I reckon double figures is enough for their own thread, so tough issues first, the name? We need a flip chart and some pens to come up with that!! Next we need some factions 🙂
Will the be the Pro Remain voice? Will they get some more support? Or more importantly how many will be back at HQ come April?
Was Not Was.
Will any lib dems defect to join them? as theyve already said they wont be joining vince!
Peston reckons that theres more pressure on Sinn Fein to take up their seats now as then May would no longer have a majority
It's finally happening then!
PMQs is gonna be amusing or dull, I dunno
Can we get Phil to commentate on the state of the breakaways and their chance of getting to the line or are they just in it for the advertising and intermediate sprints?
Name: defili
Factions: From what I understand there are already several including whether to have a party or not.
Main problem they face is the same as (their predecessor party?) the Libdems. The "centrist" vote is too geographically spread so without really appealing to either left or right (or just hijacking the party for a bit) they will have difficulty gaining traction.
Time to see how they voted on parliamentary reform.
Comment of the day Mike!
The “centrist” vote is too geographically spread so without really appealing to either left or right (or just hijacking the party for a bit) they will have difficulty gaining traction.
Major, Blair, Brown and Cameron are all centrists. Collectively they represent 26 years of Government. Far from perfect of course, Economic Collapse, War and the Referendum obvious low-points, but they all treaded the middle ground and were able to set aside idealism to choose policies traditionally from each side of the divide for the benefit of the country.
I think there has never been a better time to be an independent MP. If they don't have aspirations to form a government then why do they need a 'party' as such. Why can't they just be a collective group of independent MP's trying to reflect he views of their constituents rather than a party?
I think it is a shame there are not more independent MP's in Parliament
they all treaded the middle ground and were able to set aside idealism to choose policies traditionally from each side of the divide for the benefit of the country.
To pick two examples, the Iraq war and NHS reforms were driven by ideology.
Centrelights
or
Centrelightweights
But who will be leader. Will there be a leader...
To pick two examples, the Iraq war and NHS reforms were driven by ideology.
I'm trying to use use a more nuanced tone, but I guess my "far from perfect of course" line wasn't definitive enough 😉
May and Corbyn aren't completely driven by ideology, the Indie's won't be completely free-thinking pragmatists, no one is 100% anything and certainly not perfect.
both May & Corbyn have been so remarkably inept as leaders, particularly over Brexit the really amazing thing is that more MPs havent quit their parties!
Luciana won’t retain her seat. She’s my local MP. Whilst she was excellent when I contacted her for help to resolve a problem Labour could put up a dead cat for election in my constituency and win.
Good to see Torres jumping ship as well and for very valid reasons.
Will there be a leader…
Chuka Umunna seems to be the defacto leader at the moment.
Cons and Labour are both un-electable right now, so this Independent movement really spices things up.
I'm all for it - my vote goes where to the policies I agree with, not to a party colour.
I'd love to think that this is a real move towards complete political reform in the UK - but I just can't see that happening. Not until the country/services/economy is truly on its knees at least. UK Politics proves to us time and again that even when broken, it doesn't actually require fixing..
New party is being financially supported by rich donors to the tune of £50M, all bar one; Simon Franks, remain secret.
I'm not certain that's a good way of promoting democracy.
both May & Corbyn have been so remarkably inept as leaders, particularly over Brexit the really amazing thing is that more MPs havent quit their parties!
More are coming, there's at least 2 Tories who were planning to jump today and forever reason haven't as yet.
If they can get say... 30 in the coming days / weeks, they won't be anywhere near a majority of course, but they seem pretty well aligned with the SNP, Lib Dems and Plaid - they have the numbers to be Kingmakers in Westminster.
I think a lot of these MPs already suspected that their seats were in jeopardy, so they are freer to put the interests of the country first, for once!
It’s finally happening then!
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/apr/07/new-political-party-break-mould-westminster-uk-brexit
/blockquote>Despite the underwhelming response on here - I get very excited reading things like that!
