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Polling 4 years out from a GE is fairly meaningless
I actually remember you kimbers celebrating in 2020 when under Starmer's Labour first started to ease in front of Boris Johnson's Tories by 2%. 😉
I remember it because I was criticised for not being in a celebratory mood, TJ in particular accused me of deliberately ignoring the opinion polls. I wasn't particularly impressed because 2% is within the margin of error. I was massively impressed though when Labour established 20+% leads.
Anyway Starmer and McSweeney clearly don't think the polls now are meaningless which is obviously why they are trying to steal Nigel Farage's thunder. And all the elections, local, national, mayoral, and by-elections, between now and 2029 will build the momentum for the next general election. Endless poor election results will damage Labour long-term.
Betting-wise, I reckon Reform either not existing at all by the next election, or still limping on with Dicky or 30p Lee as leader but with Farage having set up yet another vehicle for his enormous ego, is probably worth a punt
The bickering has started already. ‘Splits within the party’ and there’s only five of them? 😂
Reform faces split as Farage hits back over ‘messianic’ criticism
Polling 4 years out from a GE is fairly meaningless
Dunno about that - Starmer is trying as hard a possible to react to polling (now - badly) because they plan a long time ahead. (Nuclear War enthusiasm will only play out so much.)
Betting-wise, I reckon Reform either not existing at all by the next election
The trajectory as we all know over the last few years of this type of party is gathering momentum and not going away.
Reform will exist either as it is or under a new identity but I think their branding is so strong I'd bet against you there.
In-fighting (blah blah) will just probably morph into another version at worst possibly with a different logo but the essence of this type of party is getting stronger not weaker.
Why would it? Until the there is a force to fix the things that drive Reform's success it's only going to get worse.
First thing spreadsheet Labour could do *tomorrow* which is both pragmatic and and carries polling weight - Nationalise at least water as a start.
Not happening though is it?
Edit remove duplicate post.
One version is enough.
So the utterly nasty double act of Kendall and Reeves are sharpening their right-wing Tory based ethics of needlessly punishing the vulnerable unnecessarily for the sake of fiscal rules / black holes / balanced budgets.
6bn is a half percent of the total UK budget.
All lies, every single drop of it. Can you see how following the fabricated budgetary requirements of a government house-hold analogy is poisonous beyond belief? It only works if we don't educate ourselves against it. Even if you don't believe that running a bigger deficit is a good idea because - *spooking markets* then go and take a hard look at yourself and understand how markets are secondary to government choices. You are choosing accounting over lives.
PIP is a difficult benefit to get. And there's little fraud so what is there to gain?
Diverting the debate about getting people into work is an excuse. A Tory manicured excuse for cuts.
This would be bad enough if Labour weren't doing this after 14 years of crushing the vulnerable.
I really hope this sinks Labour never to come back again in this form and I'm damn happy I didn't vote for them.
I don't doubt there will be a stream of marginal benefits that Labour might offer over the next few weeks - free passes to go into Libraries or new coloured wheelie bins or something that Libs can find amongst the ruins.
But we got the Tories out.
What a shit show. The McSweeney puppet that is Starmer hopefully will get stamped on by domestic affairs just before the elections.
In less shocking news I see Labour are now considering cutting more money from the semi-bullshit GBenergy project.
Poor old Ed - he will have a fiver left to transform the energy infrastructure in the UK by the time these idiots have done.
What a time to be in the UK.
The UK government is reportedly weighing up the possibility of cutting planned funding for GB Energy, the state-owned company set up by Labour to drive renewable energy and cut household bills, in June’s spending review.
Because that ^^ doesn't specify which government is considering the cuts if you weren't aware you could be forgiven for thinking that there had been another general election and the Tories had won this time.
Taken in isolation that news report wouldn't be particularly shocking but when taken it the context of all the other economic priorities of this current government it really is a Tory government in everything but name, just more Cameron Tory than Badenoch Tory.
