I feel that the way forward now for the manufacturers should be to focus on making their cars lighter and more fun to drive at any speed rather than faster.

Lotus and Caterhams all round then!

Actually, thinking about the amount of stuff most folk seem to carry in their cars this may not be such a bad idea. The problem is, people want cars to do everything, carry the family at the weekend, fit in bikes for the holiday to the Alps, be fun to drive on a Sunday mornimg and be the daily commuter. Not sure this is possible in a lightweight, lower power package.

Ahhh well driverless cars will do away with all this asshattery.

There will always be plebs on the road who assume they’re driving gods. Usually in an Audi estate with a blue and pink santa cruz bolted to the top 😆

Is “driverless cars” the new “it’s a limit not a target” on these threads?

Small point here – I enjoy driving. So you can stick your driverless cars up your Google.

I don’t know what’s wrong with some people. In this fabled fantasy utopia we’ll all have driverless cars, robotic factories, riderless bicycles, computerised factories, we’ll all be sat at home unemployed and bored shitless, and yes someone will still be bleating on that their kids spend too much time on their bloody iPads.

As many have alluded to above, the power is necessary because the weight of cars is increasing. For the driving I mostly do (quiet B roads) I’d rather a small, light, fun car that doesn’t need to trouble speed limits to put a smile on my face, than a huge monster of a car with lots of horses that only comes alive on a track.

Wasn’t it James May who drove the Countach dream of his childhood and concluded that it was a pile of crap for driving.

I saw one of these in the parade lap at Car Fest a couple of years ago. It was the ONLY car to spin on track, at quite mundane speeds.

^ 😆 Well said Cougar

I occasionally see a supercar being hooned around town. It’s embarrassing because no knickers fall down. The girls are not impressed.

Maybe the guy driving it is having fun though.

Wasn’t it James May who drove the Countach dream of his childhood and concluded that it was a pile of crap for driving.

James May is full of shit and he was doing a *bit* for an unfunny comedy programme also featuring cars. Just standing behind a Countach at idle, the sounds as smells awesome.

Wasn’t it James May who drove the Countach dream of his childhood and concluded that it was a pile of crap for driving.

Yup, but they were sooooo cool. I remember following one way back as a kid ad it was massive. In purple too.

Yup, but they were sooooo cool. I remember following one way back as a kid ad it was massive. In purple too.

😯

If there is a safe space to do so, you should always pull back into it.

Not always.

If there’s faster traffic behind you that can’t pull out into another lane, then yes.

Zigzagging in and out of lanes at 80mph trying to occupy the left lane at all times unless overtaking is bananas. You’d probably drive 10% further overall. And yes I do see people doing this.

Power hasn’t necessarily developed the bhp arms race itself.

Cars are very well insulated and quiet these days, mechanical grip is better etc. So you actually need more power for it to feel like your having fun !

I used to have a Suzuki Cappuccino. It was limited to 86mph and 0-60 in about 8 seconds.

However it was the fastest thing I’ve ever driven (other than Caterham/Elise) because there wasn’t so much cosseting, you could feel everything, so 70mph felt really fast!

70mph is still really fast, but cars are built in such a way now that it feels slow….until you crash

I watched a video about the new M2 v 240i. The guy doing the test was convinced the M2 was the quicker car in a straight line. When they put them head to head they were identical. They couldn’t believe it. Basically the M2 you pay £10k more for BMW to take out some sound deadening, and engineer in some noise. OK there are changes to handling etc, but the fact is it feels quicker, without being quicker

Cougar – Moderator
Next time it goes to the garage I’m going to ask them to have it demagnetised.

What’s your middle name, Lucky?

Cougar – Moderator
Is “driverless cars” the new “it’s a limit not a target” on these threads?
Small point here – I enjoy driving. So you can stick your driverless cars up your Google.
I don’t know what’s wrong with some people. In this fabled fantasy utopia we’ll all have driverless cars, robotic factories, riderless bicycles, computerised factories, we’ll all be sat at home unemployed and bored shitless, and yes someone will still be bleating on that their kids spend too much time on their bloody iPads.

Now that’s a post I whole heartedly agree with!
As far as I’m concerned they can poke those driverless cars, where the sun doesn’t shine, and no, I’m not referring to Grimsby.
😉

I enjoy driving. So you can stick your driverless cars up your Google.

I enjoy a relaxed zip across quiet mountain roads. But I don’t enjoy trundling along the M4 in rush hour.

