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or an opposition who understand that (outside this forum) this is going to be pretty popular amongst people that vote Labour as well as Tory.
It isn't. People in this echo chamber might think that compassion towards those fleeing persecution is unpopular among voters but there compelling evidence from opinion polls that it isn't. I've posted links to polls showing precisely that before but I can't be arsed to dig them out again.
That's the first point, the second point is if you feel you shouldn't oppose the Tories because to do so would be unpopular then just join the Tories, there is no point pretending to be an alternative if you aren't.
Besides, you would probably be far more effective inside the Tory Party. You know all this stuff about having more influence inside than from the outside.
Whats depressing is that if you turn the Five Live phone in on now, the usual suspects are all lapping this 'send 'em back' crap up.
Shoredingers immigrants yet again..
Simultaneously 'taking our jobs' while also somehow 'sitting around on benefits'
The Tory racists are having their tummies tickled before the local elections and they're all rolling over and purring.
I hate this country sometimes
Horrendous
Also I've just listened to Johnson's speech and the Govt is going on the pre-emptive offensive against the legal profession for anticipated legal challenges. The descent into authoritarian populism is not slowing
Utter Scum.
And whilst the racists and halfwits are getting suitably self lubed prior to the elections in a couple of weeks they can quietly take the empties from Downing Street to the bottle bank whilst everyone is looking the other way.
I’ve not read the previous 2 pages but I suspect (hope) they contain sentiment similar to mine
Even by our government standards this is disgusting
I am sickened
Also I’ve just listened to Johnson’s speech and the Govt is going on the pre-emptive offensive against the legal profession
Of course got to get the scape goats line up for when this inevitably turns into a money pit that achieves nothing
This seems pertinent -
https://twitter.com/DavidDavisMP/status/1461741115141505030
I have once again written to my MP expressing my disgust. But rather than the obvious moral outrage, I am complaining about the costs...
60,000 - 100,000 expected to cross the channel fleeing the bloodshed and persecution in war-torn France this year. Tory scum gammon racist Brexit!
60,000 – 100,000 expected to cross the channel fleeing the bloodshed and persecution in war-torn France this year. Tory scum gammon racist Brexit!
Oh hello person who understands nothing regarding immigration or refugees.
I hate having to agree with the Brexit Bulldog.
<Sorry>
border
/ˈbɔːdə/noun
1.
a line separating two countries, administrative divisions, or other areas.
"Panama's western border with Costa Rica"2.
the edge or boundary of something, or the part near it.
"the northern border of their distribution area"verb
1.
form an edge along or beside (something).
"a pool bordered by palm trees"2.
(of a country or area) be adjacent to (another country or area).
"regions bordering Azerbaijan"
boarder
/ˈbɔːdə/noun
1.
a person who receives regular meals when staying somewhere, in return for payment or services.
2.
a person who forces their way on to a ship in an attack.
</not_sorry>
No, I have nothing better to contribute as this is beyond satire, farce, the pale or anything else sensible or otherwise. I'm expecting an announcement any day that we're going to recover the abandoned Lancaster bomber from the moon.
If David Davies can see the flaw in the plan, you really are scraping the barrell.
Will Rwanda process our dead cats too? This is ridiculous and will simply not happen. When you find yourself agreeing with Davies you know someone has lost the plot.
This is as likely to happen as erecting a big barrier in the sea or naval vessels turning back small boats to France.
Starmer's reaction on the news seemed to be "this is so ****ing stupid I don't even know where to begin"
I'm not sure where this certainty that it won't happen comes from, is because it seems so un-British?
Priti Patel has got the the former Australian minister responsible for Australia's overseas asylum seekers detention centres on the case, he seems to have been successful, which presumably is why he has agreed to help.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australian_immigration_detention_facilities
Well Who'd a thunk it eh?
Priti hires Alexander Downer, one of the architects of/cheerleaders for Australia's "Off-shore migrant misery Islands" as a "Consultant" on migration policy and as if by magic a few months later, the UK comes up with the idea of instant deportation to a country with a poor Human rights history, for Asylum seekers...
This is pure pandering to EDL meatheads and outright Racists...
Culture war distraction, also probably a Dead Cat of course. But that doesn't mean they won't try to push it through, plus I'm sure Gove's got a mate with some planes lined up with a contract for the flights too...
The best way to deal with both issues is keep writing to your local Tory MP with questions about when Bozza is going to go, and offering congratulations on how good a job their continued support/lack of challenge to the leader and his cabinet full of bastards is doing of driving away moderate voters...