I guess that Morgan McSweeney's thinking is that the only serious electoral threat comes from a hard-right Tory party or Reform UK so offering a slightly watered down version of the two is the best course to follow. After all keeping Labour in power is what motivates McSweeney, not challenging the status quo or changing the lives of ordinary working people.
This report only speaks of "weighing up the possibility of cutting planned funding" so no decision has been made. I expect that this, as much of Starmer's doom and gloom strategy, might be an exercise in expectation management.
And probably to placate criticism of Labour free-spending on renewables and climate change issues from Reform UK and a hard-right Tory party.
chimes in with earlier discussion on arms expenditure
Since its foundation in 2012, Tell Mama has been wholly funded by the Ministry of Housing, Communities and Local Government to run its reporting service, which received almost 11,000 reports in 2023-4, and support victims of Islamophia
So an organisation which was set up during the time of a Tory government to deal with serious cases of racism, and was wholly funded by a Tory government, is now having the plug pulled on it within 9 months of a "Labour" government taking power.
And the police call their work "invaluable", so much for Starmer's commitment to law and order and supporting the police.
Police sources raised alarm over the potential impact of the cut, saying information provided by Tell Mama under a data sharing agreement signed in 2015 has been “invaluable” for monitoring indicators of rising tensions and responding to potential threats.
So much too for Starmer recognising the growing threat from the far-right.
Fiyaz Mughal, the founder of Tell Mama, said its resources were being cut while “the far right and populists across Europe are growing significantly”.
Any Starmer supporters on here fancy having a go at defending this? There was a half-arsed attempt recently to defend slashing the International Aid budget by 40% but is it all getting a bit too difficult now and remaining silent feels like a simpler option?
I was in the pub yesterday, watching the rugby and people were speaking of little else. I suppose it’s just what happens when you’ve nothing major going on in the world, but still, that so many people are talking about funding for Islamaphobia charities it must be a real problem for the government.
On a serious note, my wife has worked in the charity sector most of her life and all of them have targeted fundraising positions because very few charities receive any government money at all and are entirely self-funded. For a charity to be entirely government funded, like this one has been since 2012, is really, really unusual. It’s the exception rather than the rule
I was in the pub yesterday, watching the rugby and people were speaking of little else.
Try speaking to people on the receiving end.
Of the rugby?
For a charity to be entirely government funded, like this one has been since 2012, is really, really unusual. It’s the exception rather than the rule
Is that the best that you can come up with........ it's "really, really unusual" ?
The fact that it is really, really usual, didn't stop Tory governments from fully funding a charity set up to help the victims of racism.
Is that the official 'Labour" government reason given for pulling the plug ........ it was really, really unusual?
So nothing to do with Labour trying to establish stronger anti-woke credentials in a gutter raking exercise then?
I’m just telling you how pretty much all charities are funded and that’s not by central government. I’d say that if they’ve been fully funded for 13 years without having to raise any money themselves then that’s pretty much unheard of.
If a donkey sanctuary in Devon can raise millions to fund itself from people who like donkeys, then surely people with an interest and who benefit from this charities work can do what every other charity has to do too?
I know that the tinfoil-helmet brigade see sinister agendas everywhere, but I’d suggest that at a time of limited funding, this is just bringing this particular charity into line with any other.
You could raise some funds for them yourself Ernesto if you feel that strongly about it? Maybe you could have a cake sale or do a sponsored event like spending 24 hours doing laps around the Houses of Parliament on a spacehopper?
If a charity is goverment funded, then it is not a charity, it's a pubic service/social benefit like any other.
You could raise some funds for them yourself Ernesto if you feel that strongly about it?
Wow, a classic Tory retort. Tories usually come out with bollocks like when it is pointed out to them the need to spend money on socially vital/community issues.
We are not talking about "donkeys" we are talking about human beings and their indisputable right to live free from the fear of street based hate crimes in their communities.
Did you see this paragraph? :
Police sources raised alarm over the probable impact of the cut, saying information provided by Tell Mama under a data sharing agreement signed in 2015 has been “invaluable” for monitoring indicators of rising tensions and responding to potential threats.
