yeti you still have not proved that as a male i am a worse driver, i’m still waiting for you to show your superior intellect, if you’re inclined to think that my poor grammar and punctuation means i have less intelligence than you then you’re clearly not as clever as you think.
there are many men who have never had an accident or claim and yet they pay an increased premium based on other peoples poor driving and that is unfair.

it is not fair to be charged for the mistakes of others

You aren’t – you’re charged for the statistical chance of you having an accident based on all the information available to them. The fact you think the 40yo woman in my example should be charged more despite being vastly lower risk says enough for me to realise it’s pointless debating this further with you.

Well, all I know is that as a ‘mature’ woman driving a dull small-engined car, I seem to pay a high premium for not having had an accident for 10 years. I drive around 15K a year, mainly motorway. Only me on the insurance too.

there are many men who have never had an accident or claim and yet they pay an increased premium based on other peoples poor driving and that is unfair

Plenty of people pay into a pension all their lives and die at 66 – how unfair is that?

the statistical chance of an accident based on the information available to them is statistics from other peoples accidents not yours if you have not had any.

TSY – you need to include smilies in your posts!

Your failure to show a basic grasp of the insurance market and to really think about the questions posed on here tonight is all the evidence I need.

Refer back to my last point on the previous page if you wish… if we only pay for our own mistakes… insurance doesn’t exist. It can’t.

Statistics and probability is how insurance works.

I’ll ask you another question… I’ve never had a fire in my house what should my ‘buildings’ premium be? Free?

die at 66? that’s not unfair at all! it’s just bad luck.

Sorry C_G

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I was saving them until you showed up!

cinnamon_girl – Member
Well, all I know is that as a ‘mature’ woman driving a dull small-engined car, I seem to pay a high premium for not having had an accident for 10 years. I drive around 15K a year, mainly motorway. Only me on the insurance too.

out of interest what do you class as a high premium?

no it shouldn’t free but it shouldn’t cost more because you are a male! if you are a smoker perhaps but not because you’re male.

OK – lets explore my sidetrack how do insurance companies calculate premiums for life insurance given that none of the people taking that out have died yet?

statistically, black people might crash more than asians, christaians more than Jews! male or female, ahh yes thats fine!

About time & completely right!

Nice point on retirement age

it shouldn’t cost more because you are a male! if you are a smoker perhaps

oh were getting somewhere here so youre suggesting that smokers should pay more for fire cover on their house even if they’ve never had a house fire?

i understand perfectly well how the insurance market works and just because it is done in a particular way does not mean it’s fair. many things have been done a particular for many years and have been changed because they were not fair, it’s called progress.

mmb

This is a wind-up, right ?

yes smokers should pay more as there is an evident risk but being a male is not evidence of being a poor driver.

yes smokers should pay more as there is an evident risk but being a male is not evidence of being a poor driver

men don’t pay more because theyre worse drivers just (mainly) because they have more expensive crashes which isn’t the same thing at all yes there is evidence of this statistical evidence just the same as for smokers and fires plenty of smokers manage to go a lifetime without starting a house fire because theyre careful how unfair is it that they have to pay increased premiums

I hope so, or else I’ve been overly patronising. In which case… I apologise.

i’m happy to continue this discussion tomorrow if you like but i’m up at six and i need my sleep.
goodnight all and good talking to you! 🙂
my tune has not changed smokers pay more as the risk is proven.
goodnight till tomorrow 🙂

It’s statistically likely that I’ll be posting rubbish on here tomorrow.

Sweet dreams, x.

out of interest what do you class as a high premium?

Can’t remember exact figure but over £400 and insurance companies sneakily increase the excess each year unless you specify the amount yourself.

smokers pay more as the risk is proven

just as it is for male drivers

smokers pay more as the risk is proven

just as it is for male drivers

exactly, just as smoking is no guarantee of cancer, insurance is about future risk as well as your personal history, and the only way to determine that is statistical evidence based on the population (and your demographic) as a whole – it’s a whole business and it’s called actuary. If you don’t do that, everyone’s premium would be zero (or nominal) until you have and accident and then no insurance company would even look at you, so just as THY says, the insurance industry just wouldn’t exist.

being a male is not evidence of being a poor driver.

it does mean you are statistically more likely to crash which is the irsk you are being insured for

http://www.niassembly.gov.uk/researchandlibrary/2010/3610.pdf
for a worldwide study
and they tend to cost more when they do

The British Insurance Brokers’ Association (BIBA) said currently the cost of the average car claim by an 18-year old man was £4,400, while that for an 18-year old woman was £2,700

cinnamon_girl – Member
Can’t remember exact figure but over £400 and insurance companies sneakily increase the excess each year unless you specify the amount yourself.

thats relatively low tbh…

thats relatively low tbh…

Though as a 40yo man driving a relatively big car with 3 speeding points I pay less than £200. Some combination of where I live, my profession and the car being something I presume people don’t crash much (as opposed to most small hatches…)

Interestingly, mrs aracer pays more than me on a smaller car despite a very similar job description, a lack of any speeding points and no claims in the last 15 years (I’ve had a few, but the most recent more than 5 years ago, so irrelevant). Don’t suppose she’ll be impressed if her premiums go up and mine go down!

