EU Referendum – are you in or out?

Good. Nice tight bill. Almost got it onto two lines.

They are getting the hang of this now,

Odd how there are no comments from the Remainers here now we have the A50 Bill and Labour has announced a three line whip to ensure it’s passed 8)

Did I say the entire EU would collapse or that I want it to ? I don’t think so. It’s fundamentally broken and require wholesale change but the core members are too tied to it politically to allow it to disintergrate. The euro will change, it cannot continue. @Edukator the issue with what you call eurobonds is that Germany quite rightly has no enthusiasm for being liable for the debts (and total loack of financial discipline) of Southern Europe.

Ok I’ll bite. One countries lack of financial discipline as another’s creative accounting.

A few Lab MPs have announced they’ll defy the whip and few have announced they will tow the line.

The party is ruined and really should reform as two new parties, an opposition that acts like a box full of angry cats is not doing anyone any favours. Who knows how they will vote on the day.

Odd how there are no comments from the Remainers here now we have the A50 Bill and Labour has announced a three line whip to ensure it’s passed

Eh? What were you expecting? And what are you inferring?

Odd how you can’t get your head around that most remainers have accepted that 50 is going to get fired, it is a truly stupid thing to do but as you are a Trump fan and don’t mind getting on your knees to guzzle from Donald then keep gloating over your support for this disaster.

That is when the hard work begins.

Nothing to bite on. We’ve covered the role of MPs over and over already. Nothing has changed. We still expect nothing useful from the majority of them. We’ve covered Labour’s predicament, and the failure of their leader, in boring detail, from the very start of the campaign.

@Edukator the issue with what you call eurobonds is that Germany quite wrongly has no enthusiasm for being recycling its surpluses to the deficit countries of Southern Europe preferring to hide behind the mirage of German financial discipline.

FTFY

Hence the system is bust at its core. Not that this is a reason to stop being a member, outside of the € and Shengen etc. Still that horse has bolted now.

Jezza’s done well today – only one resignation from his front bench. He must have feared more from the whipping. Why do visions of Diane Abbot suddenly spring to mind?

jambalaya – Member
Odd how there are no comments from the Remainers here now we have the A50 Bill and Labour has announced a three line whip to ensure it’s passed

Mainly because I for one am waiting to see what actually happens.
We’re told 50 labour rebels minimum plus some tories – we’ll see.
We’re told Corbyn won’t oppose it but will propose amendments – again, we’ll see.
And we know that the libdems and SNP will propose amendments – we’ll see how many are deemed to be more than vexatious time wasting.
So really today is just the opening of the piece- whether it’s long or short remains to be seen.
It could all be over by early next week and this country will have committed another act of self harm.

If there are too many amendments, the gov will simply use the guillotine. They are making the timetable a key performance indicator.

Indeed. Some might still get through though.

Now remind me. Can the parliament act be used on this bill? I seem to recall it can’t but I’m not certain.

MPs are in general reflecting their constituencies. Seems perfectly reasonable to me 😉 The notion that somehow Brexit is a Government policy which should be contested by the opposition is wrong. It’s a cross party issue.

Corbyn’s 3-line whipping shows his true EU colours too, he has always been against. A true left wing agenda isn’t possible whilst being a member of the EU.

Supposedly Blair was cozying up to Junker yesterday (after a Holocaust memorial event he was invited to speak at)

No amendments will get through imho. Far too many will vote for, we already have the “Labour Bill” and a commitment for a White Paper by May – sort of literally, after March and before June 🙂

jambalaya – Member
MPs are in general reflecting their constituencies. Seems perfectly reasonable to me

There are worse things I suppose. Unfortunately we have Julian “alternative referendum facts” Sturdy here. He is currently denying which way his constituency voted.

You may be right Jamba. But a very sad day for our country and our children is it goes through as is (not great if it goes through at all).
The Brexies will have ruined a once great country. They will never be forgiven.

+1 iigm

Most folk will have to get use to an ongoing drop in their living standards…

You know I think very differently, this will be the making of our country and a much brighter future for our country for my kids and grandkids.

My original gybe at Remainers is we have had months of court / high court nonsense and now we see the result – an uktra short bill and a 3-line Labour whip. All for nought really (and @Mike is quite right to have asked why this didn’t happen months ago without a court case)

Quick reminder the pm’s constituency voted remain. I assume she will vote against the bill.
Some days you would think the vote was a landslide majority….

What it really means is coming out in the excitement of a few here. Leave at any cost, no matter the cost leaving is all that matters.

“What it really means is coming out in the excitement of a few here. Leave at any cost, no matter the cost leaving is all that matters.”

Ruining the UK isn’t a vote winner so what it really means is that some better informed people have looked at the facts and reckon it’s not going to be too problematic.

Ruining the UK isn’t a vote winner so what it really means is that some better informed people have looked at the facts and reckon it’s not going to be too problematic.