How much money will be saved by making the work of the police harder and allowing more criminality to go unchecked, have you got some figures? Since "saving" money now seems to be your justification for pulling the plug.
Wow, comparing the services provided by Tell Mama to a donkey sanctuary? That's an opinion, I guess.
I hate to tell you but many people like donkeys but hate brown people. Or perhaps you're aware already.
I guess we should all just be happy that the Community Security Trust's funding is safe so we can keep track of anti-semitism.
I'm sure you'll be able to explain to us all why anti-semitism is more important than islamaphobia.
a charity is goverment funded, then it is not a charity, it's a pubic service/social benefit like any other.
Which is basically what I’ve been trying to explain. Ask any other ‘charity’ where they get there funding from? It isn’t from central government, that’s for sure.
We are not talking about "donkeys" we are talking about human beings and their indisputable right to live free from the fear of street based hate crimes in their communities
In which case, raising funds for such a noble cause shouldn’t be a problem at all.
Maybe ask the donkey sanctuary how they do it? Actually, Mrs Binners bought some novelty socks with donkeys on them. She likes things like that. They do fridge magnets too and donkey cuddly toys. Oh… the cafe was nice too, if a bit overpriced
I hate to tell you but many people like donkeys but hate brown people. Or perhaps you're aware already.
What If i don't like white people, but I do like brown Donkeys? if I don't have any choice over what my tax contributions go toward, then it's hardly a charity now, is it.
Actually, Mrs Binners bought some novelty socks with donkeys on them. She likes things like that. They do fridge magnets too and donkey cuddly toys. Oh… the cafe was nice too, if a bit overpriced
The fear of street based hate crimes which minorities live with, especially easily identifiable targets such as women wearing hijabs, is very real, and not least after the race riots of a few months ago.
But why don't you treat it as some sort of joke and post hilarious photos of donkeys?
I am sure that Nigel Farage would approve of your contempt and join with you in laughing at all this woke nonsense.
Actually, Mrs Binners bought some novelty socks with donkeys on them. She likes things like that. They do fridge magnets too and donkey cuddly toys. Oh… the cafe was nice too, if a bit overpriced
The fear of street based hate crimes which minorities live with, especially easily identifiable targets such as women wearing hijabs, is very real, and not least after the race riots of a few months ago.
But why don't you treat it as some sort of joke and post hilarious photos of donkeys?
I am sure that Nigel Farage would approve of your contempt and join with you in laughing at all this woke nonsense.
Call it what it is (or isn't) then, it's either a tax payer funded public service or a charity, it can't be both.
Tell Mama wasn't supporting brown people or dealing with general racism, it was targeted on Islamaphobia, not exactly promoting cultural or religious harmony.
Ironic once again for the lefty echo chamber here holding the Torys up as the benchmark for promoting racial tolerance over the last decade given Johnson et al managed to set back societal inclusion 20 years and made it OK to be publicaly racist and bigoted again.
I assumed that the "fully funded" sentence was ambiguous and meant that Tell Mama's costs for running the phone line were covered, not necessarily that all funding for everything came from the state. If it's all state-funded then that's not much of a charity and more of a contractor.
I guess we should all just be happy that the Community Security Trust's funding is safe so we can keep track of anti-semitism.
don't think the CST tracks anti-semitism in Norway m8
Ironic once again for the lefty echo chamber here holding the Torys up as the benchmark for promoting racial tolerance over the last decade given Johnson et al managed to set back societal inclusion 20 years and made it OK to be publicaly racist and bigoted again.
I know it can't be easy to defend Starmer as he tries to find common ground with Reform but do you really have to come out with such disingenuous nonsense?
You know full well that it has nothing to do with "holding up the Tories as benchmark for promoting racial tolerance" and everything to do with pointing out that even the last Tory government recognised the value provided by Tell Mama, as indeed the police currently do.
A reminder again of the "lefty" police attitude over the issue :
Police sources raised alarm over the probable impact of the cut, saying information provided by Tell Mama under a data sharing agreement signed in 2015 has been “invaluable” for monitoring indicators of rising tensions and responding to potential threats.
