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So we have a beautiful little girl who is nearly 2, we also have a standard sized pedigree Dachshund (sausage dog) - I was out for a bike ride yesterday morning & baby jek was in the care of the my mother as mrs jek was away and I had my mum over. Apparently the dog and baby were sitting together on the sofa watching tele and the dog was licking his paw, it's been a bit sore this week as he had a claw nail come off. My mum said she reached over to pet him and then he bit her on the face. Just a tiny nick and it did break the skin about 4cms from her eye!!
He can be quite an aggresive dog, he's bitten me before trying to get him out from under the bed, he bit a stranger out on a walk once, my neighbour when he was dropping off some post and he's also bitten my daughter before, just a little nick on the arm when she was teasing him. We tell her off for teasing him and try to watch them together all the time, but sometimes it's just not practical.
It's too easy to say 'just get rid of him' - quick jab and it's all done but he's been our dog for years. My wife moved in in 2004 and baby jek didn't come along will 2011, so in all that time he's been a great family dog, country walks, holidays, afternoons and evenings on the sofa, the whole bit If I think about getting rid of him and that moment when I'll come to put him in the car to go to the vets, he'll be wagging his tail and expecting a walk because I've got his lead out and looking up at me with his little happy face like he'll be saying 'we are going for a walk aren't we dad, you're not taking me to get me put down are you?' - the guilt will haunt me for me years I'm convinced.
So.....what shall we do?
Taking him to be killed is a bit strong. What about trying to rehome him with friends relatives or if not, the RSPCA?
I don't think you can have that dog around your child anymore though. Sorry.
Two choices, keep and worry or put down...
Although maybe as he's old, you need to accept that he's getting grumpy and be aware - see above.
My parents had a dog when I was born. My dad saw it snarl at me when I started crawling and went past it around meal time. He said he'd never have been able to live with himself if I was bitten by the dog so he took it to be put down (it had been a shelter dog so unlikely to be rehomed). He said it was one of the hardest things he's done and cried while it went to sleep but that it was easier than the idea of having me taken to hospital if the dog got me.
So I'd say get the dog put down asap. If you can rehome it instead, great but don't spend ages trying to do so. Needs to happen in the next day or so or you may talk yourself out of it or give the dog another opportunity to scar your daughter.
He can be quite an aggresive dog, he's bitten me before trying to get him out from under the bed, he bit a stranger out on a walk once, my neighbour when he was dropping off some post and he's also bitten my daughter before
he bit her on the face
The dog needs to go.
RSPCA?
Though as wrecker says, you'll never be able to trust him around your daughter and ultimately it's her safety you've got to keep paramount.
He does have history and unfortunately some pedigree dogs can be unexpected and unpredictably aggressive.
Is he neutered?
A good starter for a boring Monday morning I'd say.
Maybe dont out source your pet and childcare simultaneously to the same provider?
Just common sense really?
Ooh, judgemental!
He has been neutered yes, later in life at aged 9 or so. He was a rescue dog to start with, my wife got him as a year old pup from a home and he is now 12 years old.
It's a horrible situation but with dog's previous behaviour you can't take the risk. You have to think which would be worse, dog gone (whatever way you end up deciding) or daughter scarred for life or worse. It has to be the former I'm afraid. I have two kids under 3 and a dog we have had for years. You have my sympathies.
It could be a child's face next time!!!
Oh
I seem to recall a lot of dog shelters put down dogs with a history of biting people, especially kids. If you do take it to the RSPCA or a local charity, please don't lie about the biting in case it becomes someone elses problem. If they say they're going to put the dog down anyway, maybe it's best if you take the dog to the vet yourself.
it's a no brainer. Dogs gotta go. Sorry
Sorry as I don't see a decision here.
You have a dog that bites people and a young child. It's already bitten your daughter.
It won't be the dogs fault if the dog bites your daughter again. It's squarely on your shoulders.
Grow a pair and get the deed done. Sorry if that sounds harsh but you have a dangerous situation which so far you haven't addressed.
Rehome with breed rescue? They will insist on older/no children household given his history.
