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I think Botas wins that competition anyway.
Ooh very nice. I have a soft spot for Jessica though.
[i]I am an admitted JB fanboi[/i]
aracer, me too! yes, I got the count wrong, didn't include today's race d'oh!!
stand by what I said though, Magnussen makes much better sense from Maclaren's POV. I can't see Alonso being happy to go to Maclaren other wise. At the very least, he's not want a repeat of last time, where there wasn't a clear first and second driver, and Button wouldn't want that.
This season has been electric - for all people saying F1 is now sh*t, then you clearly haven't watched any races this year
I watched some bits of some races at the start of the season, fell asleep on the sofa and so couldn't be bothered with the rest.
I calculate that with 19 races ( I had to look that up) I have probably saved myself approx. 60 hours (qualifying +race day) to do something more exciting instead.
I am glad other people get something from it, but with some regret I have grown apart from it because of the politics and personalities.
fell asleep on the sofa and so couldn't be bothered with the rest.
So there is a reasonable chance you are arguing from a position of ignorance?
I don't watch the live events - refuse to line Murdoch's pockets - but i do watch the 90 min highlights every race and keep bang up to date with everything else - including the politics (which are fantastic!!) on-line.
This way, i get to go biking every weekend, then come home and watch the race with my dinner and a bottle of wine
win-win-win 🙂
stand by what I said though, Magnussen makes much better sense from Maclaren's POV. I can't see Alonso being happy to go to Maclaren other wise. At the very least, he's not want a repeat of last time, where there wasn't a clear first and second driver, and Button wouldn't want that.
Apparently it's the other way around - Alonso wants Button and McL are trying to sort out further sponsorship on the back of Alonso which may allow them to keep JB. Apparently Alonso would prefer JB too on the basis that a) he's a known quantity (that he reckons he can beat) and b) JB will be more help in developing the new Honda to get integrated into McL and also help sort out the new car.
Heres to a third title. 
I really like LH now, was always a fan but I'm warming to him more and more. I'm not a fan of diamond earrings, gold chains and tattoos but I think he's a character - and F1 needs more characters. It has been said in the F1 coverage that he's easy to market - that might be because his skin colour attracts a new audience but I think it's mostly because he has a style. You might not like that particular style but at least he has one!! Too many drivers repeating corporate responses - go too far with that and you end up being pretty faceless - Paul Diresta a prime example. Sponsors want something they can market and LH is perfect!
Plus he is turning out to be a really nice bloke now. Yeah he's had his ups and downs but that's great - people want to see emotion and passion about the sport which he had shown in spades. Rosberg has shown some real character in the last race and I think it'll stand him in good stead too.
After watching the domination of Williams years ago I am so happy to see them doing well again. There is something about a team whose name is the team owner/principle, and after handing the reins to Claire I think sets a fantastic legacy in place. I would love to see Massa win the World Championship one year, he's a great bloke and a great racer.
BTW - was anyone shocked at how long it took the marshals to put out the fire on Maldanados car? They didn't appear to be doing anything and someone had to run from the other side of the track to put the fire out. I am sure that would NEVER happen at Silverstone. What would have happened if he had been stuck in the car and the fire was spreading??
Big shout out to all the marshals at all the motor racing - something the Brits can be very proud of as our marshals are the best in the world and go to so many races around the world to support the local teams and basically show them how it's done. Nice to see the British marshal got to give Lewis a flag for the victory lap.
All I saw in this year's championship is that the team with the best engine and car package usually wins.
Mercedes made the best interpretation of the horribly complicated new engine rules. Their fuel also had more pep in it. They were aided by a ridiculous freeze on development, and were allowed to provide their own team with a more powerful model than the one they supplied to McLaren, Williams and Force India.
Disappointment of the year, definitely Raikkonen, I wouldn't employ him if I was running a team, far too many 'can't be arsed' races.
+1
He's a fantastic driver and I kind of like his 'whatever' attitude but I wouldn't have him in my fantasy F1 team. It's a shame he's basically hogging that seat at Ferrari when there are people like Vergne potentially looking at going back to being reserve drivers, or Button leaving altogether.
Are Ferrari actually wanting to keep him or are they stuck with him contractually now?
But Raikkonen is clearly better than he showed this year and while I agree his motivation seems to come and go, I reckon if they provided a better car (that he was comfortable in) then we'd see the best of him again.
