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AA - interesting on the "bite" the pics I have seen of his arm seem to be just the impression of the upper jaw and little bruising which looks to me more like an arm pressed against an open mouth rather than a bite - and the angles of the bodies in that ruck its hard to see how anyone could actually get their mouth near his arm anyway? A real bite intended to cause harm causes a lot more damage than that IME and I have treated a few
However I also very much doubt North did it himself nor that it happened earlier and he saved it for then.
Very difficult to know what actually happened here but I guess the balance of probabilities is as you say that one of those french players did it then.
Looks consistent with lower jaw to me as the biter had a gum shield. Not sure how you get to your conclusion. Looks like a clear bite mark to me and it did to the ref.
I forgot about the gum shield. 😳 Doh!
I have treated a fair few human bites and it didn't look like any I have treated but your explanation explains it
*slaps self around head*
Its clearly teeth marks.
They could just ask the players for dental records to assist with enquiries... 😈
They could just ask the players for dental records to assist with enquiries...
Only 3 or so anywhere near at the time, so eminently doable.
AWJ out for six weeks with a shoulder injury. That's not going to leave much time, if any to regain / prove fitness fitness etc.
Huw Jones is broken too.
Hogg six nations player of the year again
there are a couple of videos on here which will pass a boring moment
http://www.rugbydump.com/2017/03/5662/stuart-hogg-awarded-player-of-six-nations-championship-for-second-year-in-a-row
First time since BOD! (Impressive! Even if he's not fit clean BOD's boots 😀 )
Just what the rest of the world don't need.. another bloody Barrett! 🙂
So are we ready for an STW lions team now? The 6N is over and I guess the only things that could affect selection is some of the european cup games particularly Glasgow V Saracens
I'm not too sure about those smelly big chaps up front really. I've gone for the best player in each position IMO rather than combos used to playing together
AA don't shoot me! Its just a bit of fun 🙂
15 Hogg
14 Loopy Liam
13 Ringrose
12 Dunbar
11 Seymour
10 Sexytoes
9 Webb
1 ?
2 Best
3 furlong
4 ickle Jonny
5 Itoje???
6 Lawes?
7 Hamish Watson
8 Stander
Not enough english men I guess given their dominance but in every position bar the two forwards there would seem to be someone better. 5 scots seems a bit much as well but I guess most of you will disagree on most of them. the bulk should be Irish and English I suppose
I guess dunbar and watson will be the really controversial ones there. I've gone for them for turnover skills and and in Watsons case speed. I ain't got space for Farrell ( his kick % was the lowest of all the 6N kickers) which many will disagree with I am sure but he is not as good at 10 as sexytoes and even if its not Dunbar I want a specialist 12.
Best to be captain
Hardly a team to strike fear in to the opposition!
Launchberry should be in there of course
15 Hogg
14 Loopy Liam
13 Ringrose
12 Dunbar
11 Seymour
10 Sexytoes
9 Webb
1 ?
2 Best
3 furlong
4 ickle Jonny
5 Itoje???
6 Lawes?
7 Hamish Watson
8 Stander
😆
Lawes at 6? ahead of Stander or POM or Warburton or even John ****ing Barclay?
If you leave out North you leave out the biggest attacking threat the Lions have out wide.
What exactly has Dunbar done?
And ickle Jonny went completely awol when the pressure came on v England, that performance showed a lack of heart from a good number of Scots who rolled over to have their belly rubbed.
McGrath or Vunipola at 1 for me.
Stander at 8 is certainly the form choice and I think has a more all round game than Billy Vunipola. I think a player like him or Faletau will be needed at 8 against NZ. NZ will just up the pace and move the ball around when in posession and I'm not sure he'll cope or he'll certainly need to complete workaholuc flankers like say Robshaw and Warbs for it to work. Certaily not Courtney ****ing Lawes at 6.
I also think Webb is too stupid to be a Lions starter, would be a weapon off the bench.
I love the lions so interesting to see how players get on in new combinations.
TJ even though ithink that Watson and Seymour are great players i would not include in the lions XV, possibly part of the squad and dunbar is nowhere near (Jones would have been).
As above from AA the back row needs Warbs in, POM would be an option and possibly a starter. Good point about Billy being moved around but the Lions will see lots of use of the "finishers" so sixty minute mark will be interesting.
