I'm "mates with the owner" of another forum and if anything it increases my level of self-moderation because I don't want to abuse that friendship by putting him a position where he has to chose.
On another note, is the swear filter really necessary these days? Anyone claiming it's because this is a family forum is delusional, it's a bunch of middle aged men testiculating over things they have no control over FFS... 😉
A virtue signalling filter would be much more useful but would probably cause the forum to implode.
I got a ban for arguing with one of the aforementioned, #justsayin.
Bruce let it go and have a long hard think about your posting history and style. I've been on here for years and managed a grand total of 2 gentle warnings from the mods despite getting into it with a few people on here including dazh. Both occasions I stepped over the line as I'm not so good at playing the game as some others on here after getting very very frustrated (and forgetting it's just a forum). I have been to STW towers and once walked past the STW tent at Mountain Mayhem but I'm pretty sure the owners don't know or care I exist.
What Stumpy says - after a similar thread when I got called out a few years ago I apologised and have tried to alter my behaviour. Its horrible to have to face but I know having been there
You made it public so I responded publicly Brucewee.
you break the rules and it’s spotted you get modded
Who does the spotting, though?
Is it mods or is it users (who may have an ulterior motive) reporting it to mods - either via the report button or by messaging?
Fully accepting that rule-breaking will need to have taken place for any sanction.
And who watches the watchers? Feels like we need an additional oversight team to keep an eye both on the mods and these 'pet posters' of theirs, given the enormous amounts of life-altering power they appear to hold. 😀
Also, top marks for the perfect use of 'testiculating' above.
Another global pandemic should perk things up 😉. Don’t think I’ve even had a warning let alone a ban. But then I’m not anonymous, and treat others as I would if they were in the room. Civility matters. And when the serious topics come from those in need, this place still shines.
The new platform is however a challenge. It’s crawling on chrome on my iPhone 12. And I never got over the original classifieds forum swap.
Forums have a huge amount of competition. I think Whatsapp must be a big competitor
I still like it here, warts and all. Usability is pretty good now and i like being able to post pictures without going through a third party site.
In the real weird world i think MTB seems to be alive and well. But as an unskilled 59 year old rider i feel left behind. I still riding off road every week and some times on an FS bike. But I don’t get far off the ground and I’m not really pushing hard into the corners.
I went to Chicksands not long ago. Lots of great people. Skilled riders looking out for each other. Wonderful bikes. But I’d say as a group they seemed more doers than typers into forums
i generally avoid political treads. But i have had my views changed but other discussions in here
Who does the spotting, though?
Is it mods or is it users (who may have an ulterior motive) reporting it to mods - either via the report button or by messaging?
Does it matter? Even if a user reports a post with an ulterior motive, the mod will take the reported post at face value and act (or not) accordingly. The forum seems fairly moderated to me, with a light touch. They have to deal with some right old tosh too, at all hours with no thanks or remuneration. Only to be accused by those on the receiving end of warnings or bans of bias. In most of those cases I see it like some incredulous footy player waving his arms at the ref and pleading innocence after blatantly slicing someone's legs from under them. I just can't buy the idea of moderator or site owner "favourites" getting let off with breaking forum rules. Or even of them having favourites tbh - they're grown ups not school dinner monitors.
as an unskilled 59 year old rider i feel left behind. I still riding off road every week and some times on an FS bike. But I don’t get far off the ground and I’m not really pushing hard into the corners.
Are you me? 😆
This place just needs more silliness and piss-taking in general, it's a forum, it's supposed to be a bit undignified and anarchic. There is nostalgia for 10+ year-old 'classic' threads but not a lot of sign of the right conditions for next one showing
Back in the day (early/mid 2000’s) the stw forum was a frenzy of activity and piss taking mostly due to the way we all knew each other in one form or another as we’d meet up at weekends around the 7stanes/welsh mtb centres/out in the wilds along with the very active single speed scene such as the races/meet ups so naturally everyone knew everyone else (especially us SS’ers as we were a very weird bunch 😉), then there was mountain mayhem, sleepless in the saddle, real ale wobble, Bristol bike fest etc.
One weekend I could be riding down at cwmcarn, next weekend I could be up at aviemore, across at hamsterly or merely at my local trail kirroughtree 25 mins from my door, all of these times I could guarantee I’d be in the car park or out on the trail and meet a fellow stw’r…it was almost a running joke that we needed a secret nod/handshake/funny walk to identify each other.