Call it what it is (or isn't) then, it's either a tax payer funded public service or a charity, it can't be both.
Of course it can be. Just the same way that something outsourced to capita is still a public service but being delivered by a private company.
Figures are a bit old but in 2020/21 30% of incomefor charities across the board came from the public sector.
As of this year public sector procurement has been told to maximise use of charities. Note thats procurement and so doesnt cover the separate grants approach.
There has been debates about the use of the third sector for public services for several years now especially the risk if they grow overdependent on that cash flow. Its odd that it seems to be news to many. This should be something anyone with a basic understanding of public services should be well aware off
I know it can't be easy to defend Starmer as he tries to find common ground with Reform but do you really have to come out with such disingenuous nonsense?
Its rather telling that stumpyjob is so ideologically pure that they cant accept that sometimes even arseholes manage to do the right thing. Still its everyone else in an echo chamber and not the true believers in St Starmer.
I didn't mention Starmer in my post merely pointing out the irony trying to suggest the Torys valued a state funded contractor, sorry charity, given the damage they deliberately did to our society to grab a few votes.
As for claming the current government and Reform are in anyway equivalent is pure hyperbole.
stumpyjob
That's mature, are we resorting to name calling now?
As for idealogical purity your, and other posters, obsession with Starmer is hardly objective. Anyway I'll leave you to your little echo chamber.
Call it what it is (or isn't) then, it's either a tax payer funded public service or acharity, it can't be both
How to be wrong on technicalities.
Tax-payer funded? The government doesn't need your money and you don't create it either.
Charities can access money from central government. Which is simply government money.
Why oh why are the right-wing Labour shills so exhausting at defending every single stupid Labour move.
Usually with a load of nonsense too.
As for claming the current government and Reform are in anyway equivalent is pure hyperbole.
So you don't fancy easing off the disingenuous nonsense then.
the irony trying to suggest the Torys valued a state funded contractor, sorry charity,
Absolutely it is ironic. The whole Labour government austerity programme is ironic.
We are actually in a situation where the international aid budget cut under athe current "Labour" government will be 40% less than it was under the last Tory government. How ironic is that when you consider that it was the last Labour government which boosted the international aid budget to a never before 0.7% GDP level?
And that's the Reform territory/common ground that the current "Labour" government is aiming for. Keir Starmer is attempting to park his tanks on Nigel Farage's lawn.
It will help Starmer about as much as it helped Rishi Sunak.**
Edit : ** And that's ignoring the moral considerations of attempting to chase the culture war votes.
Call it what it is (or isn't) then, it's either a tax payer funded public service or a charity, it can't be both.
Of course it can be. Just the same way that something outsourced to capita is still a public service but being delivered by a private company.
So Capita is a charity according to you? who knew? 🤣
Call it what it is (or isn't) then, it's either a tax payer funded public service or acharity, it can't be both
How to be wrong on technicalities.
Charities can access money from central government. Which is simply government money.
If they they can, then they shouldn't be able to, especially organisations with religious ties, religion has no place in modern society, IMO, I don't care if you are Christian, Muslim, Jew or Pastafarien, you can get in the sea.
That kind of nonsense would be the first thing on the chopping block if I were a government looking to save money.
Just look at the christian church in the uk, they are basically just a bunch of nonces who don't pay any tax.
So Capita is a charity according to you? who knew? 🤣
You even quoted dissonance and yet apparently still somehow failed to understand the quote.
"capita is still a public service but being delivered by a private company"
No mention of it being a charity.
I see the usual suspects from extreme left on here, are still shouting down anyone on here who dares to have an opinion more balanced than that of the Khmer Rouge.
Finger on the pulse about the issues at the forefront of the nations concerns with this one comrades…
The latest piece of anti-labour fear mongering to be proven completely wrong is the impact of the private school VAT changes on state school applications.
The fear mongerers claimed the numbers switching from private to state would overwhelm state schools. Whereas in reality most councils have not really noticed any change at all.
