[Closed] The Animal Liberation Front should be listed as a proscribed terrorist group

I see lefties.... everywhere!

Lansera

I'm as right wing as they come on here!

I also spent over a decade working in animal research labs, as a home office licensed animal technician - I know my stuff on this one, and I, and my friends, have been on the receiving end of these peoples 'protest'

This is nothing to do with left wing or labour!

This is about a small bunch of zealots who, rather than loving animals, hate people!

I don't quite know how you relate them to labour and lefties.

Dunno how you think they are a terrorist group under the act either.

🙄

[b]Zulu eleven[/b] This is nothing to do with left wing or labour!

the FBI disagrees http://www2.fbi.gov/congress/congress02/jarboe021202.htm

This is nothing to do with left wing or labour!

Yeah, but let's not spoil his fun, eh? 😉

Hello Lanesra! Have a nice weekend? Must've enjoyed your result on Sunday, eh? I'd imagine you were at the game, rather than not being on here simply because you were banned for a couple of days or whatever...

I knew you'd bite on this TJ, read the act, read the court reports.

[i]Section 1. -
(1) In this Act "terrorism" means the use or threat of action where-
(a) the action falls within subsection (2),
(b) the use or threat is designed to influence the government [or an international governmental organisation][2] or to intimidate the public or a section of the public, and
(c) the use or threat is made for the purpose of advancing a political, religious [, racial][3] or ideological cause.
(2) Action falls within this subsection if it-
(a) involves serious violence against a person,
(b) involves serious damage to property,
(c) endangers a person's life, other than that of the person committing the action,
(d) creates a serious risk to the health or safety of the public or a section of the public, or
(e) is designed seriously to interfere with or seriously to disrupt an electronic system.
(3) The use or threat of action falling within subsection (2) which involves the use of firearms or explosives is terrorism whether or not subsection (1)(b) is satisfied.[/i]

Unless, of course (TJ) you agree of the stealing of bodies from graves, hoax bomb threats, allegations of paedophilia, threats to children etc etc..

im a 'leftie' ! ive even got an alternative hairstyle
though i believe animal testing for medical research is essential, and its related to my work

The FBI estimates that the ALF/[b]ELF[/b] have committed more than 600 criminal acts in the United States since 1996, resulting in damages in excess of 43 million dollars.

Eh? I've only been to America once! 😯

I did knock a bin over in a bank in Times Square though. Oh, and knocked over a glass in a bar in Bleacker St. 😳 Can't imagine I did [i]that[/i] much damage though.

Hitler banned vivisection and hunting, was he left wing too Lansera?

(TJ, Ernie - let this point go, I'm batting for your side on this one :wink:)

I'd be the first to call them terrorists!

But its not a left/right wing issue - they merely share a number of beliefs with left wing organisations.

[b]Zulu eleven[/b] they merely share a number of beliefs with left wing organisations.

Ergo, Left wing; this isn't a right/left wing argument, just highlighting the disgusting lengths the Animal Liberation Front go to, to achieve their aims

Trip trap troll.

I preferred them when they were just a loveable cuddly alien with a taste for suburban life and inexplicable popularity in Germany.

No Lansera

I share a deep seated belief in the essential messages and aims of the constitution of the United States.

And I own a gun...

Doesn't make me an American though.

😀

It is indeed nothing to do with politics.

But, the law did change a few years ago to make their protestations less harrassing for employees of various companies. The fact they now choose to use other tactics is a nuisance.

I'm sure they mostly wear leather shoes, eat meat and have (at some point) taken some kind of licenced medication.

Lanesra - but the alf have not done the things that means they are terrorists under the law - except perhaps property damage.

Hoist by your own petard.

Usual muddled wiooly thinking from the hard of thinking. Jezzo - you make Zulu look sane and thats a hard thing to do

Elfinsafety - Member
Oh, and knocked over a glass in a bar in Bleacker St.

I bet it was one of those contoured ones. They're quite expensive.

I don't quite know how you relate them to labour and lefties.

Don't be daft TJ. Lanesra loves winding up STWers. This thread fits perfectly in that respect.

I do agree with ratty, although if you [i][b]were[/b][/i] going to look at left and right on this issue, then if anything, the reverse is true.