Murray is the no 9 and then Webb.
Second row with AWJ possibly borked, Launchbury and Ijote are the best pairing.
Farrell learnt a lot last time, by his own omission, so players like Little Johnny may go and continue to develop and Finn.
Front row Mcgarth and MAko
Hooker, well Ken Owens will be in with a shout now he made six nations player plays but George and Best maybe better options.
There will only be one Scot in the 1st XV Mr Hogg.
[i]Ideally...[/i]
Hogg
North
Daly
Joseph
Farrell
Not Sexton
Youngs
Mako V
George
Cole
AW-J
Launch Codes
Tips
Sam W
Billy V
Finishers to be advised to Gatling by Eddie via text message at 55 mins.
Hooker, well Ken Owens will be in with a shout now he made six nations player plays but George and Best maybe better options.
What has George done to be chosen by so many? Darts looked dodgy when he came on v Ireland. Has he started an international v a top team? Owens has been solid, as has Hartley, Best can be better but is erratic.
Second row with AWJ possibly borked, Launchbury and Ijote are the best pairing
Even with AWJ fit its the case. Kruis could make it too.
Front row Mcgarth and MAko
Too looseheads? Bold!!
Youngs and Care are behind Murray and Webb imo. One should go but I'd be suprised if they make the test side unless we get injuries.
Anyway I have been woooshed!!!
Why you so againt the lions DD?
Just what the rest of the world don't need.. another bloody Barrett!
Yeah the NZ press have been down on him for making too many handling errors and missing too many tackles but - come on!
He looks like he could be even better than Beauden to me. He's made a few errors because he tries outlandish things and, besides, it's his first season of Super Rugby.
Scott Barrett has also been outstanding at lock for the Crusaders but apparently they're moving him to 6 this weekend. He seems to have the same running and handling skills as his brothers but in a bigger package. 😯
If you leave out North you leave out the biggest attacking threat the Lions have out wide.
Lol...
Lol...
Point me to any player in the British Isles that is as big a threat ball in hand?
Wrecker, has Henson sprained a finger nail again?
Just seen this:
15 Hogg
14 Loopy Liam
13 Ringrose
12 Dunbar
11 Seymour
10 Sexytoes
9 Webb
1 ?
2 Best
3 furlong
4 ickle Jonny
5 Itoje???
6 Lawes?
7 Hamish Watson
8 Stander
8OAnyone would think that England had come 4/5 not Scotland and Wales....and one of the 2 English players is a 6 not 5 where he usually plays?! 😆
North is different to all the other wingers that play for home nations and he is a real threat. Would get in most of the other home nations teams I'd imagine.
Would get in most of the other home nations teams I'd imagine.
He'd be in all of them, although he would have to be more consistent to stay in some of them.
In other news how shit are Edinburgh? Conceded 4 tries to The Scarlets after 35 mins!!
AA - didn't want to make such a bold statement as they seem to be incendiary!
15 Hogg
14 Loopy Liam
13 Ringrose
12 Dunbar
11 Seymour
10 Sexytoes
9 Webb
1 ?
2 Best
3 furlong
4 ickle Jonny
5 Itoje???
6 Lawes?
7 Hamish Watson
8 Stander
So you've managed to put only two of your countrymen, the best team of those available, and put question marks by them. Well done. Great selection.
It was just to get a discussion going
North wouldn't get in the scotland team. Visser outplayed him FFS and Visser is 4th choice scots winger! He is not the player he was - needs a summer off IMO
Warbs obviously should be 6 and other good candidates available as well- stupid of me. tired late last night.
YOu are right that Jonny Gray did fall below his usual standards the last two games and probably played himself out of a place on the plane
I did say I hadn't put enough englishmen in and some of my choices including Dunbar and Watson were somewhat controversial
Dunbar - after 3 games he had more steals than any other player forward or back in the 6N or so the commentators said - I can't find stats on turnovers tho. Also made several of Scotland tries vastly underrated player and a specialist inside centre who tackles and jackels like a 7 with lovely hands as well. Poor in the england game tho. Watson outplayed the Welsh back row or so all the pundits said
My team barring a few of obvious errors ( no launchbury / lawes in the wrong place etc) is one built around pace and turnovers not stodge and truck it up
Its a team to play the tactics I think are what is needed to beat NZ. Pace, turnovers and backs who can do more than run in straight lines and shovel on shit
How shit are Edinburgh? - a huge steaming pile of it. YO could fertilise and entire country with the amount of shit they have. cockers can't arrive soon enough
North wouldn't get in the scotland team.
