EU Referendum – are you in or out?

it looks like a pretty strong commitment to me

They wrote it on a bus

it might not quite say it directly, but it’s as close as makes no difference

if we took that money back we could spend it on the NHS.”

Rarely have so many voices agreed with me in unison, that no one actually said they were going to spend £350m a week on the NHS

Before claiming that the supposed doom-mongering hasn’t come to pass, it’s worth remembering we haven’t actually left…pound certainly doesn’t look happy at the prospect and as time passes major investment decisions will need to be made one way or the other.

Hole – digging – stop – deeper

re-arrange to suit :wink:

Lol.
I hope you are a politician Ninfan, otherwise your career is wasted.

Rarely have so many voices agreed with me in unison, that no one actually said they were going to spend £350m a week on the NHS,

OH FFS stop being so silly we all know they did just as we all know your pants are on fire

So far, the only people who seem to have believed the ‘lie’ that they think was written on the bus (but actually wasn’t) have been remainers.

maybe they’re the stupid and gullible ones?

I suppose they must be to think that the EU is a good thing…

maybe they’re the stupid and gullible ones?

They seem to believe the nonsense that Europe will descend into war without us. You might be onto something.

So far, the only people who seem to have believed the ‘lie’ that they think was written on the bus (but actually wasn’t) have been remainers.

Do you want the Farage quote again

This is what Jamby does and why folk call him a liar

Stop BS ninfan you are better than this

Nigel Farage has disowned a pledge to spend £350 million of European Union cash on the NHS after Brexit.
The Ukip leader was asked on ITV’s Good Morning Britain programme whether he would guarantee that the money pledged for the health service during the campaign would now be spent on it.

Speaking on the morning of the referendum result he however said he had never made any such pledge.

“No I can’t [guarantee it], and I would never have made that claim. That was one of the mistakes that I think the Leave campaign made,” he said.

OK then mr clever clogs, if that’s the level of pedantry you have to stoop to in order to support the Brexit BS, would you care to point out to me where anybody* has claimed that Brexit did say they were going to spend £350 million on the NHS? I want those exact words if you’re going to continue to support this particular line of BS.

*apart from Nigel Farage as quoted up there by JY – I don’t think him claiming that particularly supports your assertion about remainers BSing.

Do you want the Farage quote again

Why would you expect me to value the opinion of a bloke who you keep reminding us is backed by fruitcakes, loonies and closet racists?

Farage has an opinion, but you’ve still been unable to point me to anyone who actually promised to spend this money on the NHS.

you can come forward with lots of inferred, suggested, indicated and hypothecated but still a complete lack of promised like you’ve seen weeks claiming they said

still, whatever, remainers gonna bullshit…

Here you go ninfan:

Ninfan, you know full well that given that VL was not a government it could not promise anything. So your false argument falls over immediately. Beyond that there is ample evidence of BSers stating that the £350m could be spent on the NHS. Admittedly, it varies from the website that said “NHS and other priorities” to leading spokesman like Gove who chose to lie more blatantly and make the link directly.

Watch Gove and read the VL website. Its all there.

you’ve still been unable to point me to anyone who actually promised to spend this money on the NHS.

This is the political equivalent of saying “I had my fingers crossed” or “Aaah.. but I didn’t say ‘Simon Says’ we’ll spend 350m on the NHS, did I?”.

oldnpastit posted a nice image of Boris stood in front of a great big campaign sign saying “Let’s give our NHS the £350 million the EU takes every week”

Here’s another one to save you going back a page:

Is the new rule in post-truth politics that you can base your campaign around any promise you like as long as you don’t actually use the word “promise”?

Amazing stuff. I look forward to the next election:

:lol:

Interesting article in today’s Guardian on 100 days after Brexit

When even Tory backbenchers are describing the utter tripe being spouted about what a post-brexit economy will look like, by the three stooges brexiteers, particularly Liam Fox, as ‘totally delusional’ then you know we’re in trouble

Why would you expect me to value the opinion of a bloke who you keep reminding us is backed by fruitcakes, loonies and closet racists?

because you exemplify his target audience :wink: your claim was only remainers thought this.

