[Closed] What big diesel estate, 2nd hand?

Skoda Octavia/Superb, Volvo V70.

Subaru outback legacy whatever.

Bmw 520d

Mondeo obviously. Worth looking for the bigger engines, if you like driving, the 2.0 is fine and dandy but there's very little drawback to the bigger ones- I pay a few buttons extra in tax and something like an extra £7 per year in insurance for the 2.2, but fuel economy is basically the same and it has about 50% more feels.

Basically any big 2ltr estate i went for a cotroen c5exclusive because im a bit daft.

VW passat

Merc E Class

Is the Vectra option a woeful one?

Parkesie + 1

I drove a newish C5 Exclusive Tourer recently, it's what I'll replace the mothership with next.

I've done 11k since new in my V70, no complaints. 50mpg+ and getting better. You obviously won't get a new one for £10k but probably an early mk3.

A slight tangent, but my wife is on to her second VW Touran. Dull as dishwater, but in 2.0TDI form an excellent motor with a massive boot.

Passat, have B5.5 which is ace.
or
E class or V70 which I'll look at when the Passat needs replacing.

[i]Is the Vectra option a woeful one? [/i]

Not in the least, estate is huge and you could easily get an 2008 for half what you want to spend. The post 55-plate cars are totally under-valued and nothing like the ones Top Gear castigated.

A6, Mazda6?

I like the E class but each to their own.

How about a Hyundai I40? Just about in Budget with a little haggling.

Massive cars with huge amounts of space and loads of kit, will still have 3 or 4 years warranty and are really well built.

Vectras aren't bad, I'm not a Vauxhall guy, (have never liked the driving position in them).

I bought my wife a Renault Laguna for commuting in, cheap as chips and I don't care what everyone says, Renaults are all built with the same components that everyone else use. Car manufacturers just assemble vehicles from set pieces these days!
We bought it ex lease, I prefer Ex lease vehicles as they are serviced well and you aren't generally buying someone elses trouble (second hand cars generally get swapped in when people get fed up with the problems they are having with them)

We've done 15,000 miles in twelve months and its been brilliant, and a Mondeo would have been £10k at the same age, the laguna was £6.5k

The vectras are perfectly decent, and the boot is really, really long- well shaped too. (probably better use of space than the mondeo, though I think the actual space is slightly smaller, just going by how it feels to squeeze bikes into them both). Not that nice a car overall imo- feels like it was stamped out of beer cans, quite noisy too. But drives alright, does the job, perfectly sensible option.

Mazda 6 really does take some beating in my opinion...

Basically any big 2ltr estate i went for a cotroen c5exclusive because im a bit daft

Thats poitivly sane, i bought a 159 2.4jtdm sport wagon. Drinks deisel and everthing is £200 to replace (wheel bearing dealer only anyone) looks nice though.

Oh and to top it off the rear seats dont fold full flat. Brill car.

[i]Mazda 6 really does take some beating in my opinion..[/i]

+1

Audi A7 all road 60000 service intervals, beast the 2.7 one.

Heard bad things about Mazda diesels, relating to the way they design their DPF. Same engines as Ford where it's a service replacement item I think..? Do your research.

As long as you get rid at 80k you'll be all right. Wouldn't keep a newish diesel past that. Big bills looming after that. People on here will say mines done 150k with no probs but its probably pre DPF and probably a pre common rail VAG ie 1.9 TDI PD. As said above do your research and choose carefully.

2000 vectra dti cdx estate: full cream leather, heated seats, full electrics, cd multichanger, cruise control , roof rails, 50mpg, 120k miles, cost me, £510, job done

Did I say its a timing chain engine ?

I'd happily buy another Octavia estate or possibly upgrade to the superb. Mines now on 130k, I've done 70k of that and it's been brilliant.

I love my honda accord, 2.2ctdi. Mega reliable, economical, fast.

I had a Vectra for years and it was a big, comfy, fuel efficient load lugger. However, at 95,000 it fell apart. Can't grumble as it didn't owe me anything.