Bring on driverless cars.

molgrips – Member
I enjoy a relaxed zip across quiet mountain roads.
Are you still stuck behind that tractor?…

But I don’t enjoy trundling along the M4 in rush hour.
Bring on driverless cars.
What you appear to be describing is a desire to have a car which comes with a rush hour, driverless, mode?

You won’t get a choice with driverless cars.

Government is faced with congestion in economically vital parts of the country at damaging levels and projected to get worse. Congestion is bad for business and people.

To fix this you either spend 100s of billions on new road infrastructure, which is unacceptable financially and politically.

Or you find a way to get fewer cars to transport more people faster to where they need to go. It fits perfectly with the conservatives market driven ethos and pushes the cost(and benefits) to corporations and individuals.

tomd

You won’t get a choice with driverless cars.

Driverless cars are already here. With such features as choice.

tomd – Member
You won’t get a choice with driverless cars.
I believe there are OEMs that would disagree with you.

Or you find a way to get fewer cars to transport more people faster to where they need to go.
700bhp, mini bus?

What you appear to be describing is a desire to have a car which comes with a rush hour, driverless, mode?

Yeah would be good. Drive the fun bits, then snooze when you get tired or bored.

Loud cars are what bother me. Who wants to hear some knob head making loads of noise with his car.

This is known as “illusory superiority” and is a well-researched phenomenon. Something like 80% of drivers rate themselves as being above average. People also believe themselves to be less biased than others when making that assessment.

The bottom line is, the “right” speed and power is whatever you choose, everyone faster is a dangerous lunatic and everyone slower is a bimbling buffoon.

Whu… not even a mention of Georgie boy…?

@Sundayjumper, I suggest you look at davidtaylforth’s history on here. You’ll then realise what his game is (clue: lives under bridges).

Trip trap, trip trap, trip trap…

Small point here – I enjoy driving. So you can stick your driverless cars up your Google.

Yes agree 100%. I enjoy the drive to the go mountain biking as much as the biking itself sometimes.

If you don’t enjoy driving, don’t like cars, simply feel that getting from A to B is all it’s about (in other words a chore) then why feel the need to comment on other people’s discussion of a thread around car power and enjoyment?

It’s like me wading into the local Beer Festival to warn people about the health and social perils of real ale, the extra strain placed on the NHS by people drinking too much real ale, and how all real ale should be limited to a maximum alcohol content of 3% for the good of the local neighborhood.

Are you still stuck behind that tractor?…

😆 😆 😆

It’s like me wading into the local Beer Festival to warn people about the health and social perils of real ale, the extra strain placed on the NHS by people drinking too much real ale, and how all real ale should be limited to a maximum alcohol content of 3% for the good of the local neighborhood.

Don’t give them ideas…

Small point here – I enjoy driving. So you can stick your driverless cars up your Google.

And hopefully I’ll be in zipping past in my auto guided jet pack while you lot dordle on the roads, making especially responsible progress into the 3m gaps that are left, protesting like smokers that it’s a free choice to endanger others etc.

James May is full of shit and he was doing a *bit* for an unfunny comedy programme also featuring cars. Just standing behind a Countach at idle, the sounds as smells awesome.

Which sums up petrol head logic…

Have an electric driverless car, a loud mp3 player and show dashcams of people racing on a track as your slog out the commute in safety.

why feel the need to comment on other people’s discussion of a thread around car power and enjoyment?

In fairness, this thread is about the folly of lots of horsepower. So in your analogy, it’d be like going to a debate about the merits of beer and citing those things. Quite reasonable IMO.

I would like a go in a big horse power car though. Before we are driven round by automatons.

Only managed to fit 115 horsies in my focus.

mikewsmith

James May is full of shit and he was doing a *bit* for an unfunny comedy programme also featuring cars. Just standing behind a Countach at idle, the sounds and smells are awesome.

Which sums up petrol head logic…

Have an electric driverless car, a loud mp3 player and show dashcams of people racing on a track as your slog out the commute in safety. [/quote]

My point was that there’s more to old cars than how practical they are to drive in 2016. My comment about the sounds and smells was one such aspect. It doesn’t “sum up petrol head logic” as you put it and no, putting an mp3 player and a video screen in a car isn’t the same. For anything 🙄

James May “hilariously” pointed out the impracticalities of driving a 30 year old super car (designed for the Autostrada or the Riviera) around a small English town. Completely missing the point that there’s a lot more to old cars than practicality.