Maybe you'd like to talk less about Donkey sanctuaries and more about the Community Security Trust, given that Tell Mama is the Islamaphobia equivalent of the CST (which deals with anti-semitism).
Looks like Tell Mama has gotten just over 6 million since 2011. In total.
https://questions-statements.parliament.uk/written-questions/detail/2024-03-18/HL3322/
The CST is getting over 14-18 million each year:
I can see why people would much rather talk about donkeys but seriously, how are we supposed to read this as anything other than pandering to Reform voters?
Pandering to Reform voters?
If you got together every Reform voter in the country and asked them all what they thought about the government cutting funding to ‘Tell Mama’ I can just imagine the look of collective bemusement staring back at you.
They would have no idea what on earth you were on about. Not one of them.
I see the usual suspects from extreme left on here,
Fascinating given how Binners is doing his normal shitting all over the thread with hilarious photos to make up for lack of argument and you are coming out with balanced arguments like "they are basically just a bunch of nonces who don't pay any tax."
The most fascinating bit about the recent comments is just how clueless many people are about how charities actually work and their interaction with the public services.
Finger on the pulse about the issues at the forefront of the nations concerns with this one comrades…
Immigration innit? And people like you and Nigel knows it. Do you remember the time binners when you barred yourself from your local pub the Rose and Crown in Ramsbottom after calling everyone in the pub "bigots"?
Isn't it now time you went back to the Rose and Crown apologised and told them that you have had a 'Road to Damascus' experience and you now understand their concerns?
Men of the people like Farage and Trump, and you binners, understand what is at the "forefront of the nation's concerns". Obviously it might not be at the forefront of the Muslim community's concerns but who cares, apart the usual leftie woke snowflakes?
They would have no idea what on earth you were on about. Not one of them.
When you say, 'We stopped giving money to Muslims' I think even the densest of Reform voters will understand and appreciate it.
If they notice it at all, which they won’t, obviously. They’re busy having a massive handbag session with each other (which is frankly hilarious), the subtext to which seems to be whether they should welcome Tommy Robinson or not
Be honest… other than our resident PFJ members, how many people do you reckon have ever heard of ‘Tell Mama’? Even after the article buried on page 15 of the Guardian?
Like I said… finger on the pulse guys
Be honest… other than our resident PFJ members, how many people do you reckon have ever heard of ‘Tell Mama’? Even after the article buried somewhere in the midst of the Guardian
So what's your explanation for the 0.8 million Tell Mama has been getting annually being removed while the CST's 14 million remains in place?
Your first explanation was that it's unusual for the government to fund a charity but this doesn't seem to be an issue for the CST.
Then you went on a hilarious donkey posting spree.
Now you're saying no one will even notice so it doesn't matter (while still hilariously posting pictures of donkeys).
If it doesn't matter and no one will notice, why was it done? And why was the funding to the CST not cut if it's a question of saving money?
So what's your explanation for the 0.8 million Tell Mama has been getting annually being removed while the CST's 14 million remains in place?
Like the other 99.9999% of the population I had never heard of ‘Tell Mama’ before this thread. I’ve also never heard of CST either and have no idea who they are or what they do. Apparently I should be very angry about it though, for some reason
The latest piece of anti-labour fear mongering to be proven completely wrong is the impact of the private school VAT changes on state school applications.
The fear mongerers claimed the numbers switching from private to state would overwhelm state schools. Whereas in reality most councils have not really noticed any change at all.
That was likely to be the case last July according to the IFS, hardly the "latest piece".
3-7% move Treasury wins, 10% move no tax gained, however population decline, blah, blah
If you want the latest piece of anti-labour fear mongering that matters,
LONDON, March 10 (Reuters) - Britain's jobs market cooled in February as the pace of hiring slowed and starting salaries rose by the least in four years, according to a survey on Monday that underscores firms' concerns about higher employment costs and a soft economy. https://www.reuters.com/world/uk/uk-employers-slow-hiring-pay-growth-cools-survey-shows-2025-03-10/
Be honest… other than our resident PFJ members, how many people do you reckon have ever heard of ‘Tell Mama’?