Got an S-Max now and that too is a big comfy load lugger. Fuel efficiency isn't that great compared to the Vectra but it is quite a lot bigger.

rented an smax this summer, liked it. Would buy one in the future.

@andy8442 is that the D5 and if sumo, how many horses? What mpg do you get from it please?

New shape Mondeo estate.

As long as you get rid at 80k you'll be all right. Wouldn't keep a newish diesel past that. Big bills looming after that.

If you keep replacing them at 80k you'll probably have even bigger bills. False economy I reckon.

Boblo- Mine is the D3 136 bhp auto. Overall average 45 mpg but on a motorway run 52-54mpg (and increasing). Lovely to drive,and a huge usable boot. I looked at the A6 and BMW 5 series (new models) and they quote comparable boot capacity but its just nonsense. The shape of the backs of these cars sweep down and you loose so much in the boot. The Volvo is just a big square box in the back, just what I want.

If load capacity is what you really are looking for, the the Mpvs are the way forward, but they just aren't nearly economical enough. The V70 was the best compromise IMO.

pug 407 in 2.7HDi flavour - abysmal residual value, so nice and cheap now (same motor as fitted to Jaguars) - bit thirsty for a diesel (45 on motorways IIRC)

mondy 2.0 160ps (or the bigger 2.5? L)
mazda 6 (same chassis/engine as mondy)
volvo v70 (as above)

it'll be the mondy or pug for me in a year or two.

If you keep replacing them at 80k you'll probably have even bigger bills. False economy I reckon.

You could keep a car until it dies and have the occasional big bill but you get diminishing returns driving it.

FWIW, I have a brand new car (change every two or three years) but our second car is now coming up 8 years old - owned from new, still only has 38k on the clock, hasn't had many nasty surprises with bills, but it is already feeling old and less pleasant to drive.

Cars don't actually get worse as you own them, provided you maintain them of course. If you go around dealers a lot and read What Car, then you'll realise what you're missing out on. But if you don't, then your car really is still just as good as it was when you bought it.

I suspect your second car is feeling old because you're changing your first car 🙂

Well no it's not, after all, it's still on original suspension and that's had 1 tonne of car sat on it for 8 years so if nothing else, the suspension is wearing out.

And it gets properly maintained to manufacturer specification at the correct intervals. But it simply doesn't feel anything like new anymore - just lots of little things. Not that it could have helped being within a wafer of being an economical write off when 6 weeks old thanks to a dozy delivery driver piling into the back of it...

E-Class.

EDIT: Having said that, Autoexpress makes an interesting case for an Insignia tourer:

If you’re after maximum car for your money, look no further than the Insignia. Thanks to the fleet sector’s hunger for spacious, comfortable and cheap-to-run family cars, the market is flooded with nearly new examples of the big Vauxhall. We found a one-year-old car for £14,056 less than its
original list price – it’s the sporty SRi, too, so you get 18-inch alloys, parking sensors and an upgraded sound system. While the 2.0 CDTi diesel will suit high-mileage drivers, the 138bhp 1.8 petrol has enough power for most.

Read more: http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/vauxhall/insignia/84691/best-used-car-2013-vauxhall-insignia

Speaking from prior experience, go absolutely nowhere near a Vectra if its got 1.9 cdti engine in it.

I'm in a similar'ish situation at the moment but don't need anything as massive and I'd be doing less than half as many miles a year.

