Help protect our national parks from fracking!

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  • Help protect our national parks from fracking!
  • fourbanger
    Member

    What are the pros and cons?

    Premier Icon kimbers
    Subscriber

    Potential pollution problems aside I suppose that an area being cracked would be closed to the public

    Premier Icon stumpyjon
    Subscriber

    What exactly are we protecting them from? The foot print of a fracking site and associated infrastructure probably isn’t much bigger than a trail centre car park or farm yard. The sites aren’t intended to pollute the land around them, in fact legislation and monitoring around them will be much tighter than your average farm yard. Farms for example have a pretty poor record when it comes to environmental pollution.

    Premier Icon Pawsy_Bear
    Subscriber

    No thanks I’m for diversifying our energy sources

    Premier Icon colin9
    Subscriber

    I am broadly a supporter of fracking.

    Premier Icon jamj1974
    Subscriber

    Pros: –
    – increased dividends to shareholders of utility companies
    – potential for cheaper energy (some debate)
    – increased revenue from corporate taxation (yeah right…!)

    Cons: –
    – continuing pollution from prolonged fossil fuel use
    – pollution caused directly by extraction
    – cost of subsidy/tax break to ‘encourage’ exploration and production
    – potential for reduced or impaired access to parks
    – environmental impacts including destabilisation etc…

    Premier Icon Pik n Mix
    Subscriber

    Frack on I say.

    steezysix
    Member

    Pros: some people will make a lot of money from fracking.

    Cons: it won’t be you or me. There’s also the environmental damage, the fact that it will undoubtedly restrict public access to certain areas and it sets a precedent for future schemes to be allowed in UK wilderness areas.

    I’m normally not one to sign up for online stuff as there’s two sides to every debate, but fracking just seems like a terrible idea to me. Money should be invested in sustainable energy, not stuff like this.

    crosshair
    Member

    I’m not a big fan of the National Parks. A bit too ‘Scottish’ an idea for my liking. So no, I’m not against a bit of exploratory Fracking.

    Premier Icon jamj1974
    Subscriber

    colin9 – Member
    I am broadly a supporter of fracking.

    That’s fair enough – room for two sides on an issue after all… If there is a pro cracking petition and you feel strongly about it you could start a thread! πŸ™‚

    gonefishin
    Member

    I’m not a big fan of the National Parks. A bit too ‘Scottish’ an idea for my liking.

    Eh? The first national park in England was designated in 1951, the first in scotland was over 50 years later in 2002. In what way is that a “Scottish” idea?

    crosshair
    Member

    What, ‘sustainable’ like a chuffing great steel-giant of a wind farm you mean?? the ones that are never going around because it’s too windy? The ones which have further blotted another hundred square miles of countryside with the endless miles of pylons and cables?

    Or the ugly acres of solar-farms, sprayed to within an inch of their lives to keep the weeds at bay and all facing South so we get a surge of power at lunch time when nobody needs it??

    Let’s build a Nuclear power station and have done with it. If they lose the vote, we’ll build it in Scotland to say thanks and show we care about the Scottish economy πŸ˜€

    crosshair
    Member

    @gonefishin All a bit ‘power to the people’ ‘let’s tell the farmers what to do’ for my liking.

    Junkyard
    Member

    crosshair wrote:

    I’m not a big fan of the National Parks. A bit too ‘Scottish’ an idea for my liking. So no, I’m not against a bit of exploratory Fracking.

    the national parks are only in england and wales

    I am not sure why th e”nationality” of an idea woudl make you pro another

    What about democracy …not a fan as it is a bit Greek?

    Premier Icon jamj1974
    Subscriber

    Or the ugly acres of solar-farms, sprayed to within an inch of their lives to keep the weeds at bay and all facing South so we get a surge of power at lunch time when nobody needs it??

    Bit like traditional power stations that used to stay on line all night and hence the promotion of economy 7…

    Premier Icon jamj1974
    Subscriber

    Or the ugly acres of solar-farms, sprayed to within an inch of their lives to keep the weeds at bay and all facing South so we get a surge of power at lunch time when nobody needs it??

    Bit like traditional power stations that used to stay on line all night and hence the promotion of economy 7…

    crosshair
    Member

    I just couldn’t believe how much the Scottish interfere with their private landowners. I was only up there a week and our hosts had about five visits from interfering jobsworths measuring this, assessing that and counting the other. It struck me that the National Park movement here was very similar in its outlook.

    I’m a big supporter of the American National Park movement but over here it’s just a bit un-English πŸ˜‰ πŸ˜€

    Just an opinion………

    Don’t get me started on planning permission and so called Heritage either πŸ˜€

    gonefishin
    Member

    Well if you mean left wing then come out and say that rather than trying to hide behind some slightly weak xenophobic garbage. Scottish people aren’t some homogenous mass with identical political viewpoints. That said given that the current government is guttering criticism for it’s protection of the national parks due the proximity of some cabinet ministers constituencies, it would seem like the right seem to think they are a pretty good idea!

    psst Junkyard, there are two in scotland too. Loch Lomond and Caringorm.

    steezysix
    Member

    Actually, I’m including nuclear when I say sustainable. Offshore wind farms and hydro electric power are also options if your delicate eyes are easily offended…

    crosshair
    Member

    No, not just left wing. It’s more subtle than that. A kind of patronising arrogance only found in slimy Salmonoids of the Alex variety πŸ˜€

    @steezysix I just can’t believed we’ve unwittingly visually-raped half of our countryside for some dubious wind-power with barely a consultation. I couldn’t believe how many Scotland have got- an absolute travesty.