Low!!!!

My car is group 23 with 6 years protected no claims, £300 excess and breakdown cover. I’m about the same age as CG and I thought £310 fully comp was expensive 😯

Slightly OT but I do feel a need to rant in this general subject area.

Just bought my first new car. Before doing so, checked with my existing insurers what my new premium would be.

Ring up today to arrange swapping the insurance over. Apparently they can’t insure me because the wheel size the car has is different to their records, even though it’s a brand new vehicle, the wheels are mfr fitted parts, and are standard issue on higher spec models of the same car. Absolute imbeciles of the highest order…

Most infuriating part of the entire 30 minute conversation: “Is there anything else I can help you with?” The urge to point out that she hadn’t exactly helped in the first place was too great…

Still chuckling at all these people who truly don’t grasp the actuarial science behind it.

I spent 12 years in claims dealing with some horrific photos and medical reports following accidents, and I can’t recall a bad one that was caused by a woman. At the time we were the insurer dealing with the first £1 million pound damages settlement and had the record damages award in Northern Ireland as well. As my boss ruefully pointed out, that’s like San Marino winning the European and World Cups!

The number one cause of death in young women is apparently their driver boyfriends. That should make people think a bit about cause and effect (though the dead ones are, usually, cheaper than the badly injured ones)

Since when has insurance been ‘fair’ anyhow. I pay more for my insurance because I’ve lived abroad (so not accrued no claims bonus), because I’ve had someone crash into a hire car I was driving and because my car was stolen after a burglary. Not really fair (i live at a different address to the burglary so the risk based on address doesn’t fit) but it’s how insurance works.

Insurance isn’t even logical nevermind fair. Adding my dad onto my insurance reduces the premium by 100 quid even though he lives hours away and has points on his licence.

I’m guessing all the people moaning about premiums high at 300 quid are 40 plus – you’re a little out of touch with reality

The Southern Yeti – Member
Ah FFS, my initial assertion has been proved correct. Insure yourself against pointless typing by not entering into debates with people who don’t use capital letters.

POSTED 12 HOURS AGO # REPORT-POST
Pure STW magic 🙂

C_G, how about paying 1200 quid TPFT for a OAP caravan AKA Pug 406 estate worth maybe 700 quid if cleaned? That’s what my mate was quoted (35y.o. male, Surbiton, garage, alarm, immobiliser, tracker fitted, no points, no convictions, no commuting) recently.

BTW Shall we insist that if you’re a male who shaves his balls you pay more?

Here’s another perspective: If an insurer has better information than most which identifies groups of people that have fewer accidents (volvo owners who shop at Waitrose and are CTC members, say) they can charge them slightly less than the competition, and fill up their book with safe, low cost drivers.

They’re all looking for the safe drivers whose premiums they can discount, and they’ll carry on researching, recording claims data in more granular ways, and tweaking pricing algorithms.

They’re trying hard to be as accurate as they can, because being more accurate than the competition means they can be cheaper than the competition while still making money.

That’s the idea, but there’s loads of them all doing the same thing and, as an industry sector, it’ll carry on losing money…

I’m guessing all the people moaning about premiums high at 300 quid are 40 plus – you’re a little out of touch with reality

Yes! I’ve been driving for around 35 years and have always had ‘dull’ cars as it were cos they don’t interest me. Not claiming to be a good driver at all but, fingers crossed, no speeding tickets.

The reality is that my premium has virtually doubled within the last few years and I suspect part of this is due to uninsured drivers.

Edit: Hairychested – blimey! 😯

And tbh in my case the insurance premiums don’t really seem related to the car I drive – as its rarely changed over the years, while the cars have.

But then since the real cost of an accident is in the 3rd party costs, is that a surprise?

my insurance is £1600 per year, £200-400 is something i will never experience, oldies, consider yourself lucky, not hard done by

I’m 28 and pay £240 for an mx-5 and similar again for a diesel mondeo. Don’t need to be old for cheap premiums 🙂

mmb were you on radio 1 newsbeat yesterday stating that mean have more accidents becasue more of them are on the road at a time? 😆

how about paying 1200 quid TPFT for a OAP caravan AKA Pug 406 estate worth maybe 700 quid if cleaned? That’s what my mate was quoted (35y.o. male, Surbiton, garage, alarm, immobiliser, tracker fitted, no points, no convictions, no commuting) recently.

Blimey – that’s exactly what my <£200 quote is for, and I don’t have quite a lot of those things. My only plus points are postcode, 6 years in age and possibly profession – though they’re quite big plus points.

I’m guessing all the people moaning about premiums high at 300 quid are 40 plus – you’re a little out of touch with reality

It depends what you mean by “reality”. There are actually rather more drivers over 40 than under.