Estates (I do love a wagon) I've looked at:
- another Octavia vRS. Ticks a LOT of boxes but we want an auto next ideally and DSGs on sub-£10k cars are rare unless the car has high'ish mileage. Don't really want to sell our car, shove thousands on top and end up with basically the same thing on same mileage but with a different gearbox! But they are good cars and if you don't want an auto I'd reccommend one. Seems almost wrong to have such good inside space for a relatively small car.
- mk4 Mondeo. Loads of kit as standard on the Titanium X things I was looking at but they aren't the best looking things in the world (the post-2010 FL ones look much nicer). Loved my old ST TDCI soo much I had to look at a mk4 but they're just too dull for what I want. Ace motorway munchers though.
- A6 estate (2007/2008'ish). S-Line spec packs a hell of a lot of kit but doubts over the reliability of the Multitronic gearbox is kinda putting me off and thinking it might just be a bit too big! Manuals are out there though (rarer than the autos) and its possibly the comfiest car I've ever sat in. Its like driving a sofa.
- 5-series estate (similar vintage to the A6). Lovely looking things but living on a hill + RWD + wife NEEDING to get into work virtually no matter what the weather (I'm ok, I can just work from home) kinda rules them out. Nice though... Still tempting.
- Mazda 6 Sport. Kinda tempting this. Cheap and nice looking things but I'm not keen on the interior/dash. May be worth a closer look.
- Passat. Insanely boring but massive and well built.
- Superb. Bonkers massive but there are a few estates knocking around in approved Skoda dealers for under £10k. Tempting but I suspect there'll be zero pleasure derived from driving it I suspect.
- Insignia. Surprisingly nice! Comfy, loads of toys, seemed well built and lots of options to look at for sub £10k. I might have a closer look at one of these (it'd 'just' be a car as well in the eyes of the wife would would mean my mk2 Golf plans would have a better chance of being approved).

Most of the cars above though are bordering on being too big for us really (despite having two kids, we'd prefer a slightly smaller car + have a roof box for holidays etc).

At the moment we're thinking either a BMW 330 Touring or A6 saloon but any of the above I'd take a closer look at (except maybe the Passat).

If you wanted to spend less and get loads of toys, I'd reccommend a mk3 Mondeo ST TDCI. Theres a couple of low (50k'ish) mileage 2007 plate cars on Autotrader at the moment but they're hatchbacks. Massive boots though. I was doing 20k+ a year in mine and it was an excellent car to the point we've seriously thought about getting another. Auto everything, heated leather, 50+mpg etc.

Well no it's not, after all, it's still on original suspension and that's had 1 tonne of car sat on it for 8 years so if nothing else, the suspension is wearing out.

I did say properly maintained. Lots of things are not on the regular service schedule but are service items. Shocks are one, but suspension bushings and even springs need to be looked at too.

I put a lot of effort into trying to make my old Passat nice again, and it went from a bit of a banger to a fairly decent car. There were some things that wore and were difficult to fix, I suspect the seats were a bit firmer when new, but then I never had the car when new so I didn't know.

Both my cars are now 6 years old, and whilst the interiors hve picked up scuffs and dirt, there's not much difference between the way they are now and when they were new. The Prius interior has a rattle in it, and it's not that tight, but it was like that after 2 years and hasn't got any worse.

The Passat's paid off soon, and I think I'm going to keep putting the loan payment in a savings account so in 5 years time I'll have a boat load of cash AND a car 🙂

Passat. Insanely boring

See, I don't get why people say this. Wtf are you expecting out of a large diesel estate? It handles well enough, and those other cars aren't exactly sporty. And not everyone wants sportiness.

I'd check out a Toyota Avensis. They're cheap cos of this ridiculous 'boring' epithet, but are capable cars.

"5-series estate (similar vintage to the A6). Lovely looking things but living on a hill + RWD + wife NEEDING to get into work virtually no matter what the weather (I'm ok, I can just work from home) kinda rules them out. Nice though... Still tempting."

not really - they are pretty capible cars with winter tires on.

If I'm spending £10k on a car I want something that is at least nice to sit in and have a bit of go. Even the Highlines look like they've had their leather seats fitted by a blind person. Insanely dull cars to drive, look at and be in. Plus you'd get people trying to flag you down for a lift all the time.

Avensis? Same as above.

Looked at them both, just not for me...

Insanely dull cars to drive,

I still don't understand how a car is going to excite me on the M4 down to Farnborough..?