"One way ticket" ffs
he seems to have been successful, which presumably is why he has agreed to help.
was successful up until the point that the rapes, murders & child abuse got so bad they had to abandon it and ended up paying $10s of millions in compensation to asylum seekers
was also a disaster when Israel tried it in Rwanda
https://twitter.com/mattuthompson/status/1514567706904780800
appeals to their more racist base, but not the wider public
https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1514590971354308610
the astronomical cost, ilegality and human rights record in Rwanda
Kagames CV is
Torture
election rigging
assassination of political opponents (including in UK!)
state sponsored terrorism....
all add up to this being a dead cat with a very short shelf life, ideally enough to see Johnson through next round of fixed penalty notices and local elections
he seems to have been successful
Define successful. Last year Australia's offshore scheme cost several hundreds of millions to process just 250 or so asylum seekers. last year 600 tried to cross the channel in wee boats.
Nothing more than a dead cat thrown on the table to appease and garner support for the may elections from the Brexit faithful red wall voters who will lap it up.
Our local wannabe tory councillor was out n' about in our galloway town this morning trying to drum up support, what he didn't expect was being surrounded outside Tesco's with cries of "*****" thrown at him. (I didn't see it, mum phoned me up)
All his pamphlet says is "vote for me to keep the snp out" and "vote for me to stop an independent Scotland".
I hope the tory's get decimated come may 5th.
https://twitter.com/pritipatel/status/1514584617772273672?s=20&t=DMTQW8ujK1_E-NMMM6Snxg
Difficult to watch this smirking ghoul at the best of times, but when she's encouraging refugees to go to Rwanda and 'build their futures there'.
I think we'd all rather that Priti Patel went and built her future there instead, as she would have to have done if these rules had applied when her parents arrived here
Whilst I agree that this system is never going to work what is the solution to uncontrolled illegal economic migration into the U.K.? It is economic migration as refugees have lots the right to claim that status because they have passed through several safe countries in get here. I would take allot of convincing that any of the European countries they have traveled through are any more or less safe than the U.K.
I hope the tory’s get decimated come may 5th.
Just emailed my MP politely noting that as non-ideological voter, Boris Johnson and his Cabinet are certainly not swaying me to vote Conservative.
what is the solution to uncontrolled illegal economic migration into the U.K.?
This particular measure is to do with asylum seekers, not immigrants. So the answer is to have legal means of entry. The idea that a country should control immigration isn't a controversial one. what it probably shouldn't do is make it difficult for legitimate asylum seekers to come to this country safely.
The fact that most people who currently come here "illegally" as defined by Ms Patel, are in fact granted asylum on appeal in overwhelming numbers of cases, seems not to make a difference to these twerps
The reason we have uncontrolled illegal economic immigration into the Uk is because we tolerate Illegal economic migrants in the workforce.
You can't complain about it then expect a curry/haircut for £10.
I thought the UK had hit rockbottom a couple of years ago. Unfortunately we seem to be tunnelling like ####.
There is a legal means of entry for asylum seekers. Im sure its not even close to perfect. These are not those people though. These are people who have chosen to illegally cross Europe to seek entry into the UK
These are not those people though. These are people who have chosen to illegally cross Europe to seek entry into the UK
Which part of....
The fact that most people who currently come here “illegally” as defined by Ms Patel, are in fact granted asylum on appeal in overwhelming numbers of cases
...are you not following?
These measures proposed are for asylum seekers, not economic migrants
The people that we have obligations to under international law.
Define successful
Successful in putting asylum seekers in remote detention centres very far away from Australia.
Some people on this thread appear to be certain that Priti Patel's plans will never be implemented.
There is no reason to assume this especially as one of the Australian government minister behind Australia's scheme has been helping Patel with her plans.
It is economic migration as refugees have lots the right to claim that status because they have passed through several safe countries in get here.
there is no legal weight to what youve just said
80% of assylum claims are upheld!
Have you seen the actual figures involved?
The proposed new facility in Rwanda will house 100 asylum seekers, so even if it does go ahead (which I seriously doubt) it'll be neither here nor there in the grand scheme of things
This isn't even a policy. This is just whatever the opposite of virtue signalling is.
They're just flagging up to their core vote of racists that they're still on their side. Its just more culture war bollocks ahead of the local elections, and a dead cat to distract from Johnsons upcoming fines for attending more parties
These are people who have chosen to illegally cross Europe to seek entry into the UK
Under international laws that we've signed up to, the means of entry for asylum seekers shouldn't be a reason to not admit them. The whole narrative around "illegal means of entry" that the Tories are using is there to obfuscate. We make it especially hard to safely and legally get to the UK from places like Syria and Afghanistan, so those people invariably end up trying "illegal" routes. I mean, you can fly from neighbouring countries to Syria to the UK, there are scheduled airlines. There's a non-stop flight from Beirut to LHR for £300 or so. Why do you think people are forced to pay many thousands to smugglers and a chance in a blow up boat if the alternative is a comfy airline with food provided for 5 hours?
but why is it always little old England?
It isn't. The Daily Mail might be busy inflating the egos of their readers suggesting that everyone fleeing persecution and war is heading to the UK, but they aren't. Not even close.