A ex-gf of mine is very heavily involved in animal rights, she has often stated that she would never vote "socialist" as she calls it. And she visits in prison a ex-Croydon NF geezer who's doing time due to his animal rights activities.

More here : [url= http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1353870/Neo-nazis-join-animal-rights-groups.html ]Neo-nazis join animal rights groups[/url]

Brigitte Bardot is another obvious example.

TJ, sorry, You might want to tell that to my ex-boss, who had his head stoved in with a baseball bat... Or the people I have met who have received letter bombs and dirty hypo's through the post...

Doesn't make it a left/right wing issue though!

Ernie, I don't think we need to repeat our previous discussion on the left/right wing origins of the NSDAP...

I used to eat at this vegetarian place in Boscombe. It turned out that they held fund raisers for ALF.

I'll be furious if I'm on a no-fly list now, I only popped in for some falafel.

BH9er; I tell you, it was quite embarrassing. Bizarrely, the barmaid took a right fancy too me. I was with two ladies, and I think the idea of some kind of 'menage a quatre' excited her somewhat. 😯 She thought I had a nice bottom, and made me show it to the entire bar. 😳 Fortunately, the consensus was quite favourable, amonst the female clientele, at least.

I'll be perfectly honest, I was quite spaced out at the time. Was an interesting 'holiday'...

The Animal Liberation Front should be listed as a proscribed terrorist group

This is about a small bunch of zealots who, rather than loving animals, hate people!

animal testing on bbc2 now

I'm with ernie on this, used to know a couple of sabbers, and they were pretty right wing.

So Lanesra- which of the activities you quoted have the ALF done then?

TJ - I'd kind of disagree that they've done nothing to make them count as terrorists.

It's just that someone needs to stand and say they're a terrorist group. But because it's cuddly uddly animals, the public probably wouldn't respond well.

The really stupid thing is that instead of hitting pharma/Huntingdon and the like they'd be better protesting government as the vast majority of testing is mandated under law.

can't believe anyone has bothered to bite.

though i believe animal testing for medical research is essential

So zulu - whch of the activities you quoted have the ALF done then?

Well for starters -

[i]
the use or threat is designed to influence the government [or an international governmental organisation][2] or to intimidate the public or a section of the public, and
(c) the use or threat is made for the purpose of advancing a political, religious [, racial][3] or ideological cause.
(2) Action falls within this subsection if it-
(a) involves serious violence against a person,
(b) involves serious damage to property,
(c) endangers a person's life, other than that of the person committing the action,
(d) creates a serious risk to the health or safety of the public or a section of the public, or

[/i]

All of that to my knowledge. (20+ years as an angler and family who hunt. You get to know about them)

backhander - Member

though i believe animal testing for medical research is essential

I agree. It's the shampoo and lipstick testing that p1sses me off.
Of course the beagles love it; shiny hair and pouty lips. (JOKE)

...and all the fags they like!

I don't agree with animal testing personally. Sometimes the bunnies can't remember the answers and they get really anxious.

serious violence?endangered life?

If teh ALF fall into this category then so does the BNP and hunts certainly do so. Violence and endangering life. Been a good few prosecutions

Tj, yet gain your leftist views/prejudices get in the way of reality.

Have a read of this; http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2000/11/contents/enacted if you don't understand anything feel free to ask

Just in case you never read it before try again (left wing friendly links)

http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2010/oct/25/animal-research-animal-welfare

Or the most disgusting thing i've ever read http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2006/may/12/animalwelfare.topstories3

Now tell me how it's not a terrorist group

Section 1, which you again failed to counter

[i]Section 1. -
(1) In this Act "terrorism" means the use or threat of action where-
(a) the action falls within subsection (2),
(b) the use or threat is designed to influence the government [or an international governmental organisation][2] or to intimidate the public or a section of the public, and
(c) the use or threat is made for the purpose of advancing a political, religious [, racial][3] or ideological cause.
(2) Action falls within this subsection if it-
(a) involves serious violence against a person,
(b) involves serious damage to property,
(c) endangers a person's life, other than that of the person committing the action,
(d) creates a serious risk to the health or safety of the public or a section of the public, or
(e) is designed seriously to interfere with or seriously to disrupt an electronic system.
(3) The use or threat of action falling within subsection (2) which involves the use of firearms or explosives is terrorism whether or not subsection (1)(b) is satisfied.[/i]

Ernie, I don't think we need to ........