Details on rescue are [url= http://www.dogpages.org.uk/breedd.htm ]here[/url].
[i]He can be quite an aggresive dog, he's bitten me before trying to get him out from under the bed, he bit a stranger out on a walk once, my neighbour when he was dropping off some post and he's also bitten my daughter before, just a little nick on the arm when she was teasing him.[/i]
Is this a troll?
Sounds like he thinks he's higher up the pack than everyone else does.
Sorry to say, but its very likely to be how the family unit works and what you've let him get away with over the years. If you couple that with likely anxiety about his rank now theres a two year old around, you've got what you've got.
He won't change unless you 'demote him' which is likely to involve some effort and behavioural changes on your part to get the changes from him.
Alternatively, you can have him killed or ship the problem out to someone else.
I love dogs. I think the right dog in a family with kids can be special for everyone.
BUT. Your dog has bitten your daughter twice. It has also bitten others. You have a choice. Daughter or dog. Lets be fair here, it's a dog. You know what you have to do.
By your own admission if you took the dog to the vet the guilt would stay with you for years. Now look at your daughter. How would you feel if you were taking your daughter to A&E to get stitched up after the dog had done a nasty job on her?
I really don't understand the point in these posts?
Keep the dog, it may be more serious next time! 🙄
Look at it this way, would you prefer to rehome (or otherwise get rid of) the dog, or explain to people in years to come where the big ragged scar on your daughters face came from?
How would she explain it when she's 18 and someone asks...would she think fondly of how you decided to keep a dog that had already bitten her twice?
I'd hate to be in your position as you have a strong bond to a pet dog, but as soon as you became a father your pet was demoted in terms of priority.
[i]as soon as you became a father your pet was demoted in terms of priority[/i]
this.
I feel for you.
We went through something very similar about 6 months ago. We rescued a springer and he'd been brilliant, a bit of agro with other dogs with possessive behavior but never humans. We thought we had got on top of it so much we let my niece & nephews play with him with no problems (always supervised). Then one day out of the blue he attacked my 3 yr old nephew. Small tooth mark under his chin and another on top of his head both broke the skin.
As the other posters have said we had the choice of putting him down or never trusting he'd do it again. We didn't want a dog we couldn't trust so made the decision to give him back to the RSPCA (if you get a dog from them they retain ownership so we couldn't get him put down without there permission).
Disappointingly the RSPCA knew our dog and weren't surprised about what had happened so we have our suspicions that it had happened before. But because he'd bitten a child and broken the skin they said they had no choice but to put him down. I don't know if the have a two strikes - out policy or not? They took him away for us but we found out the vet only visits once a week - my other half hated the fact he was on his own on death row so we went back and took him to our vet to do the deed...
If you do decide to give him to a rescue home you might want to try the Dogs Trust as they never put a healthy dog down.
tough decision.
On a plus, we last about three months before deciding to get another, we've now got a 12 week old Springer bitch called Willow and my 3 yr old nephew loves her to bits!
He can be quite an aggresive dog, he's bitten me before trying to get him out from under the bed, he bit a stranger out on a walk once, my neighbour when he was dropping off some post and he's also bitten my daughter before, just a little nick on the arm when she was teasing him. We tell her off for teasing him and try to watch them together all the time, but sometimes it's just not practical.
When your daughter is 18 and asks you again about how she lost the sight in one eye because of some dog you used to own and why you did nothing until it was too late. How will you answer?
Same situation with my 2yr old son with a dog we'd had from 12weeks to 7yrs.
It was swift and he was rehomed ASAP.
You could keep them apart- for how long? (See my first comment).
You could retrain him? He has a history and see my first comment.
Would you like your daughter to fear dogs for life?
You have a duty of care to your child.
+1 for scienceofficer
If you really want to keep the dog he has to be moved down a peg or too. That will take time, understanding and effort from everyone involved, not sure that it is something that you can easily undertake. His position has been confirmed by you and your wife for many years and he will be pretty set in his ways.
If you do decide to have him put down then please remember that he is 12 years old and you have given him the best things in life so far. At his age this option may be easier on the dog than either rehoming or radical retraining.