I did say properly maintained. Lots of things are not on the regular service schedule but are service items. Shocks are one, but suspension bushings and even springs need to be looked at too.

trail_rat - Member

"5-series estate (similar vintage to the A6). Lovely looking things but living on a hill + RWD + wife NEEDING to get into work virtually no matter what the weather (I'm ok, I can just work from home) kinda rules them out. Nice though... Still tempting."

not really - they are pretty capable cars with winter tires on.

^ +1
I`ll take the 535D Touring fitted with winters over any of the FWD alternatives on Summer tyres

And at 20k a year I`d question whether you need a diesel too

And at 20k a year I`d question whether you need a diesel too

Did I miss something about diesels and high miles?

I'm finding it harder and harder to fight the inevitability of a Dacia as the future of my motoring

Brand new diesel estate, loads of room for bikes, turning 70 odd MPG with 7 years warranty and 3 years servicing, zero rated for road tax and without lots of bells and whistles to go wrong

for £10k 😯

Ahh, but if you went around just changing things like that every few years before they have physically worn out

Are they not already worn out then?

molgrips - Member

I still don't understand how a car is going to excite me on the M4 down to Farnborough..?

Get a mk1 Focus, and buy a faulty crankshaft sensor, it'll cause the engine to cut out without warning every few days. Much excitement will ensue as you try to coast to the hard shoulder, while turning the ignition on and off to try and clear the fault code.

Oh, fwiw, for sportiness... Or sport-touryness- try a nice Mondeo ST. No it's not a sports car but there's something hugely involving and balletic about it. There's loads of big estates that actually handle [i]better[/i] I reckon these days, with modern electronics etc but it's not the same feel.

[i]I'm finding it harder and harder to fight the inevitability of a Dacia as the future of my motoring

Brand new diesel estate, loads of room for bikes, turning 70 odd MPG with 7 years warranty and 3 years servicing, zero rated for road tax and without lots of bells and whistles to go wrong

for £10k

[/i]

Except they're £12k, 50 odd MPG and 7 years warrenty is £850.

Are they not already worn out then?

Well no, bushings gradually wear out don't they - they don't just go from working perfectly to not working do they? As do shock absorbers (usually) and springs etc.

I would recommend a Mercedes 124 estate (the one from the 80's and early 90's) The 3.0 24v diesel or a 6 cylinder petrol.

Not the best on fuel but they are very reliable and will clock up 4 or 5 hundred thousand miles.

You will have to pay quite a few thousand for one but they hold there value.

If I couldn't have one of those, a VAG 1.9pd or old school, wouldn't rule out a petrol.

Citroen XM diesels have quite a following and fetch a few grand. There is usually a reason older cars have a following and command reasonable money.

Petrols are not really that bad on fuel and are much more reliable than a cr diesel. Pumps and injectors have fine tollerances and wear out a lot quicker than old school diesels. 6 injectors u/s and high pressure pump could set you back a good £4k and they probably wont get to 200k miles.

Regarding long warranty on these Dacia and other cars. Bear in mind if the distributor goes under, the warranty paperwork is not going to be worth the paper it is written on. Dacia have been in uk before and dissapeared, as did Hyundai in the 80's

A warranty is not much help when you need to be somewhere and your waiting 3 hours for a truck to pick you up. I would rather have something that I trust.

Except they're £12k, 50 odd MPG and 7 years warrenty is £850

Logan not duster - diesel one £10445 including the 7 year warranty, 74.3 mpg combined and CO2 Band A

Bear in mind if the distributor goes under

Renault?

"A warranty is not much help when you need to be somewhere and your waiting 3 hours for a truck to pick you up. I would rather have something that I trust. "

Ever been out the uk ? other countries seem to love the dacias - including france , holland , ukraine , azerbijan.

its not just a new start up with no background.

and yes most of the dacia garages round here are just tagged onto renault dealerships - probably some incentive from the parent company.

im quite taken by a dacia duster for 12k my self - ive yet to see another 12k 4x4 with decent MPG and a propper drive train - how ever the tow capacity puts me off so ill probably end up with an isuzu rodeo. the logan has been on and off my radar also but i cant help think the roofs very low for carrying bikes and that a blingo multispace would be a better buy for extra.

oh an id buy a dacia rather than have a hyundai (again) a kia or a sssangyong and id rather walk than buy a great wall ....