But Raikkonen is clearly better than he showed this year
That's sort of my point- he's clearly better (much better) than his performances, but that's no good if he doesn't deliver, and he's had more than enough chances now.
And I agree - I'd rather have an Alonso who'll do everything he can regardless of how bad the car is but Kimi is great in a half decent car.
Raikkonen is probably the most disappointing driver of the year.
Ricciardo is probably the most impressive.
Well done to Lewis though, Rosberg was quick and consistent but when it mattered on a Sunday, Lewis was able to dominate his team mate.
Ron Dennis made an interesting comment though. He said that there were eight drivers on the grid who could have been world champion in the Mercedes
Their fuel also had more pep in it. They were aided by a ridiculous freeze on development, and were allowed to provide their own team with a more powerful model than the one they supplied to McLaren, Williams and Force India.
And they ran to the same rules as everyone else.
The others cocked-up, Mercedes didn't.
Ron Dennis made an interesting comment though. He said that there were eight drivers on the grid who could have been world champion in the Mercedes
Hamilton & Rosberg are a given.
Alonso
Vettel
Ricciardo
Button
Bottas
Raikkonen or Massa
That would be my 8 (or 9)
And they ran to the same rules as everyone else.The others cocked-up, Mercedes didn't.
Yes. That's exactly what I'm saying. Nobody except Hamilton or Rosberg had much chance of winning.
But the fact that we didn't know which of them it would be made it much better than last year
Well done to Hamilton, I am no fan of his but he drove very well and thoroughly deserved the win as the dominant driver at Mercedes. He really nailed it when he had to and that's outstanding work.
As for what Ron Dennis said, yes statement of the obvious as the Mercedes was so dominant.
northernmatt - MemberRon Dennis made an interesting comment though. He said that there were eight drivers on the grid who could have been world champion in the Mercedes
Hamilton & Rosberg are a given.
Alonso
Vettel
Ricciardo
Button
Bottas
Raikkonen or Massa
I'm not so sure about Vettel or Raikkonen because they both were outclassed by their team mate and showed that they can't drive a car they don't like.
they can't drive a car they don't like
But they would have liked a Mercedes.
The double points for last race thing got me thinking.
To keep the championship alive, all you need to do is make it all count on the last race - i.e. the winner of the last race is world champion. Eliminate qualifying for that race - make the results so far determine grid position.
BigJohn - Memberthey can't drive a car they don't like
But they would have liked a Mercedes.
Why would they?
Raikkonen did like the Ferarri because he couldn't set the front end up to his liking. And Vettel can't adapt his driving away from using RB's effective exhaust blown defuser to give much greater rear end grip when coming out of corners.
Ron Ron Ron
Did he mention about how if he'd have not been such a di** about his team his cars could have won more titles, ie. pi**ing off renault who dropped the tie up with them (and went onto win with williams!) , so he had to use ford , then peugeot , the signing of ANDRETTI ffs.
and his treatment of JB is laughable...
Ron anyone of 8 team managers on the grid could do you job and get those results
pi**ing off renault who dropped the tie up with them
Didn't know about that - link?
Ron Dennis had tried very hard to secure a deal with Renault, and even considered buying Ligier in order to obtain its Renault engines. McLaren would naturally have wanted to use Shell fuel and lubricants, and ultimately this proved a stumbling block with Renault’s sponsor, Elf. There was thus no alternative but to invest an estimated £6 million in developing the HB.
http://www.mclaren.com/formula1/heritage/cars/1993-formula-1-mclaren-mp4-8/
Ron Dennis made an interesting comment though. He said that there were eight drivers on the grid who could have been world champion in the Mercedes
Just shows how much more goes into being a world champion than being a good driver. Making the smart moves and deals, being in the right place at the right time, etc. Remember how people were saying what a mistake Hamilton had made, or how big a risk he was taking, going to Merc?
To that point:
Obviously hindsight is great but still...
Remember how people were saying what a mistake Hamilton had made, or how big a risk he was taking, going to Merc?
Well I was one of them @mrblobby but then again I will confess to not knowing much about F1 ! A good friend of mine who does run professional sports teams (non cars but budget $25m pa) said his "inside track" was that Merc where going make a very big impact (story told to me at the Singapore F1)
Was there ever an interview from Martin Whitmarsh following his sacking? He seemed to disappear at the time and I don't remember hearing anything from him afterwards either.