And don’t forget we were all a lot younger and had more free time back in the day, I’ve recently broke through the half century barrier
I personally last rode a “normal bike” in 2016, got Scott e-genius from Dave @ bothy bikes which kept me mobile for a further 2 years then diagnosed with SPMS which led me to fitting my cove hummer with a throttle bafang conversion which kept me mobile till end of 2020 when I could no longer get on it.
I’ll never get on/ride a bike again but this forum is still my go to first page that I look at when I sit down with my toast/coffee, it “does” take an age to load/post/browse etc… the functionality of including YouTube links often doesn’t work, same goes for attempting to post website links/hypertext links or similar so whilst I very often have something I consider valuable or interesting to post I generally give it one attempt and if it doesn’t work I think “**** it” and go do/browse something else.
I wish it was similar to how it looked 20 odd years ago as it was perfectly useable and functional, it looks “messy” compared to other forums I use such as…..edit - prime example as I just attempted to include hypertext links to other forums here but the web address thingy doesn’t seem to be working (iPad pro,,latest software) so I’ll post “functional” forums I use below as examples
https://community.drownedinsound.com/latest
https://pinkfishmedia.net/forum/whats-new/posts/1454051/
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?whats-new/posts/10536590/
Anyway…….thats my gripe over…….heres a pic from 2004, way back in the day at 2004 SSUK champs at Aviemore when all was fine (with the forum and my ability to ride) 😉
[img] 
[/img]
Edit : just as well I copied the above before posting as it didn’t work the first time, and took 15+ seconds the 2nd time, must remember to copy everything before hitting the “post reply” button.
Using iMac/ipad/iPhone safari all using latest software updates etc
Bruce let it go and have a long hard think about your posting history and style.
Yeah Bruce - you might want to increase the patronising level of your posts if you want to fit in with the gang.
Are you me? 😆
I think he's most of us, well maybe not me, my time on the trails is spent building them rather than riding them. Mind you as one of the younger volunteers at 54 I'm looking forward to getting my bus pass and ebike and riding again when I'm old enough, like the others do.
Back in the day (early/mid 2000’s) the stw forum was a frenzy of activity and piss taking mostly due to the way we all knew each other in one form or another as we’d meet up at weekends around the 7stanes/welsh mtb centres/out in the wilds along with the very active single speed scene such as the races/meet ups so naturally everyone knew everyone else (especially us SS’ers as we were a very weird bunch 😉), then there was mountain mayhem, sleepless in the saddle, real ale wobble, Bristol bike fest etc.
I think that was a huge part of the initial success of the forum and the mag.
Much the same way that some folk used to get to Pat Adam's house at 5am with their Mountain Mayhem entry form and it wasn't considered weird; maybe a bit eccentric but he "knew" you and you "knew" him and likewise you'd "know" half the people at the event.
Is it the internet in general that's removed that community feel or has it split, split and split some more into more niche / local groups...? Or is it simply that many people have moved on in life, the events have evolved / died off / been reborn...?
I’ll never get on/ride a bike again but this forum is still my go to first page that I look at when I sit down with my toast/coffee,
I barely rode MTB at all for about 10 years (did road & gravel plus a bit of track) but STW was still the main cycling site that I looked at and certainly the only one I posted on. road.cc forum was overrun by spambots and trolls, most other forums I dipped into had a tenth the traffic of this place. Possible exception being London Fixed Gear & Single Speed (LFGSS) but that had so many sub-forums it was a total pain to navigate.
For people who supposedly want me to stop posting you sure do seem to like to lay out stuff for me to respond to.
Bruce let it go and have a long hard think about your posting history and style.
I tend to match the energy of the posts I'm responding to. binners' initial post that I answered set the tone and other people have been jumping in and escalating since. Seemingly some amongst you have been pissed off at me for quite some time. OK. Maybe try calling me out at the time directly rather than meta comments about 'some people' on STW. Expressing how others are making us feel is a good way to check in and make sure everyone is comfortable with the exchanges.
My posting style on here is much the same as the way I speak in real life. If anything I'm more reserved here. However, perhaps something is getting lost without the tone and body language of a face to face interaction. That's why it's really important to say things directly to people on here. Very difficult to read the room through text boxes.
You made it public so I responded publicly Brucewee.
