will be better. Given that Alex Song just stamped on his calf, a classic shithouse move, a measure of justice was done.

To be fair, it was a red for the slap, but he was a bit theatrical about it. Red for both would’ve been about right.

Should have been red for both. The fact that he can throw himself to the ground with a delay after being tapped very lightly, claim several times that he was punched and then come out and say he doesn’t dive are frankly shameful.

Not really. The Arsenal player (the cheat) dived to try and cheat his way to a penalty – this is a booking, and would anger any opposing player in the league. The cheat then slapped Barton who clearly made a meal of it. Dive for a penalty and then slap someone is obviously a red. Get slapped by someone who’s just tried to cheat your team out of the game and go down easy – not close to a red.

Mix in the fact that Barton had been the victim of a properly snide dig from Song earlier on and most neutrals will feel that it was a fair outcome.

So the Arsenal player who dived and tried to get a penalty was cheating but Barton going down when hardly touched and claiming he had been punched in order to get an opponent sent off was fair enough was it .

Agree with TJ he won’t or probably can’t change , I don’t think he’s all bad , very committed if you were being kind . ( Joey Barton that is not TJ )

Just read an interview with him on BBC – ‘yeah I went down easy’.

So – that’s okay, but going down ‘easy’ when caught in the box isn’t?

Try to think about what you are saying silly boy.

I think that’s absolutely disgusting and a pretty poor example for the kids. ‘Easy’ is an adjective and the statement really needs the adverb ‘easily’ as he’s describing the verb. Deserves to be sent down for that one.

The Arsenal player didn’t dive. Barton put his oar in and then did a drama queen act and lied about the “slap” purely to get the player sent off. Nice.

all great but it ignores the fact an Arsenal player slapped him. Had it been reversed and barton “dived” then slapped Gervinho [ WTF IS GOING IN WITH THAT HAIR?} I can safely assume you would be defending Barton then?

I can safely assume you would be defending Barton then?

I don’t know, I’d call the incident if I actually saw the footage rather than make judgement based upon a hypothetical situation. I don’t have a Barton agenda but he did himself no favours yesterday despite the provocation (Song incident).

Joey Deacon’s competing in the Discus..?

At the Olympics…?

that’ll never work

Nice to see that Wenger has finally decided to start concentrating on the game too.

“I don’t understand the red card,” said Wenger. “I am 100% sure the referee did not see what happened.

“I think he has his back turned to the incident. If he had seen it, he would have sent both of them off, or nobody.”

Junkyard – he slapped Barton because Barton manhandled him. He manhandled him because he decided the ‘dive’ was cheating. So he cheated himself.

6 and two 3s but Barton has the reputation and is his own worse enemy.

i dont think barton covered himself in glory but it is hard to think of another player who would have been stamped on then hit who would get this much grief for it.
I also imagine the response if Barton had stamped and then been provoked into a slap.
It was not a great spectacle but cheating may be going a tad far. I thought it was a dive initially but I suspect that makes me wrong rather than a cheat. I suspect every premier league player would have gone down for that slap as well – this is not much defence but it cannot be used to single him out for our contempt.

If he’d have been playing for Arsenal yesterday, they probably would have won.

Too much hand-wringing overreaction to anything involving JB.

EDIT: Deux Cent 🙂