you misunderstood yourself Mol, so no hope for the rest of us 😉

*waves* hi molgrips…. i can almost feel you struggling to keep yourself from typing!

(EDIT, – i was too late!)

i’ve got a Gymduction (see what i did there?) on monday

I’ve just finished a stint with a PT and found it very usefull. Cost £300 for 12 1 hour sessions. What I learnt was that ‘for me’ cardio used as a warm up only, then onto free weights as using these rather than the resistance machines helps build core stability, mix the general free weights with kettle bell sessions- weight work included lots of upper body, core work and lots and lots of various squat exercises- finish with interval training on the bike. Interval training usually consisted 1km sprint followed by 1 minute rest, carry on till can’t anymore. I learnt lots of exercises and also had my eating habits dissected! Was unsure about a PT at first but now think it was money well spent.

Not read all the posts but surely there will be an instructor on hand that can devise a programme for you?

I’m going to try and get some better all round exercise this winter. I was considering gym workouts but then I thought something like a martial arts workout, yoga or rock climbing would be much better, and more fun. Going to look into the martial arts thing.

Anyone want to volunteer to beat me up?

1)Warm up for 10 mins on running machine, cross trainer or rower at RPE of 5/50% or max HR.
2)Dynamic stretches
3)perform 3 sets of 10 – 15 reps with a weight that leads to failure on the last reps of the final set. Rest 45 secs between each set.
Shoulder press
chest press
Pec flyes
Leg press
Lat pull down
Sit ups
Warm down on cycle for 10 mins starting at RPE 5 gradually reducing effort.
Static stretched, hold each one for 30 secs.
Re-hydrate.
If you are returning to the gym or starting out, use the machines for the weight exercises, moving onto free-weights when strength is built up. Free weights will use Stabilisers and Fixator muscles, leading to a better workout.
Increase intensity/weight as you see fit. Get coached in the proper technique for Olympic squat.

Between 1 or 2 people on here you can get all the advice that a good PT will give you.

What you can’t get from here is someone making sure you exercise with good form. A class like body pump (providing the instructor is good) should sort this for you.
Obviously if you’ve got the money Yoshimi is right, the PT will also work you harder than you may work yourself.

Gymduction? Dungeddit, who cares about brains when you’ve got bicpes like these….

Dunno whether I’d bother listening to half the people on here, they dont have a clue.

All they know of strength and fitness is having a stroll on a treadmill in a nice, warm, cosey gym on a cold winters evening. Its not the way to do it if you want to build strength and fitness. Gyms are great place to go if your incredibly vain and want to get the “toned” look. However, this isnt real world strength, its just a look and its not going to help you at all when your out in sub zero temperatures on a wet, muddy mountain side.

Look at all the greats:- Sir Edmund Hillary, Clint Eastwood and George Foreman to name but a few. You wouldnt catch them in a nice, warm, cosey gym. Strength and fitness is earned through hard, physical graft.

My favoured technique through winter is to spend 4 nights a week putting up stone walls on a local farm. I usually pack a rucksack with my tools and clothes and a bit of bait and then run the 10 miles to the farm (can be further if Im working on the fells). Spend the next four and a half hours drystone walling then run back. On a friday night I’ll usually take a bivvy bag and sleep “in the field” over night so I can get an early start on the saturday morning.

I’ve never been beaten up a hill by anyone at my local trail centre

Anyone want to volunteer to beat me up?

[Tannoy] Shiboleth to the forum please, Mr Shiboleth [Tannoy]

🙄 @davidtaylforth

I think the general conclusion is:

Don’t ask STW for fitness/gym advice…

Mol – sounds good. I’ll lend you some pads though if you want them…
Good martial arts training involves circuits/press ups that you can mostly do at home/any gym anyway. The stretching is handy but again you can do it at home/a gym.

‘and a bit of bait’ – can’t you just heave fish out of the sea with your mental robustness?

Make that 2 or 3 people. DavidTaylforth makes a lot of sense.

Although you’ll not catch Clint, George and Eddie fannying around at a trail centre. Last I heard they were doing relay sprints up Everest with Chuck.