Yes, and as I said the reason I started bringing it up publicly was because as I experienced it I wasn't getting deleted if I did so. I'm quite happy to never mention it again.
What Stumpy says - after a similar thread when I got called out a few years ago I apologised and have tried to alter my behaviour. Its horrible to have to face but I know having been there
I actually apologise on here quite often. I apologised to someone on a thread recently who said I was making them feel shit. I apologised and we were able to move forward with better boundaries. I apologised to you as I genuinely don't think you are a bigot and if I said that I must have been having a particularly bad day. I apologised to someone else who said I called them a racist (who I definitely don't think is a racist).
I don't try to wiggle out of it or 'apologise if you feel that way'. Even if I didn't mean it that way, it was taken that way so that's all that matters.
I strongly feel we should just acknowledge and validate the way people remember exchanges going rather than trying to convince them they experienced things 'wrong'.
Within reason, obviously.
Anyway, sorry to all the mods on here. I'm not trying to say you are inherently biased. I'm saying this is what I experienced. It looked to me like there was some unconscious bias when it came to two specific posters but I definitely accept it could all just be purely coincidental.
And sorry to anyone I've been pissing off recently. Just let me know at the time when I've actually said something. Honestly, I will always make the effort to validate the way you are hearing what I'm saying and try to adjust.
reading this thread, i would say the forum is fine and dandy.
loads of middleaged old blokes arguing about **** all.
Bruce let it go and have a long hard think about your posting history and style.
Yeah Bruce - you might want to increase the patronising level of your posts if you want to fit in with the gang.
There is no "gang" to fit in with. Which probably means there's no "them" out to get "us".
Does it matter? Even if a user reports a post with an ulterior motive, the mod will take the reported post at face value and act (or not) accordingly.
On an individual basis no. But if there is a couple of very active post reporters on a particular side of arguments within threads, then they'll prevail in the end. Especially if others are simply not minded to report stuff. And what if the mod is not openly declared as such? I've seen this in operation on other forums/groups and it can become corrosive.
Of course, looked at objectively, hardly anything on STW matters in the wider world in its own right. The issues being discussed may be incredibly important, but STW's take on them is irrelevant most of the time.
loads of middleaged old blokes arguing about **** all.
No we're not...
On an individual basis no. But if there is a couple of very active post reporters on a particular side of arguments within threads, then they'll prevail in the end. Especially if others are simply not minded to report stuff. And what if the mod is not openly declared as such? I've seen this in operation on other forums/groups and it can become corrosive.
There's a lot of "ifs" in all of that. To the point that it's almost whataboutery
I was one of those on the New Forum thread who thought I'd noticed a drop off in forum activity recently. I still think that's the case generally, but over 200 posts in a day or so on this thread proves there's plenty of life in the place yet. So more mildly contentious threads with a sprinkling of nostalgia, introspection and a few handbag duels seems to be the winning formula?
There's a lot of "ifs" in all of that. To the point that it's almost whataboutery
Point taken.
On an individual basis no. But if there is a couple of very active post reporters on a particular side of arguments within threads, then they'll prevail in the end. Especially if others are simply not minded to report stuff. And what if the mod is not openly declared as such? I've seen this in operation on other forums/groups and it can become corrosive.
Doesn’t work like that.
On an individual basis no. But if there is a couple of very active post reporters on a particular side of arguments within threads, then they'll prevail in the end. Especially if others are simply not minded to report stuff. And what if the mod is not openly declared as such? I've seen this in operation on other forums/groups and it can become corrosive.
Doesn’t work like that.
I have been told off by mods for reporting too much and have had reports ignored.
NO issue with that BTW
Not quite how it happened though.
we got all serious along the way, Friday Kylie being an example. I wasn't particularly a fan of the thread, but was it really that bad?
From memory, it got forbidden because (as ever) there's always someone who has to take it too far. I could be wrong.
Besides, a group of mostly middle-aged blokes thigh-rubbing over women some of whom were half their age isn't a great look and hardly welcoming for new female members.
Plus, I'd be thinking of her sister.
Well I suppose this thread proves the forum isn't really dead.
I ride bikes.
Sorry, playing catch-up.
People have understood what Cougar said decades ago, once you've put something into the Internet you can't get it out again. And as the active community gets smaller it gets too easy to guess who's behind the new login.
I don't know what the new moderation suite looks like (or even if there is a new one) but back when I was a moderator, spotting returning-banned and working out who they were was almost sport. Nine times out of ten it wasn't difficult because some people simply can't help themselves and they're generally not as smart as they think they are.