Horrible situation, I feel for you.
I have a 2 year old. If a dog bit her in the face then there would be only one knee jerk option.
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@ jekkyl - We have two dachshunds. We also have a 11 month old son.
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Our two dogs (despite being brother and sister) are very different in their interactions with our son.
Our bitch can b a bit vocal, will stand her ground and tell our son off (with a bark) if he is annoying her.
The other (male) will just remove himself from the situation immediately.
We have met oodles of dachsies and have seen a good deal of behavioral tendencies.
How old is your dog? Has he been socialized?
Why not give it another chance and just keep the two separated?
Failing that .... where are you as we will come and collect him.
Edit >>> Just seen his age. I don't believe that at the age he is he will respond to adjustments in the internal hierarchy. Look to re home rather than put down if push comes to shove.
Failing that .... where are you as we will come and collect him.
Top man. 🙂
I don’t think you owe anything to that dog.
MTFU and get it done before the impact of what has happened starts to wear off.
he's bitten me before trying to get him out from under the bed, he bit a stranger out on a walk once, my neighbour when he was dropping off some post and he's also bitten my daughter before,
Well, seems to me the dog isn't the issu, you are, buy not putting him down on the first bite. Funny how when I tell people it will happen they all laught and point to me. If I was the stranger I would have made sure your dog was put down. So you probably know what to do.
im not especially a dog lover, i love other peoples dogs as i can pet them without having to follow them around and pick up their deoppings.
so its easy(ish) for me to say get rid of him.
id speak to rspca/dogs trust and ask their advice tbh.
we had a dog when i was a kid, if you annoyed him (by walking past him. for example) he would bite*.
didnt take me long to learn to stay away from him, but i will say its taken until i was an adult to get over my fear of dogs, and im still wary of them.
*gummed is probably more accurate than bitten, in fairness*
Sorry with what has happened/happening so far OP I don't think you owe him anything. Once hes turned, will you really put faith in any sort of retraining? You'll have to check/gates/worry about where they both are at any one time. Do you want a nervous child?
Get rid. Be responsible. Its stopped being a protector or a pet. Its now dangerous.
Pardon the pun but I am going to bite at this .......
To all those suggesting the dog be put to sleep STFU unless you have been in the same position and gone down the same route.
What the OP person describes is within the spectrum of behavior for the breed. They were bred for a job after all. I am not excusing what has happened but no dog should be lest unattended with a child of that age (no offense OP).
we had a dog when i was a kid, if you annoyed him (by walking past him. for example) he would bite*.
didnt take me long to learn to stay away from him,
Emotional attachment to a pet trumps wellbeing of a child; odd attitude from your family. Your parents should have dealt with the dog after the first bite, not have you learn to avoid the dog.
Letmetalktomark.
Let me get this straight. You have an 11 month old baby in the house with 2 dogs, one of which is happy to ‘stand her ground’ and you are offering to take in another dog that has a history of biting people / babies. And you seem to think this is an understandable characteristic for this breed.
Get a grip?
To all those suggesting the dog be put to sleep STFU unless you have been in the same position and gone down the same route.
Sorry, that's crap. I don't have a dog or a kid but I can guarantee what would happen if I had a dog and it bit my kid. Probably the people who are thinking clearer here are the ones who haven't got attachments to animals that have proved to be a danger to their child.
@letme we are in north Staffordshire, stafford way, he is 12. He has been socialised with other dogs if that's what you mean. My bro in law has a dog and he often stays with him and his dog (a bitch staffy) when we go on holiday often for a week or so and when we have that dog to stay. There's never any trouble between the two and they play together fine.
Thanks for your offer, very very kind. I think all the posts on here have focussed my thoughts and I agree yes we have to get rid of him. I shall ring round the shelters in our immediate area today and also those pedigree numbers given by sandwich (thanks). letme you would be welcome to have him if you can. He is a lovely dog (obvisously apart from this)
Your dog has to go. It is your responsibility to re-home it, putting it down is the easy way out.