😆
😆 😆
No seriously, thats ****ing gold.
He wouldn't AA. Not right now. A very good player no doubt but not at his best this series and not as good as any of the Scots wingers this year. It would help of course if he got some decent passes.. I say it again - turnstile Tim outplayed him
Stats - from the head to head match
Seymour 1 try, visser 1 try. North nil
North - no passes 4 carries for 18m no defenders beaten
Seymour 2 passes 5 carries 21m 2 clean breaks 2 defenders beaten
Visser 3 passes 7 runs 45 m 3 clean breaks 3 defenders beaten one offload
North 1 turnover conceded 2 tackles made [u][b]4[/b][/u] tackles missed
Seymour 1 tunover conceded 3 tackles made none missed
Visser 3 turnovers conceded 5 tackles made 1 missed
When you get outplayed by turnstile Tim then you know you are having a bad day
That vid shows his class - unfortunately it wasn't this year when his form was just not there most of the time.
Or do you want to pick on reputation not form like Woodwood did?
From Wales on line - player ratings
George North 3
He flaps so much in defence, the Royal Society for the Protection of Birds might feel the need to investigate. Did hold up Tim Visser at one point, but North largely looked a missed tackle waiting to happen.
No rating for the scots
telegraph
visser 8
Seymour 7
North 4
You can't judge a player on one game. How many scots would make the line up based on the england/scotland game?
I'll help with that; precisely zero.
Maybe you can't but a head to head comparison is as good as we have unless you want to tot up stats for the entire series.
North is a fine player who needs a summer off. NOt he player he was year or two ago
Seymour is on fire and playing the best rugby of his career, he scores more tires per game over his career than NOrth.
tunstile Tim is a big wuss who had a cracking game that game and completely outplayed NOrth
flaps so much in defence, the Royal Society for the Protection of Birds might feel the need to investigate.
Hogg?
Agree with TJ, this tournament north had one game where he seemed back to his old self and a couple of flurries in other games. Hope he re-kindles the spark but one swallow doesn't make a summer.
refering to NOrth
Hoggs much discussed defensive frailties didn't really seem to happen this year
Maybe you can't but a head to head comparison is as good as we have unless you want to tot up stats for the entire series.
So you're happy to replace every scots position in your selection with the english alternative?
Heaslip's and Kearney's chances take a blow. Both have had surgery and will be out for quite a few weeks.
Gutted. 🙂
TJ as much as i admire Seymour , North is the better player by some distance. Visser was hammered by North for 35 minutes I have never seen such a psychological turn around by player like Visser, he went from a no hoper to brilliant t in 5 minutes, North has been and is constantly a great player.
Hoggs was defensively weak at times but is the best 15 in the northern hemisphere, he will get better.
As others have said head to head no Scotland player makes the trip because of their game v England.
No england player makes the trip because of their game v Ireland.
No irelamd player makes trip because of game v wales
No tour them.....
North would walk into the Scotland team and maybe thrive with better ball than he gets for wales. If he plays outside say Murray sexton Farrell Joseph then he will be a handful.
Only put Farrell in as too late to think of anyone else.
Vondally - Visser - turnstile Tim FFS - completely outplayed north. Look at the stats
Yes North might do better in the Scotland team as he wouldgetmore ball but on this years form North is not on the plance to the antipodes
You guys are selecting on reputation not on form
You guys are selecting on reputation not on form
Question is, will Gatland? Certainly the preferred selection process for Wales!
So North wont be on the plane? Tell you what how about a bet. If North is fit and not in the squad I will never post on this thread again how about you TJ?
What is bizare is your banging on about stats seemingly falling into the well Dan Luger won a world cup trap that Englamd fans fell in post world cup. North was part of a team the had a collective meltdown second half v scotland. He also scored a very good try v Italy whilst on one leg, I wonder if hexwas rushed back for the Scotland game too soon, he was excellent v Ireland scoring two tries and generally dominating their back 3, didnt do much v France but it wasnt a game for wingers.
Oh and if you are going to quote pointless stats and little fact checking may help.