I expect that his silence would have been part of his settlement package. Same as FA has never slagged off McL after his season with them (which with hindsight is just as well!)
Ron anyone of 8 team managers on the grid could do you job and get those results
😀
Completely true as well. For a team of their size, experience and budget the performance was abysmal.
On track performance - pretty poor, not a single podium
Off track - also poor. No title sponsor and pretty shoddy treatment of their drivers
To be fair to Ron (or to treat him with even handed consideration in Ronspeak), he only took back the team late last year which meant he couldn't really influence it that much for 2014. Next year he'll have no excuse (for the chassis at least).
nemisis, I hadn't heard that (your comment re Alonso wanting JB to stay at Maclaren) but it does make sense.
I guess we'll only really know when Maclaren tell us their driver line up for next year!!
Ron Dennis made an interesting comment though. He said that there were eight drivers on the grid who could have been world champion in the MercedesHamilton & Rosberg are a given.
Alonso
Vettel
Ricciardo
Button
Bottas
Raikkonen or Massa
I imagine part of his comment was barbed/aimed at one or more drivers who 'jilted' his approach to sign for 2015....
COUGH LEWIS
Plus, really? You could say that about any previous title holder. Its a combination of the car, the driver AND luck.
A few of the above drivers were only starting to get to grips late in the season.
I don't like Ron. Plus even when you have the best car. Your team and team tactics really can conspire against the driver to tie him up. Cough Mclaren and their idiot pit crew and race strategy in 07 and 08. They'd have taken the Merc car and ruined their championship with the managment... all that work and cheating gone to waste. 😆
TBF, when I look at a lot of world championships, I do wonder whether the winning driver is often aided by data and set-up of the team mate. I'd think at the very least, the sharing of telemetry and the elimination of set-up parameters is useful, if you have a team mate whose judgement and talent you trust.nickc - Member
nemisis, I hadn't heard that (your comment re Alonso wanting JB to stay at Maclaren) but it does make sense.I guess we'll only really know when Maclaren tell us their driver line up for next year!!
Two things Button has to his credit are consistency and an ability to get the car off the line and make places that is probably only second to Alonso. Add to that he has regularly proven his ability to race wheel-to-wheel without catastrophe - passing as well as being passed - and you have a very safe pauir of hands.
Don't over look Honda when it comes to JB, they think highly of him and he brings alot to table in the fair east. (He was world champ in a Honda all barr name.)
If you were bringing a new engine and chassis together and had the chance of JB as a driver, you'd jump at it.
[quote=richmtb ]On track performance - pretty poor, not a single podium
I think you need to check the results of the Australian GP.
[quote=digga ]Add to that he has regularly proven his ability to race wheel-to-wheel without catastrophe - passing as well as being passed - and you have a very safe pauir of hands.
I'm not the only one on here who's mentioned the joy of seeing JB and FA going head to head - they know (and you know) that they will take every chance available, but never a chance which isn't available, and that the driver in front will block as much as they can, but give space when they have to. I think the only difference being that FA is sometimes able to create opportunities JB doesn't (as good as JB is I'm still not sure he'd have overtaken Schumacher in 130r).
I do hope what nemesis writes is true, and would love to know the source.
Found the article - I have seen it elsewhere too.
Brundle usually has his finger on the pulse though maybe the article is more speculative than I recalled.
That said, it's the simplest explanation for the delay for me - Now Alonso is confirmed, they're seeing what other money that can pull in and whether that's enough to pay for JB. Don't forget that McL will have a bit of a dent in their finances with this season not having been very good, not to mention having to pay for FA.
fell asleep on the sofa and so couldn't be bothered with the rest.
So there is a reasonable chance you are arguing from a position of ignorance?
No, boltonjon said anyone who thought F1 was sh*t hadn't seen any races. I merely said I had seen some bits of some races and couldn't be bothered with the rest. I was not ignorant of the bits I saw and thought dull. If I missed some 'great racing' after I made the decision to go and do something I believe was better instead so be it.
I am glad that you continue to enjoy what you feel is worthwhile to you. I've moved on, it happens.
(He was world champ in a Honda all barr name.)
And engine.
That team is untimately what is now the Merc factory team.
To keep the championship alive, all you need to do is make it all count on the last race - i.e. the winner of the last race is world champion. Eliminate qualifying for that race - make the results so far determine grid position.
So why not just have a one race season? The whole point of a season is to find out who the best person is consistently...