Dacias look great vfm in standard spec but when you start adding extras they quickly become quite expensive

For instance base Petrol 2wd Duster with no options £9k

Diesel Duster with 4x4, Lauréate trim, touring pack, 5 year warranty and traction control £17k ish.

Amazingly popular on the continent.

No it's not a sports car but there's something hugely involving and balletic about it.

On the M4? Are you talking about the bumpy bits as you pass the Severn Crossing toll on the other carriageway?

Tools for jobs. The requirements for comfortable motorway cruising aren't the same as boy racering around .. wherever you do your boy racing.

they don't just go from working perfectly to not working do they? As do shock absorbers (usually) and springs etc.

Dunno about bushings but shocks often do. With lots of things, wear increases slightly until a critical point after which it suddenly goes to pot.

Anyway, changing bushings doesn't cost that much, nor does shocks. Ok so it's a reasonable hit on your wallet, but nothing compared to a new car. People treat the costs differently, but it's all the same money.

Dunno about bushings but shocks often do. With lots of things, wear increases slightly until a critical point after which it suddenly goes to pot.

Anyway, changing bushings doesn't cost that much, nor does shocks. Ok so it's a reasonable hit on your wallet, but nothing compared to a new car. People treat the costs differently, but it's all the same money.

"Diesel Duster with 4x4, Lauréate trim, touring pack, 5 year warranty and traction control £17k ish.
"

But its all relitive - thats not expensive for what you get - yes its alot of money and it will likely depreciate like a stone but its still cheap for what you get imo - and while its no looker id sooner have it than a quasqui

and while its no looker id sooner have it than a quasqui

Was referring to this Molgrips, are you having trouble following your own posts?

See, I don't get why people say this. Wtf are you expecting out of a large diesel estate? It handles well enough, and those other cars aren't exactly sporty.

ive yet to sell a car for more than 500 quid - that tells you how long i keep em.

most get scrapped at end of life.

On the M4? Are you talking about the bumpy bits as you pass the Severn Crossing toll on the other carriageway?

As a Passat owner yourself you're obviously not quite getting it are you, nor ever will.

are you having trouble following your own posts?

Yes.

"Diesel Duster with 4x4, Lauréate trim, touring pack, 5 year warranty and traction control £17k ish.
"

But its all relitive - thats not expensive for what you get - yes its alot of money and it will likely depreciate like a stone but its still cheap for what you get imo - and while its no looker id sooner have it than a quasqui

Well it still seems like a lot of money and puts it into the same bracket as base Skoda Yeti's, Suzuki SX4 S-Cross and a myriad of nearly new competitors

in price only really .

none of them are really the same kind of car.

id say its quashqui / xtrail / antara /freelander competitor rather - yes you can get a used one cheap but my point still stands that for 17 grand you wont get a new car thats similar in spec.

poverty spec in any of the above is grim anyway.

pug 407 in 2.7HDi flavour - abysmal residual value,

I have the 407SW in 2.0Hdi. It's like driving a very comfortable sofa.

It has a couple of electrical quirks, which are down to iffy earthing, but mechanically has been flawless.

had a 2011 mondeo for a short while, hated driving it but it had been a pool car with 100,000 on the clock, felt dangerous in the corners. i then had a 2008 Mazda 6 whilst i waited for an A4 to be delivered and was gutted when the A4 tuurned up. the Maxda was a lot bigger and a nicer drive. i've since changed jobs and we get a car allowance and bought a 2010 Maxda 6 with 16,000 miles for £13,000. a bike can be thrown straight in the back if needed and its big enough for 4 bokes and theior kit for a weekend or for me my wife and dughter to go away for a week.

I just bought a 02 plate 5 series touring. it's great.

living on a hill + RWD + wife NEEDING to get into work ... kinda rules them out.