    Junkyard
    Member

    I’m a big supporter of the American National Park movement but over here it’s just a bit un-English

    Just an opinion..
    There are owned by the state and ours are not is that what you meant by Un english?Not enough state ownership?

    obvious troll is obvious

    Premier Icon andytherocketeer
    Subscriber

    Frack on I say.

    and more nukes.

    will make my mind up based on science, not media scaremongering and political bs

    Premier Icon jamj1974
    Subscriber

    Hi,

    If you want to protect out national parks from fracks go you may want to sign this!

    Here!

    Jay

    brooess
    Member

    I’m happy for fracking to take place so long as the risks are properly identified and mitigated against which I know is a big ask.

    There’s a lot to be said for diversifying our energy sources and there’s certainly political risk from expecting to get our gas cheap from Russia for the forseeable. If it drops energy prices and supports economic growth/helps pay off the national debt (which is huge and growing) then well-managed fracking could help sort out a lot of our problems

    Instead of spending time being anti-fracking, thinking about how to reduce the pollution from excessive use of cars and lorries might be a bit more constructive IMO

    Is there even any evidence that fracking will take place in our national parks or is it just a story that NIMBYs like to tell? (note there’s not a single source for any of the claims made in the petition other than a link to a Guardian article!)

    I remember when Chris Bonnington put forward a proposal to ban driving in the Lakes and there was a hell of a fuss…

    crosshair
    Member

    Junkyard, not trolling at all. America is so different to here- so much bigger and a lot less populated.
    There version is all about wonder at nature, education and a sense of pride. Ours is more centred on controlling people and petty bureaucracy.

    Premier Icon deadkenny
    Subscriber

    I’m all for it if it means more laughing at newsreaders talking about fracking πŸ˜€

    And nuclear… nuke away πŸ˜€ . Cleanest and long term the only option. If we just hide that waste that is πŸ˜‰

    Premier Icon MoreCashThanDash
    Subscriber

    Think broess sums up my views – what he said!

    dobiejessmo
    Member

    Fracking in the Peaks will be interesting!!!!.They keep banning vehicles of the green lanes see what they do with that?Suppose be a lot of shale gas under the Peaks.I expect they will do it around Buxton near the Quarries out of the National Park πŸ˜‰

    athgray
    Member

    I’m not a big fan of the National Parks. A bit too ‘Scottish’ an idea for my liking. So no, I’m not against a bit of exploratory Fracking.

    National Parks were first created in England and Wales. 10 parks were created in the 1950’s. Scotland has only recently created 2 National Parks in 2002 and 3003.

    I am not against fracking in the right locations and with suitable controls.

    Premier Icon deadkenny
    Subscriber

    God forbid they frack in the New Forest. They can’t even cope with bikes without frothing at the mouth.

    El-bent
    Member

    I am broadly a supporter of fracking.

    I would be surprised if they get away with it in the national parks, the public opposition would be enormous, they will simply have to frack in places like under your house, since this Government is looking to prevent you from opposing that from happening.

    Or what about in our forests? You know the ones this Government tried to sell off, and have quietly re-introduced that notion, in the very same paper that sets out how Lord brown is going to wreck the place with fracking.

    He did such a good job in the gulf of Mexico.

    There’s a lot to be said for diversifying our energy sources and there’s certainly political risk from expecting to get our gas cheap from Russia for the forseeable.

    We don’t get our gas from Russia.

    If it drops energy prices and supports economic growth/helps pay off the national debt (which is huge and growing) then well-managed fracking could help sort out a lot of our problems

    What, you think energy companies are clamouring to invest in fracking just to sell it to you cheap? πŸ˜†

    Premier Icon midlifecrashes
    Subscriber

    Oil doesnt have to be massively intrusive. A big chunk of D Day was only possible because 3.5 million barrels were extracted from Sherwood Forest at Eakring with only a few hundred people ever knowing about it. The wells went on to total 47 million barrels, with very little to see on the ground that couldn’t be hidden with a bit of shrubbery. I’d much rather a bit of (careful) drilling and fracking than going cap in hand to that nice Mr Putin.

    jekkyl
    Member

    Frack on…. frack off!

    b r
    Member

    OP If you want it banning in the ‘National Parks’, does that mean you are happy for it to happen next to my house (which isn’t in a National Park)?

    There’s a Map on the DECC website which shows 14th onshore round of licensing blocks under offer, as well as blocks currently under licence.

    Premier Icon deadkenny
    Subscriber

    El-bent – Member
    We don’t get our gas from Russia

    Maybe, maybe not, but possibly will do.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/energy/oilandgas/10715674/Where-is-our-gas-coming-from-Centrica.html

    Premier Icon kimbers
    Subscriber

    I’ll confess to being sceptical about the claims of fracking offering a huge boost to our economy

    I’m sure i read an analysis somewhere stated that the majority of the north seal oil boom money got sunk into the London property markets, helping to drive up our housing bubble debt based economy
    If we had a Norwegian style sovereign wealth fund then things might be different

    Oil companies need to big up their reserves to keep the share price high, don’t believe the hype !

    As for fracking national Parks I suppose it depends how lax the laws are they can drill horizontally from quite a distance so it should possible to avoid conflicts with users

    And pollution (from shale fracking, they’ve been fracking gas and oil onshore in the uk since the 80s). There’s been some examples of groundwater contamination in the USA and the small earthquakes near Blackpool show that you need to be careful but accidents can happen

    Premier Icon Nipper99
    Subscriber

    Less intrusive than covering the hills with windmills.

    GEDA
    Member

    Can’t we just leave it where it is until we know if the technique messes up water tables etc? It’s not going anywhere and as a resource leaving it in the ground can only make it more valuable. Win all round in my book. Oh yes we are not interested in long term stuff just short term gain.

    Premier Icon Nobeerinthefridge
    Subscriber

    Less intrusive than covering the hills with windmills.

    Such a lovely way to mill flour though.

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