If we take refugees more generally...
Turkey 3.7 million
Colombia 1.7 million
Uganda 1.5 million
****stan 1.4 million
Germany 1.2 million
...
UK...? about 0.1 million
That's about a quarter of a percent of all refugees that are hosted by the UK. Negligible.
----
Everyone knows which voters this dumb arse, expensive, unnecessary, inhumane policy is aimed at. Those who think we're being "flooded" by people who see the UK as a "Gold Mine"... be careful not to find yourself joining them... have a good look at the reality of how we handle refugees, asylum speakers, and immigrants... and especially whether we play our part in the world as regarding helping those fleeing war, conflict and persecution. The idea that we already "do all we can", or "more than our fair share" is a very sticky but entirely bogus idea.
----
BBC playing a clip from a Home Office minister saying (on LBC), 9 days ago, that he hadn't heard of this policy... it is new... and it is all about red meat policies aimed at saving big dog. Will it come to pass... my bet is some people will be handled this way, so that the government can brag about it to the voters motivated by such things (we can try had not say it's the new voters that Brexit delivered into the arms of the Tories... but, well, it is them, isn't it) come the next general election ... but not big numbers, and at huge cost (to lives and to the government)... and will be wound down after a year or two.
https://www.lbc.co.uk/news/boris-johnson-migrants-rwanda-processed-deal/
Lord Richard Harrington told LBC's Iain Dale on Tuesday evening: "If it's happening in the Home Office on the same corridor that I'm in they haven't told me about it.
"I'm having difficulty enough getting them from Ukraine to our country, there's no possibility of sending them to Rwanda."
and will be wound down after a year or two.
Or cancelled after horrific and expensive abuse comes to light, like Australia and Israel.
Don't see what the problem is. I'd rather be in the sun in Rwanda than a miserable fried-chicken shop in Newham.
Sending these young men to Rwanda is symptomatic of an inability to address regional inequities.
They may be unwanted in the over-expanded south east of England, but in Scotland there appears to be a recruitment shortfall coming around the corner.
The recent census was nothing more than a thinly disguised labour survey.
The ‘Stakhanovich Brides’ have cottoned on to this too, but it’ll take twenty years to get these products ready for the labour market.
Doctors' concerns over hospital abortion demos https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-61111211
Christians are overly keen to abrogate the actual responsibility of raising a child.
Whereas, these economic migrants already possess all the skills required for the labour market.
They’ll be proficient in English, they’ve demonstrated a grasp of currency, economics, and geography, etc.
White Britain is becoming inbred. We need the genetic input of other countries.
Send them oop north. Perfectly welcome.
I have just read this :
Rwandan nationals fleeing the regime of general Paul Kagame, in power since 2000, will not be relocated.
So the UK government is openly admitting that Rwanda has a problem with persecuting people and can't be trusted.
And yet it proudly announces that it has struck a deal with them......to look after people fleeing persecution.
It's like some sort of weird and tasteless joke.
“You are a slow learner, Winston."
"How can I help it? How can I help but see what is in front of my eyes? Two and two are four."
"Sometimes, Winston. Sometimes they are five. Sometimes they are three. Sometimes they are all of them at once. You must try harder. It is not easy to become sane.”
Very good interview on Radio4 Today… minister (Tom Pursglove?) unable to answer any of the simple practical questions (how much will it cost per a person, will it cost less then having them live at the Ritz, when will it happen, will it even happen, what stops people leaving Rowanda and trying again, if it didn’t work for Israel why will it work for us, will it actually reduce the small boat traffic from France)… when faltering just fell back on this new nonsensical headline grabbing plan being “world leading”. The policy doesn’t make any sense, but it’s not supposed to. It’s about campaigning to steer the media’s attention and to revive the interest and loyalty of people who vote based on feelings as regards “take back control”, or “Britain First”, rather than having any interest in the costs and feasibility (never mind morality) of seeking to close the UK to asylum seekers, and shipping people off to live under a dictator that other people are fleeing from.
Not sure it's been covered in the first few pages but the Rwandan government spokesperson on PM last night was quite clear that people won't be applying for UK asylum from Rwanda, once they are there the application will be for Rwandan asylum.
I'm not sure many people understand that, I certainly assumed it was a temporary arrangement while a UK application was processed.
No it's permanent. So if you are an Afghan who speaks English and has family in the UK you will be expected to live in Rwanda.
Denmark, a country which has a particularly unpleasant attitude towards refugees (unless they come from a European country) is currently negotiating with Rwanda for a similar deal. I believe that Israel is/has also considered Rwanda for people they don't want in their country.
Yup permanent. That’s the idea. But sounds like those who Israel sent to Rwanda left as soon as they could, and were on the move again. Have a listen to that Radio4 Today interview on iPlayer. A lot of information packed into some very calm questions about the practicality of this back of a fag packet policy. Empty answers though, as you’d expect.