This season I've really gone off Bernie, I've never liked him, but his recent comments not being interested in getting new fans into the sport as they can't afford the brands of F1, pretty sure Bernie wasn't born rich & if all the young man in the street fans disappear then Sky/BT/ITV/BBC aren't going to be paying big bucks because if no-one watches they'll have no interest in covering it.
bernie doesnt really care what people think..he's just causing a stink to assert his authority. Apparently the divided and conquer mentality, unfortunately he has forgotten he has an employer who has intervened once this season already. I think its a last gasp attempt by bernie to show he has some power in the paddock.
Those shady backhand deals are long gone and the money men he dealt with before are being relived of their duties. So long bernie, you were lucky in germany to buy yourself out of jail.
Has Alonso definitely signed to McLaren then?
Well he's told the King of Spain he has. Allegedly.
Two things Button has to his credit are
The ability to under perform
and to have plenty of excuses ready for the post race interview to blame someone/thing else for his poor performance. Its no wonder none of the top teams want him for next season
It's funny. People who don't really know much about f1 often say that. Few if any people in the sport seem to agree. I know who I'd take as credible.
SPOTY candidates just announced.
Odds on it NOT being LH?
[quote=chrismac ]The ability to under perform
Ah. That will explain why he's been beaten by his teammate in the championship every year, even when his teammate has been a complete duffer like LH.
The ability to under perform
and to have plenty of excuses ready for the post race interview to blame someone/thing else for his poor performance. Its no wonder none of the top teams want him for next season
Even if that was true, which I don't believe it is we have...
The Canada thing
Last twice in a race and still won it. That's great driving and great tv
Oh and like Lewis when he was world champion he still had a team mate to beat
[quote=scotroutes ]SPOTY candidates just announced.
Odds on it NOT being LH?
You can currently get 7/2 at Bet365, which seems incredibly good value. I'm just trying to work out the catch. Unless of course the golfists are all more likely to vote, as the current odds-on favourite is McIlroy
http://www.oddschecker.com/awards/sports-personality-of-the-year/winner
Lewis has made it now, he's on BBC breakfast!
I think the thing with SPOTY is there's quite a big section of people that watch that are into golf. When Cav won it there was 3 golfers in there with him which split the vote up. With there only being one I can imagine McIlroy will get a bigger vote. Still think LH will get it though.
2015 season starts today!!
Bottas tops the time sheets, McLaren not off to a good start:
[url= http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2014/11/bottas-heads-day-one-of-abu-dhabi-test-as-mclaren-honda-makes-stuttering-debut/ ]James Allen on F1[/url]
McL off to the sort of start you'd expect, surely, especially as this is pre-preseason testing for them - we didn't see any of the other teams test their engines this early this year (though for Renault it was about this good 🙂 ).
So if 2015 has started who the hell is driving for McLaren?!
Er...Stoffel Vandoorne, obvs (?!?!!)
'Stoffel' is a great name, he'll go far.
Apparently not. They only managed three laps.
Decent showing from carterham I thought
I'm struggling to understand what Catherham are doing there.
Finishing ahead of Lotus, Sauber, Toro Rosso and McLaren Honda by the looks of it
Trying to make themselves look like a going concern with a future so someone wants to buy them I guess...
.
Were they the only ones on next year's tyres? What's the difference?
Maybe Will Stevens paid for another go?
Short video of the sound of the new Honda PU in the Mclaren MP4-29H leaving the garage in Abu Dhabi.
rumours are of v6 powerplants for 2016, still with kers
allegedly they will be cheaper..... dont we hear that every engine change!
also a push for the unfreeze of engine development in season, to allow the big 4 to catch up to each other by pumping huge amounts of cash when they realise their engine is rubbish (coughferraricough)
[url= http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2014/11/wehrlein-sets-the-pace-for-mercedes-as-mclaren-endure-another-nightmare-in-abu-dhabi-test-day-two/ ]McLaren only manage two laps in final day of testing. [/url] I'm actually sad that its all winding down for the year, it's been an amazing season with an excellent result. Can't wait for March 15th!! 🙂
March 15th? First test is Feb 1 isn't it? Then all the car launches before that...
b2b I think you're pretty safe predicting v6s in 2016 😉
Fair point! Should help to keep us ticking over the winter!
allegedly they will be cheaper..... dont we hear that every engine change!
.