So there you have it, the justification for pulling the plug on Tell Mama is that most people (including I suspect you binners) haven't heard of it!!
If only the last Tory government had used those sorts of excuses to justify their policies they would have presumably received much more support from you binners. They obviously missed a trick!
But as it is you binners opposed absolutely all Tory government policies whilst you now you fully support every single "Labour" government policy. Which is weird when you consider that many people are struggling to see much difference between the two and that it presumably means that the current UK government is the first one in history to be right about everything.
so the exodus to state schools doesn't seem to be happening
sorry see this was posted above
will the NI increase cause more of an impact?
Like the other 99.9999% of the population I had never heard of ‘Tell Mama’ before this thread. I’ve also never heard of CST either and have no idea who they are or what they do. Apparently I should be very angry about it though, for some reason
So in your opinion anything you haven't heard of is not really relevant. I hadn't heard of Tell Mama or the CST either. A quick bit of googling told me they both provide important services to the country. And to be clear, it's the police who are saying they provide important services.
I'm sure there are lots of very important things going on every day that neither one of us has heard of. As a white relatively well off man I'm sure there many public bodies, charities, NGOs, and many other types of organisations I've never had to even think about.
Doesn't mean I just assume none of them matter.
so the exodus to state schools doesn't seem to be happening
It was never going to.
and even that doom mongering was hedged
Appointments to permanent jobs declined for the 29th month in a row, but the drop in hiring was smaller than in January."While it is still a wait and see approach to hiring ... the softer decline could be an indication that expectations of further interest rate cuts and better than expected recent economic data are starting to release some of the pressures on business," Jon Holt, chief executive of KPMG, which sponsors the survey, said
As a white relatively well off man I'm sure there many public bodies, charities, NGOs, and many other types of organisations I've never had to even think about.
Have you spoken to other white wealthy men about it? If they say cutting the funding isn't a problem then it mustn't be.
The instinct to immediately bring up a Jewish organisation in a discussion that's sod all to do with Jews is...an interesting one. 🤔
I felt it was more relevant than discussing donkey sanctuaries.
Also, Tell Mama was explicitly modeled on the CST and provides similar services. And yet only one is facing being shut down (and it's the one that receives a fraction of the funding). So more than a little relevant, wouldn't you agree?
But if you want to accuse me of being antisemitic then go ahead. I am accusing the government of pandering to Islamophobes afterall.
i'm always intrigued by people who come on here and have sod all to do with mountain biking.
I just don't get what all our resident lefties have got against donkeys
Hahaha...... comparing a donkey charity with a charity set up to help the Muslim community live free from fear of far-right street crime is just a bit of banter, innit binners?
You're just "having a bit of a larf", no offence intended, of course.
The classic bigot defence. Jim Davidson would approve. I bet you struggle to understand why miserable joyless lefties have a problem with Jim Davidson's hilarious "Chalky" character, dontcha?
Why so angry? You sound to me like one of Horse Supremacists I’ve heard about
It is quite remarkable how quickly the pretend centrists were first converted to tory ideology and now full blown knuckle dragging racists. Just goes to show the maga cult is not confined to the US.
Here we see binners celebrating with his new found friends having left the pub where he learns all the important political inside information.
It is quite remarkable how quickly the pretend centrists were first converted to tory ideology and now full blown knuckle dragging racists. Just goes to show the maga cult is not confined to the US.
And the fact that they don't even notice it because they don't have a position other than whatever Starmer-might-do. Sod the utility.
Anyway, let's see what happens in Mike Amesbury's seat in the first Starmer byelection.
It's funny every Centrist repeat act was talking up a Reform meltdown whilst a Labour MP was literally beating their own constituent up and ultimately triggering a by-election.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2025/mar/10/mike-amesbury-resigns-as-mp-triggering-byelection
"Anyway, let's see what happens in Mike Amesbury's seat in the first Starmer byelection."
Do you think it will deliver a knockout blow to Starmer's reputation as an election winner? Or do you think Kier can still make a fist of it?