I kept a text file of shibboleths for the known problem children who had earned the accolade of "ban on sight." They usually get the message eventually (or start behaving, which is all we really wanted anyway) but they're a pain in the arse. There's a couple of posters today who I'm genuinely surprised still have accounts.
This site taking longer than any other I’ve ever used to refresh or basically function as a forum, then popping up with stuff on every page you visit which makes it borderline unusable doesn’t help. I subscribed for over 10 years in the past but to me it’s a pale imitation of its former self and I don’t think it’s worth it. Supporter the raffles too hoping for a last hurrah but nothing works as it did. I don’t care what it looks like and I don’t mind change, but it has to perform its basic requirements and struggles to. Wish it wasn’t the case.
I find other small things annoying. Users post content and then stw towers crack on (after being beaten to it) that something is breaking news wise, then they close busy threads and post their own “news story” to gain traction to their own journalism. Not sure it’s healthy.
Classified died and used to generate a lot of interest and traffic.
Seems a bit of a death spiral if I’m honest.
Besides, a group of mostly middle-aged blokes thigh-rubbing over women some of whom were half their age isn't a great look and hardly welcoming for new female members.
Plus, I'd be thinking of her sister.
If you're a 112 year old bloke and still able to rub your thighs to pictures of Kylie I say good on you.
Yes, we are all getting old.
Kylie is 4/5 years older than myself…….so as she’s not half my age I consider myself not guilty 😉
I've been here since the start and I'll be gutted if it dies, but I think it's inevitable.
There's still half a million people coming to the site every month. And while I get that there's issues with the forum that we still need to work through, to be fair the posts that the forum is dying have been a regular topic for over 20 years. I'm not being complacent but there's a lot to be optimistic about the future of Singletrack. Right now as I type there are 604 people active across the site. 458 from the UK, 43 from the US and the rest from other countries. It's Saturday and this is the quietest day of the week for the site. Typically on a monday evening around 9pm we'll see well over 1000 people actively viewing pages across the site - daily figures are typically 20k+ people on the site. I'm not saying nothing is wrong and all is hunkdory.. It really isn't. It's never been harder than right now to keep a niche media company afloat but there's still a lot to be optimistic about the future. There are very few forums left that are run by media companies now - certainly a lot less than several years ago. MBR closed theirs around GDPR time and BikeRadar shut all theirs down in March of this year. Road.cc is going strong but everyone in this space is struggling and we are doing our absolute best to keep going. You all know how hard it is for the team here and you all know our limitations - Your support has always been appreciated and I don't take that for granted for a second - But... please be patient. The forum is a vital part of what we are and we know how important it is to many of you. There is no complacency at our side and every day we look to make improvements. A forum of 10 million posts is massive. It's a battle everyday to keep that going and especially so alongside a full magazine membership system. The two are intrinsic to each other and they cannot be separated. One cannot exist without the other now. We work every day (7 days/week) to keep improving it.
And we do listen to what you have to say - always and we try and act on it as best we can.
Is the forum dying? IMHO no it isn't. Is it different to how it was? Most certainly. Forums are changing everywhere. How people interact with websites is constantly changing and Singletrack is constantly changing too. That's why we are still here a quarter of a century since we started.
We'll keep at it for as long as we can doing the best we can. It's what we've always done.
458 people is not even chump change
head over to eMTB forum there’s thousands
There's a couple of posters today who I'm genuinely surprised still have accounts.
Spill the beans, you're retired from the Gestapo now. " 'ardest game in the world, 30 years man and boy". 😉
I find other small things annoying. Users post content and then stw towers crack on (after being beaten to it) that something is breaking news wise, then they close busy threads and post their own “news story” to gain traction to their own journalism. Not sure it’s healthy.
Actually writing copy, often having spoken to those involved, or providing background takes a bit longer than a few words and a link to instagram.
I've been here since the start and I'll be gutted if it dies, but I think it's inevitable.