I'm agreeing with you ratty......it's not a left/right issue. I'm just saying I know about involvement of the far right in animal rights.

Here's the animal rights geezer from Croydon who's doing time.

http://www.thisiscroydontoday.co.uk/news/Jail-Croydon-animal-rights-blackmailer/article-632759-detail/article.html

He was in the Croydon NF in the 1980s

alcoholic mice on bbc2 now

Lanesra - you have asserted the ALF are a terrorist group within the meaning of the act. I don't see that they have passed the test that you quote unless you draw teh line so loosely that the BNP become a terrorist group, the countryside alliance is, hunts and all sorts of othergroups.

Make your case. You have not done so yet.

You're a crank - They've already passed the test (read the court reports)

If you can show me the BNP/Countryside alliance have dug up graves and stole bodies, I'll (maybe) respect you're point of view

Does Lanesra ever post owt positive and nice on here, or only stuff that provokes argument?

Why does digging up graves mean they pass the test to be terrorists?

Pretty abhorent behaviour but there are clear tests to pass for a group to be proscribed under the act and yo have failed to shaowe the ALF have done so.

Hunts - known to use violence against their enemies, deliberate attempts to influence government policy with the threat of disorder.

You are the crank - so blind. Draw the definition so loosely as to catch the ALF and you scoop up all sorts of other folk as well - the BNP and hunts /. countryside alliance for sure.

TJ - I admire your compassion and humanity.

Lanesra is sad lonely and unloved.

And yet only you, really give Lanesra the attention he so desperately craves.

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You know me. Like all lefties full of compassion for my fellow man - even the intellectually challenged, the sad and lonely and the deluded

Again, you miss the point, crank

Read the act http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2000/11/contents/enacted /p>

Read the reports> http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2010/oct/25/animal-research-animal-welfare

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2006/may/12/animalwelfare.topstories3

After today there is a large movement within the Govt to outlaw the Animal Liberation Front

The countryside alliance, is that the group that had a member decapitated by a gyrocopter?

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/2875491/Gyro-pilot-Bryan-Griffiths-cut-off-hunt-chief-Trevor-Morses-head.html

Again left wingers taking extreme action

Rudeboy, what's your point?

TJ - since Lansera unfortunately has the intellectual capability of a mouse...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/1494924.stm

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/2839511.stm

and, to name a few:

Dave Callendar HV3314, HMP Birmingham, Winston Green Road, Birmingham, B18 4AS. ALF prisoner who's had his ten year sentence cut by two.

Michael Green AV2923, HMP Ashwell, Oakham, Leicestershire, LE15 7LF. Serving 5 years for arson at a slaughterhouse and attempted arson of cattletrucks.

Keith Mann EE3588, HMP Long Lartin, South Littleton, Evesham, Worcs., WR11 5TZ. ALF activist serving 11 years for criminal damage, attempted incitement, attempted arson, possession of explosive materials and escaping from custody!

Noel Molland CK4321, HMP Channings Wood, Denbury, Newton Abbot, Devon TQ12 6DW. Saxon Wood CK4322, HMP Guys Marsh, Shaftesbury, Dorset, SP7 0AH. Steve Booth CK4323, HMP Lancaster Castle, Lancaster, LA1 1YL. All three are editors of Green Anarchist magazine and have been sentenced to 3 years for 'conspiracy to incite persons unknown to commit criminal damage' by publishing reports of direct action.

Simon Richards BH4011, HMP Blundeston, Lowestoft, Suffolk. Was at Guildford anti-road camp. Currently in for 4 years for animal liberation actions.

Geoff Sheppard MD1030, HMP Parkhurst, Newport, Isle of Wight, PO30 5NX. ALF prisoner serving 7 years for possession of a shotgun and materials for making incendiary devices.

Barbara Trenholm RL1292, HMP Durham, Old Elvet, Durham, DH1 3HU. Animal liberationist sentenced to 10 years for conspiracy to commit arson.

Justin Wright CE3046, HMP YOI, Portland, Dorset, DT5 1DL. Same charge and sentence as Barbara Trenholm.

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