At the moment we're thinking either a BMW 330 Touring

not sure i follow that logic!

had a 2011 mondeo for a short while, hated driving it but it had been a pool car with 100,000 on the clock, felt dangerous in the corners

You must've been doing something wrong, I've never had a car that felt dangerous in corners when driven appropriately!

i have - was an escort - knackered shockers and wishbones made it horrendous in corners . once swapped it was like a different car.

to be honest it felt pretty dodgy in a straight line, was thinking about getting one before driving that one. pool car at 100,000 miles might explain it. it was the titanium model and i just didnt like it either.

id say its quashqui / xtrail / antara /freelander competitor rather - yes you can get a used one cheap but my point still stands that for 17 grand you wont get a new car thats similar in spec.

Not really, Qashqai yes, the others are SUVs. You also only get a 3 star NCAP rating. But you pays your money etc. I actually like them but an amazing bargain it is not.

had a 2011 mondeo for a short while, hated driving it but it had been a pool car with 100,000 on the clock, felt dangerous in the corners. i then had a 2008 Mazda 6 whilst i waited for an A4 to be delivered and was gutted when the A4 tuurned up. the Maxda was a lot bigger and a nicer drive.

Don't the Mazda and Mondeo share the same platform?

Also the Mondeo is widely recognised as being a very well sorted car, possibly the best in that market sector. So chances are the one you had had a problem of some kind. Unless the entire motoring press is wrong and only you are right.

like i said 100,00 mile pool car probably explains it i.e. never looked after. im sure it did have something wrong as a car that bad surely wouldnt make it to market. no idea if it shares the same platform or not.

cr500dom - Member
And at 20k a year I`d question whether you need a diesel too

All depends on the mpgs of the old and new. My passat is £200+ ved each year and 50mpg so a 1.6tdi golf would save me quite a bit.

I would recommend a Mercedes 124 estate (the one from the 80's and early 90's) The 3.0 24v diesel or a 6 cylinder petrol.

Not the best on fuel but they are very reliable and will clock up 4 or 5 hundred thousand miles.

You will have to pay quite a few thousand for one but they hold there value.

I've got one of these. Now at 198000 miles.

30 mpg. No performance. Not as reliable as people think.

However, massive, comfortable and the most relaxing drive imaginable. We did 350 miles non-stop on the way to Morzine this year and only stopped because we needed fuel. (60 litres, BTW)

It's fine, because when it goes wrong I borrow my wife's Golf. Would not recommend one as your only car.

I recently went through a similar scenario. I booked test drives in the mondeo estate, i40 estate, Octavia vRS estate, smax, touran, insignia and c5 estate.

The smax was brilliant in every way except the one I was looking at was near 26k, far too dear for us as a family car! Didn't like the seating position of the mondeo, which is a pity as I set my heart on it too 🙁
Hated the vRS, felt small and claustrophobic which really surprised me! I40 was okay, pretty basic inside but engine underpowered, c5 was very good as was insignia vx-line. Ended up buying the insignia as they gave us a cracking deal, not what I intended buying but after 9 months and 16k I'm very happy with our choice to buy the sports tourer..

Test drive plenty to get the feel of what you want, only real way for you to choose bud - good luck!

Another +1 for Mazda 6.

Mine was 08 plate 2.0d, 65k miles, sport estate, £8,500. I've done 20,000 without a glitch this year.

I have the 407SW in 2.0Hdi. It's like driving a very comfortable sofa.

It has a couple of electrical quirks, which are down to iffy earthing, but mechanically has been flawless.

Nice to know.

Couple of years back I had a 406, the V6 petrol. Lovely car, top spec, echo the sofa comment - as a big cruisy car to go long distances I liked it a lot, except the petrol bill. 3L and 200hp, so not too surprising, but did have an utterly ridiculous and surprisingly satisfying ability to go from about 20mph all the way up to 90, in third gear and piss off anybody in a saxo with a large subwoofer and silly suspension.

Hence I'd quite like the new flavour with a big diesel. Bit disappoint that it only comes as 6 spd auto, but thems the brakes.