There's still half a million people coming to the site every month. And while I get that there's issues with the forum that we still need to work through, to be fair the posts that the forum is dying have been a regular topic for over 20 years. I'm not being complacent but there's a lot to be optimistic about the future of Singletrack. Right now as I type there are 604 people active across the site. 458 from the UK, 43 from the US and the rest from other countries. It's Saturday and this is the quietest day of the week for the site. Typically on a monday evening around 9pm we'll see well over 1000 people actively viewing pages across the site - daily figures are typically 20k+ people on the site. I'm not saying nothing is wrong and all is hunkdory.. It really isn't. It's never been harder than right now to keep a niche media company afloat but there's still a lot to be optimistic about the future. There are very few forums left that are run by media companies now - certainly a lot less than several years ago. MBR closed theirs around GDPR time and BikeRadar shut all theirs down in March of this year. Road.cc is going strong but everyone in this space is struggling and we are doing our absolute best to keep going. You all know how hard it is for the team here and you all know our limitations - Your support has always been appreciated and I don't take that for granted for a second - But... please be patient. The forum is a vital part of what we are and we know how important it is to many of you. There is no complacency at our side and every day we look to make improvements. A forum of 10 million posts is massive. It's a battle everyday to keep that going and especially so alongside a full magazine membership system. The two are intrinsic to each other and they cannot be separated. One cannot exist without the other now. We work every day (7 days/week) to keep improving it.
And we do listen to what you have to say - always and we try and act on it as best we can.
Is the forum dying? IMHO no it isn't. Is it different to how it was? Most certainly. Forums are changing everywhere. How people interact with websites is constantly changing and Singletrack is constantly changing too. That's why we are still here a quarter of a century since we started.
We'll keep at it for as long as we can doing the best we can. It's what we've always done.
458 people is not even chump change
head over to eMTB forum there’s thousands
and yet, it has 6% of the posts this forum does, and fewer total members.
not a lot of sign of the right conditions for next one showing up or enough energy to sustain one if it does.
genuinely curious as to what topics folk thought weren't being started/replied to compared
I'm gobsmacked this is even up for debate. The forum software doesn't work [ properly?]. Any good intentions that anyone might have about starting, or contributing significantly to a thread, are quashed by the hideous battle trying to actually type and submit any input.
It's just not worth the effort. The only things that get posted are quick pointless comments exactly like mine here that the authors don't actually care whether it is posted or not.
And 723 different topic areas some of which have gone weeks without a reply.
reading this thread, i would say the forum is fine and dandy.
loads of middleaged old blokes arguing about **** all.
Yeah it's just like being in the pub. Except I can't afford the price of a pint these days so I'm rarely in the pub.
Maybe we should have a "virtual pub" on here
introspection and a few handbag duels seems to be the winning formula
Ooo we love a bit of handbags at dawn and long may it continue!
yet, it has 6% of the posts this forum does, and fewer total members
How much of that is current and how much 'past glories'?
Anyway - the point i'd make; anywhere I've worked (and this IS a workplace for the staff and mods) customer feedback is gold. Even if it's telling you home truths. What I'm seeing from mods and Mark is broadly rejection of the feedback being given, and that just puts me off further from feeling liked a valued customer.
All the comments about there being many more options nowadays, that there is Facebook and Whatsapp and other SM - they haven't been invented in the last 12mo, and yet the forum seemed to be active and thriving in terms of users and posts even against this competition. I understand why the 'upgrade' was needed but it has not been a success and you're burying heads in sands if you think it has.
This thread alone shows that there are people on the fringes of being active users who DO care enough to contribute, even if it is to give feedback that you don't like hearing. Up to you whether you want to act on it.
more to do with people quiet quitting the internet / social media in general.
THIS and SO MUCH this. I have got to the point now where I literally despise social media and everything it stands for. STW forum is unfortunately just another social media channel - and as such I can barely be bothered engaging with anymore.
In my very humble optinion - you can trace all the world’s current problems right now directly back to social media - and the massive, horrible impact it has on people's thinking and behaviour. STW forum is probably one of the least damaging social media channels in this respect, but to my mind - it still fits somewhere inside the Venn diagram. For that reason, I'm out (mostly!)
...And yes, the irony of expressing my oh-so-precious-opinions right here, on a social media channel, is not lost on me.
I find other small things annoying. Users post content and then stw towers crack on (after being beaten to it) that something is breaking news wise, then they close busy threads and post their own “news story” to gain traction to their own journalism. Not sure it’s healthy.
Actually writing copy, often having spoken to those involved, or providing background takes a bit longer than a few words and a link to instagram.
What a very patronising comment. Very little evidence of any inside scoop or “speaking to those involved”. And other outlets manage to break the news.