So far, the only people who seem to have believed the ‘lie’ that they think was written on the bus (but actually wasn’t) have been remainers.

I would rather have thought that even you would accept that he is not a remainer.

As others note you are just talking crap we all know what they did; even Nigel accepts it and I dont think he is a remainer.

Obviously not a “promise” though eh? Just what Gisela Stuart, co-chair of Vote Leave, said she would do “if I had that control”.

The fact there is no £350 million (as the article explains) is apparently irrelevant as well.

(BBC News: Reality Check: Would Brexit mean extra £350m a week for NHS?)

If they didn’t actually mean £350 million for the NHS, then what exactly did they mean??

It would be funny if it wasn’t so serious:
remainers “BS” – suggesting that they promised* to spend £350m on the NHS instead of the EU when they actually used slightly different weasel words
leavers BS – well thanks for giving us a great example to discuss

*though ninfan is yet to provide any evidence that anybody did suggest those exact words had been used

So far, the only people who seem to have believed the ‘lie’ that they think was written on the bus (but actually wasn’t) have been remainers.

Actually this is just more BS, and in two different ways – it’s almost as if somebody had asked “please give us examples of leavers BS” and ninfan was helping out. Firstly can ninfan provide a single example of a remainer who actually believed that lie (there is a difference between believing the lie and believing that the lie was made in case that is confusing you). Secondly it seems rather strange to make the claim/connection between the supposed amount spent on the EU and spending on the NHS, and to make such a big thing about it, if it didn’t influence any leave voters.

make your mind up aracer

one minute you claim that nobody said they thought it was a promise, then you reckon that loads of people voted out on the basis of the promise.

:lol:

one minute you claim that nobody said they thought it was a promise, then you reckon that loads of people voted out on the basis of the promise.

Can you provide evidence for either of those assertions? Exact words

Its fairly easy to find where people claimed it was a promise: http://bfy.tw/7ynU

you either have to accept that both sides told deliberate mistruths/lies//canards and that one side was better at it than the other was

or accept that neither side really ‘lied’ but manipulated, misrepresented and exaggerated facts in the way that politicians always do, and that one side was better t it than the other was

All the bluff, bullshit and bluster from the remain side about ‘back of the queue’ ‘£4300 per household’ and ‘the end of western political civilisation as we know it’ was just as bad as anything from the remain side

you lost – get over it

Congratulations. It’s a shame that the question was which remainers were claiming it was a promise and your clever dick link doesn’t really help. Maybe you’d like to try finding some evidence rather than expecting other people to do your work for you. Remember that given your criteria we want exact words or it doesn’t count.

you either have to accept that both sides told deliberate mistruths/lies//canards

No, I really don’t, not given you’re still failing to provide direct evidence to back that up, and some of your claims are quite clearly BS. Nor do I have to get over the fact that we are facing major political and economic upheaval because 37% of the electorate voted for it, despite the majority of those not understanding what exactly they were voting for, and voting that way for lots of different reasons the majority of which aren’t going to be met whatever deal is done.

Maybe you need to get over the fact that to borrow the words of Nigel Farage, the vote was so close that it is unfinished business and it is just as reasonable for people to be opposed to the current status quo as it was for people to be opposed to the status quo before the vote.

All the bluff, bullshit and bluster from the remain side about ‘back of the queue’

How is quoting the US President “bluff, bullshit and bluster” FFS??

The White House confirmed that sentiment[/url] on the day of the results.

The ‘£4300 per household’ claim – we don’t know one way or the other yet, so bit early to call that a lie.

And the ‘the end of western political civilisation as we know it’ claim is basically just you exaggerating for effect. There is a difference between being concerned about the social and political impacts of leaving the EU and saying it is the end of times.

you lost – get over it

So I should stop caring about my country?

Leave lost the EEC Membership referendum in 1975, and much more decisively too (67.2% remain, 32.8% leave) – that didn’t stop them talking about it for 41 years.

Why should Remain shut up now?

Forget a spade ninfan, looks like you are using a JCB – oh wait a minute…..there’s a link :wink:

VL had five reasons to vote Brexit. None held up to scrutiny.