Excuse me while I take a moment here…
Find me one of those experts. Let’s see how the vote goes, anyway as nobody has seen the plan even the mp’s who in reality don’t know what sort of leap into the dark they are voting for (except for a tory lead ideological hard brexit) I think your just making shit up.

Jamba

You seem to see this as a party political thing, it isn’t, it’s proper stuff this and quite frankly I don’t care what Corbin says either as he’s as ideological crackers as Davis and Fox and co.

Real world impact will be huge on the average worker and eventually even the pensioners will be hit as we’ll not have the cash and won’t be able to borrow it (and the Tories have shown themselves to like to borrow, how bigs the debt mountain now?).

My original gybe at Remainers is we have had months of court / high court nonsense

Hang on. Nonsense? You don’t care about due process of law? You want whatever PM happens to be in power to be able to do whatever they want without scrutiny?

Like hell you do. You are just heavily biased towards ‘your’ side so you just cheer them on regardless.

Very poor show.

I honestly wish I had the same blind faith as the brexiteers on here 🙂
Life must just be fab! Although presumably you need to be wary of buying any magic beans from random street vendors.

jambalaya – Member
No amendments will get through imho. Far too many will vote for, we already have the “Labour Bill” and a commitment for a White Paper by May – sort of literally

Sort of literally? Say what now?

Why wouldn’t MPs force amendments, the white paper is more vague than vague Mc Vaguey face from from vaguesvilles academy of experts in vaguenes.

Given the gravity of the situation, MPs would be irresponsible and abhorrent not to force amendments.

My original gybe at Remainers is we have had months of court / high court nonsense… …and @Mike is quite right to have asked why this didn’t happen months ago without a court case)

Hang on. Nonsense? You don’t care about due process of law?[/quote]
It didn’t happen months ago without a court case because someone made it a court case. Which was upheld. Twice.

Molgrips +1

Why wouldn’t MPs force amendments, the white paper is more vague than vague Mc Vaguey face from from vaguesvilles academy of experts in vaguenes.

Is it? How can you be so sure when it hasnt been published yet.

Is it? How can you be so sure when it hasnt been published yet.

Dude… it’s all over the internet…sigh.
EDIT.. sorry I’m confusing Bill with white paper..

The bill isn’t worth the paper it’s written on.

Which isn’t saying much considering the volatility of currency right now.

There has been an extraordinary shift in this debate. Before the vote, it was the Brexshiteers making crap up. Now the whole thing has flipped on its head and it’s remainers who have taken over the BS role.

What is the world coming to?

It’s odd when May comes out looking like one of the few sane people left, despite her track record.

May could have accepted the original verdict.

Displaying a lack of judgement she wasted my taxes on going back to court.

You are right Jamba. This verdict changes nothing- we had the decision before Christmas. Just a Brexy government wasting money. Something we’ll have to get used to.

Now the whole thing has flipped on its head and it’s remainers who have taken over the BS role.

Really??
I’d be 99% confident that the white paper holds no more useful information than one of May’s massive speaches.
What else is being made up THM?
You seem to have your own reasons for wanting to do this as fast as possible, I get the uncertainty part but also going in completely unprepared (as I pointed out there was a select comittee talking to business leaders this week – no reports from that yet) understaffed on negotiators is a big leap.

Many of us are also deeply uncomfortable giving an exceptional amount of power to what will effectivly be an unacountable group of people with no oversight from parliament.

teamhurtmore – Member
it’s remainers who have taken over the BS role.

Yeah like asking for considered, thought out logical long term plans and strategies. Total BS. Who needs plans when we are going to have a red white and blue brexit?

Mike you are correct on the white paper.

Without Gina, most people wouldn’t have had the slightest clue or even issue with the royal prerogative, judging by many recent comments they still do not.

Matty QED.

jambalaya – Member
You know I think very differently, this will be the making of our country and a much brighter future for our country for my kids and grandkids.

By the time your grandkids are our age I doubt there will be a UK. Brexit is a nail in the coffin of an ever more disunited set of kingdoms.

In other news, I’ve been asked to go to the States to assist with the UK’s charm offensive on trade etc. (In a very junior role of course)

I’m just disgusted, there’s noise in the press that ex pats might be denied health care without paying significant ‘fees’.

My old man lives in Spain, and gets free care as he’s paid uk tax all his life, and that could be taken away because the UK is too lazy to claim the cash back, so to speak.

Not only do I disagree with this abhorrent lethargy on the part of the NHS, it’s now becoming very personal… leavers are quite simply becoming my enemies.

Sounds like congrats are in order IGM. Enjoy it!

(are you a “germaphobe” too?!?)

I’m just bemused.

But we have just had a 0.6% growth quarter (lots of shopping)
We made 1.7m cars last year (all cars built in the last quarter were produced at a loss due to the pounds decline)

“Things can only get better” come on let’s all sing along.

Forgot to mention our £557m for the Northern Powerhouse – job done no need to worry about Nissan f****g off.

I am not sure that any of the political **** wits running the exit strategy have ever actually been involved in running an actual business in the real world.