I've never understood how changing the rules to make things 'cheaper' actually makes things cheaper. R&D is by the far the biggest cost and constantly changing the rules to reduce the manufacturing/servicing costs a wee bit is going to massively increase R&D spending. The only way around this is a total budget cap but the big teams are never going to allow that.
.
Whilst on the subject, the new engines. Supposed to use less fuel, but huge development costs last year to come up with a whole new system. In the spirit of allowing engineers to innovate and improving variety why not have engine rules which just say:
You can use whatever configuration/size/combination of internal combustion/electric motors you wish
Limit on turbo boost pressure for safety reasons?
Maximum fuel tank size is 100 litres, no refuelling. 90 litres next year...
At a stroke you have innovation galore and with decreasing fuel tank sizes an incentive to work on effeciancy too
(obviously simplified somewhat and ingnoring cost factors) When I started watching there were V8s, V10s and V12s all racing against each other quite happily.
Raced against each other happily you say, but the ones with the deepest pockets still win in the end.
Stop changing the rules each year for sure, but try to clamp down on costs so small teams can come to the grid.
Also divvy up the winnings and funding more equally.
why not have engine rules which just say:
You can use whatever configuration/size/combination of internal combustion/electric motors you wish
Maximum fuel tank size is 100 litres, no refuelling. 90 litres next year...
Budget really. Such open regs mean people have to spend a lot to be competitive and then keep spending.
Also having a more limited scope is supposed to secure more closely matched racing but Merc screwed that up. But give it a few years and everyone's engine will be very closely matched again.
The RB throwing toys out of the pram proposal for new V6s in 2016 is just stupid. RB have no issue with spending huge sums of money (they're 2nd best funded after Ferrari), they just don't like that they're not winning right now.
Going back to the engines they propose would likely see Mercedes, Renault and Honda leaving the sport which would leave F1 in a right mess.
The new engines are great - there's certainly application of the technology to the real world (hybrids seem like the short term solution to fuel price rises/climate change) and I actually really like that you can hear tyre squeal, etc in F1 now.
When I started watching there were V8s, V10s and V12s all racing against each other quite happily.
If you mean the early 80's the turbo in-line 4 came in and mopped the floor with all those dinosaurs.
Going back to the engines they propose would likely see Mercedes, Renault and Honda leaving the sport which would leave F1 in a right mess.
I think Mercedes are tied in for a number of years (they have agreed to stay in return for a nice fat wedge of cash). They have been rumoured to have spent about £100M developing the current engine though so they won't be happy.
As for Renault I can see them leaving F1 soon unless something happens to make them more competitive. Are redbull still signed up to use them next year?
I can see Red Bull switching to Audi for 2016. BMW have had their stint in F1 which didn't go that well (didn't they try to buy Williams?) so now it's VAGs time to have a go and they obviously have merc in their sights and have been pressurising Audi to leave LeMas to Porsche and take on F1 were it will have a greater marketing impact.
The only other companies I could see coming back are peugeot as they are big on small turbo engines and hybrid or Ford as they have the funds. In all honesty I am not sure what Renault are doing in F1 these days. Yes they have a big sporting history looking back at the early 90's with Williams and their lower rank single seat car engines but I don't think now is right for them and they are struggling.
It was the early 90s when I started watching ScottChegg. The Benneton Fords were using V8s, there were a couple of V12, the Ferraris and I think possibly the Larousses with the Lamborghini engines. Did Minardi use them for a bit too? I think most others had V10s.
.
Anyway, I think the less the rules impose the same solutions on people the more scope there is for innovation and for 'men in sheds' to take on the big teams. Look at probably the biggest change in F1, the switch from front to rear engines, the big budget teams of the day, Ferrari, Maserati, Alfa, Mercedes were all using big front engines but the rules were much less prescriptive and allowed an upstart British designer to fit a small engine at the back and beat them, they had just never thought of it. Same with turbos first time round, been allowed for years but no-one had really bothered with them until Renault and it became a game-changer.
I love the weird stuff, Brabham BT46B, Tyrell P36, will just not happen nowadays and then people moan because the cars all look the same
andrewh
I think that's all just an eara that's gone. All the big teams are pushing the limits all the time. Look at blown rear diffusers etc. I don't think the big teams think there is "a method and" stuck in their ways. I bet if Ferrari were allowed they would build loads of different engine solutions and use the best and spend their way to the top
just on radio - no double points for end of season race next year.
Hope JEV gets another drive after the news he's leaving Torro Rosso.