Yoshimi is right, the PT will also work you harder than you may work yourself.

Damn right………after each session I was reduced to a sweating, slavering mess and sometimes couldn’t ever lift my arms high enougfh to wash my hair in the shower……..they work you hard 😯

Gyms are great place to go if your incredibly vain and want to get the “toned” look.

Then you picked the wrong gym.
“Toned” is a phrase used to get people into gyms, telling them they are going to build muscle puts a lot of people off, especially women.

I recommend getting at least a proper induction (not the 15 min run-through used in most gyms to satisfy H&S regs) before you start. Tell the instructor/PT what you want to achieve and if they are any good they will advise accordingly.

And of course if you want to loose weight then cut out Alcohol.

Reminds self never to ask for gym workout advice on here.

emsz – but we’re here to help…

Agree with Every – gyms are the best place to increase overall strength which comes in handy for pretty much every sport.

I’m less convinced of the benefits for cardio fitness – IMO just getting out there and running/cycling/whatever is best. Hours on a treadmill/rowing machine just don’t do as good a job.

Always used cardio machines just for warmimg up, not to increase fitness.

Surf-Mat – never tried a spinning class then?

TSY – yes. I’d rather cycle fast.

Reminds self never to offer gym workout advice on here.

Surf-Mat – even in the sleepy backwaters of Cornwall I imagine that your cycling fast is interrupted by the occasional bit of traffic or errant livestock.

Spinning, like a turbo-trainer, allows focus on just one thing. With the advantage of an instructor shouting at you for a bit of additional motivation!

**** the gym, go swimming.

Muhammad Ali never lifted a weight.

He was the greatest boxer of all time.

He ran.

I am lucky enough to sit next to a PT at work and my gym are also pretty clued up and have been really helpful in putting a plan together.

The consistent theme is cardio for between 20 and 40 minutes a session no more than that and then work a single group of muscles hard for maybe another 20-40 minutes.

It seems to be working for me.

I’ve not read most of the posts on the thread but my thoughts:

Spinning class is a great way to build power ime – it helped me a lot for climbing out of the saddle on the road bike. Intervals also burn calories. Plus you’ll push yourself harder in a spin class than you would on the bike in the gym.

Weights are important. Being female i wasn’t very strong when i started riding. I’ve been doing weights two or three times a week for the last 4 years or so and its really helped – i very rarely get sore or tired muscles even on long rides. I spend about 1hr 30 on a weights session and do everything from squats on the powerplate, to planks, deadlifts, bench press, press ups (trying to beat my record of 83 is tough!), lunges with weights, leg press, clean and press (helped me to be able to lift my bike over gates etc) upper body stuff and abs. I feel more tired after a weights session than a ride! Having lean muscle will also burn slightly more calories than having a higher % of body fat. Don’t be afraid of bulking up as you won’t – i’m 5’3″, a size 8/10 despite weight training. For a while i had a PT who was also my sport masseuse which was brilliant as he identified where my weak areas were through the massage and we worked on them in the gym, but at my current gym, most of the PTs are a waste of space. IME, lifting weights once a week won’t give you results, it needs to be a minimum of 2.

Running: This will improve your leg strength and CV fitness. Where you can, opt to do your cv outside as things like wind and uneven terrain will make your workout harder and burn more calories.

I’ve tried doing weights following by spinning/run, splitting my sessions with weights in the morning, and spinning/run in the evening, and have now settled on training 6 days a week doing weights on different days from my cv so i get the most out of my workouts as i’ve specific running and road riding goals. Play around with your workout to see what works best for you, but doing weights after a cv session will mean you won’t get maximum benefit from the weights as your muscles will be tired.

In terms of losing weight/eating better, keeping a food diary is good – i was shocked at the amount of junk calories i was eating compared to normal food.

I’ll stick to my own routine, I’m not telling you lot what I do, even if I did nobody would take any notice.

Kev

Surf-Mat – even in the sleepy backwaters of Cornwall I imagine that your cycling fast is interrupted by the occasional bit of traffic or errant livestock.

Spinning, like a turbo-trainer, allows focus on just one thing. With the advantage of an instructor shouting at you for a bit of additional motivation!