Seymour is on fire and playing the best rugby of his career, he scores more tires per game over his career than NOrth.
Really North has 32 tries from 72 internationals and is 24. Seymour 36 caps 16 tries and is 28. North made is try scoring international debut at 18 so has been learning on the job too.
Seymour 33 tries for Glasgow and Ulster in 104 games
North 44 tries in 114 appearances for Scarlets and Scumhampton.
I would rather look at what I saw from the East Stand than the stats - Visser was transformed after 35 minutes from a flapping sack of ineptitude to a rugby wing, I have never seen anything of the ilk, exceptional. North looked and played well but was part of a team going nowhere as a unit, who under pressure ( from a very good Scots team) imploded.
As I have said I like Seymour as a player and would place in the mix for the Lions, determined, good hands, quick and finishes with aplomb. BUT he is not as dynamic nor as powerful nor as experienced as North who is genuinely world class and we saw that in some of the tries this tournament, I would pick Nowell before him as well, just.
My concern for North is keeping him injury and concussion free, not a lot one can about the latter given the game and his committment but the former is something of a worry.
You cannot select based on one performance.
Top level sport is about identifying the players and developing them. A revolving door selection policy was the downfall of the England cricket team of the 90's. When they started to identify the players they wanted and stuck with them they had considerable success.
Rugby is no different, Norths career record is good despite playing for a side not geared to get the best from him. Over several games and seasons he has shown that he is a quality player. This six nations he looked to be coming back into some form and had several good games as well as a poor half. You can't select Visser because he was awful against England, therefore you get Daly on the wing, that's how the argument works isn't it?
North wouldn't get in the Scotland team
Really, TJ I admire your support for Scotland but that is a bonkers thing to say.
Tis early after after a long day and night so just to clarify here folks, no one is suggesting Visser for the Lions?
Not even TJ was suggesting Visser...but then Cuthbert was a try scoring test Lion last time AND looked very good doing it so anything is possible!
Just checking, that s all.
Heaslip's and Kearney's chances take a blow
Kearneys chances took a blow when North knocked him into next week twice in the first 5 mins of the Wales ireland game. His tackling is very poor.
Could you explain why you are so anti The Lions?
So you've managed to put only two of your countrymen, the best team of those available, and put question marks by them. Well done. Great selection.
Erm I'd copied TJ's team to take the piss!
Thank you to Gloucester from a Worcester fan after putting away Bristol last night . 5 ponts for Glos and zero for Bristol who were very poor .
I think we are going to have our work cut out against Wasps tomorrow mind not to suffer the same fate .
Northampton v Leicester was quite the game today.
Its a team to play the tactics I think are what is needed to beat NZ. Pace, turnovers and backs who can do more than run in straight lines and shovel on shit
Aside from some top class trolling in other posts, I don't think the way to beat NZ is to try and play like NZ because we just don't have the class. Frustrate them and let the piggies win the game with some hard grunt
5 ponts for Glos and zero for Bristol who were very poor .
True. But despite what the score might say, Glaws were pretty shit too. Not surprised that they have struggled this year.
Ospreys 🙁
That was piss poor from them was it Parry at 2...awful darts.
Did you see should of Giles breaks though 😯
[quote="anagallis_arvensis"]
...........
In other news how shit are Edinburgh? Conceded 4 tries to The Scarlets after 35 mins!!
[quote="Bear"]
AA - didn't want to make such a bold statement as they seem to be incendiary!
I think I may be the only Edinburgh supporter here
Its hardly bold or controversial to say Edinburgh re a large steaming pile of poop. Its really pretty obvious. Some good players that should make a halfway decent team but playing with no plan, no heart and who look disinterested half the time. Completely inconsistent as well. Look good against the minnows in the minnows cup but put any halfway decent side up against them they fall to pieces.
Cockerill cannot arrive soon enough for this fan. Perhaps not the best coach in the world but his teams never seemed to lack heart. I expect him to find Edinburghs missing backbone. the only good thing about this ~Edinburgh team is they are the best looking and most well groomed of any side in the NH. Unfortunately those ugly smelly beggars from the west take all the glory.
I feel for any Edinburgh supporter. Scarlets scored 4 tries in 35 mins and should have put at least 50 on them but were too shit themselves to play through an Edinburgh team that simple tried not to concede second half.