You should not allow the dog to sit on the furniture, the dog believes it is one of the family (reinforced by sitting on the furniture) and in fact probably believes it is above your daughter in the pecking order. The dog should have been better trained.
@ uwe-r - 😆 Guess you are right. But then I guess you have no real understanding of the bread or dogs so you are entitled to your thoughts 😉
Our pack hierarchy is correct/enforced and we take the correct provisions to protect both baby and dogs.
The OP's dog doesn't seem to be unfairly aggressive if you look at the situations cited above.
To all those suggesting the dog be put to sleep STFU unless you have been in the same position and gone down the same route.
We had ours rehomed to another Westie owner through a Westie charity.
I was very attached to that dog but my heart turned very cold towards him on the second lunge at my son. If I couldn't have rehomed him within a few days I wasn't going to put others potential at risk with a family in a general dogs home.
Who do you love more, your daughter or your dog?
Jekyl – well done for making the right decision. Make sure you follow it through and don’t get hung up on re-housing.
LMTTM
‘The OP's dog doesn't seem to be unfairly aggressive if you look at the situations cited above’
I would say biting a childs face is unfairly aggressive but I don’t think we are going agree on this.
@ hora - I meant put down not rehomed
@ jekkyl - Stafford may be a bit far. Will make some inquiries.
I was thinking of the option of putting him to sleep as I didn't want anyone to unintentionally pick him up unknown into a house with <10yr old children.
Ours was a brilliant dog but at the end of the day its a dog.
Further reading.
http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/has-someone-elses-fireworks-cost-me-my-dog
Seems like Hobson's Choice to me. I totally understand an attachment to a pet, but you've got a dangerous animal in the house with an infant. It needs rehoming at least.
Ours started with the warning signs (with hindsight):
http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/rehoming-our-beloved-dog
Post attacks then rehoming:
http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/our-westiepet-that-attacked-our-sonan-update
@ uwe-r - I agree. I was only trying to convey that the dog may not have been in the best of places with a sore paw before the bite.
When I was a kid I used to pull ears, slap its 'ass - alsorts. Our dog just used to run off or paw at me to stop me.
My Dad is a vet, as child we always had 2-3 dogs.
Our springer at 6 months old bit my 4 year old sister, just a small nip on the face. Dad put him down straight away.
I've just asked him, he said the dog needs to go, because whislt anyone over the age of 10 could probably handle him, being a small breed, he is obviously a danger to small kids.
Whenever one of our much loved dogs die or needs to be put down I'm sad for a day. As much as I totally love dogs ,it's still justa dog. Get rid of it. You have new priorities now.
Ps my dad didn't come to my wedding as he didn't want to leave the dog. My friend was also spurned by his parents in favour of the dog at his wedding. Get some perspective,people.
Keep the dog, put the child up for adoption. The only logical choice.
RSPCA officer friend says they routinely have to put down dogs with a history of biting as they're near impossible to re-home, recent experience of the DogsTrust is that they'll take dogs that bite and carefully assess potential new owners for age of kids etc etc and try to rehome with a suitable family, and they'll keep them until they're rehomed as they dont put dogs down.
Scienceofficer nailed this in the last page - the dog is not properly trained. Either get it down the pecking (possible poor word choice) in the 'pack' or get it to someome who can to look after it.
Ps my dad didn't come to my wedding as he didn't want to leave the dog. My friend was also spurned by his parents in favour of the dog at his wedding.
😯
Dogs can be dangerous, as can be steps, walls, sharp knives, corners of hearths, electricity, etc.
Manage the dog in the same way you 'manage' these other risks ?
I have friends who modify their holidays as they say the cat gets pissed off if they leave it with family or a kennel (or whatever the cat version of a kennel is) and that it's moody with them for days when they get back. As such, most of their holidays are shorter or in the UK so the cat can come. I can see how people become attached but sometimes it's a bit much.
Manage the dog in the same way you 'manage' these other risks ?
I'm not sure you can have knives put down though and they tend not to get pissed off because their handle is a bit sore.