New party is being financially supported by rich donors to the tune of £50M, all bar one; Simon Franks, remain secret.
I’m not certain that’s a good way of promoting democracy.
Give them a few days at least to get themselves together, remember they had to do most of this behind closed doors. If Chuka wasn't passing notes with the words "tsetse fly" on it, I'll be a bit disappointed.
They could call it the Birthday Party and they'll be jelly, ice-cream and party blowers for all :toot:
It's political suicide int it tho coz at the next GE the people will just vote for the official lab/con candidate and they'll be out of public office.
What are we reckoning..funded by Israel? All the left fb pages are going on about this but I'm not so sure...what would be the reason?
I would have thought that Ivan Lewis would be joining soon too.
Only a few more Torys need to jump before there has to be an election. Which is ironic because if there is a sudden GE then almost all the 'Independent Party' people will lose their seats.
If it did happen an election would be a terrific excuse to delay Brexit. Maybe that delay could turn out to be indefinite. (Or as a whacky leftfeild unlikely outside chance maybe a large umber of independent MPs could stand on a "Stop Brexit and then call a new GE ticket.")
I don't see the point in being cynical about it before they've even kicked a baw.
Let them find their feet and say their piece...
Then we can laugh at them! 😆
I’m trying to use use a more nuanced tone, but I guess my “far from perfect of course” line wasn’t definitive enough 😉
You said that they were able to set aside idealism, but I think that is demonstrably untrue: Blair and Cameron both pursued hugely damaging policies because of their beliefs.
Only a few more Torys need to jump before there has to be an election.
Well not exactly. There doesn't HAVE to be an election does there?
The government is already lacking the numbers to get its legislation passed. What difference does 3, 5, 10 fewer Tory MPs really make? Still May presses on without majority support.
I am very interested in the idea that it's being backed by philanthropists etc. Even if they only win a small number of seats, if any, it'll certainly have an effect. If they win 10-20 seats, well, that could shake things up quite a lot.
Well not exactly. There doesn’t HAVE to be an election does there?
Good point.
I don’t see the point in being cynical about it before they’ve even kicked a baw.
Very much this. I still think there may be an anti-Brexit plan here that doesn't even require the Independents to form a party.
You said that they were able to set aside idealism, but I think that is demonstrably untrue: Blair and Cameron both pursued hugely damaging policies because of their beliefs.
Nah, I tied, but it's not working.
Yep, you're completely 100% right because of those actions, which you declare to be driven by ideology it's a completely proven fact that they were idealists completely devoid of independent thought at all times, in every situation.
I wonder where they'll sit on the Commons now, I guess the ex-Tories will have to sit on the opposition benches (probably for the best given how some MPs act in parliament).
Well both leaders ignored them during PMQ's. How very bold and brave of them.
Yep, you’re completely 100% right because of those actions, which you declare to be driven by ideology it’s a completely proven fact that they were idealists completely devoid of independent thought at all times, in every situation.
You seem to be under the impression that I am disagreeing with you because I have not understood your point. In fact, I am disagreeing with you because I think you are wrong, and misrepresenting my view through reductio ad absurdum reinforces my belief that your argument is not a strong one.
LOL! Told you I see them coming. (mentioned in the other thread few days ago ...)
New Labour
New new labour remainders
Tories
New Tories remainders
Guess I is not wrong.
😀
All they will achieve is splitting the vote on the left and ensure the tories stay in power. Probably their intention
All they will achieve is splitting the vote on the left and ensure the tories stay in power. Probably their intention
It works both ways all parties are split.
All they will achieve is splitting the vote on the left and ensure the tories stay in power.
Zero change from the current position then.
Or maybe they disagree with their former party lines, especially On Brexit.
Supporting Labour and Corbyn equals to supporting Brexit.
You can't deny it.
And same with Tories.
Hopefully they'll learn to stop mis-speaking when the cameras are rolling...
https://twitter.com/angelasmithmp/status/1097518807357288448
ensure the tories stay in power.
Labours indifference and utter uselessness is managing that all on it's own. They are unelectable even without this.