Thank you AA - its an affliction sometimes I can hardly bear.
What really pisses me off is I was born in the west country. I could have been an England and Bath supporter but my folks moved away before my allegiance was set. I blame the parents!
Just checking the results - treviso beat ospreys! Thats a real shocker.
Edinburgh firmly down the bottom of the table with the other no hopers 🙁
Bath supporter
Ah, but you escaped having to wear barbour jackets, hunter wellies and one of those shit australian leather hats!
And good job you don't support Bath after today's game.......
I thought I would have another look at the stats for North V Seymour. Makes for interesting reading
NOrth missed one game, Seymour played them all.
Everything very similar bar North made 256m, Seymour 128 ( was North running back deep kicks? I don't remember him doing so) and missed tackles. North missed 6 Seymour 3
One thing that was very obvious tho is that when North played well - like against Ireland he ran riot (5 clean breaks 8 defender beaten). In other matches like against Scotland he was very much second best. ( 4 missed tackles only 18m made - worse than Seymour against England)
Seymour was much more consistent, North at his best was better at his worst was worse as north missed one game it makes his overall stats better. the game North missed was against England which might have helped him on his missed tackle count 🙂 North missed 6 tackles in 4 games, Seymour 3 in 5 games
Whilst pondering the stats I thought I'd look at Hoggs supposed defensive frailties. Missed 4 tackles all series
Lies, damn lies, and then statistics.
Does matter how you present it, North is still a better winger than Seymour.
😉
Stats would seem to agree if you ignore his turnstile defense. 😉
The Leicester Northampton game yesterday is everything I hope to see when watching. Great game. I was thinking that as Northants got their 3rd try and I thought tigers were buried again, and somehow they clawed back to make it superb
So Scotland have a turnstile on both wings?
That's really going to help in NZ this summer.
Only on one wing bigblackshed - and only when maitland is injured 🙂 the infamous turnstil tim ( who still outplayed north head to head 🙂 )
North is the turnstile in those stats
OK
change the topic
anyone give Glasgow a chance against Sarries? Its going to be an interesting clash of styles and a chance for a good few players from Glasgow to atone for the humping by England
If it was in Glasgow I'd say a decent chance but at Sarries ground - its going to be very difficult but then I didn't think Glasgow would [s]beat[/s] demolish Racing and Tigers
Sarries by a single score?
Nope, sarries by 15.
Sorry TJ, racing and Tigers have been shit all season, Sarries have not. They also have the ability to strangle teams and then score every time they get the ball. On the plastic pitch, they'll win no worries (and I'll be very happy to be wrong - can't stand them as a club!)
Glasgow play on a plastic pitch as well so thats no advantage to Sarries - infact the plastic pitch is a bonus for Glasgow as they play better on one.
Strangling Glasgow is the way to beat them. Fast paced game with a lot of backs involved and moving the ball around a lot is the Glasgow style and the way to beat Sarries. Glasgows high pressure defense has been pretty good this year
Gonna be a cracker of a game I hope and while I think Sarries will win its not a cert by any means
was North running back deep kicks
have you even seen Wales play in the last 7 years?
Stats equal Moneyball, really does not mean everything in isolation of the game played,the team around the player, style of play right down to the condition of the player on the day including phycology.
Anyway after weekend Ashton on the plane for the Lions?
Anyway after weekend Ashton on the plane for the Lions?
No
Ahhhh, but couple of commetators ( guardian) have suggested it, good try record may e even better than Seymour's stats?
Saffercens coach said it too. Doesnt mean it'll happen!
Maitland would be a great solid choice to bench or play mid week though. Ashton isnt good enough to be in the test side and I'm not sure he has the righ attitude for the mid week side.
Sarries seem to be hitting their stride again just at the right time - I think they'll beat Glasgow. They play with more pace then they're given credit for, but mix this with good defense and the ability smoother teams. That was a dicking handed out to Bath at the weekend.
Shame I missed the Saints / Tiger's game because it sounded like a good match.
Worcester did better than expected against Wasps taking two bonus points - I would have settled for one. Gary Gold has made a difference is not much time - hopefully he'll be given a contract for next year so they can start to build some continuity. Thought Wade had a good game for Wasps - will he go for the midweek team? I'd rather him than Ashton.
Not Toby Faletau signs for Bristol!!
really? bloody hell!