Cars that feel faster than they are and offer the most road/steering feedback are safest, and in my view much more desirable – someone is going to mention the GT86 now.

I am pretty content driving on the motorway in my Alfa GT (miserly 170bhp) at 70 as mostly it feels like ‘the right speed’. If there’s not much traffic and it is a bright day then maybe 80 feels right.

Same for 30mph in urban areas, and 40-50-60 around country lanes, where all the bends make the driving more enjoyable.

The wife has even questioned why I was only doing 20 in an area, when I pointed out the school. It wasn’t a concious slow down, just an unconcious driving at the speed that seemed the correct speed for the area.

You do notice that in some areas the speed limit doesn’t match the road, as a wide road makes it feel like the right speed is faster.

Noticed this as soon as I got my first Alfa 156 and drove 3 wheel sizes on the test drive of the GT to see which gave the most appropriate feedback, whilst still being reasonably comfortable for the pasenger.

no you had

the sounds as smells awesome.

before your edit 😉
that sums up the logic…

putting an mp3 player and a video screen in a car isn’t the same. For anything

no but you could probably safely have a happy ending while been driven along 😉

and having had lifts from people who use phrases like these

Yes agree 100%. I enjoy the drive to the go mountain biking as much as the biking itself sometimes.

I tend to not go with them again. Enjoy a track not a public road.

mikewsmith – Member

no you had

the sounds as smells awesome.

before your edit
that sums up the logic…

Oh shit. I made a spelling mistake. Someone call the Grammar Police, hopefully they can deduce some meaning from my garbled nonsense.

putting an mp3 player and a video screen in a car isn’t the same.

As an aside, doesn’t one company do this with their electric cars, pump the missing engine noise electronically through the stereo? You can even pick your engine type; “tonight Matthew I’m going to be driving the three litre V6!” Or have I just dreamt the entire thing?

I tend to not go with them again. Enjoy a track not a public road.

You only travel with people who don’t like driving?

Seriously?

I tend to not go with them again. Enjoy a track not a public road.

You can ‘enjoy’ driving perfectly safely on a public road. Or are you disputing this? If so maybe you just aren’t driving a very fun car.

You don’t need 500bhp to do this however!

When people start to describe how they love to drive then go on about the twisty roads etc they tend to turn out to be the idiot throwing it into corners or taking chances or the git with leather driving gloves doing 20mph. Personal preference and experience though…

As an aside, doesn’t one company do this with their electric cars, pump the missing engine noise electronically through the stereo

Volkswagen do, and probably others too.

It’s interesting to note those who, on threads like this, can’t separate the enjoyment of driving from risk. Those who enjoy driving aren’t all on the limit, recklessly endangering everyone else who gets anywhere near them and aren’t all breaking the speed limit at every opportunity in the pursuit of enjoyment. Enjoyment and safety aren’t mutually exclusive, and the choice of car is a huge driver (pun intended) of the fun side.

On a different note, I drove a Pug 308 GT Line courtesy car that had a synthesised engine noise when you pressed “The Red Button”. My cynicism was replaced with startled joy at how strangely satisfying the completely artificial noise was 🙂

As the OP, i’m firmly in the ‘a bit more power at times is better’ camp. What i don’t undertand is why you will ever need more than say 300 bhp on a road car.

It’s needed to drag around all the “safety” shit that manufacturers have to fit.

When people start to describe how they love to drive then go on about the twisty roads etc they tend to turn out to be the idiot throwing it into corners or taking chances or the git with leather driving gloves doing 20mph. Personal preference and experience though…

Clearly fairly limited experiance then.

I’m going to go out on a limb here and say you probably don’t own a very exciting car if thats your attitude to folks that enjoy driving (fyi theres nothing wrong with not having an exciting car..before I get puled up by the STW police)

I love getting the roof down on a sunny day and going for a drive round Scotland. I don’t go at 20mph, I don’t speed, I’ve never had a ticket, and I’ve never made a claim on insurance in 23 years. But I still have great fun.

Am I the anomaly?

I loaned my mum my car for the week, she 70, and she said she absolutely loved driving it. So i guess not.

You can turn you r car radio onto AM and tune it to between a station and let it pick up interference from the engine…

Am I the anomaly?

Probably. Everyone speeds. Even the ones who think powerful cars are the devil’s work…