It’s probably one of the best indoor workouts BUT I still think getting out there and blitzing some miles on a road/mountain bike beats it hands down.

Having said that my sister dropped from a size 14-16ish to an 8-10 almost all by doing gym related stuff including spinning. She’s now quite an exercise addict!

Mat, there is no doubt what I’d rather do, but in 45 mins on my lunch break, ain’t really got the option.

I’ve been using some of the routines from this site.

MTB Strength Training

One of the few MTB specific weight training website I have found. I use mostly freeweights at home (Powerblocks – expensive but very useful and don’t require any storage space).

Another tip that I would say when considering weights is to use compound moves that have more than one form of movement. Say performing a front squat with a shoulder press on the up movement. There are a few places to learn compound moves and this is great way to get more exercise in less time, and it exercises the core muscles as well.

Also don’t forget the core muscles, it is all well and good getting strong quads, biceps, etc but if the frame that holds them together is weak this will translate into back ache and overcompensation from inefficient muscle use on the bike.

A conventional gym will get you conventional results. What you want to be doing is this: http://www.crossfit.com/ I’ve not long started and have been making fantastic progress.

handstand push ups! 😯

Try freestanding ones – I get to 3 then fall over.

I couldn’t even do a handstand, never mind push myself up

Good martial arts training involves…

Mat, how about I come down and fight you. We could slag off each other’s cars, that’d give us real motivation for a good workout.

Just had a thought though – getting out there and hammering on a bike is a good workout but it occurred to me that if you are a slip of a girl you might not have the strength to be able to do this particularly well (of course there are many small but strong women etc etc etc etc). Some strength work in a gym could help there.

Right. How about those that are suggesting using weight lifts to increase cardiovascular fitness, explain their reasoning. I am truly lost by the suggestion.

I’d recommend Dorian Yates’ book. OK, the prose style is for 15 year old boys, but the susbtance is good. His theory is that weight training should be hard, because you need to take your muscle to the point of failure and beyond. Because you can’t train that hard for a long time, it needs to be short. He asks, why do people do multiple sets? What’s the point of the second or third set? Why not go all out on one set (after a proper warm up)?

My not try the following; Deadlifts (works pretty much the whole of the back of the body), step-ups (working the thights, but allows a lighter load that squats), chins (works the lats and the biceps and grip) and dips (works tricps, pecs, shoulders). Throw in some ab work, and Bob’s your uncle. Do a good run on the treadmill beforehand, and you can get a very good workout in a relatively short time.

No one is suggesting using weights to improve cardio fitness, at least I’m not.

But resistance training is effective for fat loss, and enhanced upper body and core condition will improve performance on the bike. In addition, using the cardio equipment for intervals will improve ability on the bike more than steady state.

Intervals and resistance work – which I suggest is done using dumbells/medicine balls and instability exercises (swiss balls/beams/balance boards), is in my mind the most effective use of time in the gym.

Just spouting cardio cardio cardio is lazy and or ignorant of the priciples behind cycling performance

getting out there and hammering on a bike is a good workout but it occurred to me that if you are a slip of a girl you might not have the strength to be able to do this particularly well

I’m not exactly a slip of a girl, probably about average tbh. BMI is right in the middle of ‘normal’ anyway. I can ride for ages so endurance isnt a problem really, its the strength and extra fitness needed for climbing. Problem with the winter is I dont get so much time to get out on the bike because I dont like riding in the dark on my own!

OP wants to lose weight, gain fitness and get stronger for riding the bike. OP doesnt need to gain muscle, they will improve their power to weight ratio simply by losing weight and gaining cardio fitness. Increased upper body strength, like most of the folk up there are suggesting, will do very little for bike handling skills. Better to go and improve technique. Very few biking skills rely on brute force and ignorance.

You really haven’t a clue have you SBZ? You can enhance strength without adding muscle mass – ever wonder how weight lifters can improve without going up a weight category? No thought not.

No one has suggested developing brute force and the ignorance is displayed by poorly trained and misinformed ‘experts’.

As I said, intervals and functional resistance training is the best way to get the results the OP is after.