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i dislike gaudy displays of wealth that are enabled through capitalism. but i like having the choice to buy what i want and go where i please.
i like the idea of greater equality amongst people, but dislike the controlling hand of the state.
if you had to choose which system would you opt for?
I quite like the UK's balance of capitalism with moderate socialist taxation and benefits.
Full socialism is unworkable in a global economy. Full capitalism just pisses on the poor.
The trouble with Socialism, is that sooner or later you run out of other people's money...
[i]The trouble with Socialism, is that sooner or later you run out of other people's money... [/i]
On the other hand Socialism works fine if you have Capitalists to pay the bill...
capitalism
we have arseholism - which is where you can keep taking out without putting ANYTHING in.
The only working case of socialism I've ever seen that was anything like justifiable was implemented at sailing club.
Option A - high membership fee, Option B - lower membership fee plus work 1 day for club,.... F - pretty minimal fee, several days work for club.
[[i]Nuts in May[/i]]
"But do you have a system? Is it tabulated?"
[/[i]Nuts in May[/i]]
The trouble with Capitalism, is that sooner or later you run out of other people's money...
I dont know enough about either, but Socialism for sure.
The trouble with Socialism, is that sooner or later you run out of other people's money...
and capitalism is the opposite ?
Socialism - works for Norway (best place to live in the world apparently).
Keep up Simon ;oP
The reailty in the UK is that we have neither, and the vast majority don't want either extreme. The fact is that there are good points on both sides of the equation as there are also bad. What we really need is consensus politics, which unfortunately is exactly what we won't get under the current electoral system, which is both unrepresentative and hands power to the establishment.
Personally I can't beleive that we are looking like electing the Etonian old Boys YaaHoo Society to be our represenatives. I can hardly think of any other human beings on the planet less representative of the average person in this country!!
socialism....help your fellow man. distribute wealth.
capitali$m... * your fellow (lower class) man in the * and sell his kids.
What dave says.
Capitalism, a nice system invented by noble to make peasant think they could climb up the social ladder.
Socialism won't work at a worldwide level because so far people are c0ck, they have the money=power in head and that is it (by people that is myself included).
Devout capitalist here. The socialist experiment has allowed the feeble to flourish and left us with a human race depleted of many of the qualities that allowed it to evolve to such a high level in the first place.
There's a very good argument for letting the weak, ****less, workshy and disabled starve to death so the human race becomes stronger.
Not a very palatable view, but look what modern optometrics has done to the world's eyesight. 1000 years ago, myopia was a very big hurdle to the day-to-day business of finding things like food and a mate, so the numbers of Magoos were self regulated.
Fast forward to the invention of the refractive glass lens and within a couple of centuries, the world is overrun with people that couldn't find their arse with a map unless they've got their bins on.
I tell ya, let 'em starve. It's the only way out of this mess.
There's a very good argument for letting the weak, ****less, workshy and disabled starve to death so the human race becomes stronger.
doesn't that describe the aristocracy too ?
However I vote for compassion over efficiency any day. It's no good having a strong race of sociopaths 🙁
Capitalism with a conscience. The conscience being Socialism. Find it annoying that people think it has to be one or the other.
Mix it up.
To have a socialist(ish) society everyone who can contribute has to contribute - too many here have an ingrained reluctance to contribute.
Full capitalism just pisses on the poor.
And where the hell have you seen "full capitalism" ?
Name the country where everything is left to the market, the state never interferes, and the economy just runs on autopilot ?
Name me the country which has no Chancellor of the Exchequer or finance minister because their job isn't required, as economy looks after itself and the market always knows best ?
There is [i][b]no such thing[/b][/i] as "full capitalism".
Just some countries are less socialist than others.
You need poor people to dig roads and shovel crap for you otherwise a lot of very rich people are very quickly going to find themselves up to their knees in shit. Actually I've answered that one haven't I? Capitalism works, if you re-introduce slavery.
To have a socialist(ish) society everyone who can contribute has to contribute - too many here have an ingrained reluctance to contribute.
Are you talking about the work dodgers, or the wealthy employing accountants to tax dodge? Both I presume.
greater equality amongst people
I'd prefer equality of opportunity so that anyone who wants to can make the best of themselves. People are not equal, get used to it
[i]Name me the country which has no Chancellor of the Exchequer or finance minister because their job isn't required, as economy looks after itself and the market always knows best ?[/i]
Channel Islands?