You lied – you won – how proud does that make you feel? Time for a TUE exemption??

you lost – get over it

I voted remain, I’m over it. It appears that it’s the incumbant PM who’s pissing around at the moment.
You won, get on with it (assuming you know what it is).

And the ‘the end of western political civilisation as we know it’ claim is basically just you exaggerating for effect. There is a difference between being concerned about the social and political impacts of leaving the EU and saying it is the end of times.

No, it’s not exaggerating for effect, it, quite remarkably, was an actual claim by the EC president:

“As a historian I fear Brexit could be the beginning of the destruction of not only the EU but also Western political civilisation in its entirety,”

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36515680

But ninfan, that’s not bullshit. It may happen yet. No-one said it would happen immediately.

you lost – get over it

Im trying to

but my funding ends in March
my industry has lost a huge chunk of its funding, so Im worrying about the future quite a lot

all so a bunch of lieing xenophobes can get a blue passport

Both sides told lies but Nissan Workforce in Sunderland is a lot closer to loosing £4300 than getting £350m spent on the NHS.

No, it’s not exaggerating for effect, it, quite remarkably, was an actual claim by the EC president:

So not actually a claim/promise made by the Remain campaign then?

As a historian I fear Brexit could be the beginning of the destruction of not only the EU but also Western political civilisation in its entirety,”

Key word there is “beginning”. Could take decades, so sit tight.

** STOP THE PRESS **

Ladies and Gentlemen: A PLAN! (sort of)

”Road To Brexit”, a story for grown-ups by Iain Duncan Smith

This summarises it nicely:

:lol:

kimbers – Member
you lost – get over it
Im trying to

but my funding ends in March
my industry has lost a huge chunk of its funding, so Im worrying about the future quite a lot

all so a bunch of lieing xenophobes can get a blue passport

I’m unhappy to read of your funding issue, is it likely to end immediately given we haven’t actually gone anywhere yet or are your controlling powers using the moment to unsettle you in pay negotiations?

Personally I voted out for my own reasons, they were not because of the colour of my passport, or the immigration issue, my soon to be extended family are all immigrants and our dinner table at Christmas when they all gather is multi racial, cultural and contains at least five religious strains for us to banter about.

Nor was my vote swayed by either the leave or remain campaign although I did a fair bit of fb reposting for the fun of it, never thinking for one moment the vote would swing our way, like just about everyone else on the leave side, I was both shocked, excited and a little worried about the outcome.

So I know it’s a healthy debate, well as healthy as a left leaning bulletin board like this can ever be, but I do think it should be more about what positive things can be derived from the future out of Europe. My own personal circumstances and profitability have suffered at the hands of the damn city boy speculation and the idiot Carney panicking in an attempt to make things look worse than they were, but even with this knowledge would I turn back the clock purely for my own individual profit? No, I genuinely still think this watershed moment will eventually serve us well, just as it did on black wednesday when we left the exchange rate mechanism and I lost tens of thousands as the £ crashed against the then deutche mark.

There are still serious issues hanging over us all as a result of the crash, a good read (and watch) is a book and movie called the Big Short which highlights just how bad things really were/are and have yet to be fully unwound. Europe hasn’t even begun to deal with their issues and these current market worries with Deutche Bank and our own RBS have some way to go and are more likely to cause grief than us leaving the single market imv.

So what am I saying, I hope things go well for you, as I hope Germany can keep Europe motoring on, we are after all still going to trade with them all as I am, I’m really worried about this winter if and when they push the A50 button and the prices of my goods will again soar, but not much we can do about it now, winding each other up isn’t going to help.

GrahamS. That is quality. Imagine my surprise when I followed the link and it didn’t go to The Daily Mash.

So, brexiteers have discovered they quite like the single market after all… haha…

So Rosscore did you just vote Leave for ideology reasons?

Rosscore, that is a good post. However a huge part of the problem is the way things have happened, not just the end result.

If we’d had years of debate and years of debating, addressing the issues and working through, if we’d eventually come to the conclusion based on real evidence and experience that we really would be better off out, then that would be different.

However what we had was a political gamble by Cameron for the sake of his own credibility. He played a game and lost. That is NO way to run a country.