Reform are the bookies favourite to have the Runcorn by-election
would be nice if the reform meltdown blows up their chances but Amesbury has gifted farage a golden opportunity , the current polls plus an imprisoned MP equals the best chance reform has
Im assuming that the by-election will be held with the locals in May, 7 weeks can be a long time in politics.
candidate selection will be critical for both parties & whoever wins a lot of nonsense will be spun in the press
What's nuts is that the Tories dont even factor into the discussion !
https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/disabled-benefits-welfare-pip-reeves-kendall-b2712297.html
Well yes you would have thought so but it won't.
Because literally no one is talking about this down your local pub, so thankfully it doesn't actually matter.
Plus your bleeding heart Tories were spending too much money on this sort of thing anyway. Time to get tough and prove to voters that they don't need to vote for Reform to stop this disability woke nonsense.
TBH the sort of thing above isn't much of a surprise.
Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't the previous Labour government alter unemployment benefit based upon forced participation in shelf stacking and likes for big chain stores.
They also compulsory purchased loads of terrace housing in working class areas (after running the areas down and paying peanuts for them 9-30K) to sell to their chosen developers, who queued up to offer front handers for a slice of the pie. Not to mention selling small land parcels from council estates, along side right-to-buy (a Tory idea) further diminishing existing stock and ensuring no further public hosing could be built on the land, as private housing now occupies the space!
It's not just the Tories who are shithouses.
Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't the previous Labour government .......
Blimey, how much has the political centre shifted that I now have to defend the Blair-Brown years?
The Labour governments of 1997-2010 were not noted for being austerity driven, on the contrary actually. In contrast the Tory-LibDem coalition and Tory governments of 2010-2024 are very much associated with austerity and its devastating consequences.
What we are now witnessing is more and new austerity from a recently elected "Labour" government, and the consequences will of course be devastating, eg it has been claimed that the cut in disability benefit will push 700,000 into poverty.
What the Blair-Brown governments had to deal with was Margret Thatcher's legacies. One of those legacies was the fact that because her policies pushed UK unemployment to over 3 million she desperately tried to manipulate the figures. She decided to redefine "unemployment" as specifically being on "unemployment benefit".
So among other things Thatcher categorised a lot of people as being on disability benefits and not included in the official unemployment figures. Whatever the rights or wrongs of it Labour decided to deal with that legacy. What the current "Labour" government are doing is not in response to government benefit/unemployment policies introduced 40 years ago.
You've only got to look at the seething illiterate logic of Liz Kendall. She shouldn't be in charge of anything more than bog roll. Lliz Kendall hasn't a got a ****ing clue other than what she's been told about finances. She would be better off in Reform. "It's not working for tax-payers." She says. No impact assessment as far as I know. Another clueless shit-face policy from the stupidest people at the stupidest time.
Nothing about what Labour is doing here will be anything less than a disaster and is absolute evidence of a right-wing idealistically failed set of cruel bean counters.
Labour have done bugger all for the vulnerable so far of any merit - apart from attack them.
This will be a massive fail (it's a small amount of government money in reality). Given the current feeling of people sinking to the bottom amongst Labour supported energy rises and other financial kicks - this will probably take them lower in the polls.
Once again for the incalculably stupid - the government is not restrained by amount of £££ it needs. Looking for cuts like this on the vulnerable will absolutely do no good. It has no savings account and all government spending is new money. Like Musk with DOGE - Kendall is simply removing money from the economy. There is no return now on that money for anyone.
It will also shrink the economy as money is removed.
Grown-ups, sensibles etc appear to have zero critical thinking or political analysis on these issues other than their ideological purity to follow shrinking the state - despite what the real 'needs' might be.
I am sure the Starmer fan boys will be along in a minute to tell us why going after disability benefits is the right choice amongst all the choices they could be making.
before Rone decides to try to bore us to death again...if im lucky he'll post a helpful youtube video which agrees with him
do you think that Universal Credit has been a success? do you think that PIP is a well targetted and essential lifeline?
do you think that the current employment rates be that youth, gig economy, remote/hybrid, double hatting childcare are a) good b)sustainable c)have knock on positive impacts on education, justice, health?