[i]Scienceofficer nailed this in the last page - the dog is not properly trained. Either get it down the pecking (possible poor word choice) in the 'pack' or get it to someome who can to look after it.[/i]
I think this is the post I most agree with on here (missed scienceofficers) - I have a large dog and a 10 year old (Kid came first). From the start we made sure the dog knew it's place.
But that's by-the-by, I've tried to put myself in the same situation - what would I do? As the dog hasn't shown any aggression whatsoever towards our son, I think I'd give her a chance - would take excessive teasing from the kid to cause anything... so the kid would be warned too. The tiniest signs of aggression subsequently, the dog would be re-homed. But you know who would be most upset by that? The kid!
I guess, it comes down to individual circumstances - only YOU know what is the right thing to do.
Dogs can be dangerous, as can be steps, walls, sharp knives, corners of hearths, electricity, etc.
Dogs don't stalk or jump/attack like electricity though.
In addition, you wouldn't leave a carving knife on the sofa yet a dog with an issue/grudge/dislike for a child is left there?
We tell her off for teasing him and try to watch them together all the time, but sometimes it's just not practical.
surely this is a troll? it has to be, right???
edit
I read a paper once that suggested daschunds as the most aggressive breed. Anyway 12 year old dog. Would be unfair to rehome imo. Put to sleep or keep it away from child for the last year or two of its life.
or keep it away from child for the last year or two of its life.
A family friend.
Double post.
Blimey - let's have some perspective please. Jekyll, "some" sympathies to you mainly due to the predicament and the fright of "what might have happened" tempered with the recognition that you have to shoulder some of the blame IMO.
But it is important to be very clear about what your dog did before the lynch mob mentality kicks in. Dogs use their mouths in many different ways ranging from play, taste to outright aggression. Watch two dogs together at play and they will nip each other on the legs etc. This can, but shoudn't extend, to humans if they play incorrectly with their dogs or start being stupid with them. You refer to several incidents. - were they nips or real aggression? I see no reason to put a dog down merely because it nips someone. of course, a scar or a loss of an eye may result, but that could be true for any animal - a horse can kick and bite and kill unintentionally, cats can take your eye out and don't forget goldfish! Do we put them down as a result? Do we stop MTBing when accidents happen? Plus, animal owners should know not to tease their pets/animals.
But remember you have chosen to bring a dog into your home that was originally bred to be aggressive and to hunt. It is our fault is we forget that. Ready to be flamed for the next bit, but (1) why was the dog on the sofa - the easy bit and more seriously (2) why are you putting a baby and a dachshund together on the sofa? Another poster has already been labelled judgemental for pointing this out, but sorry, I think the dog is not solely to blame here.
I think an error has been made and that it is probably a great shock to you because of the "what might have been." but by the sounds of it you have a 12 year old dog that has been largely well behaved and that you seem to love. From what you have said, I see no reason why you can't use a different approach to dog care and ensure that you all have more happy years together. I hope that is the conclusion rather than the long needle, knee jerk response advocated by others.
Now where's the flame suit......?
he's as healthy as larry, no signs of dieing yet (unfortunately) & dachshunds do generally live a shorter life than most breeds. The breed do have a problem with their backbone in later life so we keep him really trim and he's very energentic, even after I take him out for 6 miles along the canal.
& no I'm not a troll either unfortunately. When I said it's not practical I meant like if I'm the house without the wife and both kid and child are there, it's not practical to pick the kid up and take her with me everytime I want the toilet or something.
The dog was on the sofa because that where he likes to sit. I agree that dogs shouldn't be on the sofa but if we told him off for sitting on it we'd be shoving him off it all day and anyway he just goes and sits on the other one anyway and he probably sits on them all day when we are out. The baby was there because she likes to sit on the sofa too, they sit together all the time without any previous incident and they get on fine (mostly)
The other time he bit her it was in the conservatory and on the floor. Some of the other times he has bitten people I would say yes real aggression with snarling. I agree that dogs do 'bite' other dogs just as communication or playfulness but of course my daughter is not a dog and a 'nip' could puncture her eye or similar.