Devout capitalist here. The socialist experiment has allowed the feeble to flourish and left us with a human race depleted of many of the qualities that allowed it to evolve to such a high level in the first place.There's a very good argument for letting the weak, ****less, workshy and disabled starve to death so the human race becomes stronger.
Do you apply this argument to your own family/friends?
Again:
NORWAY
Capitalism works, if you re-introduce slavery.
Not quite slavery, but I do think this country has gone back to a period similar to the industrial revolution before the unions.
'd prefer equality of opportunity so that anyone who wants to can make the best of themselves. People are not equal, get used to it
I'd agree with that, unfortunately its now those who have that are preventing those who have not from doing so.
[i]I'd prefer equality of opportunity so that anyone who wants to can make the best of themselves. People are not equal, get used to it.[/i]
And people can't have equality of opportunity. Get used to that too 🙂
There is no such thing as "full capitalism".
Just some countries are less socialist than others.
Of course not, which kind of indicates the system is flawed.
IMO the US takes capitalism a bit too far (see New Orleans, healthcare etc)
I'd prefer equality of opportunity so that anyone who wants to can make the best of themselves.
let's start with equality of opportunity to eat
Socialism - works for Norway (best place to live in the world apparently).
In fact, all the Scandinavian countries seem to be successful at a more planned economy than the UK, with high taxation, high levels of welfare, excellent education, whilst allowing private business to flourish.
Socialism vs capitalism isn't a binary choice - it's a continuum. I'd like to see us more towards the Scandinavian end than (say) the USA at the other.
Those in favour of unchecked capitalism are welcome to move to the DR Congo.
Channel Islands?
No, the Channel Islands have finance ministers.
In every capitalist country, the most important minister after the prime minister, is the finance minister.
Because controlling the economy, is the most important job for any government to do in any capitalist country.
It cannot be left to the market.
[i]Name the country where everything is left to the market, the state never interferes, and the economy just runs on autopilot ?[/i]
Somalia. 🙂
doesn't Norway finance its generous social system through the sale of oil?
Are you talking about the work dodgers, or the wealthy employing accountants to tax dodge? Both I presume.
Well sort of though I'm not sure it's really a bad thing to try to pay as little tax as possible as long as it's legal - there are moral gray areas though. Socialism relies on the majority wanting to do what's best for society as a whole whereas capitalism assumes people are mostly selfish - so maybe we get the system we deserve?
It cannot be left to the market.
should read "meerkat"...
they're useless economists and just bury stuff and stand around showing off their impressive testicles 🙁
Somalia is a failed state without effective government. Even I, as a socialist, wouldn't want to offer Somalia as an example of 'full capitalism'.
doesn't Norway finance its generous social system through the sale of oil?
Didn't we also have some oil (and spent all the money we got from it)?
wouldn't want to offer Somalia as an example of 'full capitalism'.
But surely it is - raw market forces are completely unchecked by any state intervention. The strongest/richest wins - ultimate capitalism.
yeah, but on fast cars and champagne.... loadsa money!!!!!!!
Didn't we also have some oil (and spent all the money we got from it)?
But we're better off now than we were in the late 70s - give or take the odd credit crunch....
[i]letting the weak, ****less, workshy and disabled starve to death[/i]
Is he [u]definitely[/u] not brilliant and witty photocopying entrepreneur Adam_G?
To the utter w**nker who reckons that 'the socialist experiment' has bred a weak and enfeebled population etc. Unless I'm very much mistaken there was a project fairly recently to reverse the tendency of welfarism and redistribution to allow those less than perfect specimens to stop being a burden on wealth creation. But things must be looking up for you and your kind...you've got a special party to vote for who take their cue from the experiment alluded to above. You are beneath contempt.
Anarcho-capitalism...
Free to make money in any way you see fit, as long as you pay taxes on it.
[i]Is he definitely not brilliant and witty photocopying entrepreneur Adam_G?[/i]
🙂
Hey Robespew how do you cope with all that hatred spewing from the pores of your skin? You must create a puddle wherever you stand...
I'm curious, did the "project" you speak of yield any results?
Definitely one of the most interesting hate fueled left wing rants I've read on STW for a while, probably beats Ernie-Che-Lynch, TJ and even the hallowed RudeBOY.
EDIT: I shouldn't have used the term left wing, sorry.
how do you cope with all that hatred spewing from the pores of your skin
you can have contempt for an idea without hatred for its proponents