How about you actually share your views before demanding everyone else shares theirs. I am sure you have a point to make or are you just trying to bore us to death with inane questions.
I still want to know why none of the usual suspects are prepared to justify their own uncomfortable prejudices and isms.
Why do you all hate donkeys and want to see them suffer, eh? WHY?
The double standards are frankly disgusting
The stats are quite shocking. One in 8 young people not in education, employment or training is abysmal. Three or four kids out of every classroom straight onto the scrapheap - what a disaster.
The precipitous rise in the forecast cost of out-of-work benefits is also alarming.
Even if we did fire up the old crystal dome and spray some newly created cash around the place, that would be nothing more than a sticking plaster. These stats show an underlying problem - a humanitarian problem, a social problem, whatever you want to call it - that a responsible government should try and solve.
I trust Labour to have a proper look at it and come up with a fair plan that addresses it from all angles. I know they've already done some things with work coaches. Perhaps some more things like that. Increasing the minimum wage, check. Continuing their good work to improve working conditions should also help. But sometimes you do need a bit of stick to go with all the carrot, it wouldn't surprise me.
The challenge of course is to make sure that stick never lands where it shouldn't - something the Tories never cared about.
Tory policies with performative cruelty being spotlighted as a virtue.
Or
Tory policies with a mutter of "we're really sorry to have to do this".
It's not much of a ****ing choice, is it?
Centralist bastard Labour Party - backing paid miscarriage bereavement leave - they should be ashamed of themselves.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/clyjd18l0y3o
The stats are quite shocking. One in 8 young people not in education, employment or training is abysmal. Three or four kids out of every classroom straight onto the scrapheap - what a disaster.
Yes indeed. And you're right this is a social issue, but cash would help a great deal. Get more teachers, get the teachers the resources and training they need to help kids. Get families more help. Get more facilities to give kids and parents more opportunities and better lives. You do need a proper compassionate intelligent joined up approach, but that takes money. Humanity is something that needs money investing in it.
Centralist bastard Labour Party - backing paid miscarriage bereavement leave - they should be ashamed of themselves.
I'm sure you think you're making a point.
Centralist bastard Labour Party
You prefer devolved government?
I'm sure you think you're making a point.
Indeed. Especially since the government agrees in principle. I'm sure there are many things they agree with in principle but lets wait until it's signed into law before we start popping champagne corks.
In addition, the Tories also agree with the proposal despite disagreeing with pretty much everything else in the Employment Rights Bill.
Do people even read the articles they post or do they just scan the headlines looking for one that seems to support their team?
Why do you all hate donkeys and want to see them suffer, eh? WHY?
You showed yourself to be remarkably ill-informed yesterday which is fine. Most of us were. Strangely you also seem to be completely incapable of using google (other search engines are available).
I'm sure the rest of us were happy to stop talking about it but you seem to be hell-bent on continuing the discussion despite, as you yourself pointed out, no one covering it other than page 14 of the Guardian.
If I were you I would let it go but if you want to continue not explaining your reasoning then you go right ahead. We'll continue pointing out that you're being a bit of a numpty.
I'm sure you think you're making a point.
To be fair you cant expect them to have read the entire article and understood that it is an amendment rather than government led and secondly that the tories arent against it. So let them pat themselves on the back.
Note how a second amendment that NDAs shouldnt be used to silence people is simply "an important issue that warrants further consideration".
In addition, the Tories also agree with the proposal despite disagreeing with pretty much everything else in the Employment Rights Bill.
Not just the Tories, it has wide cross-party support which includes the LibDems and the SNP.
So yes the current government is clearly giving its support to some important issues.
What I want to know though is whether anyone was talking about "miscarriage bereavement" when binners was watching the rugby.
According to loyal Starmer supporter binners this decides whether an issue is important enough to qualify for his support.
What I want to know though is whether anyone was talking about "miscarriage bereavement" when binners was watching the rugby.
I'm sure Binners will post an asinine response.
I see what you did there. Very good
#donkeylivesmatter