Ok but there is an obvious contradiction between the final sentences of both paragraphs. But enough, I am not meaning to be rude or to troll and fear that this may be the perception if I continue. Sorry to hear about the incident and the predicament you have. The second para suggests that finding a rescue home for your dog may be the best solution. Good luck and I hope that you find a good solution.
Dogs get agitated just like people do. Some more than others. How many fights do kids get into? And how many pick up a 12 inch blade and start stabbing other kids to death? Dogs are pretty much the same. They nip and pinch. Even in serious fights with other dogs they rarely tear each other to bits in the way people would lead you to believe.
Not saying the dog in question is not dangerous. There's no way I could possibly say that, not knowing the dog. But some of the responses in this thread are a bit extreme.
Teamhurtmore sums it up perfectly imo.
"Daddy, why do I have this scar on my face"
"It wasn't practical for me to separate you and the dog, which had already bitten you, and other people. But, to be fair, I did tell you not to tease it, when you were two"
I've been in almost the exact situation the OP finds himself in: We had a border collie and when our first child was born, he flipped. Obviously a heirarchy thing. He never bit the boy, but he took a chunk out of the doctor who came to check on the baby and he tried to bite people on the street a couple of times. I spoke to the RSPCA and the vet about rehoming and both suggested I was just moving the problem on to someone else. We put him down. Tough to do but the only decision really.
Daddy, why do I have this scar on my face?
...because you loved rugby, hockey, but you had an accident....
...because you loved MTB and you had an accident....
...because accidents happen.
In hindsight, they can all be avoided but....
but if we told him off for sitting on it we'd be shoving him off it all day
This tells me you're not prepared to put the work in required to bust him down to his proper pack position.
Move him on or have him killed.
I've just rung the vets for advice and a couple of rescue homes. They all said the same thing, he can't be rehomed due to his age and for having a history of biting. So the only choice we have is either find a family friend who might have him or give him the needle. His name is Cabbage by the way, Cabbage the dachshund. 😥
Can you just put a stair gate between kid and dog.
I insist on that when I take my little ones to my parents and they happen to be looking after my sisters dogs (border collie and some mongrel thing)
He can be quite an aggresive dog, he's bitten me before trying to get him out from under the bed, he bit a stranger out on a walk once, my neighbour when he was dropping off some post and he's also bitten my daughter before, just a little nick on the arm when she was teasing him.
Four bites before this incident?
Get rid. Now. Dog not to blame, the owner is. However, the owner hasn't dealt with the problem so the dog has to go.
Its a shame but its unlikeky imo that your going to be able to change the dog if its an older one, plus if its got a sore paw its not going to be overly pleased by anyone going near it, weve always had labs and there great with kids our little girl is four now and the dog six i would deff be looking at re homing him, If your little en is anything like ours it will happen again as they forget so quickly
...just read above post guess re homing out of the question then...
It sounds unlikely that your dog will be able to be retrained and it bites people. I'd try and avoid having it killed but you should get it re-homed. For now you need to put up a physical barrier between it and your child like a baby gate etc.
As a dog owners - Sympathetic to your problem
As someone who has been repeatedly bitten by dachshunds - my sympathy is tempered by experience.
The in-laws have had dachshunds as long as I have known them. The current pair are barky, but have never shown any inclination to bite. The previous pair were very, very snappy.
It is down to training and where they see themselves in the pecking order. The IL's older dogs were allowed on beds / upstairs / on sofas etc.
They are unpredictable and agressivley territorial. Even if the FiL or MiL tried to move one of the older ones of a bed, they would get bitten. Stranger in the house, such as myself - bitten. Child in the house - well, luckily theyy had gone before our children arrrived. wife and myself were clear we wouldn't have taken kids to see her parents with those dogs in the house...
ETA - as for retraining - not too bright are they??
ETA - as for retraining - not too bright are they??
I think this is a common misunderstanding.
Ours are very bright. We do a lot of training with them (agility, scent work etc).
Stubborn yes, but stubborn and bright.
Stubborn yes, but stubborn and bright.
Yes, I can see that